[conspire] No more GNU HP Minis
ruben at mrbrklyn.com
Thu Nov 5 16:15:14 PST 2009
Ruben Safir wrote:
> Carl Myers wrote:
>> I think the disconnect here is there are two separate usecases.
>> 1. People who use a computer as a "dumb tool" for web browsing, email,
>> productivity, and the occasional fancy thing like "burn CDs" or
>> "download/listen to music".
>> 2. People who USE a computer to accomplish anything they want.
>> People who read
>> man pages, write scripts and/or code, search out programs to
>> accomplish tasks,
>> possibly programs they've never used before, and if they can't find
>> one, they
>> write or modify an existing one.
>> What Rick is saying (I think, correct me if I am wrong - and I think
>> I agree) is
>> that it is not his goal to have every person with usecase #1 running
>> His goal (again, I am interpreting, so apologies if I misunderstand)
>> is to help
>> people with usecase #2 discover that GNU/Linux is a great way to
>> solve their
>> problem and share their work with others. Stand on the shoulders of
>> giants and
>> benefit everyone. People in usecase #2 care about where software
>> comes from and
>> they care about the control they can exercise over it - "will I be
>> able to
>> modify this program in the future?" is a question they might ask.
> Ask yourself this: How many GNU/Linux users have actually contributed
> code to any significant programs in the GNU world? Less than 1% might
> be the right answer.
>> People in usecase #1 will never ask that question. People in usecase
>> #1 want it
>> to "just work". Now it sounds to me like Rubin is a user in usecase
>> #2, but for
>> this particular machine, he has decided he wants usecase #1 simplicity.
>> Additionally, he feels like socially everyone in usecase #1 should
>> also be using
>> GNU/Linux for some reason.
> For ever specific and critical reasons, that is for the human race
> which I outlines and have written about all across the internet and
> the paper world.
> I have a question: See this video
> Are these in users group 1 or 2?
>> Probably because later, when he wishes his purchase
>> was actually for usecase 2, he will be able to have his cake and eat
>> it too.
>> I agree in that I too wish GNU/Linux solved usecase #1 better than
>> alternatives, and frankly, it is closer today than it ever was (in
>> terms of
>> solving the use case, not in terms of availability, which is what
>> started this
>> whole discussion). I hope that some day GNU/Linux can and does solve
>> #1. I hope that companies like microsoft will stop expending
>> precious resources
>> trying to make a non-free operating system when a perfectly good free
>> exists, and maybe they can get a clue and a better business model and
>> solve new
>> problems instead of finding new and terrible ways to fail to solve
>> old ones
>> which GNU/Linux has already solved better.
>> But I don't think it is my job to make that happen. I am a
>> minority. I am one
>> of you. I won't use a preinstalled OS because nobody will preinstall
>> an OS the
>> way I want it (plus the very good reasons Rick already listed). All
>> I can do is
>> ensure I don't pay any money in support of operating systems I won't
>> use. I can
>> educate users in usecase 1 and try to turn them into users in usecase
>> 2, but
>> some people will never be usecase 2 material. Trying to force users
>> in usecase
>> 1 to use GNU/Linux before there is a GNU/Linux distro ready that
>> really solves
>> that usecase is only going to make them think badly of it.
> GNU/Linux has been ready for general public usage since RH 5 and SuSE
> 5. There is nothing it doesn't you
eh - there is nothing it doesn't do...
I might learn English one day before I die...
> and the obstruction of it from being THE general use desktop system
> for the public has been purposeful disruption, and stupidity on part
> of the community, which includes IBM, Novell, Bruce Perens and RMS. I
> must have written an encyclopedia already on the troubles with
> Vertical Application building , business modeling and DRM politics
> which has prevent non-slaveware, free software, from broad adoption.
> And it seems if I ever contribute anything important to the Free
> Software community it will be to convince people that EVERYONE needs a
> Free Operating System to work on...if they want to live in freedom.
>> I would guess that
>> is why no company has *really* tried to compete in that market. Dell
>> with preinstalled linux - system76 machines, and any other machine with
>> pre-installed linux (except some andriod phones and the occasional
>> running some crazy simplified linux-based GUI) are all geared towards
>> usecase 2.
>> I guess what I am saying is, I understand where you are coming from
>> now Rubin,
>> but I'm not sure how constructive it is for "the cause". You guys
>> have been at
>> this way longer than me though, so please feel free to enlighten me =)
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