[sf-lug] printer consumables & printing costs (inkjet, laser, ...) ... Hewlett-Packard (hp) LaserJet Pro 200 color MFP M276nw Product No. CF145A ...

[Michael Paoli]

> From: "Rick Moen" <rick at linuxmafia.com>
> Subject: Re: [sf-lug] printer consumables & printing costs (inkjet,  
> laser, ...)
> Date: Fri, 25 Jan 2019 02:34:51 -0800

> Quoting Michael Paoli (Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu):
>
> A couple of things I observed about the Epson Stylus [someththing] inkjet
> printer my now-late mother bought, against my strong recommendation to
> the contrary, in the middle 2000s:
>
> 1.  Mom talked herself into the purchase, in part, by saying she'd
> normally print in B&W mode, hence rely only on the (cheaper and
> higher-capacity) black ink cartridge, not the pricier three colour
> cartridges.  It turned out, there was no way (at least on OS X) to
> disable colour print mode.  If, say, Mom printed a Web page that had a
> lot of red, then she chewed up a lot of red ink in doing so.
>
> 2.  We also noticed that if _any_ of the four ink cartridges ran low,
> the printer automatically shifted into doorstop mode and refused to
> print anything again until the low-on-ink cartridge got replaced,
> whether it was needed for printing or not.
>
> Ka-ching!

Yes, ... I've had relatively (pun semi-intended) similar experiences,
fortunately indirect.  E.g., once-upon-a-time friend.  (Ex-friend -
only one to quite "earn" that distinction - but that's another story.)
Anyway, said (former) friend, once had some brand of all-in-one color
inkjet thingy.  Said "friend" became highly frustrated at it - to say
the least.  Most notably, *one* of the colors ran out.  And of course they
were expensive to replace, and you had to replace (at least) all the colors
at once.  And ... talk about doorstop mode.  Oh, it was much more stubborn
than not merely "printing".  With so much as a single color not working,
it couldn't even receive B&W FAXes ... I think it wouldn't even scan and
*send* a B&W FAX, because it insisted on printing (consumable $$) "receipt"
copy confirmations of FAXes sent (at least 1 page per FAX sent), and, the
bloody sucker would refuse to FAX if it couldn't print even that single
1 B&W page "receipt" of FAX having been sent.  At least that's as I recall
hearing it all, and it may have been that bad ... but that person also
may not have been sufficiently competent to make its operations suck less
than that.  In any case, sounds highly annoying at best, and glad I didn't
have the displeasure of experiencing that first-hand (and no, I don't
know/recall what make/model it was ... that person was also dang light on
providing relevant technical details - and also jumped to conclusions a
whole lot - to say the least ... so not sure exactly how technically
accurate, but wouldn't surprise me the least if that was at least that
device's *default* behavior and/or so with whatever "drivers"/software,
etc. it came with for operation on Microsoft Windows (which the person
was using at the time).

And another similar, but annoyingly relatively (yes, pun) closer, but
still indirect, ... the "mom" printer.  Yes, she insisted, inkjet.
Bloody hell, and color too.  She couldn't afford replacement ink,
and whether the black, or the color combo cartridge ran out, either way,
it was pretty dang non-functional (wouldn't print at all if I recall  
correctly,
but hey, it would still scan and do *some* other stuff at least), so, yeah,
unfortunately thereafter it meant for quite a number of years, much of
my gift(s) for mom budget got used on ink cartridges for her ... to the
tune of about ~$50.00 to ~$75.00 or so per year on bloody ink cartridges
for her thereafter.  And yes, I did originally try to talk her into
laser ... even when in *either* case I was also buying the printer for
her originally too (also a gift), but no, she *insisted* upon inkjet, ...
I did try to go with one that was *supposed* to be less expensive / more
economical to resupply with ink (cartridges) ... but still far from cheap
on that, and especially given that she didn't print all that much (much more
than me, but not all that much ... probably at least below, maybe even well
below about 600 pages / year.).  So yes, there, even color laser and buying
full MSRP toner cartridges, probably would have been less overall cost - at
least if I guestimate she printed at or under 444 pages per year (likely
so), and may have been comparable to fair bit cheaper on (re)supplies and
overall cost even if she printed at to well over 444 pages/yr. - depending
on supply sourcing and reasonable shopping around for best prices of
sufficient quality supplies.  <sigh>  All quite highly annoying.
Well, unfortunately she now lives where she doesn't have any space for
a printer of any type, but fortunately that means I'm not bloody spending
~$50.00 to ~$75.00 or so per year resupplying her with inkjet supplies.

>> Hewlett-Packard (hp) LaserJet Pro 200 color MFP M276nw
>> Product No. CF145A

> I'm actually not finding an entry in the OpenPrinting database for this
> puppy, just for HP LaserJet Pro MFP m126nw (which of course might be a
> close cousin).  I'm guessing that when you say 'Works fine with CUPS',
> you mean you were able to download from HP's Web site an HPLIP filter
> with required proprietary plug-in for it (that then worked in the CUPS
> framework).

It might be under MFP M276<whatever> - the <whatever> bit just are some
different letter(s) (if present) for some/additional interfaces(/features?)
it may have.  I'm guestimating, from what I have and the <whatever> letters,
that the letters I have - n is for Network (wired Ethernet), and w is for
Wireless - specifically Wi-Fi (it also has USB interface for printing, etc.
over USB cable).  At least thus far I don't care for the Wi-Fi, and just
leave it disabled (my network is mostly hardwired Ethernet LAN, and only
sometimes do I use Wi-Fi at home).  So, likely there's common "driver"
or whatever, for at least the M276<whatever> series, and possibly even
broader range of models that also includes the M276<whatever> series.
(the bits I do have installed and/or otherwise still hanging about, might
also somewhere, contain the "answer" to that - or at least what was
applicable when I installed it nearly 6 years ago.)

Fully open source, "drivers" and such with (but generally not from) CUPS,
or ???  I don't fully recall - that was years ago ... though I do have
good notes and such on what and how I did the install (at least buried
somewhere in my notes/documentation/collection of relevant files).

I recall, at least approximately at the time, I wasn't *quite* able to
do it *just* from packages in the then Debian stable.  For that particular
model, at least at that time, I recall it required some newer software that
wasn't yet in Debian stable.  So, there was that bit ... it may not have
even (yet, at that time) been in Debian backports.
And, ... any proprietary HP binary non-open source bits?  Perhaps a trace,
or maybe it was or was on its way to open, but wasn't yet into or fully
supported in the upstream sources outside of HP ... at least yet, at that
time.  In any case, yes, fuzzy on the details (nearly 6 years ago), but
it worked dang well (at least enough), and without pulling in too much
cruft from HP.  It also seemed (similar to IBM in the days when they
owned at least majority stake in making ThinkPad* laptops), that there
was sufficient commitment to open source, that it would likely be, at
least sufficiently well supported by open source in (near to medium-ish
term-) future, that I wasn't particularly concerned about it, and that it
would probably work - or work "well enough" ("driver"-wise, and the like),
going into the future.
(* e.g. I remember in 2003 when I got my IBM ThinkPad T40p (model no.  
2373G1U),
that at the time of purchase, its built-in Wi-Fi was *not* (yet, at the time)
supported.  But I was confident it would be.  Within 6 months time it was
supported by the (out-of-kernel) Mad-Wi-Fi (if I remember the name right)
project - and that "just worked" ... and within a year of purchase it was
supported by mainline kernel.org - and probably by my favorite distro's
stable within about 2 years of that, and probably by their backports
thereof in significantly less time than that).  So, likewise, I figured
HP's stuff - at least for that model, would likely be at least "well enough"
supported continuing into future.  (at least certain other manufacturers,
I would never presume such - some mostly lock one into their binary
blobs forever - and maybe if one is lucky there will appear an open-source
alternative that may cover "enough" - or most - of the functinality
and work at least "well enough").

And ... "some day" I'll go through and fully clean up and redo my CUPS
some fair bit ... I think some bits of it semi-broke some years back
with some distro major version upgrade (probably to be expected, as I
hadn't fully and cleanly ripped out all the (modest) bits that were
dragged in outside of distro ... but tracked well enough I can probably
clean that all up - when I get around to it).  I expect when I do finally
bother to do so, I probably won't have too much difficulty to sort that
out again (was certainly easy enough the first time getting it all set up
just fine), and, heck, even in "worst case" ... printer also has USB port,
so also can print quite easily and nicely from USB (e.g. flash) device,
and can likewise scan to such - so I'm not horribly worried about it ...
definitely presently still quite low on my priority list to get all the
CUPS fully squared away, and fully (or to the extent feasible) disintangled
from any trace remnant HP proprietary bits.  But hey, at printing <~= 50
pages per year, I'm in no rush (but maybe when I've got sufficient free time
and am otherwise bored or find it "interesting" enough to get that all
squared away ... meantime I've generally got things that interest me
more ... and also, if I may want ... I might first "solve" all that
on virtual machine - see if I can do so with zero HP proprietary bits
dragged in ... if that all works fine, then I mostly have "recipe" for
doing so on the main (bare metal) computer that I'd be using for such ...
at least if same distro version and such ... only additional bit, I'd need
to finish cleanly ripping out any remnant HP proprietary bits ... then
apply the "recipe", and all should be good ... that would then also likely
smoothly continue to work through distro version upgrades).  Anyway, no rush
to fully "fix" that, ... but ... maybe some day  :-).  Perhaps when I'm
doing / screwing around with - some other stuff also on virtual machine,
where it would be sufficiently easy/convenient, to "hey, why don't I also see
if I can fully get the CUPS stuff working properly there while I'm at it
anyway".  Anyway, ... no rush.  :-)  Thanks for thinkin' of it, but I
probably wouldn't be putting such "solution"/fix into practice anytime
particularly soon (time ... priorities, ... that one is quite low on the
list).

> Everyone talking about this model for Linux deployments seems to have
> said you need to download the HPLIP stuff, anyway.

I think at least way back at the time (about 6 years ago), it required a
*newer* HPLIP version ... but that stuff did (at least always would, as
I seem to recall from "way back then") make it's way from HP to the non-HP
upstream repositories (and from there into Debian repositories - either
main, or "worst" case, possibly some bits in contrib and/or non-free).
But my memory may be a wee bit fuzzy on that ... like I said, about 6
years ago.

> At least, unlike the case with Mom's Epson inkjet, you can substitute in
> a B&W toner cartridge and do actual B&W printing at B&W-toner prices.

Maybe *some* day I'll know exactly what my printer will/won't do if so much
as *one* of the color toner cartridges is out (I suppose I could find out
sooner by remove, try, replace ... but that may well involve mess and/or
toner loss that may make it quite unworth trying the experiment before
at least one of them runs out anyway).  But also, at present printing
rates, I'm still probably >~=6 years away from managing to so much as
run out the first of any of the 4 toner cartridges.  So ... I may just
wait 'till then, and see.  And since I can easily check remaining page
count on each (and without having to print a page to determine that!),
I could always have handy replacement(s) on-hand "before" - or at least
when, it finally gets so low on one that - at least that one (black, or
a color) will no longer print, or error(s) out on that black or color,
or whatever.  Don't know about this model, but some printers/copiers,
allow one the option to continue printing even if there's insufficient
toner - and one just gets results with that toner missing or partially
missing or light/thin(/maybe even splotchy) on the output.  Other models
may simply stubbornly refuse to print at that point - or refuse to print
anything that would require use of that particular toner (black, or a
color).  Anyway, maybe one day I'll know ... no rush (if I was highly
curious, answer likely can be found on the Interwebs ... but it's *not
that interesting* to me - at least thus far).  Also possible firmware
versions might alter that behavior.  Somewhere (low) on my to-do
list ... can I backup firmware that's installed on that printer,
and (how?) can I upgrade the firmware off-line.  Since printer is
out-of-warranty, I want to play it very safe/conservative on any
firmware upgrades (primary policy may be if it ain't broke, don't
fix it, secondary is don't bloody expose old firmware device to 'da
Internet, third (well, maybe approximate order), it's out-of-warranty,
so don't trust it to talk to HP over 'da Internet and ... do whatever
it might do if it were allowed to so communicate with/to HP, 4th, any
firmware upgrades, first have a way to back up existing, secondly
if/as feasible and if I get around to it, download and save each version
that HP puts out, and all along with that, only upgrade firmware off-line,
and only if there's feasible way to get back to the earlier firmware
version) ... anyway, something at least theoretically like that.
But also, since it basically "works" (or at least well enough, and
certainly for my purposes), and I've no intention of letting The
Internet talk to it, nor it talk to The Internet ... I'm relatively
unconcerned about firmware matters ... though maybe I ought at least
save all the versions that get released, and all the older versions too ...
if/as feasible, ... but thus far haven't bothered to do so.  8-O

>> okay, peek on-line to refine cost ... $72.99 Black, $169.99 CMY 3-pack
>> - and those are what appear to be HP MSRP prices (probably lower
>> prices and/or lesser quality to be had, if one wishes / shops around).
>
> Dood!  You bet, much better pricing than that can be had.  HP-branded
> printing supplies are priced for the 'money no object' people
> (especially at full MSRP), and non-suckers seek alternatives.

Yep, I'm quite confident I could find significantly to much better
prices (and thus lower costs), and if not identical product, and least
comparable quality and highly compatible ... but part of the earlier was
conservative exercise in costs - even at full MSRP from HP on toner,
for most of my example scenarios, and certainly my use case, even
looking at that "worst case" supply cost, it *still* saves me
at least >~= $25.00/yr. (after about 3 yrs. ... and more like
~= $50.00/yr. for the majority of the first decade).
So, yeah, reasonable shopping around, and my actual savings are
probably mostly a fair bit more than that.

>> Also, I didn't calculate paper costs.
>
> Costco is one's friend.  (If one cannot swing entry on one's own or a
> friend's membersip, then Office Depot's reasonable.)

Yep, can be quite cheap if one shops around (and/or takes advantage of the
occasional special/sale ... I still quite like my $0.01/ream x 4 or 5
reams ... I'm pretty well supplied on that for quite a while to come now.
Maybe there will be similar sale or other opportunity like that again
within the coming decades(!) before I run out of paper at my current
printing rates.)