[conspire] (forw) Re: [svlug] New question.. not really :) (was: svlug Digest, Vol 299, Issue 24)
Rick Moen
rick at linuxmafia.com
Fri Jul 15 14:14:37 PDT 2005
All of this is (sort of) a roundabout way of reminding people that
tomorrow (Saturday) is SVLUG's installfest day, 11-4 at a Google
building in Mountain View, not far from Shoreline Amphitheatre.
http://www.svlug.org/installfest/
----- Forwarded message from stripes <stripes at tigerlair.com> -----
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 13:45:26 -0400
From: stripes <stripes at tigerlair.com>
To: svlug at lists.svlug.org
Subject: [svlug] New question.. not really :)
*sigh*.. I hate asking this. I'm trying to find a new distro. Here
are my thoughts on the ones I don't like:
- Debian, love apt, but out of date even running unstable :(
- FC4, slower than crap, stuff that doesn't work does in other distros
- SUSE, clunky
- RH, expensive
So, here's what I'm leaning towards:
- Gentoo, but not sure about the constant compiling or upgrade path
- Ubuntu, not sure how often this is updated
- Mandrake, seems like you have to pay for this now :(
Oh yeah, and this has to run on my laptop (IBM Thinkpad T41) :)
Thoughts? I'm not starting a flame war, seriously.
-Anne
--
In God we trust. All others (\`--/') _ _______ .-r-.
must provide a digital >.~.\ `` ` `,`,`. ,'_'~`.
certificate. - Crispin Cowan (v_," ; `,-\ ; : ; \/,-~) \
stripes at tigerlair dot com `--'_..),-/ ' ' '_.>-' )`.`.__.')
stripes at brickbox dot com ((,((,__..'~~~~~~((,__..' `-..-'fL
----- End forwarded message -----
----- Forwarded message from Rick Moen <rick at linuxmafia.com> -----
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 11:21:32 -0700
To: svlug at lists.svlug.org
From: Rick Moen <rick at linuxmafia.com>
Subject: Re: [svlug] New question.. not really :)
Quoting stripes (stripes at tigerlair.com):
> *sigh*.. I hate asking this. I'm trying to find a new distro. Here
> are my thoughts on the ones I don't like:
Having taken a monk-ish vow, many years ago, to stay as far away from
distribution advocacy as humanly possible, I can only offer to provide
installation media (and installation help) for any of these Linux & BSD
flavours, which I'll bring to tomorrow's SVLUG installfest in Mountain
View:
http://linuxmafia.com/cabal/installfest/#distros
Can help you with any of those. Some are even available as live CDs,
which you can therefore evaluate (a little) before installing.[1]
> - RH, expensive
For those leaning in RHEL's direction, I am fond of pointing out CentOS.
The version 4.1 cited on my Web page is CentOS's rebuild of RHEL4 Update 1.
> - Mandrake, seems like you have to pay for this now :(
Mandriva ne Mandrakelinux remains freely redistributable, to the best of
my knowledge and recollection. The "2005 Limited Edition Download
Edition" spoken of on my Web page is the interim refresh following
Mandrakelinux 10.1, and appears to be the latest.
[1] Uprelated note: I recently put a special "embedded" set of files
for the Damn Small Linux distribution (55MB) on my USB flash drive:
The "embedded" variant comes prepackaged with the qemu emulator, plus
Linux + MS-Windows scripts to start up a qemu virtual machine, letting
you launch a virtual Damn Small Linux session within either OS.
http://ftp.belnet.be/packages/damnsmalllinux/current/dsl-1.3-embedded.zip
----- End forwarded message -----
----- Forwarded message from Bill Kendrick <nbs at sonic.net> -----
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 10:56:20 -0700
From: Bill Kendrick <nbs at sonic.net>
To: svlug at lists.svlug.org
Subject: Re: [svlug] New question.. not really :)
On Fri, Jul 15, 2005 at 01:45:26PM -0400, stripes wrote:
> - Debian, love apt, but out of date even running unstable :(
Wow, really? There have only been a very _few_ things that I've missed
out of straight Debian, and have had to (or will have to) go elsewhere
for: KDE 3.4.1 and some TTF-related libraries (to get around a crash bug
in Tux Paint).
<snip>
> - Ubuntu, not sure how often this is updated
I don't know too much about Ubuntu, but in being Debian-based, isn't it just
feeding off of the main Debian branches? (I admittedly know _very_ little
about Ubuntu, and only played with a LiveCD once. I wasn't that impressed,
since the LiveCD was pretty bare-bones and boring. I think that had to do
with the fact that they included some Win32 OSS stuff on the disc as well.
It looks like TheOpenCD v3 is now handling this, acting as Win32 OSS
_plus_ a light version of Ubuntu LiveCD.)
<snip>
> Thoughts? I'm not starting a flame war, seriously.
Suuuuure you aren't. ;)
--
-bill! Picn*x14 --- Linux Anniversary Picnic & BBQ!
bill at newbreedsoftware.com Sunnyvale Baylands Park, Sunday, August 14th
http://newbreedsoftware.com/ http://linuxpicnic.org/ to RSVP & volunteer!
----- End forwarded message -----
----- Forwarded message from Rick Moen <rick at linuxmafia.com> -----
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 13:50:38 -0700
To: svlug at lists.svlug.org
From: Rick Moen <rick at linuxmafia.com>
Subject: Re: [svlug] New question.. not really :)
Quoting Bill Kendrick (nbs at sonic.net):
> Wow, really? There have only been a very _few_ things that I've missed
> out of straight Debian, and have had to (or will have to) go elsewhere
> for: KDE 3.4.1 and some TTF-related libraries (to get around a crash bug
> in Tux Paint).
Two possibly useful resources as addenda to "straight Debian" -- that
not everyone knows about:
http://apt-get.org/ Various unofficial apt repositories.
http://backports.org/ Backports of leading-edge pkgs to Debian-stable.
Although Debian proper contains a very high number of packages, there
are always ones that for sundry reasons aren't yet packaged[1] (or are
prevented from being included by patent or licence-compatibility
problems, etc.). Those are often findable via apt-get.org packaged for
_various_ Debian branches, or through backports.org for the "stable"
Debian branch. Disadvantage: Being unofficial packages, these
offerings cannot be guaranteed to comply with Debian policy standards.
[1] apt-get.org lists an unofficial repository for KDE 3.4.1, for
example.
----- End forwarded message -----
----- Forwarded message from bruce coston <jane_ikari at yahoo.com> -----
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 12:48:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: bruce coston <jane_ikari at yahoo.com>
To: svlug at lists.svlug.org
Subject: Re: [svlug] svlug Digest, Vol 299, Issue 24
distro on laptop, just went throuogh my 12 distro oob
binge again and my impressions R:
k and ubuntu actually went on, a big improvement.
pc bsd worked but doesn't play so good with others.
the slack based cd's work well enough but i don't plan
on leaaving apt-get update etc.
PClinuxOS remains a good .rpm distro.
the latest mepis stays a notch down.
kaNOTix so improved i recommend it 1st for desktop and laptop!
----- End forwarded message -----
----- Forwarded message from Rick Moen <rick at linuxmafia.com> -----
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 13:32:43 -0700
To: svlug at lists.svlug.org
From: Rick Moen <rick at linuxmafia.com>
Subject: Re: [svlug] New question.. not really :) (was: svlug Digest, Vol 299,
Issue 24)
Quoting Bruce Coston (jane_ikari at yahoo.com):
> distro on laptop, just went throuogh my 12 distro oob
> binge again and my impressions R:
> k and ubuntu actually went on, a big improvement.
^
Just to clarify: Bruce is referring, here, to "Kubuntu".
Ubuntu is a desktop-oriented Debian derivative, oriented towards GNOME,
that forks off a copy of the debian-unstable package collection every
six months, performs maintenance on that fork separately from Debian
itself, and adds additional packages & enhancements by Ubuntu's
developers. It provides highly stable, leading-edge GNOME packages for
which commercial support is available through the sponsoring company,
Canonical, Ltd. -- plus an optional set of the surrounding
Debian-derived packages dubbed "universe". Each release will, they say,
occur six months from the previous one, and each will be supported for
at least 18 months. They have, thus far, met two release deadlines
right on schedule.
Kubuntu is the same system, except furnished with leading-edge KDE
desktop packages instead of GNOME ones. The two sets of desktop
packages can each be retrofitted to the _other_ sister distribution,
using a single command that fetches them from the Internet:
o On an Ubuntu system, type "apt-get install kubuntu-desktop" at
a root-user shell to fetch KDE packages.
o On a Kubuntu system, type "apt-get install ubuntu-desktop" at
a root-user shell to fetch GNOME packages.
All of the other Linux & BSD variants Bruce mentioned are likewise
desktop-oriented systems.
----- End forwarded message -----
----- Forwarded message from Bill Kendrick <nbs at sonic.net> -----
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 13:38:08 -0700
From: Bill Kendrick <nbs at sonic.net>
To: svlug at lists.svlug.org
Subject: Re: [svlug] New question.. not really :) (was: svlug Digest, Vol 299,
Issue 24)
On Fri, Jul 15, 2005 at 01:32:43PM -0700, Rick Moen wrote:
> Ubuntu is a desktop-oriented Debian derivative, oriented towards GNOME,
<snip>
> It provides highly stable, leading-edge GNOME packages for
> which commercial support is available through the sponsoring company,
> Canonical, Ltd.
<snip>
...and then...
> Kubuntu is the same system, except furnished with leading-edge KDE
> desktop packages instead of GNOME ones.
Who is responsible for Kubuntu? I'm guessing _not_ Canonical?
Is support provided? Do they have a similar 6-month schedule?
(I suppose I should hit the Kubuntu website at some point, sorry :^) )
Thx!
--
-bill! Picn*x14 --- Linux Anniversary Picnic & BBQ!
bill at newbreedsoftware.com Sunnyvale Baylands Park, Sunday, August 14th
http://newbreedsoftware.com/ http://linuxpicnic.org/ to RSVP & volunteer!
----- End forwarded message -----
----- Forwarded message from Rick Moen <rick at linuxmafia.com> -----
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 14:00:20 -0700
To: svlug at lists.svlug.org
From: Rick Moen <rick at linuxmafia.com>
Subject: Re: [svlug] New question.. not really :) (was: svlug Digest, Vol 299,
Issue 24)
Quoting Bill Kendrick (nbs at sonic.net):
> Who is responsible for Kubuntu? I'm guessing _not_ Canonical?
> Is support provided? Do they have a similar 6-month schedule?
> (I suppose I should hit the Kubuntu website at some point, sorry :^) )
No problem. I've been wanting to know the answer to that, myself. ;->
http://www.kubuntu.org/hoary-release.php says:
Kubuntu brings KDE to the Ubuntu world, creating a GNU/Linux
distribution from the solid base of Ubuntu and the world leading K
Desktop Environment. Kubuntu comes with the latest KDE 3.4 and the
promise of 18 months support.
[...]
Kubuntu is the result of several months effort to get KDE 3.4 into
Ubuntu's main repository and create the first major derived Ubuntu
distribution. It is not a fork of Ubuntu but an official project of it,
sharing the same package archive and infrastructure. It is possible to
convert an Ubuntu system to Kubuntu or vice versa.
Cool linguistic hack: According to the Kubuntu FAQ, "Kubuntu" is said
to mean "towards humanity" in Bemba (Bantu-family language spoken in
Zambia) -- just as "ubuntu" means (approximately) "humanity towards others"
in Zulu and Xhosa.
----- End forwarded message -----
----- Forwarded message from Andrew Stitt <a at t.armory.com> -----
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 11:37:11 -0700
From: Andrew Stitt <a at t.armory.com>
To: svlug at lists.svlug.org
Subject: Re: [svlug] New question.. not really :)
distrowatch.com is a good resource for learning about the various distros,
if nothing else how popular they are, and just how many livecds there
really are.
Their 'major distributions' page [0] has blurbs on the top ten most popular
distros and listings by category (liveCD, beginner friendly, source-based etc.).
Each distro has its own page which lists the versions of software it has for
each release/branch. You can see how up to date they actually are and
what software they offer.
[0] http://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=major
----- End forwarded message -----
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