From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Thu Jan 3 04:48:18 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Thu, 03 Jan 2013 04:48:18 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] can you suggest a docbook-friendly editor for ubuntu? In-Reply-To: <50E54D61.7030104@gmail.com> References: <50E54D61.7030104@gmail.com> Message-ID: <50E57E12.7080204@gmail.com> i'm new to docbook and want to try using it for all my teaching material. i know i can edit straight xml (i'm very comfortable with this) but i like the idea of a wysiwyg editor of some kind so i can see what i'm doing on the fly. suggestions? i'm told i can do this with libreoffice but i haven't quite worked out the process. i presume i need to save the file as an xml file but i don't see a docbook specific "save as" option. suggestions welcome. From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Thu Jan 3 11:11:52 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Thu, 03 Jan 2013 11:11:52 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] is there a way to open the clipboard in vi? Message-ID: <50E5D7F8.9070805@gmail.com> here's something i often do: select a portion of text in something (e.g. mail) open a terminal open a vi session paste what i selected into vi do some complicated manipulation that is trivial for me in vi (e.g. remove all email quote symbols) write vi file to tmp file cat tmp file select catted contents paste into the final destination computers are here to help us dammit, shouldn't this be an easy step? in my fantasy: select a portion of text in something (e.g. mail) magic shortcut OPENS SELECTION IN A VI SESSION edit to my hearts content close vi which writes the vi buffer back to the select buffer paste result in final destination is this possible? ubuntu From akkana at shallowsky.com Thu Jan 3 12:13:26 2013 From: akkana at shallowsky.com (Akkana Peck) Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 12:13:26 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] is there a way to open the clipboard in vi? In-Reply-To: <50E5D7F8.9070805@gmail.com> References: <50E5D7F8.9070805@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130103201326.GB5476@shallowsky.com> Michael Shiloh writes: > select a portion of text in something (e.g. mail) > magic shortcut OPENS SELECTION IN A VI SESSION > edit to my hearts content > close vi which writes the vi buffer back to the select buffer > paste result in final destination Install the xclip program, then do something like this: xclip -out -selection primary >/tmp/clip; vi /tmp/clip; xclip -in -selection primary < /tmp/clip Of course, you'd make that an alias if you wanted to do it very often. My vim adds a newline to files that don't initially have one, so if yours does too (I'm fairly sure that's a configuration option) you'd probably want to change that or call vi with a special config file. I've had some problems with xclip on multi-line selections, and I ended up writing a Python program to use instead. My python program eliminates newlines so you don't want to use it verbatim, but if you have any problems with multi-line selections you might want to consider an option like that -- and then you could call vi from the same script. http://shallowsky.com/blog/linux/open-selection-in-browser.html ...Akkana From grantbow at ubuntu.com Thu Jan 3 14:12:40 2013 From: grantbow at ubuntu.com (Grant Bowman) Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 14:12:40 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] can you suggest a docbook-friendly editor for ubuntu? In-Reply-To: <50E57E12.7080204@gmail.com> References: <50E54D61.7030104@gmail.com> <50E57E12.7080204@gmail.com> Message-ID: I am not very familiar with the details of docbook, but a google search for "docbook editor ubuntu" yielded this page: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DocBookEditors I hope this helps, Grant On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 4:48 AM, Michael Shiloh wrote: > i'm new to docbook and want to try using it for all my teaching material. > > i know i can edit straight xml (i'm very comfortable with this) but i > like the idea of a wysiwyg editor of some kind so i can see what i'm doing > on the fly. > > suggestions? > > i'm told i can do this with libreoffice but i haven't quite worked out the > process. i presume i need to save the file as an xml file but i don't see a > docbook specific "save as" option. > > suggestions welcome. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From einfeldt at gmail.com Thu Jan 3 16:30:34 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 16:30:34 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Quickest easiest way to upgrade from Ubuntu 10.10 to 12.04 Message-ID: Hi, I have an older notebook that is currently installed with Ubuntu 10.10. There is only 509 MB worth of files on the system. I am planning to just do a clean install, although I am also weighing the possibility of upgrading to 11.04 and then to 12.04, as I don't want to make sure that i have all of the apps that I want. What recommendations does the collective wisdom of this list have? Thanks. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From einfeldt at gmail.com Thu Jan 3 16:59:18 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 16:59:18 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Upgrading from Ubuntu 10.10 to 12.04 Message-ID: Hi, What is the simplest and quickest way to go from Ubuntu 10.10 to 12.04? I will be doing this on an older notebook with about 509 MB in data. I am thinking that it is best to just copy the data, and do a fresh install. The only problem with this is that I don't want to have to re-adjust any configs or re-add apps. I normally like to just use the Ubuntu upgrade manager, but I don't think that will work too well here, as I will need to upgrade from 10.10 to 11.04, then to 11.10, then to 12.04, which would be a pain. Thanks in advance. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Thu Jan 3 20:33:14 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 20:33:14 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Upgrading from Ubuntu 10.10 to 12.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Christian, I'd agree that the upgrade series would be a pain -- much more so if when you got to 12.04, you found you didn't like it or couldn't use it (maybe for performance reasons). What if you decide you need to drop back to lbuntu, and are faced the app reconfig for probably all new apps anyway. Maybe you will decide 10.10 wasn't so bad after all, so I'd recommend a whole system image backup as well as just your data, so you can restore things to what they are now. I'd say clean install the Ubuntu 12.04, but invest minimal time reconfiguring all your apps, just the most important ones, and see if it works for you (even if you replace Unity). Drop back to Lbuntu 12.04 if things seem too slow, and bite the bullet on configuring/importing data for the new apps (or just install the apps you feel you need). For older equipment, Ubuntu is less and less acceptable, with 12.04 looking like the end of the line for my 6 yr old Compaq laptop. I decided I liked Unity, but I have to run Unity 2D for performance reasons, and coupled with some Nvidia driver issues, things took months to fix things like the launch bar not appearing for mouse movements, and really slow window drag. The live media Ubuntu 12.10s I've looked at made me download some lbuntu isos to evaluate. Next time my laptop motherboard goes, I think I'll get something newer which gives me more choices. Ken -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Fri Jan 4 01:42:12 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2013 01:42:12 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Upgrading from Ubuntu 10.10 to 12.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <50E6A3F4.1030101@gmail.com> I too have been frustrated by Ubuntu's worsening performance on older equipment. I use Thinkpad T60s and T61. My main reason for sticking with Ubuntu has been that it seems to be the default package for releasing applications to a very broad Linux audience i.e. not necessarily uber geeks. Ken, is lbuntu a typo or a new variant I've not heard of? I googled but failed to turn anything up. On 01/03/2013 08:33 PM, Ken Shaffer wrote: > Hi Christian, > I'd agree that the upgrade series would be a pain -- much more so if when > you got to 12.04, you found you didn't like it or couldn't use it (maybe > for performance reasons). What if you decide you need to drop back to > lbuntu, and are faced the app reconfig for probably all new apps anyway. > Maybe you will decide 10.10 wasn't so bad after all, so I'd recommend a > whole system image backup as well as just your data, so you can restore > things to what they are now. I'd say clean install the Ubuntu 12.04, but > invest minimal time reconfiguring all your apps, just the most important > ones, and see if it works for you (even if you replace Unity). Drop back > to Lbuntu 12.04 if things seem too slow, and bite the bullet on > configuring/importing data for the new apps (or just install the apps you > feel you need). > For older equipment, Ubuntu is less and less acceptable, with 12.04 > looking like the end of the line for my 6 yr old Compaq laptop. I decided > I liked Unity, but I have to run Unity 2D for performance reasons, and > coupled with some Nvidia driver issues, things took months to fix things > like the launch bar not appearing for mouse movements, and really slow > window drag. The live media Ubuntu 12.10s I've looked at made me download > some lbuntu isos to evaluate. > Next time my laptop motherboard goes, I think I'll get something newer > which gives me more choices. > Ken > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Fri Jan 4 02:01:55 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2013 02:01:55 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] can you suggest a docbook-friendly editor for ubuntu? In-Reply-To: References: <50E54D61.7030104@gmail.com> <50E57E12.7080204@gmail.com> Message-ID: <50E6A893.6090308@gmail.com> Thanks Grant. I did see this list, but I was a little put off by the generally poor level of support for docbooks. I also thought this list was dated as it includes openoffice but not libreoffice. However I missed that lyx can work, and I use lyx for LaTeX so that would be a plus. Thanks, Michael On 01/03/2013 02:12 PM, Grant Bowman wrote: > I am not very familiar with the details of docbook, but a google > search for "docbook editor ubuntu" yielded this page: > > https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DocBookEditors > > I hope this helps, > > Grant > > > On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 4:48 AM, Michael Shiloh > wrote: >> i'm new to docbook and want to try using it for all my teaching material. >> >> i know i can edit straight xml (i'm very comfortable with this) but i >> like the idea of a wysiwyg editor of some kind so i can see what i'm doing >> on the fly. >> >> suggestions? >> >> i'm told i can do this with libreoffice but i haven't quite worked out the >> process. i presume i need to save the file as an xml file but i don't see a >> docbook specific "save as" option. >> >> suggestions welcome. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Fri Jan 4 09:26:12 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 09:26:12 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Upgrading from Ubuntu 10.10 to 12.04 In-Reply-To: <50E6A3F4.1030101@gmail.com> References: <50E6A3F4.1030101@gmail.com> Message-ID: Michael, That's Lubuntu, one of the choices at Ubuntu.com for lower power computers. Ken On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 1:42 AM, Michael Shiloh wrote: > I too have been frustrated by Ubuntu's worsening performance on older > equipment. I use Thinkpad T60s and T61. My main reason for sticking with > Ubuntu has been that it seems to be the default package for releasing > applications to a very broad Linux audience i.e. not necessarily uber geeks. > > Ken, is lbuntu a typo or a new variant I've not heard of? I googled but > failed to turn anything up. > > > On 01/03/2013 08:33 PM, Ken Shaffer wrote: > >> Hi Christian, >> I'd agree that the upgrade series would be a pain -- much more so if when >> you got to 12.04, you found you didn't like it or couldn't use it (maybe >> for performance reasons). What if you decide you need to drop back to >> lbuntu, and are faced the app reconfig for probably all new apps anyway. >> Maybe you will decide 10.10 wasn't so bad after all, so I'd recommend a >> whole system image backup as well as just your data, so you can restore >> things to what they are now. I'd say clean install the Ubuntu 12.04, but >> invest minimal time reconfiguring all your apps, just the most important >> ones, and see if it works for you (even if you replace Unity). Drop back >> to Lbuntu 12.04 if things seem too slow, and bite the bullet on >> configuring/importing data for the new apps (or just install the apps you >> feel you need). >> For older equipment, Ubuntu is less and less acceptable, with 12.04 >> looking like the end of the line for my 6 yr old Compaq laptop. I decided >> I liked Unity, but I have to run Unity 2D for performance reasons, and >> coupled with some Nvidia driver issues, things took months to fix things >> like the launch bar not appearing for mouse movements, and really slow >> window drag. The live media Ubuntu 12.10s I've looked at made me >> download >> some lbuntu isos to evaluate. >> Next time my laptop motherboard goes, I think I'll get something newer >> which gives me more choices. >> Ken >> >> >> >> ______________________________**_________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/**listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >> >> > ______________________________**_________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/**listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From grantbow at ubuntu.com Fri Jan 4 09:38:42 2013 From: grantbow at ubuntu.com (Grant Bowman) Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 09:38:42 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Upgrading from Ubuntu 10.10 to 12.04 In-Reply-To: References: <50E6A3F4.1030101@gmail.com> Message-ID: Right, technically it's a recognized flavor. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DerivativeTeam/Derivatives Grant On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 9:26 AM, Ken Shaffer wrote: > Michael, > That's Lubuntu, one of the choices at Ubuntu.com for lower power computers. > Ken > > > On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 1:42 AM, Michael Shiloh > wrote: >> >> I too have been frustrated by Ubuntu's worsening performance on older >> equipment. I use Thinkpad T60s and T61. My main reason for sticking with >> Ubuntu has been that it seems to be the default package for releasing >> applications to a very broad Linux audience i.e. not necessarily uber geeks. >> >> Ken, is lbuntu a typo or a new variant I've not heard of? I googled but >> failed to turn anything up. >> >> >> On 01/03/2013 08:33 PM, Ken Shaffer wrote: >>> >>> Hi Christian, >>> I'd agree that the upgrade series would be a pain -- much more so if when >>> you got to 12.04, you found you didn't like it or couldn't use it (maybe >>> for performance reasons). What if you decide you need to drop back to >>> lbuntu, and are faced the app reconfig for probably all new apps anyway. >>> Maybe you will decide 10.10 wasn't so bad after all, so I'd recommend a >>> whole system image backup as well as just your data, so you can restore >>> things to what they are now. I'd say clean install the Ubuntu 12.04, but >>> invest minimal time reconfiguring all your apps, just the most important >>> ones, and see if it works for you (even if you replace Unity). Drop back >>> to Lbuntu 12.04 if things seem too slow, and bite the bullet on >>> configuring/importing data for the new apps (or just install the apps you >>> feel you need). >>> For older equipment, Ubuntu is less and less acceptable, with 12.04 >>> looking like the end of the line for my 6 yr old Compaq laptop. I >>> decided >>> I liked Unity, but I have to run Unity 2D for performance reasons, and >>> coupled with some Nvidia driver issues, things took months to fix things >>> like the launch bar not appearing for mouse movements, and really slow >>> window drag. The live media Ubuntu 12.10s I've looked at made me >>> download >>> some lbuntu isos to evaluate. >>> Next time my laptop motherboard goes, I think I'll get something newer >>> which gives me more choices. >>> Ken >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> sf-lug mailing list >>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Fri Jan 4 13:18:56 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 13:18:56 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG meeting on Sunday In-Reply-To: <944566EF-10ED-4C2A-B9CA-6B50EDA4D4DF@yahoo.com> References: <50E6A3F4.1030101@gmail.com> <944566EF-10ED-4C2A-B9CA-6B50EDA4D4DF@yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 10:45 AM, John Strazzarino wrote: > Gonna do my best to be there....can you bring chumby? > > Will do, with the USB for the Debian chroot, keyboard and mouse! Ken -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Fri Jan 4 13:45:32 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2013 13:45:32 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Upgrading from Ubuntu 10.10 to 12.04 In-Reply-To: References: <50E6A3F4.1030101@gmail.com> Message-ID: <50E74D7C.9090701@gmail.com> Thanks. Checked it out. Main differences are 1) LXDE instead of unity 2) default apps selected to be lighter weight, but nothing preventing installation of other apps (if I need) Looks like a good deal to me. I'll check it out. I did once experiment with LXDE and quite enjoyed it. I can install LXDE and select it when I log in, without removing Unity, and pay only for the disc space. Michael On 01/04/2013 09:38 AM, Grant Bowman wrote: > Right, technically it's a recognized flavor. > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DerivativeTeam/Derivatives > > Grant > > > On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 9:26 AM, Ken Shaffer wrote: >> Michael, >> That's Lubuntu, one of the choices at Ubuntu.com for lower power computers. >> Ken >> >> >> On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 1:42 AM, Michael Shiloh >> wrote: >>> >>> I too have been frustrated by Ubuntu's worsening performance on older >>> equipment. I use Thinkpad T60s and T61. My main reason for sticking with >>> Ubuntu has been that it seems to be the default package for releasing >>> applications to a very broad Linux audience i.e. not necessarily uber geeks. >>> >>> Ken, is lbuntu a typo or a new variant I've not heard of? I googled but >>> failed to turn anything up. >>> >>> >>> On 01/03/2013 08:33 PM, Ken Shaffer wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi Christian, >>>> I'd agree that the upgrade series would be a pain -- much more so if when >>>> you got to 12.04, you found you didn't like it or couldn't use it (maybe >>>> for performance reasons). What if you decide you need to drop back to >>>> lbuntu, and are faced the app reconfig for probably all new apps anyway. >>>> Maybe you will decide 10.10 wasn't so bad after all, so I'd recommend a >>>> whole system image backup as well as just your data, so you can restore >>>> things to what they are now. I'd say clean install the Ubuntu 12.04, but >>>> invest minimal time reconfiguring all your apps, just the most important >>>> ones, and see if it works for you (even if you replace Unity). Drop back >>>> to Lbuntu 12.04 if things seem too slow, and bite the bullet on >>>> configuring/importing data for the new apps (or just install the apps you >>>> feel you need). >>>> For older equipment, Ubuntu is less and less acceptable, with 12.04 >>>> looking like the end of the line for my 6 yr old Compaq laptop. I >>>> decided >>>> I liked Unity, but I have to run Unity 2D for performance reasons, and >>>> coupled with some Nvidia driver issues, things took months to fix things >>>> like the launch bar not appearing for mouse movements, and really slow >>>> window drag. The live media Ubuntu 12.10s I've looked at made me >>>> download >>>> some lbuntu isos to evaluate. >>>> Next time my laptop motherboard goes, I think I'll get something newer >>>> which gives me more choices. >>>> Ken >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> sf-lug mailing list >>>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >>>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> sf-lug mailing list >>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > From jim at systemateka.com Fri Jan 4 15:57:17 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2013 15:57:17 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linux system administration class at Noisebridge on Tuesday 1-8 Message-ID: <1357343837.1942.60.camel@jim-LAPTOP> There's a Linux sysadm class in the Turing classroom at Noisebridge from 3 to 4:30 PM on Tuesdays with a recap later in the day from 6 to 7 PM. This coming Tuesday: text files on unix-ish systems along with an intro to vi and to vim features. Noisebridge is in SF on 2169 Mission Street between 17th and 18th on the third floor. Push buzzer to get in. https://noisebridge.net/wiki/Noisebridge From einfeldt at gmail.com Sat Jan 5 15:03:16 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 15:03:16 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Petition supporting FOSS Message-ID: Hi, Here is a petition that will encourage the Obama administration to support FOSS in gov. Please consider signing it and passing it along. Thx. http://wh.gov/Rz6C -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Sun Jan 6 14:39:53 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2013 14:39:53 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG meeting of Sunday 6 January 2013 Message-ID: <50E9FD39.5020804@dslextreme.com> Hi LUGgers, Well it was an interesting meeting today. John Strazzarino was there before me at the Cafe Enchante. He was very interested in seeing Ken Schaefer's Chumby running and Ken with his wife was in shortly thereafter. Ken's gadget today was not only the demo of the operating Chumby but an Ocopoid like USB Hub. Then as I was booting to Knoppix 7.04 a nice fellow named Nelson showed up briefly and then saying he need cash and the in-cafe ATM was out of order left to find $$ and food. He never returned so I hope he had no other problems. He was looking for help with his Lenova Linux install as all his support had moved East after doing a big update for him. He is a writer and needs his computer to be working. Next in was Jim Stockford and he came to help and learn. Playing with Knoppix I had tried to log out but in doing so was offered the chance to use KDE in the desktop environment and did so. This is KDE 4.7.4 and it was interesting as the set-up from the 4.5.4 that I use daily was not terribly different but there was a problem with over-sized widget(s) icons on the vertical panel. By the way the Knoppix is running on Kernel 3.4.9 I believe and usually boots to LXDE which can put up as many panels as KDE but makes it substantially harder to populate them with icons and widgets. Then Morgan cam in with a problem getting an older editor to run. We were not able to help him much though I personally sympathise because I used to use Textra on the Amiga and try to duplicated the features of that fine old tool using both KWrite and Kate to do the chores I used to accomplish with Textra. Finally Eric came in to show off his Nexus 7. This inspired a search on the tablet and on its larger brother the Nexus 10 both by Google but the 10 inch device is much more connectible and expensive. I looked up the specs for Jim and it is a very good fast multi-core with a separate core for Graphics and it shows about 2560 x 1600 in those 10 inches. Some one perhaps Ken raised the Raspberry Pi as a good usable computer which reminded me of the news from Team Amiga of "the MK802 Allwinner A10 Mini PC,the Other $35 Do-It-All Computer. Running Android 4.0, this about the size of a flash drive and, also like your favorite USB storage device, enjoys being plugged into things. HDMI inputs to be precise. Unlike flash drives, however, the MK802 also enjoys having things plugged into it. A keyboard. A mouse. A micro SD card. The little brick with the Android brain is truly a wonder of versatility and skill. . . ." We discussed the use of touch screens as well on full-sized desktop computers. I find them pointless for general computing but for kiosk and similar uses it was pointed out they have their places. 1:05 PM we adjourned. Thanks for the ride, Jim. Bobbie Sellers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at systemateka.com Sun Jan 6 14:53:20 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2013 14:53:20 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG meeting of Sunday 6 January 2013 In-Reply-To: <50E9FD39.5020804@dslextreme.com> References: <50E9FD39.5020804@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <1357512800.1942.92.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Nice report, Bobbie. Also, Eric mentioned that Canonical is releasing Ubuntu built on an Android kernel. This promises to run the same apps as those available for Ubuntu for "regular" computers, i.e. the same apps will run on an Android cellphone as run on a powerful tower or laptop. Assuming so, that's full integration across my mobile and less mobile devices, a real boon and an interesting countrast to the dumbing down trend of computing platforms in general. On Sun, 2013-01-06 at 14:39 -0800, Bobbie Sellers wrote: > Hi LUGgers, > Well it was an interesting meeting today. > John Strazzarino was there before me at the Cafe Enchante. > He was very interested in seeing Ken Schaefer's Chumby running > and Ken with his wife was in shortly thereafter. Ken's > gadget today was not only the demo of the operating Chumby > but an Ocopoid like USB Hub. > Then as I was booting to Knoppix 7.04 a nice fellow named > Nelson showed up briefly and then saying he need cash and > the in-cafe ATM was out of order left to find $$ and food. > He never returned so I hope he had no other problems. He was > looking for help with his Lenova Linux install as all his support > had moved East after doing a big update for him. He is a writer > and needs his computer to be working. > Next in was Jim Stockford and he came to help and learn. > > Playing with Knoppix I had tried to log out but in doing so > was offered the chance to use KDE in the desktop environment > and did so. This is KDE 4.7.4 and it was interesting as the > set-up from the 4.5.4 that I use daily was not terribly different > but there was a problem with over-sized widget(s) icons on > the vertical panel. > > By the way the Knoppix is running on Kernel 3.4.9 I believe > and usually boots to LXDE which can put up as many panels > as KDE but makes it substantially harder to populate them with > icons and widgets. > > Then Morgan cam in with a problem getting an older editor > to run. We were not able to help him much though I personally > sympathise because I used to use Textra on the Amiga and try > to duplicated the features of that fine old tool using both > KWrite and Kate to do the chores I used to accomplish with > Textra. > > Finally Eric came in to show off his Nexus 7. This inspired > a search on the tablet and on its larger brother the Nexus 10 > both by Google but the 10 inch device is much more connectible > and expensive. I looked up the specs for Jim and it is a very > good fast multi-core with a separate core for Graphics and it > shows about 2560 x 1600 in those 10 inches. > > Some one perhaps Ken raised the Raspberry Pi as a good > usable computer which reminded me of the news from Team > Amiga of "the MK802 Allwinner A10 Mini PC,the Other $35 > Do-It-All Computer. Running Android 4.0, this about the size > of a flash drive and, also like your favorite USB storage device, > enjoys being plugged into things. HDMI inputs to be precise. > Unlike flash drives, however, the MK802 also enjoys having > things plugged into it. A keyboard. A mouse. A micro SD card. > The little brick with the Android brain is truly a wonder > of versatility and skill. . . ." > > > > We discussed the use of touch screens as well on full-sized > desktop > computers. I find them pointless for general computing but for > kiosk and similar uses it was pointed out they have their places. > > 1:05 PM we adjourned. > > Thanks for the ride, Jim. > > Bobbie Sellers > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From grantbow at ubuntu.com Sun Jan 6 16:25:06 2013 From: grantbow at ubuntu.com (Grant Bowman) Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 16:25:06 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG meeting of Sunday 6 January 2013 In-Reply-To: <1357512800.1942.92.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <50E9FD39.5020804@dslextreme.com> <1357512800.1942.92.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: I would appreciate anyone who would like to share their perspective on our recent discussion of a feature added to 12.10 and 13.04. https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-ca/2012-December/thread.html The subject is "RMS vs. Amazon search results feature". Thanks, Grant On Sun, Jan 6, 2013 at 2:53 PM, jim wrote: > Nice report, Bobbie. > Also, Eric mentioned that Canonical is releasing > Ubuntu built on an Android kernel. This promises to > run the same apps as those available for Ubuntu for > "regular" computers, i.e. the same apps will run on > an Android cellphone as run on a powerful tower or > laptop. Assuming so, that's full integration across > my mobile and less mobile devices, a real boon and > an interesting countrast to the dumbing down trend > of computing platforms in general. > > > > > On Sun, 2013-01-06 at 14:39 -0800, Bobbie Sellers wrote: >> Hi LUGgers, >> Well it was an interesting meeting today. >> John Strazzarino was there before me at the Cafe Enchante. >> He was very interested in seeing Ken Schaefer's Chumby running >> and Ken with his wife was in shortly thereafter. Ken's >> gadget today was not only the demo of the operating Chumby >> but an Ocopoid like USB Hub. >> Then as I was booting to Knoppix 7.04 a nice fellow named >> Nelson showed up briefly and then saying he need cash and >> the in-cafe ATM was out of order left to find $$ and food. >> He never returned so I hope he had no other problems. He was >> looking for help with his Lenova Linux install as all his support >> had moved East after doing a big update for him. He is a writer >> and needs his computer to be working. >> Next in was Jim Stockford and he came to help and learn. >> >> Playing with Knoppix I had tried to log out but in doing so >> was offered the chance to use KDE in the desktop environment >> and did so. This is KDE 4.7.4 and it was interesting as the >> set-up from the 4.5.4 that I use daily was not terribly different >> but there was a problem with over-sized widget(s) icons on >> the vertical panel. >> >> By the way the Knoppix is running on Kernel 3.4.9 I believe >> and usually boots to LXDE which can put up as many panels >> as KDE but makes it substantially harder to populate them with >> icons and widgets. >> >> Then Morgan cam in with a problem getting an older editor >> to run. We were not able to help him much though I personally >> sympathise because I used to use Textra on the Amiga and try >> to duplicated the features of that fine old tool using both >> KWrite and Kate to do the chores I used to accomplish with >> Textra. >> >> Finally Eric came in to show off his Nexus 7. This inspired >> a search on the tablet and on its larger brother the Nexus 10 >> both by Google but the 10 inch device is much more connectible >> and expensive. I looked up the specs for Jim and it is a very >> good fast multi-core with a separate core for Graphics and it >> shows about 2560 x 1600 in those 10 inches. >> >> Some one perhaps Ken raised the Raspberry Pi as a good >> usable computer which reminded me of the news from Team >> Amiga of "the MK802 Allwinner A10 Mini PC,the Other $35 >> Do-It-All Computer. Running Android 4.0, this about the size >> of a flash drive and, also like your favorite USB storage device, >> enjoys being plugged into things. HDMI inputs to be precise. >> Unlike flash drives, however, the MK802 also enjoys having >> things plugged into it. A keyboard. A mouse. A micro SD card. >> The little brick with the Android brain is truly a wonder >> of versatility and skill. . . ." >> >> >> >> We discussed the use of touch screens as well on full-sized >> desktop >> computers. I find them pointless for general computing but for >> kiosk and similar uses it was pointed out they have their places. >> >> 1:05 PM we adjourned. >> >> Thanks for the ride, Jim. >> >> Bobbie Sellers From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Mon Jan 7 09:33:08 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 09:33:08 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one Message-ID: Finally, some progress on Launchpad's bug number one ( https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu) Critical In Progress #1 Microsoft has a majority market share http://www.zdnet.com/amazons-top-selling-laptop-doesnt-run-windows-or-mac-os-it-runs-linux-7000009433/ Looks like it's already a very good year for Linux! Ken -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From larry.cafiero at gmail.com Mon Jan 7 10:06:01 2013 From: larry.cafiero at gmail.com (Larry Cafiero) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 10:06:01 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Quick question: How does this article about an Android-based laptop fix this Ubuntu bug? On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 9:33 AM, Ken Shaffer wrote: > Finally, some progress on Launchpad's bug number one > (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu) > > Critical In Progress #1 Microsoft has a majority market share > > http://www.zdnet.com/amazons-top-selling-laptop-doesnt-run-windows-or-mac-os-it-runs-linux-7000009433/ > > Looks like it's already a very good year for Linux! > Ken > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 7 10:13:25 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 10:13:25 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Larry Cafiero (larry.cafiero at gmail.com): > Quick question: How does this article about an Android-based laptop > fix this Ubuntu bug? 1. Google ChromeOS is not Android. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Chrome_OS#Relationship_to_Android ChromeOS is a rather anaemic desktop Linux distro that's heavily reliant on Google's proprietary Chrome Web browser and pushes the user towards Google online hosting of data (with offline caching of many SaaS apps' files). 2. Ken's supposition is that Amazon selling a Linux-based netbook is significant progress towards lessening of Microsoft Corporation market share. From larry.cafiero at gmail.com Mon Jan 7 10:23:42 2013 From: larry.cafiero at gmail.com (Larry Cafiero) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 10:23:42 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: So noted and I stand corrected. I was wondering aloud whether credit was being given (e.g., to Ubuntu) where credit wasn't due. Larry Cafiero On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:13 AM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Larry Cafiero (larry.cafiero at gmail.com): > >> Quick question: How does this article about an Android-based laptop >> fix this Ubuntu bug? > > 1. Google ChromeOS is not Android. > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Chrome_OS#Relationship_to_Android > ChromeOS is a rather anaemic desktop Linux distro that's heavily reliant > on Google's proprietary Chrome Web browser and pushes the user towards > Google online hosting of data (with offline caching of many SaaS apps' > files). > > 2. Ken's supposition is that Amazon selling a Linux-based netbook is > significant progress towards lessening of Microsoft Corporation market > share. > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 7 11:03:50 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:03:50 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Larry Cafiero (larry.cafiero at gmail.com): > So noted and I stand corrected. I was wondering aloud whether credit > was being given (e.g., to Ubuntu) where credit wasn't due. References to Ubuntu's bug #1 are a latter-day substitute for Torvalds's old world-domination joke and Bob Young's old joke that he didn't want to make Red Hat Software as big as Microsoft Corporation, so much as he wanted to make Microsoft Corporation as small as Red Hat Software. Can't blame newcomers for thinking Canonical, Ltd. invented the concept: Many just don't know better. Anyway: Proprietary OS (MS-Windows) with user control over and local custody of their data is hypothesised to lose market share to proprietary OS (Chrome OS) heavily reliant on cloud hosting (unless using non-default offline operation where available), whose OS publisher specialises in tracking users and gets custody of the user's data and builds real-time metrics on just about everything he/she does. Um, yay? From ehud.kaldor at gmail.com Mon Jan 7 11:21:09 2013 From: ehud.kaldor at gmail.com (Ehud Kaldor) Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 11:21:09 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at systemateka.com Mon Jan 7 11:26:41 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 11:26:41 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] ISP for SF residence Message-ID: <1357586801.1942.191.camel@jim-LAPTOP> (with abject apologies for not keeping track) A friend of mine needs to set up internet access in her new apartment on 25th Street near Castro. I've recommended Monkeybrains and Sonic.net. I know Rick's mentioned another small, independent business but can't find the name via search engine keywords ("ISP" "San Francisco" "residential" "DSL" and so on). I'll be grateful for any recommendations in addition to Sonic.net and Monkeybrains. with thanks, jim From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 7 11:41:48 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:41:48 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] ISP for SF residence In-Reply-To: <1357586801.1942.191.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1357586801.1942.191.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130107194148.GH14622@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Jim Stockford (jim at systemateka.com): > A friend of mine needs to set up internet access > in her new apartment on 25th Street near Castro. I've > recommended Monkeybrains and Sonic.net. I know Rick's > mentioned another small, independent business but > can't find the name via search engine keywords ("ISP" > "San Francisco" "residential" "DSL" and so on). Mike Durkin's Raw Bandwidth Communications, http://www.rawbandwidth.com/ . Raw Bandwidth is most appropriate, IMO, for technically competent customers not needing ongoing handholding. From einfeldt at gmail.com Mon Jan 7 11:44:13 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:44:13 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: hi, On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 11:03 AM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Larry Cafiero (larry.cafiero at gmail.com): > > > So noted and I stand corrected. I was wondering aloud whether credit > > was being given (e.g., to Ubuntu) where credit wasn't due. > > Anyway: Proprietary OS (MS-Windows) with user control over and local > custody of their data is hypothesised to lose market share to > proprietary OS (Chrome OS) >From Wikipedia: *Google Chrome OS* is a Linux-based operating systemdesigned by Google to work exclusively with web applications . Google announced the operating system on July 7, 2009 and made it an open sourceproject, called Chromium OS , in November 2009.[3] [4] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Chrome_OS =========== One of the biggest challenges for free software is bringing money into FOSS communities. I see Google as being more FOSS-friendly than Microsoft, and so I am happy to see Google ChromeOS grow in popularity, and if selling ChromeOS notebooks is going to help that, I am happy about that. > heavily reliant on cloud hosting (unless > using non-default offline operation where available), whose OS > publisher specialises in tracking users and gets custody of the user's > data and builds real-time metrics on just about everything he/she does. > Um, yay? > These are some serious issues with ChromeOS. Rick's point is well taken, that we could go from the frying pan (Microsoft) to the fire (Google tracking). But we have to start somewhere, and if Google ChromeOS will help people see that it is easy to use GUIs other than just Microsoft offerings, I am in favor of it. I don't see Microsoft making serious contributions to the Linux kernel, but Google does. Google has its summer of code project. Google uses Goobuntu internally, and pays Canonical for support, and Canonical, in turn, provides me with my free (libre and beer) OS. I would love it if everyone would follow Larry Cafiero's example and give to the distro of their choice. http://larrythefreesoftwareguy.wordpress.com/2012/10/22/money-meet-mouth/ But until that happens, FOSS communities need to partner with commercial entities, and those commercial entities are going to have warts. We need to engage with Google to move them toward less intrusiveness and more freedom. But at least Google is heavily dependent on free software for their survival, which is not true of Microsoft. So Ken's point is well-taken: the success of ChromeOS is a step forward. tick's point is that it is also a half-step back, which is also well-taken, but at least that moves us forward one half-step net. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 7 11:46:15 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:46:15 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Ehud Kaldor (ehud.kaldor at gmail.com): > one could argue that if those cloud hosting services belong to the same > company making the OS, the only difference is the location of the > persistent bits. it would be great if you can port Chrome OS to use > other services, or maybe your own home server. Very valid point: A thin client is not a problem if you can migrate to use your choice of back end including a do-your-own one. However, I get the impression ChromeOS has a secret-sauce problem in that area. I certainly could be quite wrong, having not looked closely. However, one reason I haven't looked closely is that, if someone gave me a somewhat hardware-anaemic Atom-based netbook preloaded with ChromeOS, probably the first thing I'd do is overwrite the preload with my preference in standalone (and genuinely open source) Linux distro. From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 7 12:01:31 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 12:01:31 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130107200131.GD17505@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Christian Einfeldt (einfeldt at gmail.com): > One of the biggest challenges for free software is bringing money into > FOSS communities. This is the traditional excuse for pretty much every grab of user privacy and money. E.g., Canonical has trotted it out repeatedly. > I see Google as being more FOSS-friendly than Microsoft, and so I am > happy to see Google ChromeOS grow in popularity.... Statement is non-sequitur because it conflates the merit of Google, Inc. with that of ChromeOS preloads. Those are distinct things. > I don't see Microsoft making serious contributions to the Linux > kernel, but Google does. Conflates the merit of Google, Inc. with that of ChromeOS preloads. Those are distinct things. > But until that happens, FOSS communities need to partner with commercial > entities, and those commercial entities are going to have warts. Going from a proprietary OS where you at least have local control of data to a proprietary OS where by default you don't (and are data-mined pretty much on everything you do) is 'warts'? Dermatology is not for you, then. > But at least Google is heavily dependent on free software for > their survival.... Clue: Google, Inc. bought DoubleClick for US$3.1 billion cash in 2008. What does that tell you about who are their customers, and who are their product? > Rick's point is well taken, that we could go from the frying pan > (Microsoft) to the fire (Google tracking). But we have to start > somewhere, and if Google ChromeOS will help people see that it is easy > to use GUIs other than just Microsoft offerings, I am in favor of it. I'm not stopping you from buying a pallet full, man. Go to town! From einfeldt at gmail.com Mon Jan 7 12:19:35 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 12:19:35 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <20130107200131.GD17505@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107200131.GD17505@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: Hi, On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 12:01 PM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Christian Einfeldt (einfeldt at gmail.com): > > > One of the biggest challenges for free software is bringing money into > > FOSS communities. > > This is the traditional excuse for pretty much every grab of user > privacy and money. E.g., Canonical has trotted it out repeatedly. > I am pretty happy with Canonical's behavior, over all. They are not perfect, but then again, who is perfect? Richard Stallman? How is the FOSS community going to achieve mass adoption? Mass adoption is important to me, because when Linux is mainstream, I won't be forced to use Microsoft Windows when I am in my employer's office. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 7 12:43:27 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 12:43:27 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107200131.GD17505@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130107204327.GE17505@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Christian Einfeldt (einfeldt at gmail.com): > I am pretty happy with Canonical's behavior, over all. I'm glad you're happy, and that so very little is required to make you satisfied. > How is the FOSS community going to achieve mass adoption? You keep asking me such questions -- as you have at intervals over the past decade without apparently learning anything -- as if they were somehow my problem[0], which fundamental assumption I long ago pointed out is simply incorrect: 1. My world would not be materially improved by mass adoption or lack thereof of pretty much anything.[1] 2. There is no reason to think that a 'mass-market' commercial success based on the Linux kernel would be open source in any significant way, and you yourself have just provided yet another counter-example in the form of ChromeOS. As really ought to be extremely obvious, it's really easy to host dismal proprietary rubbish atop Linux. Your assumption that you would not be asked under contract from your employer to use dismal proprietary rubbish if 'Linux is mainstream' is very obviously a total non-sequitur. [0] And using clueless antimarketing like the inept term 'FOSS'. http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=882 [1] However, FWIW every TiVo, every Android-based smartphone and tablet, and every embedded Linux SOHO WAP is mass adoption. Your proprietary-desktop world is not all of computing. From jim at systemateka.com Mon Jan 7 16:58:44 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 16:58:44 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] ISP for SF residence In-Reply-To: <20130107194148.GH14622@linuxmafia.com> References: <1357586801.1942.191.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130107194148.GH14622@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1357606724.1942.256.camel@jim-LAPTOP> My thanks to you (and Bobby, who replied off-list). Here's what I've recommended to my friend in Noe Valley of San Francisco: http://www.sonic.net/ http://www.monkeybrains.net http://www.dslextreme.com/ http://www.rawbandwidth.com/ On Mon, 2013-01-07 at 11:41 -0800, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Jim Stockford (jim at systemateka.com): > > > A friend of mine needs to set up internet access > > in her new apartment on 25th Street near Castro. I've > > recommended Monkeybrains and Sonic.net. I know Rick's > > mentioned another small, independent business but > > can't find the name via search engine keywords ("ISP" > > "San Francisco" "residential" "DSL" and so on). > > Mike Durkin's Raw Bandwidth Communications, http://www.rawbandwidth.com/ . > > Raw Bandwidth is most appropriate, IMO, for technically competent > customers not needing ongoing handholding. > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From akkana at shallowsky.com Mon Jan 7 19:06:50 2013 From: akkana at shallowsky.com (Akkana Peck) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 19:06:50 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130108030649.GA1767@shallowsky.com> Rick Moen writes: > one reason I haven't looked closely is that, if someone gave me a > somewhat hardware-anaemic Atom-based netbook preloaded with ChromeOS, > probably the first thing I'd do is overwrite the preload with my > preference in standalone (and genuinely open source) Linux distro. Unfortunately, it's not as easy as that. At least, most of the x86 Chromebooks have firmware that can only boot specific signed kernels. You can install another distro, either instead of ChromeOS or in a separate partition as a dual-boot; but it has to be a distro that's capable of running with Google's signed ChromeOS kernels. So you can't run something like Debian Squeeze that uses an older version of udev, for example. My impression is that ARM models, like the model under discussion, are worse -- harder to bypass UEFI, harder to find a distro that works with any given kernel. But that's just rumor and may be wrong. I'd love to hear a firsthand account of someone installing a full Linux distro on one. Looks like nice hardware! Wish they'd sell it with a less restrictive BIOS. But consider this: however annoying the ChromeOS restrictions are, weaning people from proprietary office suites and into cloud apps also makes it more possible for them to use Linux -- a real one, not ChromeOS -- next time they buy a machine. It makes them more OS agnostic, and may also make them more open to the idea of using other cloud servers some day. So while I may chafe at the restrictions and privacy implications of ChromeOS, I still see Chromebook sales as a good sign for Linux. A small step, but it's in the right direction. ...Akkana From ehud.kaldor at gmail.com Mon Jan 7 22:19:01 2013 From: ehud.kaldor at gmail.com (Ehud Kaldor) Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 22:19:01 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <20130108030649.GA1767@shallowsky.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> <20130108030649.GA1767@shallowsky.com> Message-ID: <50EBBA55.6020608@gmail.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kevinjsmith+lug at gmail.com Mon Jan 7 22:49:17 2013 From: kevinjsmith+lug at gmail.com (Kevin J. Smith) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 22:49:17 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <50EBBA55.6020608@gmail.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> <20130108030649.GA1767@shallowsky.com> <50EBBA55.6020608@gmail.com> Message-ID: >From the Chromium OS site (open-source project for ChromeOS), this page has links to how to enable "Developer Mode" - which allows for booting into a non-signed OS http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-for-chrome-os-devices Based on a cursory Googling, appears that they have guides for installing Ubuntu and Debian on many of the devices. On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:19 PM, Ehud Kaldor wrote: > Akkana wrote: > > At least, most of the > x86 Chromebooks have firmware that can only boot specific signed > kernels. You can install another distro, either instead of ChromeOS > or in a separate partition as a dual-boot; but it has to be a distro > that's capable of running with Google's signed ChromeOS kernels. > > there is a hack available out there to disable this signing check. I > vaugely remember there is a physical switch you can move if you take out > the battery, and then it will warn you about dragons and will boot unsigned. > > Cheers, > Ehud > > On 01/07/2013 07:06 PM, Akkana Peck wrote: > > Rick Moen writes: > > one reason I haven't looked closely is that, if someone gave me a > somewhat hardware-anaemic Atom-based netbook preloaded with ChromeOS, > probably the first thing I'd do is overwrite the preload with my > preference in standalone (and genuinely open source) Linux distro. > > Unfortunately, it's not as easy as that. At least, most of the > x86 Chromebooks have firmware that can only boot specific signed > kernels. You can install another distro, either instead of ChromeOS > or in a separate partition as a dual-boot; but it has to be a distro > that's capable of running with Google's signed ChromeOS kernels. > So you can't run something like Debian Squeeze that uses an older > version of udev, for example. > > My impression is that ARM models, like the model under discussion, > are worse -- harder to bypass UEFI, harder to find a distro that > works with any given kernel. But that's just rumor and may be wrong. > I'd love to hear a firsthand account of someone installing a full > Linux distro on one. Looks like nice hardware! Wish they'd sell > it with a less restrictive BIOS. > > But consider this: however annoying the ChromeOS restrictions are, > weaning people from proprietary office suites and into cloud apps > also makes it more possible for them to use Linux -- a real one, > not ChromeOS -- next time they buy a machine. It makes them more > OS agnostic, and may also make them more open to the idea of using > other cloud servers some day. So while I may chafe at the > restrictions and privacy implications of ChromeOS, I still see > Chromebook sales as a good sign for Linux. A small step, but it's > in the right direction. > > ...Akkana > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing listsf-lug at linuxmafia.comhttp://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 7 23:55:55 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 23:55:55 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <50EBBA55.6020608@gmail.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> <20130108030649.GA1767@shallowsky.com> <50EBBA55.6020608@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130108075555.GP14622@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Ehud Kaldor (ehud.kaldor at gmail.com): > Akkana wrote: > > At least, most of the > x86 Chromebooks have firmware that can only boot specific signed > kernels. You can install another distro, either instead of ChromeOS > or in a separate partition as a dual-boot; but it has to be a distro > that's capable of running with Google's signed ChromeOS kernels. Yes, it's called developer mode, and is selected via a toggle switch. https://sites.google.com/site/chromeoswikisite/home/what-s-new-in-dev-and-beta/developer-mode It's not even a 'hack' in the sense of needing to engineer a way to break in, but rather something deliberately built in. From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue Jan 8 07:42:53 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 07:42:53 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <20130108075555.GP14622@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> <20130108030649.GA1767@shallowsky.com> <50EBBA55.6020608@gmail.com> <20130108075555.GP14622@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130108154253.GA15149@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Akkana Peck (akkana at shallowsky.com): > But consider this: however annoying the ChromeOS restrictions are, > weaning people from proprietary office suites and into cloud apps > also makes it more possible for them to use Linux -- a real one, > not ChromeOS -- next time they buy a machine. It makes them more > OS agnostic, and may also make them more open to the idea of using > other cloud servers some day. Christian's specific claim, to which I was responding, was that 'when Linux is mainstream, I won't be forced to use Microsoft Windows when I am in my employer's office'[1]. He thinks wide adoption of open source (which he calls 'FOSS') would somehow automatically ensue from mass availability of Linux-based preloads.[2] There are all sorts of magical thinking in that train of thought, and it flies in the face of available data. 1. There is a long history of Linux-based preloads sucking when they become available from major OEMs. 2. Nothing whatsoever prevents his employer from mandating use of terrible, bloated, highly restricted software that happens to run on Linux just as it now does with MS-Windows 7. 3. In fact, nothing whatsoever prevents Microsoft Corporation, if it wished to, to port and offer all of its current userspace software on x86 Linux and glibc. (Please note that Microsoft Corporation has already released general-usage software for Linux.[3]) Nothing about Linux requires userspace applications to be open source, and its wide adoption in no wise automatically weans people from proprietary office suites. In fact, in my experience, handing commodity IT users an already installed Linux installation doesn't even make them 'OS agnostic', because they are not really particularly cognisant of operating systems being a choice. To the great majority, the operating system is just the thing that came on the box, and they accomodate themselves to its quirks just as they'll accomodate themselves to whatever arrives already present on the next one. I'm frankly really rather tired of hearing pseudo-messianic bullshit about Linux desktop environments from disgrunted Microsoft software users. No, we of the Linux community are not a cudgel they can wield to make their employers more clueful, and no, the mere fact that our kernel and C library are copylefted doesn't mandate all offerings based on them automatically being vehicles for world reform. [1] http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2013q1/009757.html [2] http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2013q1/009754.html [3] Microsoft NetShow Revision 2.00, Build 251 beta (aka Media Player), statically linked ia32 Linux binary and related Web page, mirrored here: http://linuxmafia.com/pub/linux/apps/netshow_linux.html http://linuxmafia.com/pub/linux/apps/netshow_linux.gz From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Tue Jan 8 08:20:31 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2013 08:20:31 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> <20130108030649.GA1767@shallowsky.com> <50EBBA55.6020608@gmail.com> Message-ID: <50EC474F.408@gmail.com> so now we have to root our laptops and desktops as well... On 01/07/2013 10:49 PM, Kevin J. Smith wrote: > From the Chromium OS site (open-source project for ChromeOS), this page has > links to how to enable "Developer Mode" - which allows for booting into a > non-signed OS > > http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-for-chrome-os-devices > > Based on a cursory Googling, appears that they have guides for installing > Ubuntu and Debian on many of the devices. > > On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:19 PM, Ehud Kaldor wrote: > >> Akkana wrote: >> >> At least, most of the >> x86 Chromebooks have firmware that can only boot specific signed >> kernels. You can install another distro, either instead of ChromeOS >> or in a separate partition as a dual-boot; but it has to be a distro >> that's capable of running with Google's signed ChromeOS kernels. >> >> there is a hack available out there to disable this signing check. I >> vaugely remember there is a physical switch you can move if you take out >> the battery, and then it will warn you about dragons and will boot unsigned. >> >> Cheers, >> Ehud >> >> On 01/07/2013 07:06 PM, Akkana Peck wrote: >> >> Rick Moen writes: >> >> one reason I haven't looked closely is that, if someone gave me a >> somewhat hardware-anaemic Atom-based netbook preloaded with ChromeOS, >> probably the first thing I'd do is overwrite the preload with my >> preference in standalone (and genuinely open source) Linux distro. >> >> Unfortunately, it's not as easy as that. At least, most of the >> x86 Chromebooks have firmware that can only boot specific signed >> kernels. You can install another distro, either instead of ChromeOS >> or in a separate partition as a dual-boot; but it has to be a distro >> that's capable of running with Google's signed ChromeOS kernels. >> So you can't run something like Debian Squeeze that uses an older >> version of udev, for example. >> >> My impression is that ARM models, like the model under discussion, >> are worse -- harder to bypass UEFI, harder to find a distro that >> works with any given kernel. But that's just rumor and may be wrong. >> I'd love to hear a firsthand account of someone installing a full >> Linux distro on one. Looks like nice hardware! Wish they'd sell >> it with a less restrictive BIOS. >> >> But consider this: however annoying the ChromeOS restrictions are, >> weaning people from proprietary office suites and into cloud apps >> also makes it more possible for them to use Linux -- a real one, >> not ChromeOS -- next time they buy a machine. It makes them more >> OS agnostic, and may also make them more open to the idea of using >> other cloud servers some day. So while I may chafe at the >> restrictions and privacy implications of ChromeOS, I still see >> Chromebook sales as a good sign for Linux. A small step, but it's >> in the right direction. >> >> ...Akkana >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing listsf-lug at linuxmafia.comhttp://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Tue Jan 8 12:51:23 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 12:51:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1357678283.31262.YahooMailRC@web181406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From akkana at shallowsky.com Wed Jan 9 19:34:09 2013 From: akkana at shallowsky.com (Akkana Peck) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 19:34:09 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <20130108075555.GP14622@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> <20130108030649.GA1767@shallowsky.com> <50EBBA55.6020608@gmail.com> <20130108075555.GP14622@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130110033408.GB1781@shallowsky.com> Rick Moen writes: > Yes, it's called developer mode, and is selected via a toggle switch. > https://sites.google.com/site/chromeoswikisite/home/what-s-new-in-dev-and-beta/developer-mode > > It's not even a 'hack' in the sense of needing to engineer a way to > break in, but rather something deliberately built in. Developer Mode doesn't solve the kernel problem and give you an unrestricted machine, though it does let you boot other distros if you have a working signed kernel. (Also it gives you access to useful things like a console with a reasonably capable shell.) I just checked with my Chromebook expert (I don't actually own one of these beasts myself) and I had a few things wrong. You can boot from your own self-signed kernel, as long as it's monolithic (Chromebooks, or at least some of them, can't boot with an initrd). Building such a kernel a lot of work, though, and nearly everyone finds it easier just to use Google's kernel, which works pretty well with nearly all Linux distros (except when it breaks, like when they arbitrarily removed the USB ethernet drivers for a month or two). There seems to be some disagreement on whether you can boot a Chromebook from a USB disk that's not signed by Google. If it's possible, it's not easy. On some models, like the CR48, it's apparently possible to re-flash to a normal BIOS, and turn it into a normal laptop rather than a Chromebook. Newer models, especially ARM ones, are presumably UEFI and don't have that option. ...Akkana From rick at linuxmafia.com Wed Jan 9 19:55:54 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 19:55:54 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Big progress on launchpad's bug number one In-Reply-To: <20130110033408.GB1781@shallowsky.com> References: <20130107181325.GD14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130107190350.GG14622@linuxmafia.com> <50EB2025.9030405@gmail.com> <20130107194615.GC17505@linuxmafia.com> <20130108030649.GA1767@shallowsky.com> <50EBBA55.6020608@gmail.com> <20130108075555.GP14622@linuxmafia.com> <20130110033408.GB1781@shallowsky.com> Message-ID: <20130110035554.GL14622@linuxmafia.com> Akkana, thanks for the details. Quoting Akkana Peck (akkana at shallowsky.com): > Newer models, especially ARM ones, are presumably UEFI and don't have > that option. I hear that the UEFI on ARM-based models is a total roadblock (short of reflashing or replacing the ROM), making those purely locked-down appliances and not general-purpose computers. From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Thu Jan 10 13:56:40 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 13:56:40 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] BALUG Tu 2013-01-15: Grant Bowman: ubuntu-california.org Q&A; & other BALUG news Message-ID: <20130110135640.13634j5enzstdesk@webmail.rawbw.com> BALUG Tu 2013-01-15: Grant Bowman: ubuntu-california.org Q&A; & other BALUG news ------------------------------ items, details further below: BALUG Tu 2013-01-15: Grant Bowman: ubuntu-california.org Q&A BALUG Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana Petition US Government - free / open source software in schools Book(s), CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. "slides" from: BALUG 2012-07-17 screen(1) presented by Michael Paoli volunteering to help BALUG Twitter https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Bay Area Linux User Group (BALUG) meeting Tuesday 6:30 P.M. 2013-01-15 For our 2013-01-15 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Grant Bowman - ubuntu-california.org[1] Q&A Everything you ever wanted to know about the California Team and the Ubuntu community. How to represent Ubuntu[2] in local Linux User Groups and participate online and around the world in the semi-annual Ubuntu community events scheduled around the six month Ubuntu release cadence in April and October. Mr. Bowman has been a consultant and Internet professional for over twenty years and is presently a Director of Partimus[3]. He is one of three elected ubuntu-california.org[1] leaders, an Ubuntu Member, Fedora[4] Ambassador[5] and former employee of suse.com[6]. He is active with berkeleylug.com[7], noisebridge.net[8], SF-LUG[9] and DVLUG[10] and his website is at grantbow.com[11]. 1. http://ubuntu-california.org/ 2. http://www.ubuntu.com/ 3. http://partimus.org/ 4. http://fedoraproject.org/ 5. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors 6. https://www.suse.com/ 7. http://berkeleylug.com/ 8. https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Noisebridge 9. http://sf-lug.com/ 10. http://dvlug.org/ 11. http://www.grantbow.com/ Please RSVP if you're planning to come (see further below). For our 2013-01-15 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: So, if you'd like to join us please RSVP to: rsvp at balug.org **Why RSVP??** Well, don't worry we won't turn you away, but the RSVPs really help BALUG and the Four Seas Restaurant plan the meal and meeting, and with sufficient attendance, they also help ensure that we'll be able to eat upstairs in the private banquet room. Meeting Details... 6:30pm Tuesday, January 15th, 2012 2013-01-15 Four Seas Restaurant http://www.fourseasr.com/ 731 Grant Ave. San Francisco, CA 94108 Easy PARKING: Portsmouth Square Garage at 733 Kearny: http://www.sfpsg.com/ Cost: The meetings are always free, but for dinner, for your gift of $13 cash or more, we give you a gift of dinner - joining us for a yummy family-style Chinese dinner - tax and tip included (your gift also helps in our patronizing the restaurant venue and helping to defray BALUG costs such as treating our speakers to dinner). ------------------------------ For our 2013-01-15 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana In October of 2012 Elizabeth Krumbach accompanied other volunteers from Computer Reach[1], a non-profit based out of Pittsburgh, PA, on a trip to Ghana in western Africa to assist with the deployment of 100 Edubuntu[2]-based desktop computers. In this talk she will share photos and details of the trip, along with some of the lessons they learned about doing such a deployment in a developing country, covering hardware, software and training requirements. For a bit more background, one can also have a look at her earlier Ubuntu User[3] article: Road Trip: Delivering Edbuntu systems to Ghana[4]. Elizabeth Krumbach works as a Linux Systems Administrator focused on continuous integration, holds a position on the Ubuntu Community Council[5] and is the Treasurer and a Director at the non-profit Partimus[6]. She has held a leadership position in the Ubuntu Women[7], Ubuntu Classroom[8] and Ubuntu News[9] projects for several years and recently took over as Marketing and Website lead for the Xubuntu[10] Linux distribution. Former coordinator for the Philadelphia area Linux Users Group[11], she is now living in San Francisco and is one of the leaders of the Ubuntu California[12] team where she coordinates Bay Area Ubuntu events and meetings, install fests, booths and hosts Debian dinners every couple months for Bay Area Debian[13]. 1. http://computereach.com/ 2. http://edubuntu.org/ 3. http://www.ubuntu-user.com/ 4. http://www.ubuntu-user.com/content/download/3340/22578/file/070-073_edubuntu.pdf 5. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncil 6. http://www.partimus.org/ 7. http://women.ubuntu.com/ 8. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom 9. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewsTeam 10. http://www.xubuntu.org/ 11. http://www.phillylinux.org/ 12. http://ubuntu-california.org/ 13. http://bad.debian.net/ ------------------------------ Petition US Government - free / open source software in schools If you've not seen it[1], there's an on-line petition[2] to urge the US Government to favor and encourage free Open Source software use in and by schools. 1. http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2013-January/004925.html 2. http://wh.gov/Rz6C ------------------------------ Book(s), CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. Goodies we'll have at the meeting (at least the following): eBook review copy (only one copy remains): A Practical Guide to Linux Commands, Editors, and Shell Programming, 3rd Edition, Mark G. Sobell http://www.informit.com/title/013308504X http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2012-November/004885.html CDs/DVDs, etc. - have a peek here: http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc We may also be able to "burn" images per request or copy to USB flash, etc. Donations of blank or +-RW media, USB flash, or funding thereof, also appreciated. See the above URL for details. ------------------------------ "slides" from: BALUG 2012-07-17 screen(1) presented by Michael Paoli Missed that meeting, or want to review the materials? Have a peek here: http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2013-January/004926.html ------------------------------ volunteering to help BALUG Want to volunteer to help out BALUG? Quite a variety of opportunities* Drop us a note at: balug-contact at balug.org Or come talk to us at a BALUG meeting. *e.g.: o assist on publicity o assist on speaker coordination/procurement, etc. o webmastering o archivist/history/retrieval/etc. o Linux Systems Administration (e.g. do/assist/learn, with/under some quite experienced and skilled Linux systems administrators). o and other various/miscellaneous tasks BALUG "ought" to be doing or would be good to do (feel free to bring in ideas!) ------------------------------ Twitter - you can also follow BALUG on Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Feedback on our publicity/announcements (e.g. contacts or lists where we should get our information out that we're not presently reaching, or things we should do differently): publicity-feedback at balug.org ------------------------------ http://www.balug.org/ From einfeldt at gmail.com Sat Jan 12 21:31:17 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2013 21:31:17 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Booting Lubuntu from USB Message-ID: Hi, I am trying to boot from a USB with Lubuntu on an older machine with 512 MB of RAM. That machine is currently running Ubuntu 12.04 Unity, which is a little slow, so I want to try to install Lunbuntu. I have downloaded a copy of Lubuntu onto a USB stick, and confirmed that it is bootable on another machine. But the machine that I am trying to install it on, a Dell Dimension 4400 with 512 MB of RAM, won't boot from the USB stick. I went into the BIOS, and set up the boot order with "removable dev" as the first boot device, and the hard drive as the last boot device. The machine just goes through all of the boot devices, ignoring the removable USB stick and eventually boots from the hard drive. I have tried to load Lubuntu onto a CD, but unfortunately, it is about 756 MB of RAM, and the CDs that I have handy are only 700 MB CDs. I would really like to use Lubnutu, as opposed to a smaller ISO image, such as MacPup, but I fear that I am running out of options for this machine. Any suggestions are welcome. Thanks in advance. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Sat Jan 12 23:15:42 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2013 23:15:42 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Booting Lubuntu from USB In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Try one of the mini.iso downloads, ranging in size from 10-28 Meg from the link: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD Ken On Sat, Jan 12, 2013 at 9:31 PM, Christian Einfeldt wrote: > Hi, > > I am trying to boot from a USB with Lubuntu on an older machine with 512 > MB of RAM. That machine is currently running Ubuntu 12.04 Unity, which is > a little slow, so I want to try to install Lunbuntu. I have downloaded a > copy of Lubuntu onto a USB stick, and confirmed that it is bootable on > another machine. But the machine that I am trying to install it on, a Dell > Dimension 4400 with 512 MB of RAM, won't boot from the USB stick. > > I went into the BIOS, and set up the boot order with "removable dev" as > the first boot device, and the hard drive as the last boot device. The > machine just goes through all of the boot devices, ignoring the removable > USB stick and eventually boots from the hard drive. > > I have tried to load Lubuntu onto a CD, but unfortunately, it is about 756 > MB of RAM, and the CDs that I have handy are only 700 MB CDs. I would > really like to use Lubnutu, as opposed to a smaller ISO image, such as > MacPup, but I fear that I am running out of options for this machine. Any > suggestions are welcome. Thanks in advance. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From grantbow at ubuntu.com Sat Jan 12 23:21:44 2013 From: grantbow at ubuntu.com (Grant Bowman) Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2013 23:21:44 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Booting Lubuntu from USB In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I think a simple "sudo apt-get install lubuntu" on the existing machine will do the trick too, though that package name might be not quite right. Grant On Sat, Jan 12, 2013 at 11:15 PM, Ken Shaffer wrote: > Try one of the mini.iso downloads, ranging in size from 10-28 Meg from the > link: > https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD > Ken > > On Sat, Jan 12, 2013 at 9:31 PM, Christian Einfeldt > wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> I am trying to boot from a USB with Lubuntu on an older machine with 512 >> MB of RAM. That machine is currently running Ubuntu 12.04 Unity, which is a >> little slow, so I want to try to install Lunbuntu. I have downloaded a copy >> of Lubuntu onto a USB stick, and confirmed that it is bootable on another >> machine. But the machine that I am trying to install it on, a Dell >> Dimension 4400 with 512 MB of RAM, won't boot from the USB stick. >> >> I went into the BIOS, and set up the boot order with "removable dev" as >> the first boot device, and the hard drive as the last boot device. The >> machine just goes through all of the boot devices, ignoring the removable >> USB stick and eventually boots from the hard drive. >> >> I have tried to load Lubuntu onto a CD, but unfortunately, it is about 756 >> MB of RAM, and the CDs that I have handy are only 700 MB CDs. I would >> really like to use Lubnutu, as opposed to a smaller ISO image, such as >> MacPup, but I fear that I am running out of options for this machine. Any >> suggestions are welcome. Thanks in advance. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From akkana at shallowsky.com Sun Jan 13 12:10:57 2013 From: akkana at shallowsky.com (Akkana Peck) Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2013 12:10:57 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Booting Lubuntu from USB In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130113201057.GB6392@shallowsky.com> Grant Bowman writes: > I think a simple "sudo apt-get install lubuntu" on the existing > machine will do the trick too, though that package name might be not > quite right. I agree with Grant that apt-get install is the solution if you already have Ubuntu installed. The difference between lubuntu, xubuntu, kubuntu etc. are just which desktop packages are installed. But if you ever really do need to boot an older (pre USB boot) machine from a USB stick, I recommend the PLOP boot manager, http://www.plop.at/en/bootmanager/index.html It lets you write a grub entry and a mini kernel onto your existing disk that give the machine the ability to boot from USB devices. ...Akkana From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Sun Jan 13 12:45:12 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2013 12:45:12 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Booting Lubuntu from USB In-Reply-To: <20130113201057.GB6392@shallowsky.com> References: <20130113201057.GB6392@shallowsky.com> Message-ID: <50F31CD8.9060508@gmail.com> On 01/13/2013 12:10 PM, Akkana Peck wrote: > Grant Bowman writes: >> I think a simple "sudo apt-get install lubuntu" on the existing >> machine will do the trick too, though that package name might be not >> quite right. > > I agree with Grant that apt-get install is the solution if you > already have Ubuntu installed. The difference between lubuntu, > xubuntu, kubuntu etc. are just which desktop packages are installed. > > But if you ever really do need to boot an older (pre USB boot) > machine from a USB stick, I recommend the PLOP boot manager, > http://www.plop.at/en/bootmanager/index.html > It lets you write a grub entry and a mini kernel onto your existing disk > that give the machine the ability to boot from USB devices. Thanks for the tip. This might be the perfect solution to installing Linux on an old laptop that has no CDROM reader and can not boot from USB device. I'll try this next time I can reach said laptop. It's buried quite deep.... From akkana at shallowsky.com Sun Jan 13 13:22:31 2013 From: akkana at shallowsky.com (Akkana Peck) Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2013 13:22:31 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Booting Lubuntu from USB In-Reply-To: <50F31CD8.9060508@gmail.com> References: <20130113201057.GB6392@shallowsky.com> <50F31CD8.9060508@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130113212231.GF6392@shallowsky.com> Michael Shiloh writes (responding to my recommendation of PLOP): > Thanks for the tip. This might be the perfect solution to installing > Linux on an old laptop that has no CDROM reader and can not boot > from USB device. Unfortunately, PLOP probably won't help if you don't already have Linux on the machine, because you have to find some way of getting a grub (or another bootloader) onto the machine's boot partition. I've usually found it easiest to remove the disk from the target machine, plug it into a running Linux machine using a USB adaptor, get a partition onto the disk using cp -ax or debootstrap, then fiddle around setting up a bootloader. There are probably less geeky ways you can point a distro installer at a USB disk and not have to set up the bootloader by hand. ...Akkana From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Sun Jan 13 13:42:56 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2013 13:42:56 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Installing Linux with no bootable external drive (was: Re: Booting Lubuntu from USB In-Reply-To: <20130113212231.GF6392@shallowsky.com> References: <20130113201057.GB6392@shallowsky.com> <50F31CD8.9060508@gmail.com> <20130113212231.GF6392@shallowsky.com> Message-ID: <50F32A60.6060904@gmail.com> On 01/13/2013 01:22 PM, Akkana Peck wrote: > Michael Shiloh writes (responding to my recommendation of PLOP): >> Thanks for the tip. This might be the perfect solution to installing >> Linux on an old laptop that has no CDROM reader and can not boot >> from USB device. > > Unfortunately, PLOP probably won't help if you don't already have > Linux on the machine, because you have to find some way of getting > a grub (or another bootloader) onto the machine's boot partition. > > I've usually found it easiest to remove the disk from the target > machine, plug it into a running Linux machine using a USB adaptor, > get a partition onto the disk using cp -ax or debootstrap, then > fiddle around setting up a bootloader. There are probably less geeky > ways you can point a distro installer at a USB disk and not have to > set up the bootloader by hand. Thanks for the reply. I was hoping the PLOP installer would run as Windows program and install grub or lilo on the running disk. My plan B was to remove the hard disk as you said. Thanks for confirming this is still the best plan. It's an old Sony Vaio, in case anyone cares. M From einfeldt at gmail.com Sun Jan 13 21:12:11 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2013 21:12:11 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Booting Lubuntu from USB In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, On Sat, Jan 12, 2013 at 11:15 PM, Ken Shaffer wrote: > Try one of the mini.iso downloads, ranging in size from 10-28 Meg from the > link: > https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD > Ken > This solution worked like a charm, thank! I am writing this from the Lubuntu machine now, and it is reasonably fast, despite being only 512 MB. Thanks to everyone who replied to this thread! I sort of wish that I had decided to do the apt-get route, because that would have been just so cool. I wanted to go with a fresh install, because I also moved from 12.04 to 12.10. I think that if I had done the apt-get route, it would have gone from Ubuntu 12.04 to Lubuntu 12.04. I normally prefer to stay with LTS distros, but Lubuntu's home page says that Lubuntu 12.04 is not an LTS, anyway, so I am just going to have to update every 6 months or so. I am going to be reinstalling frequently anyway, because this machine faces the Internet with only a Sonic.net modem in between. I had a server that was on the internet for a commercial website I have, and squatters came onto it and put porn on it. I am just lucky it wasn't kiddy porn. Can you image what would have happened if they had put kiddie porn on it ! Serious trouble. So I am not taking any changes and I am going to blow away the install every 60 days or so. At any rate, thanks to everyone for this recommendation! The mini.iso is great! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From einfeldt at gmail.com Sun Jan 13 21:39:46 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2013 21:39:46 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Security suggestions Message-ID: Hi, For the first time in 16 years, I am running my computers without commercially-maintained firewall protection. I am looking for some tips in running behind nothing more strong than a Sonic.net firewall. So my first question is about the Sonic.net firewall. Does it provide any significant protection at all? In the meantime, I am formulating my plans for security. So far, my plan is this: 1. Put my primary computer with confidential info behind a firewall server. The firewall would be an old Lubuntu machine with 512 MB of RAM. 2. Reinstall that firewall server every 60 days with a fresh install. 3. I will put no confidential info on the server. 4. Turn off the firewall server whenever I am not on-line. I am only going to be on-line in the evenings and weekends. I have never installed a server before, only desktops. This will be a first time escapade for me. I appreciate any tips. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 14 09:35:11 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2013 09:35:11 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Booting Lubuntu from USB In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130114173511.GG32051@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Grant Bowman (grantbow at ubuntu.com): > I think a simple "sudo apt-get install lubuntu" on the existing > machine will do the trick too, though that package name might be not > quite right. 'lubuntu-desktop'. From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Mon Jan 14 09:44:26 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2013 09:44:26 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF Lug meeting next Monday, 21 January 2013 Message-ID: <50F443FA.4000705@dslextreme.com> SF-LUG meets every third Monday from 6 P.M. to 8 P.M. at the Cafe Enchante, 26th and Geary Boulevard. These meetings are usually lightly attended with a high for the year so far of 6 members. If you have a problem come along and maybe we can help but if not we can usually find someone who can. Bobbie Sellers From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 14 12:54:42 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2013 12:54:42 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Security suggestions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130114205442.GM32051@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Christian Einfeldt (einfeldt at gmail.com): > I have never installed a server before, only desktops. This will be a > first time escapade for me. I appreciate any tips. http://www.svlug.org/prev/2012dec/svlug-lecture-2012-12-05.odp http://www.svlug.org/prev/2012dec/svlug-lecture-2012-12-05.pdf http://www.svlug.org/prev/2012dec/svlug-lecture-2012-12-05.txt As alluded to on slides 9 & 10, distro maintenance package regimes are your friend. In that light, your recently announced plan to do package updates only every six months (if I understood what you were saying correctly) seems like a ghastly mistake. From jackofnotrades at gmail.com Mon Jan 14 14:03:46 2013 From: jackofnotrades at gmail.com (Jeff Bragg) Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2013 14:03:46 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Security suggestions In-Reply-To: <20130114205442.GM32051@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130114205442.GM32051@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: I agree with Rick. Apply the security and stability updates as often as they're available. On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Christian Einfeldt (einfeldt at gmail.com): > > > I have never installed a server before, only desktops. This will be a > > first time escapade for me. I appreciate any tips. > > http://www.svlug.org/prev/2012dec/svlug-lecture-2012-12-05.odp > http://www.svlug.org/prev/2012dec/svlug-lecture-2012-12-05.pdf > http://www.svlug.org/prev/2012dec/svlug-lecture-2012-12-05.txt > > As alluded to on slides 9 & 10, distro maintenance package regimes are > your friend. In that light, your recently announced plan to do package > updates only every six months (if I understood what you were saying > correctly) seems like a ghastly mistake. > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -- There Are More Than Two Ways To Do It -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Jan 14 15:12:45 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2013 15:12:45 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] REMINDER, BALUG TOMORROW Tu 2013-01-15: Grant Bowman: ubuntu-california.org Q&A Message-ID: <20130114151245.364232zdgl89peyo@webmail.rawbw.com> Reminder, BALUG meeting Tomorrow Tu 2013-01-15: Grant Bowman: ubuntu-california.org Q&A details for that event can be seen on our web site: http://www.balug.org/#Meetings-upcoming or in the earlier announcement included below: BALUG Tu 2013-01-15: Grant Bowman: ubuntu-california.org Q&A; & other BALUG news ------------------------------ items, details further below: BALUG Tu 2013-01-15: Grant Bowman: ubuntu-california.org Q&A BALUG Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana Petition US Government - free / open source software in schools Book(s), CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. "slides" from: BALUG 2012-07-17 screen(1) presented by Michael Paoli volunteering to help BALUG Twitter https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Bay Area Linux User Group (BALUG) meeting Tuesday 6:30 P.M. 2013-01-15 For our 2013-01-15 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Grant Bowman - ubuntu-california.org[1] Q&A Everything you ever wanted to know about the California Team and the Ubuntu community. How to represent Ubuntu[2] in local Linux User Groups and participate online and around the world in the semi-annual Ubuntu community events scheduled around the six month Ubuntu release cadence in April and October. Mr. Bowman has been a consultant and Internet professional for over twenty years and is presently a Director of Partimus[3]. He is one of three elected ubuntu-california.org[1] leaders, an Ubuntu Member, Fedora[4] Ambassador[5] and former employee of suse.com[6]. He is active with berkeleylug.com[7], noisebridge.net[8], SF-LUG[9] and DVLUG[10] and his website is at grantbow.com[11]. 1. http://ubuntu-california.org/ 2. http://www.ubuntu.com/ 3. http://partimus.org/ 4. http://fedoraproject.org/ 5. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors 6. https://www.suse.com/ 7. http://berkeleylug.com/ 8. https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Noisebridge 9. http://sf-lug.com/ 10. http://dvlug.org/ 11. http://www.grantbow.com/ Please RSVP if you're planning to come (see further below). For our 2013-01-15 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: So, if you'd like to join us please RSVP to: rsvp at balug.org **Why RSVP??** Well, don't worry we won't turn you away, but the RSVPs really help BALUG and the Four Seas Restaurant plan the meal and meeting, and with sufficient attendance, they also help ensure that we'll be able to eat upstairs in the private banquet room. Meeting Details... 6:30pm Tuesday, January 15th, 2012 2013-01-15 Four Seas Restaurant http://www.fourseasr.com/ 731 Grant Ave. San Francisco, CA 94108 Easy PARKING: Portsmouth Square Garage at 733 Kearny: http://www.sfpsg.com/ Cost: The meetings are always free, but for dinner, for your gift of $13 cash or more, we give you a gift of dinner - joining us for a yummy family-style Chinese dinner - tax and tip included (your gift also helps in our patronizing the restaurant venue and helping to defray BALUG costs such as treating our speakers to dinner). ------------------------------ For our 2013-01-15 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana In October of 2012 Elizabeth Krumbach accompanied other volunteers from Computer Reach[1], a non-profit based out of Pittsburgh, PA, on a trip to Ghana in western Africa to assist with the deployment of 100 Edubuntu[2]-based desktop computers. In this talk she will share photos and details of the trip, along with some of the lessons they learned about doing such a deployment in a developing country, covering hardware, software and training requirements. For a bit more background, one can also have a look at her earlier Ubuntu User[3] article: Road Trip: Delivering Edbuntu systems to Ghana[4]. Elizabeth Krumbach works as a Linux Systems Administrator focused on continuous integration, holds a position on the Ubuntu Community Council[5] and is the Treasurer and a Director at the non-profit Partimus[6]. She has held a leadership position in the Ubuntu Women[7], Ubuntu Classroom[8] and Ubuntu News[9] projects for several years and recently took over as Marketing and Website lead for the Xubuntu[10] Linux distribution. Former coordinator for the Philadelphia area Linux Users Group[11], she is now living in San Francisco and is one of the leaders of the Ubuntu California[12] team where she coordinates Bay Area Ubuntu events and meetings, install fests, booths and hosts Debian dinners every couple months for Bay Area Debian[13]. 1. http://computereach.com/ 2. http://edubuntu.org/ 3. http://www.ubuntu-user.com/ 4. http://www.ubuntu-user.com/content/download/3340/22578/file/070-073_edubuntu.pdf 5. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncil 6. http://www.partimus.org/ 7. http://women.ubuntu.com/ 8. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom 9. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewsTeam 10. http://www.xubuntu.org/ 11. http://www.phillylinux.org/ 12. http://ubuntu-california.org/ 13. http://bad.debian.net/ ------------------------------ Petition US Government - free / open source software in schools If you've not seen it[1], there's an on-line petition[2] to urge the US Government to favor and encourage free Open Source software use in and by schools. 1. http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2013-January/004925.html 2. http://wh.gov/Rz6C ------------------------------ Book(s), CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. Goodies we'll have at the meeting (at least the following): eBook review copy (only one copy remains): A Practical Guide to Linux Commands, Editors, and Shell Programming, 3rd Edition, Mark G. Sobell http://www.informit.com/title/013308504X http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2012-November/004885.html CDs/DVDs, etc. - have a peek here: http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc We may also be able to "burn" images per request or copy to USB flash, etc. Donations of blank or +-RW media, USB flash, or funding thereof, also appreciated. See the above URL for details. ------------------------------ "slides" from: BALUG 2012-07-17 screen(1) presented by Michael Paoli Missed that meeting, or want to review the materials? Have a peek here: http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2013-January/004926.html ------------------------------ volunteering to help BALUG Want to volunteer to help out BALUG? Quite a variety of opportunities* Drop us a note at: balug-contact at balug.org Or come talk to us at a BALUG meeting. *e.g.: o assist on publicity o assist on speaker coordination/procurement, etc. o webmastering o archivist/history/retrieval/etc. o Linux Systems Administration (e.g. do/assist/learn, with/under some quite experienced and skilled Linux systems administrators). o and other various/miscellaneous tasks BALUG "ought" to be doing or would be good to do (feel free to bring in ideas!) ------------------------------ Twitter - you can also follow BALUG on Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Feedback on our publicity/announcements (e.g. contacts or lists where we should get our information out that we're not presently reaching, or things we should do differently): publicity-feedback at balug.org ------------------------------ http://www.balug.org/ From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Wed Jan 16 10:15:16 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 10:15:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1358360116.54758.YahooMailRC@web181403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Jan 21 16:14:02 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 16:14:02 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG today: book giveway & CDs/DVDs/ISOs Message-ID: <20130121161402.17146v0jg5eaosso@webmail.rawbw.com> I should actually be making it to SF-LUG this evening. Hopefully I won't be late getting there, but I may be. In any case, I've a review copy book to give away too. I'll also have CDs/DVDs/ISOs available: http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc Friday I received review copies of two of each of the books noted further below. I'll do my more-or-less usual of generally giving away one per User Group as I make it to the various User Group meetings, and looks like I'll actually be making it to SF-LUG today, so that's first up on my calendar. Ubuntu Unleashed 2013 Edition: Covering 12.10 and 13.04, 8th Edition By Matthew Helmke Published Dec 5, 2012 by Sams. Copyright 2013 Dimensions: 7" x 9-1/8" Pages: 888 Edition: 8th Book ISBN-10: 0-672-33624-3 ISBN-13: 978-0-672-33624-9 http://www.informit.com/title/0672336243 DevOps Troubleshooting: Linux Server Best Practices By Kyle Rankin Published Nov 13, 2012 by Addison-Wesley Professional. Copyright 2013 Dimensions: 7" x 9-1/8" Pages: 240 Edition: 1st Book ISBN-10: 0-321-83204-3 ISBN-13: 978-0-321-83204-7 http://www.informit.com/title/0321832043 references/excerpts (partially redacted): > From: @pearson.com > Subject: RE: books & eBooks, etc. (BUUG, BALUG, etc.) > Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 12:17:47 -0500 > Hi Michael, the latest shipment of books will arrive later this week, > sorry to miss your meeting tonight. > > That said, here are our newest releases, if you want to put a call out > for reviewers tonight- I could ship a print copy- or arrange eBook > download bundle- to (2-3) reviewers per title. > > -- "DevOps Troubleshooting: Linux Server Best Practices" by Kyle Rankin; > www.informit.com/title/0321832043; **Sample Chp#5, "Is the Server > Down?": > http://ptgmedia.pearsoncmg.com/images/9780321832047/samplepages/03218320 > 43.pdf > -- "Ubuntu Unleashed 2013 Edition: Covering 12.10 and 13.04", 8th Ed. by > Matt Helmke; www.informit.com/title/0672336243; Sample Chp# "Ubuntu > Command-Line Quickstart"; > http://www.informit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=2003795 > > Thanks, From jim at well.com Mon Jan 21 21:23:51 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 21:23:51 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG today: book giveway & CDs/DVDs/ISOs In-Reply-To: <20130121161402.17146v0jg5eaosso@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130121161402.17146v0jg5eaosso@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1358832231.1854.154.camel@jim-LAPTOP> He brought 'em; I got 'em. Thanks Michael. The DevOps Troubleshooting book looks especially good (it's thin). I'll share. On Mon, 2013-01-21 at 16:14 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > I should actually be making it to SF-LUG this evening. > Hopefully I won't be late getting there, but I may be. > In any case, I've a review copy book to give away too. > I'll also have CDs/DVDs/ISOs available: > http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc > > Friday I received review copies of two of each of the books noted > further below. I'll do my more-or-less usual of generally giving away > one per User Group as I make it to the various User Group meetings, and > looks like I'll actually be making it to SF-LUG today, so that's first > up on my calendar. > > Ubuntu Unleashed 2013 Edition: Covering 12.10 and 13.04, 8th Edition > By Matthew Helmke > Published Dec 5, 2012 by Sams. > Copyright 2013 > Dimensions: 7" x 9-1/8" > Pages: 888 > Edition: 8th > Book > ISBN-10: 0-672-33624-3 > ISBN-13: 978-0-672-33624-9 > http://www.informit.com/title/0672336243 > > DevOps Troubleshooting: Linux Server Best Practices > By Kyle Rankin > Published Nov 13, 2012 by Addison-Wesley Professional. > Copyright 2013 > Dimensions: 7" x 9-1/8" > Pages: 240 > Edition: 1st > Book > ISBN-10: 0-321-83204-3 > ISBN-13: 978-0-321-83204-7 > http://www.informit.com/title/0321832043 > > references/excerpts (partially redacted): > > > From: @pearson.com > > Subject: RE: books & eBooks, etc. (BUUG, BALUG, etc.) > > Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 12:17:47 -0500 > > > Hi Michael, the latest shipment of books will arrive later this week, > > sorry to miss your meeting tonight. > > > > That said, here are our newest releases, if you want to put a call out > > for reviewers tonight- I could ship a print copy- or arrange eBook > > download bundle- to (2-3) reviewers per title. > > > > -- "DevOps Troubleshooting: Linux Server Best Practices" by Kyle Rankin; > > www.informit.com/title/0321832043; **Sample Chp#5, "Is the Server > > Down?": > > http://ptgmedia.pearsoncmg.com/images/9780321832047/samplepages/03218320 > > 43.pdf > > -- "Ubuntu Unleashed 2013 Edition: Covering 12.10 and 13.04", 8th Ed. by > > Matt Helmke; www.informit.com/title/0672336243; Sample Chp# "Ubuntu > > Command-Line Quickstart"; > > http://www.informit.com/articles/article.aspx?p=2003795 > > > > Thanks, > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Jan 21 22:10:52 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 22:10:52 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com to have short reboot (should be well under 10 minutes - for maintenance) Message-ID: <20130121221052.13385i9tzge4wr4s@webmail.rawbw.com> The sf-lug.com virtual host (and it's reverse dependency vicki and its dependencies) will be doing a maintenance reboot. Anticipated this will take (well) under 10 minutes. Be back shortly. I'll update later, but that may be fair while after the reboot. From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Tue Jan 22 07:13:02 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2013 07:13:02 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] done: sf-lug.com to have short reboot (was down for about 12.5 minutes late yesterday evening) In-Reply-To: <20130121221052.13385i9tzge4wr4s@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130121221052.13385i9tzge4wr4s@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <20130122071302.15574xpy0iqzp10c@webmail.rawbw.com> Well, was a moderate bit longer than anticipated. sf-lug.com. (webserver) was down for about 12.5 minutes[1]: up 2013-01-22 06:16:28+00:00 (2013-01-21 22:16:28-08:00) up 2013-01-22 06:28:58+00:00 (2013-01-21 22:28:58-08:00) Turns out on the reverse dependency host (vicki), there was an /etc/fstab entry that hadn't been properly updated. So, upon reboot, fsck, somewhat misleadingly, complained about "corrupt" filesystem and wanted manual intervention to fix it. Once the actual (/etc/fstab) error was found and corrected (blkid came in quite handy), all appeared fine, and one additional reboot of vicki was performed to help ensure all came up fine when (re)booting. There was also a bit of additional delay from fsck filesystem checks on ext3 filesystems having been past their configured maximum days and/or number of mounts since last checked, but those went relatively quickly (took maybe a few minutes or so). Good to reboot host at least once in a great while - to ensure all obsoleted files (e.g. older versions of files prior to security and bug fix updates) are released (no longer open) and no longer used, and that all the boot initialization (e.g. startup scripts/programs) work as expected (and configuration errors or bugs haven't been accidentally introduced). Host vicki hadn't been rebooted since, I believe 2012-02-27[2] - so it had been a rather long while. footnotes/references/excerpts: 1. $ expand -t2 < ck_sf-lug.com. #!/bin/sh IP=208.96.15.252 # sf-lug.com. sleep=1 timeout=5 stopfile=.$(basename $0).stop while : do nc -w "$timeout" -z "$IP" 80 && { echo -n 'up ' TZ=GMT0 date +'%Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S+00:00' } sleep "$sleep" [ -f "$stopfile" ] && { rm "$stopfile" break } done 2. http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=system:vicki_debian_lenny_to_squeeze#vicki_upgraded_to_debian_gnu_linux_604_amd64 > From: "Michael Paoli" > Subject: sf-lug.com to have short reboot (should be well under 10 > minutes - for maintenance) > Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2013 22:10:52 -0800 > The sf-lug.com virtual host (and it's reverse dependency vicki and its > dependencies) will be doing a maintenance reboot. Anticipated this > will take (well) under 10 minutes. Be back shortly. I'll update > later, but that may be fair while after the reboot. From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Wed Jan 23 12:28:31 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2013 12:28:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1358972911.21985.YahooMailRC@web181404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From einfeldt at gmail.com Sun Jan 27 21:10:17 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2013 21:10:17 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools Message-ID: Hi, Here is a blog with pictures about some of the work that Partimus volunteers are doing a public schools in Oakland. http://blog.partimus.org/?p=439 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Sun Jan 27 22:28:32 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2013 22:28:32 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Christian Einfeldt (einfeldt at gmail.com): > Here is a blog with pictures about some of the work that Partimus > volunteers are doing a public schools in Oakland. > > http://blog.partimus.org/?p=439 No, they aren't. Ascend Learning, which operates the school in Oakland you dishonestly refer to as a "public school', is a private corporation, part of a small cartel of private corporations, about which one can read here: http://www.ascendlearning.com/companies/ From larry.cafiero at gmail.com Sun Jan 27 22:40:58 2013 From: larry.cafiero at gmail.com (Larry Cafiero) Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2013 22:40:58 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 10:28 PM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Christian Einfeldt (einfeldt at gmail.com): > > No, they aren't. > > Ascend Learning, which operates the school in Oakland you dishonestly > refer to as a "public school', is a private corporation, part of a small > cartel of private corporations, about which one can read here: > http://www.ascendlearning.com/companies/ Is this the school in question? http://ascend.ousd.k12.ca.us/ With a URL like that, it looks somewhat public to me. Looks like apples and oranges here, perhaps? Larry Cafiero From rick at linuxmafia.com Sun Jan 27 22:59:45 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2013 22:59:45 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Larry Cafiero (larry.cafiero at gmail.com): > Is this the school in question? > > http://ascend.ousd.k12.ca.us/ > > With a URL like that, it looks somewhat public to me. Looks like > apples and oranges here, perhaps? Larry, I'm willing to bet you $50 that Ascend School, at 3709 East 12th Street, Oakland, is administered by Ascend Learning, Inc., a private corporation headquartered in Brooklyn, New York, and not by Oakland Unified School District. You're welcome to accept this wager by follow-up posting to this mailing list any time in the next 24 hours. If you want to read about the outsourcing of some Oakland schools to Ascend as a private corporate partner, read here: http://www.srnleads.org/resources/publications/ousd/cases/ascend.pdf From larry.cafiero at gmail.com Mon Jan 28 00:51:10 2013 From: larry.cafiero at gmail.com (Larry Cafiero) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 00:51:10 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 10:59 PM, Rick Moen wrote: > > Larry, I'm willing to bet you $50 that Ascend School, at 3709 East 12th > Street, Oakland, is administered by Ascend Learning, Inc., a private > corporation headquartered in Brooklyn, New York, and not by > Oakland Unified School District. You're welcome to accept this wager by > follow-up posting to this mailing list any time in the next 24 hours. I'm not going to bet you, Rick, because I don't want to take your money. From the link in your original post, if you go down a page, you'll find this: "Currently the Ascend Learning focus is primarily on higher education schools in the healthcare and wellness industries. We?re proud of our partnerships with the best educators and top colleges, universities and businesses around the country." That's here: http://www.ascendlearning.com/ascend-approach/ It doesn't sound like this company is in the elementary/middle/high school business. Also, the PDF doesn't mention the Brooklyn-based company at all, though it is an interesting read. From einfeldt at gmail.com Mon Jan 28 08:39:55 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 08:39:55 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: Hi Rick, I would like to invite you to speak with our teachers to get their perspective on this issue, as well as the parents of our students, who pay nothing to send their children to these schools. Many functions of Medicare are administered by private entities. Does that make Medicare a private system? No. Rick, you and I will just have to agree to respectfully disagree about whether KIPP, ASCEND, and Prescott are public or private. Our disagreement is definitional in nature. Your definition is more narrow than mine. The ironic thing is that you and seem to agree on how these charter schools SHOULD be run. But the operative fact motivating me is that any kid in California can attend any of these schools gratis, a fac5 upon which you and I agree. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 28 08:57:32 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 08:57:32 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130128165732.GA4089@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Christian Einfeldt (einfeldt at gmail.com): > I would like to invite you to speak with our teachers to get their > perspective on this issue, as well as the parents of our students, who pay > nothing to send their children to these schools. I'm sure they are fabulous people. For my part, I am friends with teachers from my private high school and my private university to this day, and am grateful to them. But I don't go around claiming they worked in the public school system, as they did not. > Many functions of Medicare are administered by private entities. Does > that make Medicare a private system? No. Counselor, you are arguing dishonestly again. Medicare _itself_ is administered (and owned) by the Social Security Administration. All of it. > Rick, you and I will just have to agree to respectfully disagree No, counselor. This is simply not a matter of opinion. You are lying to the public. You really need to stop. > Your definition is more narrow than mine. It's not 'my definition'. Ascend Learning, Inc. is a private corporation and its school in Oakland is not a public school and not administered or owned by the Oakland Unified School District. Those are facts. Deal. From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 28 09:02:00 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 09:02:00 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Larry Cafiero (larry.cafiero at gmail.com): > I'm not going to bet you, Rick, because I don't want to take your > money. From the link in your original post, if you go down a page, > you'll find this: > > "Currently the Ascend Learning focus is primarily on higher education > schools in the healthcare and wellness industries. We?re proud of our > partnerships with the best educators and top colleges, universities > and businesses around the country." > > That's here: http://www.ascendlearning.com/ascend-approach/ > > It doesn't sound like this company is in the elementary/middle/high > school business. And yet they are. You have another about 18 hours, if you wish to accept the wager. > Also, the PDF doesn't mention the Brooklyn-based company at all, > though it is an interesting read. Yes, it does. Keep reading, as the mention of ASCEND is quite a few pages in. Moreover, just Web-search for 'ascend learning oakland' and you'll find more aspects of the outsourcing-to-corporations story. From larry.cafiero at gmail.com Mon Jan 28 10:13:59 2013 From: larry.cafiero at gmail.com (Larry Cafiero) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 10:13:59 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 9:02 AM, Rick Moen wrote in response to me: > Quoting Larry Cafiero (larry.cafiero at gmail.com): >> It doesn't sound like this company is in the elementary/middle/high >> school business. > > And yet they are. You have another about 18 hours, if you wish to > accept the wager. Again, I don't want to take your money, so I'm not taking your bet. Even if I gave you 10-1 odds, the Ascend Learning site does not back you up: http://www.ascendlearning.com/ Last time I checked, health care and nursing were not a vital part of the K-8 curriculum, but it's been awhile since I've been in an elementary school setting. But wait, there's more: On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 9:02 AM, Rick Moen also wrote in response to me: >> Also, the PDF doesn't mention the Brooklyn-based company at all, >> though it is an interesting read. > > Yes, it does. Keep reading, as the mention of ASCEND is quite a few > pages in. You do realize that ASCEND, the name of the school, is an acronym for "A School Cultivating Excellence, Nurturing Diversity," right? At least that was it says in the PDF file which, as I mentioned, I read and thought was interesting. Also looking into this, I found that -- yes -- they do get funding through the Oakland Schools Foundation but none of the donors listed on the OSF site seem to be Ascend Learning. Look for yourself: http://www.oaklandschoolsfoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/OSF_Supporters_List_2012.pdf Maybe you could produce some evidence that Ascend Learning backs this school? From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 28 10:44:59 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 10:44:59 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130128184459.GF31449@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Larry Cafiero (larry.cafiero at gmail.com): > Last time I checked, health care and nursing were not a vital part of > the K-8 curriculum, but it's been awhile since I've been in an > elementary school setting. As I already said, it's part of a small cartel of private corporation, and I posted the URL to an omnibus page showing the various things they've gone into including health care and nursing. You are looking at the same thing and concluding in error that they aren't running charter schools. > You do realize that ASCEND, the name of the school, is an acronym for > "A School Cultivating Excellence, Nurturing Diversity," right? Correct. This is the origin of the name of the company. KIPP follows the same pattern of upbeat acronym-making, it standing for Knowledge is Power Program. Just about every one of these charter-school outfits has a name straight out of a Tony Robbins sales seminar. > Maybe you could produce some evidence that Ascend Learning backs this school? I have a better idea: I'm going to increase my bet to $200 and change terms to this offer: We telephone Ascend School in Oakland and ask the principal whether his pay cheque is issued by Oakland Unified School District. Which would be the case if it's a public school. If not, you pay me $200. If it is, I pay you the same amount. You have until 11PM tonight if you wish to accept this wager. Point is, it's a private school, run by a private corpoation. (The telephone answer obviously would be subject to confirmation. Neither of us would need to pay out for a _false_ answer.) From maestro415 at gmail.com Mon Jan 28 11:22:19 2013 From: maestro415 at gmail.com (maestro) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 11:22:19 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: <20130128184459.GF31449@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128184459.GF31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: quoting rick moen: >I have a better idea: I'm going to increase my bet to $200 and change >terms to this offer: We telephone Ascend School in Oakland and ask the >principal whether his pay cheque is issued by Oakland Unified School >District. Which would be the case if it's a public school. it seems to me should this be the case then he is paid by a public entity (oakland unified) with taxpayer funds and this info should be easily discoverable by a simple FOIA request and/or his income tax records nespa?... On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 10:44 AM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Larry Cafiero (larry.cafiero at gmail.com): > > > Last time I checked, health care and nursing were not a vital part of > > the K-8 curriculum, but it's been awhile since I've been in an > > elementary school setting. > > As I already said, it's part of a small cartel of private corporation, > and I posted the URL to an omnibus page showing the various things > they've gone into including health care and nursing. You are looking at > the same thing and concluding in error that they aren't running charter > schools. > > > You do realize that ASCEND, the name of the school, is an acronym for > > "A School Cultivating Excellence, Nurturing Diversity," right? > > Correct. This is the origin of the name of the company. > > KIPP follows the same pattern of upbeat acronym-making, it standing for > Knowledge is Power Program. Just about every one of these > charter-school outfits has a name straight out of a Tony Robbins sales > seminar. > > > Maybe you could produce some evidence that Ascend Learning backs this > school? > > I have a better idea: I'm going to increase my bet to $200 and change > terms to this offer: We telephone Ascend School in Oakland and ask the > principal whether his pay cheque is issued by Oakland Unified School > District. Which would be the case if it's a public school. > > If not, you pay me $200. If it is, I pay you the same amount. You have > until 11PM tonight if you wish to accept this wager. > > Point is, it's a private school, run by a private corpoation. > > (The telephone answer obviously would be subject to confirmation. > Neither of us would need to pay out for a _false_ answer.) > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 28 11:48:57 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 11:48:57 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128184459.GF31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130128194857.GD4089@linuxmafia.com> Quoting maestro (maestro415 at gmail.com): > it seems to me should this be the case then he is paid by a public entity > (oakland unified) with taxpayer funds and this info should be easily > discoverable by a simple FOIA request and/or his income tax records > nespa?... My wager is to my friend Larry. However, don't let me stop you from making that telephone call. (You might find that the principal's salary is paid by Oakland Schools Foundation, a private corporation. Anyway, not by Oakland Unified School District, hence my point.) From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Mon Jan 28 15:47:52 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 15:47:52 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF Lug meeting On Sunday February 3, 2013 Message-ID: <51070E28.7040405@dslextreme.com> SF-LUG meets every first Sunday from 11 A.M. to 1 P.M. at the Cafe Enchante, 26th and Geary Boulevard. These meetings are usually lightly attended with a high for the year so far of 6 members. If you have a problem come along and maybe we can help but if not we can usually find someone who can. The meeting of January 21, 2013 was lightly attended. I arrived early and Michael Paoli soon joined me. Eric followed and was showing off his Nexus 7 tablet. (If I have misidentified it, Eric can inform us, I hope) Jim Stockford showed up and he and Michael discussed the intended action since completed of rebooting the server. Michael had a great many DVDs and CD with various iterations of the GNU/Linux system. Curiously I had a problem getting online with the HP Compaq Presario and it seemed to be a hardware switch-off of the built-in WiFi card. I disconnected the power and removed the battery then re-inserted the battery and there was the WiFi working properly. This problem maybe due to the Knoppix 7 I have installed on an 8 GiB flash drive where it lets you shut off the WiFi from the desktop. Well I hope to see some of you all at the next meeting. noting that the Super Bowl should not be starting before you have time to get home. Bobbie Sellers From maestro415 at gmail.com Mon Jan 28 16:35:45 2013 From: maestro415 at gmail.com (maestro) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 16:35:45 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: <20130128194857.GD4089@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128184459.GF31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128194857.GD4089@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: not interested in the wager... just threw that out there for the entire conversation in general as something that may be easily done to find out either way... but who knows with all the diversions cities, counties, and states try to use and do use to take attention off of their schools and school systems... have fun kids ;-) please let us know what you find out... On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 11:48 AM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting maestro (maestro415 at gmail.com): > > > it seems to me should this be the case then he is paid by a public entity > > (oakland unified) with taxpayer funds and this info should be easily > > discoverable by a simple FOIA request and/or his income tax records > > nespa?... > > My wager is to my friend Larry. However, don't let me stop you from > making that telephone call. > > (You might find that the principal's salary is paid by Oakland Schools > Foundation, a private corporation. Anyway, not by Oakland Unified School > District, hence my point.) > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Jan 28 16:50:36 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 16:50:36 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128184459.GF31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128194857.GD4089@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130129005036.GH4089@linuxmafia.com> Quoting maestro (maestro415 at gmail.com): > not interested in the wager... > > just threw that out there for the entire conversation in general as > something that may be easily done to find out either way... Just a word to the wise, that sort of 'just helping' sort of kicking of hornets nests really doesn't make friends. Not to mention that all of this attempting to niggle on little points like Larry wanting to be convinced that the private corporation running Ascend School in Oakland is the same Ascend Learning Corporation that is headquartered in Brooklyn and also involved in health care and nursing, and Bill niggling over whether a non-profit corporation can be said to have owners, is from people going far out of their way to miss the point about these _not_ being Oakland Unified School District schools[1], and Christian's wording having been deliberately deceptive towards people who might not have volunteered if they'd known these were private schools that take tax money _away_ from the public schools. > please let us know what you find out... Don't wear yourself out helping. [1] ousd.k12.ca.us Web presence notwithstanding. From mhigashi at gmail.com Mon Jan 28 16:51:53 2013 From: mhigashi at gmail.com (Mike Higashi) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 16:51:53 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: <20130128194857.GD4089@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128184459.GF31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128194857.GD4089@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 11:48 AM, Rick Moen wrote: > > My wager is to my friend Larry. However, don't let me stop you from > making that telephone call. > > (You might find that the principal's salary is paid by Oakland Schools > Foundation, a private corporation. Anyway, not by Oakland Unified School > District, hence my point.) Ascend appears to have a very unusual history. You can see some of it here: http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_19184890 Deep into the article, It appears to say that Ascend was originally started by the Oakland Unified School District as a sort of magnet school: ASCEND and Learning Without Limits opened in 2001 and 2007, respectively, during an unprecedented period of school district innovation and change. [...] "They will be like internal charter schools," former Superintendent Dennis Chaconas told the San Francisco Chronicle in 2001, referring to the freedom to choose a school's teachers, themes and curriculum. That article (dated October 2011) opens with the really weird news that it was the school's staff that wanted to go the charter school route: The faculty at two Oakland elementary schools have voted to break away from the district and convert their schools into independently run charters, a move that could cost Oakland Unified more than $4 million. Teachers and principals at ASCEND and Learning Without Limits say that as charter schools, they will have far more control over who they hire, what they teach and how, and how they spend their money. They said the schools' founders were initially promised those conditions, but that they have eroded over time. This conversion was approved by the OUSD board in March 2012: http://oaklandnorth.net/2012/03/08/two-ousd-schools-will-convert-to-charters-after-board-vote/ The board voted to allow ASCEND and Learning Without Limits to convert from district public schools to charter schools this fall. Each was given a five-year agreement to function as a charter school, the board voted unanimously, though director Alice Spearman (District 7) was not present. The schools will be overseen by charter management company Education For Change. But unlike the other 30 Oakland charter schools, both ASCEND and Learning Without Limits will retain a close relationship with district?the schools will pay for services from the district, like custodial, professional development and access to data systems and teacher support. The schools will also participate in the district?s enrollment process and receive students who were expelled from other schools. Both schools will also continue to chip in their share of the district?s $6 million annual payment to the state from its emergency loan. Mike -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From maestro415 at gmail.com Mon Jan 28 19:43:02 2013 From: maestro415 at gmail.com (maestro) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 19:43:02 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] A blog about Linux in local public schools In-Reply-To: <20130129005036.GH4089@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130128062832.GA31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128065945.GB31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128170200.GC31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128184459.GF31449@linuxmafia.com> <20130128194857.GD4089@linuxmafia.com> <20130129005036.GH4089@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: please let us know what you guys find out... message ends _______________________________________________________________ On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 4:50 PM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting maestro (maestro415 at gmail.com): > > > not interested in the wager... > > > > just threw that out there for the entire conversation in general as > > something that may be easily done to find out either way... > > > Just a word to the wise, that sort of 'just helping' sort of kicking of > hornets nests really doesn't make friends. > > Not to mention that all of this attempting to niggle on little points > like Larry wanting to be convinced that the private corporation running > Ascend School in Oakland is the same Ascend Learning Corporation that is > headquartered in Brooklyn and also involved in health care and nursing, > and Bill niggling over whether a non-profit corporation can be said to > have owners, is from people going far out of their way to miss the point > about these _not_ being Oakland Unified School District schools[1], and > Christian's wording having been deliberately deceptive towards people > who might not have volunteered if they'd known these were private > schools that take tax money _away_ from the public schools. > > > please let us know what you find out... > > Don't wear yourself out helping. > > [1] ousd.k12.ca.us Web presence notwithstanding. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Tue Jan 29 12:20:36 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 12:20:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1359490836.91591.YahooMailRC@web181403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From assiroger2006 at yahoo.com Wed Jan 30 11:16:59 2013 From: assiroger2006 at yahoo.com (ASSI YAPO Roger) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 11:16:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] hi Message-ID: <1359573419.30147.androidMobile@web122003.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> hey have a look http://www.com-im3.net/ ASSI -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdmurphy at gmail.com Wed Jan 30 11:21:12 2013 From: mmdmurphy at gmail.com (Dan Murphy) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 11:21:12 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] hi In-Reply-To: <1359573419.30147.androidMobile@web122003.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1359573419.30147.androidMobile@web122003.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <72A0A754-70E5-499B-9AE4-68AF4BB3C468@gmail.com> Sounds like spam Sent from Dan. On Jan 30, 2013, at 11:16 AM, ASSI YAPO Roger wrote: > > hey have a look http://www.com-im3.net/ > > > > ASSI > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at systemateka.com Wed Jan 30 13:26:28 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 13:26:28 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] hi -- spam? In-Reply-To: <72A0A754-70E5-499B-9AE4-68AF4BB3C468@gmail.com> References: <1359573419.30147.androidMobile@web122003.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <72A0A754-70E5-499B-9AE4-68AF4BB3C468@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1359581188.1785.53.camel@jim-LAPTOP> ASSI posted "hi" at 11:16 today. Dan posted "Sounds like spam" at 11:21 today. the mailman program reported ASSI unsubscribed at 13:03 today. I looked through the sf-lug email back as far as mid-October 2012 and found no subscription for ASSI. I could have missed it; ASSI could have subscribed prior to mid-October 2012; other. Sounds like spam. Looks like spam, (glad I didn't step in it.) Something curious about this--mainly re the subscription date and the possibility of ASSI lurking for months waiting to post this message. On Wed, 2013-01-30 at 11:21 -0800, Dan Murphy wrote: > Sounds like spam > > Sent from Dan. > > On Jan 30, 2013, at 11:16 AM, ASSI YAPO Roger > wrote: > > > > hey have a look http://www.com-im3.net/ > > > > > > > > ASSI > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From kevinjsmith+lug at gmail.com Wed Jan 30 13:30:12 2013 From: kevinjsmith+lug at gmail.com (Kevin J. Smith) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 13:30:12 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] hi -- spam? In-Reply-To: <1359581188.1785.53.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1359573419.30147.androidMobile@web122003.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <72A0A754-70E5-499B-9AE4-68AF4BB3C468@gmail.com> <1359581188.1785.53.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: Appears to have the trappings of a hijacked email account - have seen same thing happen to folks I know. On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 1:26 PM, jim wrote: > > > ASSI posted "hi" at 11:16 today. > Dan posted "Sounds like spam" at 11:21 today. > the mailman program reported ASSI unsubscribed at 13:03 today. > > I looked through the sf-lug email back as far as mid-October > 2012 and found no subscription for ASSI. I could have missed > it; ASSI could have subscribed prior to mid-October 2012; > other. > > Sounds like spam. Looks like spam, (glad I didn't step in it.) > Something curious about this--mainly re the subscription date > and the possibility of ASSI lurking for months waiting to post > this message. > > > > On Wed, 2013-01-30 at 11:21 -0800, Dan Murphy wrote: > > Sounds like spam > > > > Sent from Dan. > > > > On Jan 30, 2013, at 11:16 AM, ASSI YAPO Roger > > wrote: > > > > > > > hey have a look http://www.com-im3.net/ > > > > > > > > > > > > ASSI > > > _______________________________________________ > > > sf-lug mailing list > > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Wed Jan 30 16:00:37 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:00:37 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] looking fruitlessly for SHA256sum Message-ID: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> Well Luggers, I downloaded Fedora 18 .isos one with KDE and the other with some other desktop environment and need to make sure the .isos are good but my distro does not have a version of SHA256sum nor have I been able to locate a site with an .rpm or other file for Mandriva or any other version which I can download to check those .iso files. Thanks for your attention. Bobbie Sellers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mhigashi at gmail.com Wed Jan 30 16:09:43 2013 From: mhigashi at gmail.com (Mike Higashi) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:09:43 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] looking fruitlessly for SHA256sum In-Reply-To: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> References: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 4:00 PM, Bobbie Sellers < bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com> wrote: > Well Luggers, > I downloaded Fedora 18 .isos one with KDE and the other with > some other desktop environment and need to make sure the .isos > are good but my distro does not have a version of SHA256sum > nor have I been able to locate a site with an .rpm or other file > for Mandriva or any other version which I can download to check > those .iso files. > My apologies for what may be a silly question, but did you check for a lower-case sha256sum command? Mike -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jackofnotrades at gmail.com Wed Jan 30 16:19:04 2013 From: jackofnotrades at gmail.com (Jeff Bragg) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:19:04 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] looking fruitlessly for SHA256sum In-Reply-To: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> References: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: I think openssl should be able to do that. I think something like 'openssl dgst -sha256 /path/to/file' will generate the checksum; check the man page, but I'd be surprised if it's not supported (it is on Ubuntu 10.04, fwiw). On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 4:00 PM, Bobbie Sellers < bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com> wrote: > Well Luggers, > I downloaded Fedora 18 .isos one with KDE and the other with > some other desktop environment and need to make sure the .isos > are good but my distro does not have a version of SHA256sum > nor have I been able to locate a site with an .rpm or other file > for Mandriva or any other version which I can download to check > those .iso files. > > Thanks for your attention. > > Bobbie Sellers > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -- There Are More Than Two Ways To Do It -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Wed Jan 30 16:32:31 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 16:32:31 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] looking fruitlessly for SHA256sum In-Reply-To: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> References: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <20130131003231.GX31449@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Bobbie Sellers (bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com): > Well Luggers, > I downloaded Fedora 18 .isos one with KDE and the other with > some other desktop environment and need to make sure the .isos > are good but my distro does not have a version of SHA256sum > nor have I been able to locate a site with an .rpm or other file > for Mandriva or any other version which I can download to check > those .iso files. /usr/bin/sha256sum is an integral part of GNU coreutils. So, for example: http://rpm.pbone.net/index.php3/stat/4/idpl/19399670/dir/mandriva_2011/com/coreutils-8.12-1.2-mdv2011.0.i586.rpm.html (But, don't get it off the Internet. Get it from your distro package system.) From maestro415 at gmail.com Wed Jan 30 17:00:44 2013 From: maestro415 at gmail.com (maestro) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 17:00:44 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] hi In-Reply-To: <72A0A754-70E5-499B-9AE4-68AF4BB3C468@gmail.com> References: <1359573419.30147.androidMobile@web122003.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <72A0A754-70E5-499B-9AE4-68AF4BB3C468@gmail.com> Message-ID: a humble request... when posting links to/on the SF-LUG main discussion list please put a BRIEF synopsis of what the link is to (rather than just pasting a link and nothing else) and whenever possible use https format when supported... thanks... by the by the LInux Discussion Group/Problem Solving meets tonight and every wednesday @ noisebridge 2169 mission st./18th st. 18:00-20:00 or whenever people leave... i know joseph posts a regular reminder, this is merely adjoining it in support being that it is wed. ... message ends _______________________________________________________________________________________ On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 11:21 AM, Dan Murphy wrote: > Sounds like spam > > Sent from Dan. > > On Jan 30, 2013, at 11:16 AM, ASSI YAPO Roger > wrote: > > hey have a look http://www.com-im3.net/ > > > ASSI > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Wed Jan 30 19:38:31 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 19:38:31 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] looking fruitlessly for SHA256sum In-Reply-To: References: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <5109E737.6070506@dslextreme.com> On 01/30/2013 04:09 PM, Mike Higashi wrote: > On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 4:00 PM, Bobbie Sellers > > > wrote: > > Well Luggers, > I downloaded Fedora 18 .isos one with KDE and the other with > some other desktop environment and need to make sure the .isos > are good but my distro does not have a version of SHA256sum > nor have I been able to locate a site with an .rpm or other file > for Mandriva or any other version which I can download to check > those .iso files. > > > My apologies for what may be a silly question, but did you check for a > lower-case sha256sum command? > > Mike > Yes I believe I did just that. Thanks for considering the problem. Bobbie. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Wed Jan 30 19:39:19 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 19:39:19 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] looking fruitlessly for SHA256sum In-Reply-To: <20130131003231.GX31449@linuxmafia.com> References: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> <20130131003231.GX31449@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <5109E767.8080605@dslextreme.com> On 01/30/2013 04:32 PM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Bobbie Sellers (bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com): > >> Well Luggers, >> I downloaded Fedora 18 .isos one with KDE and the other with >> some other desktop environment and need to make sure the .isos >> are good but my distro does not have a version of SHA256sum >> nor have I been able to locate a site with an .rpm or other file >> for Mandriva or any other version which I can download to check >> those .iso files. > /usr/bin/sha256sum is an integral part of GNU coreutils. > > So, for example: > http://rpm.pbone.net/index.php3/stat/4/idpl/19399670/dir/mandriva_2011/com/coreutils-8.12-1.2-mdv2011.0.i586.rpm.html > > (But, don't get it off the Internet. Get it from your distro package > system.) That worked just fine and thanks a heap. I will have the iso available at the next meeting by the way with a DVD freshly made. If someone wants a copy of the other than KDE desktop iso let me know and I will have one read for you to take home. I picked up the Linux Pro this morning at the Fog City News and it has some interesting discussion of various recovery systems. The included DVD is Mint 14 with Cinnamon 1.6. They included a version of Knoppix 7.04 as well which was the main item last month. Any interest in either of these let me know and I will get a boot-able copy made. > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Wed Jan 30 19:39:59 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 19:39:59 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] looking fruitlessly for SHA256sum In-Reply-To: References: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <5109E78F.5090707@dslextreme.com> On 01/30/2013 04:19 PM, Jeff Bragg wrote: > I think openssl should be able to do that. I think something like > 'openssl dgst -sha256 /path/to/file' will generate the checksum; check > the man page, but I'd be surprised if it's not supported (it is on > Ubuntu 10.04, fwiw). Both you and Rick came up with excellent answers. Thanks for your consideration of my problem. Bobbie > > On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 4:00 PM, Bobbie Sellers > > > wrote: > > Well Luggers, > I downloaded Fedora 18 .isos one with KDE and the other with > some other desktop environment and need to make sure the .isos > are good but my distro does not have a version of SHA256sum > nor have I been able to locate a site with an .rpm or other file > for Mandriva or any other version which I can download to check > those .iso files. > > Thanks for your attention. > > Bobbie Sellers > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > > > -- > There Are More Than Two Ways To Do It -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Wed Jan 30 19:59:24 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 19:59:24 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] looking fruitlessly for SHA256sum In-Reply-To: <5109E767.8080605@dslextreme.com> References: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> <20130131003231.GX31449@linuxmafia.com> <5109E767.8080605@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <20130131035924.GY31449@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Bobbie Sellers (bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com): > That worked just fine and thanks a heap. Yr. very welcome. There's a ton of other really useful tools in GNU coreutils, so enjoy! From jim at well.com Thu Jan 31 09:26:41 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2013 09:26:41 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] looking fruitlessly for SHA256sum In-Reply-To: References: <5109B425.4000205@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <1359653201.1785.69.camel@jim-LAPTOP> in a terminal window: $ which sha256sum /usr/bin/sha256sum On Wed, 2013-01-30 at 16:09 -0800, Mike Higashi wrote: > On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 4:00 PM, Bobbie Sellers > wrote: > Well Luggers, > I downloaded Fedora 18 .isos one with KDE and the > other with > some other desktop environment and need to make sure the .isos > are good but my distro does not have a version of SHA256sum > nor have I been able to locate a site with an .rpm or other > file > for Mandriva or any other version which I can download to > check > those .iso files. > > > > My apologies for what may be a silly question, but did you check for > a > lower-case sha256sum command? > > > Mike > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Sat Feb 2 12:04:50 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2013 12:04:50 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Some UEFI progress - news item only In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <510D7162.1010901@dslextreme.com> I think some of us will be as interested as I am. Bobbie -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Some UEFI progress Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2013 17:29:48 +0000 (UTC) From: Bit Twister Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Newsgroups: alt.os.linux.mageia,alt.os.linux.mandriva The Linux Foundation's UEFI Secure Boot Pre-Bootloader Rewritten to Boot all Linux Versions -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: Attached Message Part URL: From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Mon Feb 4 11:49:20 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2013 11:49:20 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Live Fedora 18 distros used. Message-ID: <511010C0.9070901@dslextreme.com> Hi Luggers, I downloaded the Live i686-KDE version and the x86_64 Live Desktop. Then finally the Live KDE x86_64. Unfortunately I have no UEFI to try the install on. But it had been many years since I tried any Fedora distribution as the available stuff back when I was interested about 10 years back was hard to set up with a analog modem Nowadays I use a DSL modem and Fedora was always up for that. The KDE version was quite lightweight as far as the included tools. I tried to write to an under-used Flash drive with no luck, 18 kept trying to download Fedora 17 to write to the Flash drive. Other than lacking KDE tools I want to use, the KDE 4.9.4 was smooth and as adaptable to my eccentric use as any other KDE version that I have used in the last 10 years or so. The Live x86_64 Desktop was Mate and it resembles Gnome 3 or Windows 8 when you want to see the applications. No real menus. I didn't even want this on my Flash Drive. I am sure Gnome 3 works and am certain that people coming from Windows will find it convenient and perhaps a happy experience. Mate I am told is a disguised version of Gnome 3 by the way. So I may not ever install this but I am going for the x86_64 KDE-live version and see if it will work to install to a Flash drive. That did no better. Apparently the Fedora must be installed on the hard drive before you can use the tool. So as far as setting it up on a flash drive Fedora fails not only next to Knoppix but ExeLinux with Trinity(fork from KDE 3.5.9). Bobbie Sellers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Feb 4 12:43:03 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2013 12:43:03 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Live Fedora 18 distros used. In-Reply-To: <511010C0.9070901@dslextreme.com> References: <511010C0.9070901@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <20130204204303.GP31449@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Bobbie Sellers (bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com): > So I may not ever install this but I am going for the x86_64 KDE-live > version and see if it will work to install to a Flash drive. That > did no better. > Apparently the Fedora must be installed on the hard drive before > you can use the tool. Well, not according to the docs. Maybe this guide will help: http://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/Fedora/18/html/Installation_Guide/Making_USB_Media-UNIX_Linux.html From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Mon Feb 4 14:57:48 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2013 14:57:48 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Live Fedora 18 distros used. Message-ID: <51103CEC.3020406@dslextreme.com> Hi Team, I downloaded the Live i686-KDE version and the x86_64 Live Desktop. Then finally the Live KDE x86_64. Unfortunately I have no UEFI to try the install on. But it had been many years since I tried any Fedora distribution as the available stuff back when I was interested about 10 years back was hard to set up with a analog modem Nowadays I use a DSL modem and Fedora was always up for that. The KDE version was quite lightweight as far as the included tools. I tried to write to an under-used Flash drive with no luck, 18 kept trying to download Fedora 17 to write to the Flash drive. Other than lacking KDE tools I want to use, the KDE 4.9.4 was smooth and as adaptable to my eccentric use as any other KDE version that I have used in the last 10 years or so. The Live x86_64 Desktop was Mate and it resembles Gnome 3 or Windows 8 when you want to see the applications. No real menus. I didn't even want this on my Flash Drive. I am sure Gnome 3 works and am certain that people coming from Windows will find it convenient and perhaps a happy experience. Mate, I am told is a disguised version of Gnome 3 by the way. So I may not ever install this but I am going for the x86_64 KDE-live version and see if it will work to install to a Flash drive. That did no better. Apparently the Fedora must be installed on the hard drive before you can use the tool. So as far as setting it up on a flash drive Fedora fails not only next to Knoppix but ExeLinux with Trinity(fork from KDE 3.5.9). And there are cli tools as well to create the USB drive which instructions, using "dd", are on the Fedora site where you might expect them to be. bliss From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Tue Feb 5 01:33:28 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 01:33:28 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Example of an rsync(1) based backup scheme/script Message-ID: <20130205013328.328534s8cv97iask@webmail.rawbw.com> So, I've occasionally mentioned before[1], and also elsewhere, e.g. BUUG[2], some bits about rsync(1), and caveats about using it for backup purposes, and also a bit more generally about backups, e.g. [1][3]. Anyway, latest case I had for doing an rsync based script/program was rather recently. I do, at least occasionally, backup vicki[4], most notably bits there of interest to BALUG[5], and at least sometimes also SF-LUG. Anyway, I thought it was time I create script/program(s) related to such to make it not only more convenient, but at least typically quite a bit faster. And rsync - at least with suitable invocation, is well suited to the task. In this particular scenario, as is highly typical when I want to use rsync for backup purposes - and where I or others might possibly end up quite dependent upon that backup data, I want to quite ensure that the backups are good, accurate, and complete. The rsync program, at least by default, plays a bit loosey-goosey with that, leaning more towards speed and efficiency over integrity. It strikes a good balance for many of its more typical usages, but not exactly the balance I prefer where I want an at least somewhat higher degree of integrity on backups. Fortunately rsync has lots of options, so one can generally tweak that suitably to one's liking, and I do find its options quite sufficient for doing so, and to suit my purposes. One downside/caveat I've found with that, though - the options tend to change significantly among various (major) version differences of rsync releases. So, unfortunately, it does sometimes need some careful review and tweaking/updating (e.g. I've written fairly similar scripts before, and have had to significantly change them due to updated/different versions of rsync). Anyway, I give example script[6], and example usage below. I'm not going to fully explain rsync (or shell, or ssh, or Perl, or ...) below, or even anywhere close, but I'll point out at least some of the more interesting points and bits, and some of the bits that might not be so obvious or intuitive. First of all, rsync can be very fast. Most notably where target already looks rather to quite similar to source - and that is, in fact, what rsync very much excels at, and why I chose rsync as key component of backup in this case (backups happening over Internet, and with at least one link not or not guaranteed to be especially fast - e.g. not suitable for regularly streaming full backup of all the source system's data - but quite fine for grabbing the incremental/differential data - e.g. via rsync). Anyway, a bit further below, I first show some example runs of the script/program (which I called rsync_host2dir[6]), along with timing. I don't show the "very first run" - that took on the order of several hours, as the target was quite out-of-date (had lots of the "user data" and applications data, but was quite out-of-date and/or relatively incomplete on most of the rest of the operating system (OS) bits). However, subsequent backups have generally been comparatively very fast - e.g. under 6.5 minutes total to fully backup (rsync) 3 hosts (one physical host, two virtual guest hosts). The first timing run shown, was a bit longer (bit under 38 minutes for one of the hosts), but in that case the host had somewhat over 380 MiB of additional new data. All three hosts, combined, have roughly around 8 MiB total of data of interest (actual data on filesystems, excluding: easily reobtained OS ISO images, some FSH[7] volatile contents such as on/under /tmp, virtual/pseudo filesystems such as /proc and /sys, purely redundant filesystems such as an bind mount, and one rather ancient no longer very important backup of a much older predecessor host). Anyway, examples. I show some basic command line usage, in this case, bit of "one liner" (or so) invocation to backup 3 hosts. I've reformatted the input command line a bit as it would look if I did it a bit differently to make it more readable - otherwise it's the same/equivalent. In each case, I prepared target, by first copying (most) recent earlier backup to the target location(s) (a moderately large, but fast local copy), and then using the rsync script to update the targets. The script takes two arguments, a source host, and a local target directory. In the examples below, that's seen on the lines: > do time rsync_host2dir "$tmp" \ and the following line giving the target. In the examples, the shell substitutes in for "$tmp" the host arguments that I've given to the shell's for loop. The leading "> " on each line is the shell's PS2 prompt (it's essentially prompting that it needs additional input to complete the command's syntax). The do and time are part of how I invoked it under shell - do part of the for loop syntax, and time, a built-in to the shell that gives us some timing information - most notably what it reports as "real" is total elapsed "real" time according to the system's clock - useful for a gross overall "how long did it take?". The not-so-obvious "host" (DNS) names under the .balug.org. domain are for the BALUG host of interest, and for host vicki (the physical host which contains the BALUG and SF-LUG virtual hosts). Somewhat more detailed description of the rsync_host2dir script/program follows these example invocations. The actual code for rsync_host2dir is also shown further down in the references and also available at [6]. $ (for tmp in \ > sf-lug.com. \ > balug-sf-lug-v2.balug.org. \ > balug-sf-lug-v2.console.balug.org. > do time rsync_host2dir "$tmp" \ > /home/r/root/tmp/mnt/balug/2013-01-28_BALUG/"$tmp"/root > done) real 1m24.543s user 0m7.368s sys 0m3.156s real 3m52.409s user 0m21.633s sys 0m7.648s real 37m3.104s user 0m27.754s sys 0m15.449s $ $ (for tmp in \ > sf-lug.com. \ > balug-sf-lug-v2.balug.org. \ > balug-sf-lug-v2.console.balug.org. > do time rsync_host2dir "$tmp" \ > /home/r/root/tmp/mnt/balug/2013-01-29_BALUG/"$tmp"/root > done) real 1m1.408s user 0m5.908s sys 0m1.356s real 3m27.008s user 0m19.945s sys 0m6.656s real 1m50.894s user 0m7.040s sys 0m2.916s $ So, some comments about the rsync_host2dir script/program. First of all, it includes some bits to, if not executed as superuser, to reinvoke itself as superuser via sudo. Although in some other contexts I might write script/program to do similar (or go from root to some application ID via su if not invoked as the application ID), this is a bit atypical compared to my more common rsync scripts. But in this case, it's (thus far) fired up manually on an ad hoc (but hopefully fairly regular) basis. Were it intended to be, e.g. driven by a cron job, that would probably be a bit different. Here also, in that sudo use, it essentially leverages (presumed) user's ssh key access via ssh-agent and passes that along. Again, a bit atypical compared to such scripts I've more commonly done - but particularly handy/useful/convenient in this case - especially since those ssh keys are passphrase protected and generally only used via ssh-agent, and generally "only" by that invoking user. Note also that it doesn't need the ssh keys for very long. It does two ssh connections to host, first to gather mount information, and second - quite shortly thereafter - to do the rsync based backup. They keys or only needed when making the ssh connections, not after they're already established, so, e.g., the key(s) can be made available only a quite short time (e.g. a minute or two or less) via ssh-agent, and still work quite fine, even if the backup takes much longer. Scheduled production uses would typically have a somewhat different setup regarding key(s) and ID(s) and such. In the program's first ssh connection to source host, it runs the mount command, and then parses the output of that. It does so to determine filesystem(s) to back up, and also the order in which we want them backed up. It looks at filesystem type, and mount point, only selecting filesystems that are of a desired type and also excluding mount point patterns we wish to skip. They're then sorted in a priority order - this ordering is based upon a probable restore order in "worst case scenario" where we need to restore "everything". In such cases, where there are separate filesystems, we will generally need things restored in this order of priority: /boot / /usr /var /home And then anything/everything else in sorted order (so filesystems containing mountpoints of other filesystems are restored are restored before those other filesystems). We're also not horribly picky about the order of these latter filesystems, other than that caveat, so we use a basic sort to cover that. Anyway, in "full" recovery/restore scenarios, one may often want to first recover those initial filesystems, and may then opt to restart the recovered OS, quite possibly in single user mode, and then restore the remaining filesystems onto that running OS. Also, in this particular case, since we're writing target to filesystem(s) - essential (presumed) random access media, rather than sequential, the order isn't as important, but still may be fairly useful (and that bit of code, or quite similar, is also used in some other backup code I use - including code that also does backups to sequential media or media that's handled more-or-less as sequential in full recovery/restore scenarios). The shell then shoves the list of filesystems desired into named parameter ("variable") backupmountpoints. Perl is used in parsing the output of the mount command. The only Perl bit that might not be quite so obvious for those not somewhat familiar with Perl, is bits about quoting and shell/Perl interaction. The Perl program is executed as part of shell program/script, so it's given as a single argument to Perl's -e option. To do that, the whole thing is put within single quotes ('), to protect it from interpretation by the shell. That's all fine and dandy, except then how do we effectively do ' within the perl program, since the shell is interpreting ' in that context. We've two options: '\'' q/STRING/ The first of those, within the context of single quoted string within shell, gets interpreted as a single quote, and thus passed to Perl that way. Or more precisely, it ends up as terminating the single quoted string, having a literal single quote, and then starting (resuming) single quoted string - which shell then parses as all part of same argument, leaving the literal single quote in, and discarding the surrounding single quotes, and passing that along as argument. However, the '\'' context gets ugly to read. It can, however, be used, as needed, recursively - but the parsing of such is best left to programs, as that does end up quite ugly. In this case, however, we go for the second option. In perl, ' is just a more common shorthand for Perl's more generalized q operator. By using it explicitly, starting with q, we can explicitly give our "single quote character" (or implied matched pair) to be used by Perl on that particular invocation of quoting. That makes it easier for the person familiar with Perl to read, than seeing '\'' and having to decode the shell context first, before Perl. It also can be a bit easier for the person looking at shell, as start and end of the single quoted string is easier to find/see/parse/search, without a bunch of use of '\'' within. So, we use Perl's q in this case. In our rsync invocation, I use a bunch of non-default options, to accommodate two particular objectives. First of all, want rather high integrity backups, so that adds a spattering of non-default options, e.g.: --archive --numeric-ids --sparse --checksum --ignore-times. In this case, bit of double-edged sword, but we definitely want --numeric-ids, as we always want those interpreted consistently, regardless of where that backup may move to or what /etc/passwd and /etc/group or the like look like on the system having those backups. We also chose to do it that way, as that data will never be directly used (e.g. run as operating system) on backup host - at least certainly not without suitable adjustments or context (e.g. also along with use of the backed up host's user/group context information). The other objective is more-or-less attempting certain optimizations for our particular backup scenario and usage. E.g. we use --relative, as we may have multiple source mountpoints, and we want to preserve their hierarchial relationship under the target directory. We use --one-file-system, as we've explicitly selected all the filesystem(s) we wish to backup, and wish to not include any others. We give --compress-level=9, as we wish to optimize for bandwidth, rather than CPU, even if that might make for slower over-all backups (we're more likely to have CPU to spare, and may not have bandwidth to spare or may wish to conserve bandwidth as feasible). In other scenarios we might make a very different CPU/bandwidth tradeoff decision (e.g. >= Gigabit uncongested "free" or fixed cost bandwidth with desire to minimize backup time). We use some --filter= options to exclude some stuff we don't want to backup. We'd excluded on filesystem basis earlier, this bit is to exclude any bits that may be within filesystems - e.g. we don't want to backup the FHS volatile /tmp, nor do we want to backup easily reobtained OS ISO images (and related data), so we exclude where we have only those. Well, hopefully that covers at least the bits that may not be so obvious, at least given other handy reference documentation (man pages, etc.). Script/program is shown further below and also available at [6]. And yes, I did talk at least some bit about rsync at and immediately following the SF-LUG 2012-01-21 meeting, and have also discussed rsync at other meetings, e.g. [2]. If you actually find a bug, please certainly let me know. But I'm not exactly looking for "feature requests" or the like - this is (almost) a one-off program, not (quite) designed/intended to more generally solve this particular type of backup scenario (but it's "general enough" I could use it for multiple systems, and in fact use it for at least 3 hosts thus far). references/excerpts: 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2010q1/007678.html 2. http://www.buug.org/ 3. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2010q2/007732.html 4. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2012q1/009159.html http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=system:vicki_debian_lenny_to_squeeze http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?do=index&idx=system 5. http://www.balug.org/ 6. http://www.rawbw.com/~mp/unix/sh/examples/rsync_host2dir 7. http://www.pathname.com/fhs/ $ expand -t 4 < ~/bin/rsync_host2dir #!/bin/sh program=/home/m/michael/bin/rsync_host2dir [ $# -eq 2 ] || { 1>&2 echo "usage: $0 host directory" exit 1 } [ -n "$1" ] || { 1>&2 echo "host cannot be null: usage: $0 host directory" exit 1 } [ -n "$2" ] || { 1>&2 echo "directory cannot be null: usage: $0 host directory" exit 1 } [ x$(id -u) = x0 ] || { # make our directory absolute before cd / directory=$(pwd -P)/"$2" || exit set -- "$1" "$directory"; unset directory cd / && { exec sudo su - root -c "LC_ALL=C SSH_AUTH_SOCK=$SSH_AUTH_SOCK $program $1 $2" || exit } } host="$1" directory="$2" set -- [ -d "$directory" ] || { 1>&2 echo "$0: directory $directory doesn't exist, aborting" exit 1 } # ssh -atx "$host" 'hostname; id'; exit backupmountpoints=$( ssh -ax "$host" 'cd / && umask 077 && exec mount' | #/home/m/michael/src/backup/bin/device__mount_point__type__options perl -e ' $^W=1; use strict; #data fields to gather from output of mount(8) my $match_mount=q:^(.+) on (.+) type (.+) \((.*?)\)\n*$:; # device # mount point # type # options my @mount=(); while (<>){ if (/$match_mount/) { my $device=$1; my $mount_point=$2; my $type=$3; my $options=$4; #skip filesystems we are not presently interested in ( #must be one of these types ... $type =~ / ^ (?: ext[234] | reiserfs ) $ /ox || #or one of these type and ... $type =~ / ^ (?: ntfs | vfat | fat ) $ /ox && #mounted readonly $options =~ / (?:^|,) ro (?:,|$) /ox ) && #and not one of these mount points $mount_point !~ m! ^ (?: /+mnt | /+media | /+var/+local/+pub/+iso | /+var/+local/+tower | /+home/+r/+root/+tmp/+mnt ) (?:$|/) !ox or next; #push device mount_point type options on our array, #split out the options push @mount,[$device,$mount_point,$type,[split(/,/,$options)]] } else { print ("else\n"); print STDERR ("$0: ",(m:^(.*?)\n*$:)," failed to match $match_mount\n"); } } @mount=sort { #handle highest priorities (if present) first: #/boot, / (root), /usr, /var, /home for my $pri ( q:/boot:, q:/:, q:/usr:, q:/var:, q:/home: ) { if(@$a[1] eq $pri && @$b[1] ne $pri) { return -1; } if(@$b[1] eq $pri && @$a[1] ne $pri) { return 1; } } #everything else is higher and compares normally #print ("@$a[1] cmp @$b[1] ",@$a[1] cmp @$b[1],"\n"); @$a[1] cmp @$b[1]; } @mount; my $mountpointsout=q::; for my $line (@mount) { #print join(q: :,(@{$line}[0..2]),join(q:,:,@{${$line}[3]})),"\n"; #print(@{$line}[1],"\n"); # just the mount points if($mountpointsout ne q::){ $mountpointsout .= q: :; $mountpointsout .= @{$line}[1]; }else{ $mountpointsout = @{$line}[1]; }; } print($mountpointsout); ' ) #echo "$backupmountpoints" rsync \ --archive \ --acls \ --xattrs \ --hard-links \ --numeric-ids \ --relative \ --sparse \ --rsh='ssh -aTx -o BatchMode=yes ' \ --checksum \ --partial \ --one-file-system \ --delete-excluded \ --ignore-times \ --compress-level=9 \ --filter='-,/ /tmp/**' \ --filter='-,/ /var/local/pub/mirrored/cdimage.debian.org/**' \ --quiet \ "$host":"$backupmountpoints" "$directory" # --verbose # --bwlimit=KBPS # --inplace # --compress From jim at systemateka.com Tue Feb 5 09:43:21 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 09:43:21 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Example of an rsync(1) based backup scheme/script In-Reply-To: <20130205013328.328534s8cv97iask@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130205013328.328534s8cv97iask@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1360086201.1785.388.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Amazing and useful. Many thanks. I'll have to reread this a few times, but wow! (And thanks for the expand example, too.) On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 01:33 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > So, I've occasionally mentioned before[1], and also elsewhere, e.g. > BUUG[2], some bits about rsync(1), and caveats about using it for > backup purposes, and also a bit more generally about backups, e.g. > [1][3]. Anyway, latest case I had for doing an rsync based > script/program was rather recently. I do, at least occasionally, > backup vicki[4], most notably bits there of interest to BALUG[5], and at > least sometimes also SF-LUG. Anyway, I thought it was time I create > script/program(s) related to such to make it not only more convenient, > but at least typically quite a bit faster. And rsync - at least with > suitable invocation, is well suited to the task. > > In this particular scenario, as is highly typical when I want to use > rsync for backup purposes - and where I or others might possibly end up > quite dependent upon that backup data, I want to quite ensure that the > backups are good, accurate, and complete. The rsync program, at least > by default, plays a bit loosey-goosey with that, leaning more towards > speed and efficiency over integrity. It strikes a good balance for > many of its more typical usages, but not exactly the balance I prefer > where I want an at least somewhat higher degree of integrity on > backups. Fortunately rsync has lots of options, so one can generally > tweak that suitably to one's liking, and I do find its options quite > sufficient for doing so, and to suit my purposes. One downside/caveat > I've found with that, though - the options tend to change significantly > among various (major) version differences of rsync releases. So, > unfortunately, it does sometimes need some careful review and > tweaking/updating (e.g. I've written fairly similar scripts before, and > have had to significantly change them due to updated/different versions > of rsync). > > Anyway, I give example script[6], and example usage below. I'm not going > to fully explain rsync (or shell, or ssh, or Perl, or ...) below, or > even anywhere close, but I'll point out at least some of the more > interesting points and bits, and some of the bits that might not be so > obvious or intuitive. > > First of all, rsync can be very fast. Most notably where target already > looks rather to quite similar to source - and that is, in fact, what > rsync very much excels at, and why I chose rsync as key component of > backup in this case (backups happening over Internet, and with at least > one link not or not guaranteed to be especially fast - e.g. not suitable > for regularly streaming full backup of all the source system's data - > but quite fine for grabbing the incremental/differential data - e.g. via > rsync). > > Anyway, a bit further below, I first show some example runs of the > script/program (which I called rsync_host2dir[6]), along with timing. I > don't show the "very first run" - that took on the order of several > hours, as the target was quite out-of-date (had lots of the "user data" > and applications data, but was quite out-of-date and/or relatively > incomplete on most of the rest of the operating system (OS) bits). > However, subsequent backups have generally been comparatively very fast > - e.g. under 6.5 minutes total to fully backup (rsync) 3 hosts (one > physical host, two virtual guest hosts). The first timing run shown, > was a bit longer (bit under 38 minutes for one of the hosts), but in > that case the host had somewhat over 380 MiB of additional new data. > All three hosts, combined, have roughly around 8 MiB total of data of > interest (actual data on filesystems, excluding: easily reobtained OS ISO > images, some FSH[7] volatile contents such as on/under /tmp, > virtual/pseudo filesystems such as /proc and /sys, purely redundant > filesystems such as an bind mount, and one rather ancient no longer very > important backup of a much older predecessor host). > > Anyway, examples. I show some basic command line usage, in this case, > bit of "one liner" (or so) invocation to backup 3 hosts. I've > reformatted the input command line a bit as it would look if I did it a > bit differently to make it more readable - otherwise it's the > same/equivalent. In each case, I prepared target, by first copying > (most) recent earlier backup to the target location(s) (a moderately > large, but fast local copy), and then using the rsync script to update > the targets. > > The script takes two arguments, a source host, and a local target > directory. In the examples below, that's seen on the lines: > > do time rsync_host2dir "$tmp" \ > and the following line giving the target. > In the examples, the shell substitutes in for "$tmp" the host arguments > that I've given to the shell's for loop. The leading "> " on each line > is the shell's PS2 prompt (it's essentially prompting that it needs > additional input to complete the command's syntax). > The do and time are part of how I invoked it under shell - do part of > the for loop syntax, and time, a built-in to the shell that gives us > some timing information - most notably what it reports as "real" is > total elapsed "real" time according to the system's clock - useful for a > gross overall "how long did it take?". The not-so-obvious "host" (DNS) > names under the .balug.org. domain are for the BALUG host of interest, > and for host vicki (the physical host which contains the BALUG and > SF-LUG virtual hosts). > > Somewhat more detailed description of the rsync_host2dir script/program > follows these example invocations. The actual code for rsync_host2dir > is also shown further down in the references and also available at [6]. > > $ (for tmp in \ > > sf-lug.com. \ > > balug-sf-lug-v2.balug.org. \ > > balug-sf-lug-v2.console.balug.org. > > do time rsync_host2dir "$tmp" \ > > /home/r/root/tmp/mnt/balug/2013-01-28_BALUG/"$tmp"/root > > done) > > real 1m24.543s > user 0m7.368s > sys 0m3.156s > > real 3m52.409s > user 0m21.633s > sys 0m7.648s > > real 37m3.104s > user 0m27.754s > sys 0m15.449s > $ > > $ (for tmp in \ > > sf-lug.com. \ > > balug-sf-lug-v2.balug.org. \ > > balug-sf-lug-v2.console.balug.org. > > do time rsync_host2dir "$tmp" \ > > /home/r/root/tmp/mnt/balug/2013-01-29_BALUG/"$tmp"/root > > done) > > real 1m1.408s > user 0m5.908s > sys 0m1.356s > > real 3m27.008s > user 0m19.945s > sys 0m6.656s > > real 1m50.894s > user 0m7.040s > sys 0m2.916s > $ > > So, some comments about the rsync_host2dir script/program. First of > all, it includes some bits to, if not executed as superuser, to > reinvoke itself as superuser via sudo. Although in some other contexts > I might write script/program to do similar (or go from root to some > application ID via su if not invoked as the application ID), this is a > bit atypical compared to my more common rsync scripts. But in this > case, it's (thus far) fired up manually on an ad hoc (but hopefully > fairly regular) basis. Were it intended to be, e.g. driven by a cron > job, that would probably be a bit different. Here also, in that sudo > use, it essentially leverages (presumed) user's ssh key access via > ssh-agent and passes that along. Again, a bit atypical compared to > such scripts I've more commonly done - but particularly > handy/useful/convenient in this case - especially since those ssh keys > are passphrase protected and generally only used via ssh-agent, and > generally "only" by that invoking user. Note also that it doesn't need > the ssh keys for very long. It does two ssh connections to host, first > to gather mount information, and second - quite shortly thereafter - to > do the rsync based backup. They keys or only needed when making the > ssh connections, not after they're already established, so, e.g., the > key(s) can be made available only a quite short time (e.g. a minute or > two or less) via ssh-agent, and still work quite fine, even if the > backup takes much longer. Scheduled production uses would typically > have a somewhat different setup regarding key(s) and ID(s) and such. > > In the program's first ssh connection to source host, it runs the mount > command, and then parses the output of that. It does so to determine > filesystem(s) to back up, and also the order in which we want them > backed up. It looks at filesystem type, and mount point, only selecting > filesystems that are of a desired type and also excluding mount point > patterns we wish to skip. They're then sorted in a priority order - > this ordering is based upon a probable restore order in "worst case > scenario" where we need to restore "everything". In such cases, where > there are separate filesystems, we will generally need things restored > in this order of priority: > /boot > / > /usr > /var > /home > And then anything/everything else in sorted order (so filesystems > containing mountpoints of other filesystems are restored are restored > before those other filesystems). We're also not horribly picky about > the order of these latter filesystems, other than that caveat, so we use > a basic sort to cover that. Anyway, in "full" recovery/restore > scenarios, one may often want to first recover those initial > filesystems, and may then opt to restart the recovered OS, quite > possibly in single user mode, and then restore the remaining filesystems > onto that running OS. Also, in this particular case, since we're > writing target to filesystem(s) - essential (presumed) random access media, > rather than sequential, the order isn't as important, but still may be > fairly useful (and that bit of code, or quite similar, is also used in > some other backup code I use - including code that also does backups to > sequential media or media that's handled more-or-less as sequential in > full recovery/restore scenarios). The shell then shoves the list of > filesystems desired into named parameter ("variable") backupmountpoints. > Perl is used in parsing the output of the mount command. The only Perl > bit that might not be quite so obvious for those not somewhat familiar > with Perl, is bits about quoting and shell/Perl interaction. The Perl > program is executed as part of shell program/script, so it's given as a > single argument to Perl's -e option. To do that, the whole thing is put > within single quotes ('), to protect it from interpretation by the > shell. That's all fine and dandy, except then how do we effectively do > ' within the perl program, since the shell is interpreting ' in that > context. We've two options: > '\'' > q/STRING/ > The first of those, within the context of single quoted string within > shell, gets interpreted as a single quote, and thus passed to Perl that > way. Or more precisely, it ends up as terminating the single quoted > string, having a literal single quote, and then starting (resuming) > single quoted string - which shell then parses as all part of same > argument, leaving the literal single quote in, and discarding the > surrounding single quotes, and passing that along as argument. However, > the '\'' context gets ugly to read. It can, however, be used, as > needed, recursively - but the parsing of such is best left to programs, > as that does end up quite ugly. In this case, however, we go for the > second option. In perl, ' is just a more common shorthand for Perl's > more generalized q operator. By using it explicitly, starting with q, > we can explicitly give our "single quote character" (or implied matched > pair) to be used by Perl on that particular invocation of quoting. > That makes it easier for the person familiar with Perl to read, than > seeing '\'' and having to decode the shell context first, before Perl. > It also can be a bit easier for the person looking at shell, as start > and end of the single quoted string is easier to find/see/parse/search, > without a bunch of use of '\'' within. So, we use Perl's q in this > case. > > In our rsync invocation, I use a bunch of non-default options, to > accommodate two particular objectives. First of all, want rather high > integrity backups, so that adds a spattering of non-default options, > e.g.: --archive --numeric-ids --sparse --checksum --ignore-times. > In this case, bit of double-edged sword, but we definitely want > --numeric-ids, as we always want those interpreted consistently, > regardless of where that backup may move to or what /etc/passwd and > /etc/group or the like look like on the system having those backups. We > also chose to do it that way, as that data will never be directly used > (e.g. run as operating system) on backup host - at least certainly not > without suitable adjustments or context (e.g. also along with use of the > backed up host's user/group context information). The other objective > is more-or-less attempting certain optimizations for our particular > backup scenario and usage. E.g. we use --relative, as we may have > multiple source mountpoints, and we want to preserve their hierarchial > relationship under the target directory. We use --one-file-system, as > we've explicitly selected all the filesystem(s) we wish to backup, and > wish to not include any others. We give --compress-level=9, as we wish > to optimize for bandwidth, rather than CPU, even if that might make for > slower over-all backups (we're more likely to have CPU to spare, and may > not have bandwidth to spare or may wish to conserve bandwidth as > feasible). In other scenarios we might make a very different > CPU/bandwidth tradeoff decision (e.g. >= Gigabit uncongested "free" or > fixed cost bandwidth with desire to minimize backup time). > We use some --filter= options to exclude some stuff we don't want to > backup. We'd excluded on filesystem basis earlier, this bit is to > exclude any bits that may be within filesystems - e.g. we don't want to > backup the FHS volatile /tmp, nor do we want to backup easily reobtained > OS ISO images (and related data), so we exclude where we have only > those. > > Well, hopefully that covers at least the bits that may not be so > obvious, at least given other handy reference documentation (man pages, > etc.). Script/program is shown further below and also available at [6]. > > And yes, I did talk at least some bit about rsync at and immediately > following the SF-LUG 2012-01-21 meeting, and have also discussed rsync > at other meetings, e.g. [2]. > > If you actually find a bug, please certainly let me know. But I'm not > exactly looking for "feature requests" or the like - this is (almost) a > one-off program, not (quite) designed/intended to more generally solve > this particular type of backup scenario (but it's "general enough" I > could use it for multiple systems, and in fact use it for at least 3 > hosts thus far). > > references/excerpts: > 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2010q1/007678.html > 2. http://www.buug.org/ > 3. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2010q2/007732.html > 4. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2012q1/009159.html > > http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=system:vicki_debian_lenny_to_squeeze > http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?do=index&idx=system > 5. http://www.balug.org/ > 6. http://www.rawbw.com/~mp/unix/sh/examples/rsync_host2dir > 7. http://www.pathname.com/fhs/ > > $ expand -t 4 < ~/bin/rsync_host2dir > #!/bin/sh > program=/home/m/michael/bin/rsync_host2dir > > [ $# -eq 2 ] || { > 1>&2 echo "usage: $0 host directory" > exit 1 > } > [ -n "$1" ] || { > 1>&2 echo "host cannot be null: usage: $0 host directory" > exit 1 > } > [ -n "$2" ] || { > 1>&2 echo "directory cannot be null: usage: $0 host directory" > exit 1 > } > [ x$(id -u) = x0 ] || { > # make our directory absolute before cd / > directory=$(pwd -P)/"$2" || exit > set -- "$1" "$directory"; unset directory > cd / && > { > exec sudo su - root -c "LC_ALL=C SSH_AUTH_SOCK=$SSH_AUTH_SOCK > $program $1 $2" || > exit > } > } > > host="$1" > directory="$2" > set -- > > [ -d "$directory" ] || { > 1>&2 echo "$0: directory $directory doesn't exist, aborting" > exit 1 > } > > # ssh -atx "$host" 'hostname; id'; exit > > backupmountpoints=$( > ssh -ax "$host" 'cd / && umask 077 && exec mount' | > #/home/m/michael/src/backup/bin/device__mount_point__type__options > perl -e ' > $^W=1; > use strict; > > #data fields to gather from output of mount(8) > my $match_mount=q:^(.+) on (.+) type (.+) \((.*?)\)\n*$:; > # device > # mount point > # type > # options > my @mount=(); > > while (<>){ > if (/$match_mount/) { > my $device=$1; > my $mount_point=$2; > my $type=$3; > my $options=$4; > #skip filesystems we are not presently interested in > ( > #must be one of these types ... > $type =~ > / > ^ (?: > ext[234] | > reiserfs > ) > $ > /ox > || > #or one of these type and ... > $type =~ > / > ^ (?: > ntfs | > vfat | > fat > ) > $ > /ox > && > #mounted readonly > $options =~ > / > (?:^|,) > ro > (?:,|$) > /ox > ) && > #and not one of these mount points > $mount_point !~ > m! > ^ > (?: > /+mnt | > /+media | > /+var/+local/+pub/+iso | > /+var/+local/+tower | > /+home/+r/+root/+tmp/+mnt > ) > (?:$|/) > !ox > or next; > #push device mount_point type options on our array, > #split out the options > push @mount,[$device,$mount_point,$type,[split(/,/,$options)]] > } > else { > print ("else\n"); > print STDERR ("$0: ",(m:^(.*?)\n*$:)," failed to > match $match_mount\n"); > } > } > > @mount=sort { > #handle highest priorities (if present) first: > #/boot, / (root), /usr, /var, /home > for my $pri ( > q:/boot:, > q:/:, > q:/usr:, > q:/var:, > q:/home: > ) { > if(@$a[1] eq $pri && @$b[1] ne $pri) { return -1; } > if(@$b[1] eq $pri && @$a[1] ne $pri) { return 1; } > } > #everything else is higher and compares normally > #print ("@$a[1] cmp @$b[1] ",@$a[1] cmp @$b[1],"\n"); > @$a[1] cmp @$b[1]; > } @mount; > > my $mountpointsout=q::; > for my $line (@mount) { > #print join(q: :,(@{$line}[0..2]),join(q:,:,@{${$line}[3]})),"\n"; > #print(@{$line}[1],"\n"); # just the mount points > if($mountpointsout ne q::){ > $mountpointsout .= q: :; > $mountpointsout .= @{$line}[1]; > }else{ > $mountpointsout = @{$line}[1]; > }; > } > print($mountpointsout); > ' > ) > > #echo "$backupmountpoints" > > rsync \ > --archive \ > --acls \ > --xattrs \ > --hard-links \ > --numeric-ids \ > --relative \ > --sparse \ > --rsh='ssh -aTx -o BatchMode=yes ' \ > --checksum \ > --partial \ > --one-file-system \ > --delete-excluded \ > --ignore-times \ > --compress-level=9 \ > --filter='-,/ /tmp/**' \ > --filter='-,/ /var/local/pub/mirrored/cdimage.debian.org/**' \ > --quiet \ > "$host":"$backupmountpoints" "$directory" > # --verbose > # --bwlimit=KBPS > # --inplace > # --compress > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Tue Feb 5 11:49:26 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2013 11:49:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1360093766.76016.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Tue Feb 5 13:08:18 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 13:08:18 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet Message-ID: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> Jim, et. al., Looks like it's gotten worse[1][3]. Let me know if you need/want help fixing this[1]. At present, http://www.sf-lug.org/ and http://sf-lug.org/ ... well, the results aren't pretty[3] ... at least not pretty for SF-LUG, anyway. footnotes/references/excerpts: 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2012q2/009300.html 2. And/or optimizing, particularly along with [www.]sf-lug.{com,org} 3. [4] Welcome to CircleSoft CircleSoft is a premier computer system design and implementation company with over 35 years of experience in architecting, specifying and implementing cutting edge technology. The CircleSoft staff understands digital technology from the silicon to the user's application software. We have participated in a wide variety of implementation projects from micro-chips to heavy iron VA medical information systems. In short, CircleSoft brings more to the table, a broad array of experience focused within a very small staff than conventional technology design corporations must rely upon large teams of staff members to even come close. 4. st=$(printf '\040\007') # space and tab lynx -dump http://www.sf-lug.org/ | sed -ne \ ' :t /^['"$st"']*[^'"$st"'[]/,/^['"$st"']*$/{ # first "real" paragraph and blank line p /^['"$st"']*$/{ b n } } n b t :n /^['"$st"']*$/{ # skip blank lines n b n } :2 # 2nd real paragraph p n /^['"$st"']*$/!b 2 q ' | expand From grantbow at ubuntu.com Tue Feb 5 14:45:09 2013 From: grantbow at ubuntu.com (Grant Bowman) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 14:45:09 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet In-Reply-To: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: I hope this gets fixed. No matter what a user types they should get to the real site. Grant Michael Paoli wrote: >Jim, et. al., > >Looks like it's gotten worse[1][3]. >Let me know if you need/want help fixing this[1]. At present, >http://www.sf-lug.org/ and http://sf-lug.org/ ... well, the results >aren't pretty[3] ... at least not pretty for SF-LUG, anyway. > >footnotes/references/excerpts: >1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2012q2/009300.html >2. And/or optimizing, particularly along with [www.]sf-lug.{com,org} >3. [4] > Welcome to CircleSoft > > CircleSoft is a premier computer system design and implementation > company with over 35 years of experience in architecting, specifying > and implementing cutting edge technology. The CircleSoft staff > understands digital technology from the silicon to the user's > application software. We have participated in a wide variety of > implementation projects from micro-chips to heavy iron VA medical > information systems. In short, CircleSoft brings more to the table, > a broad array of experience focused within a very small staff than > conventional technology design corporations must rely upon large > teams of staff members to even come close. >4. >st=$(printf '\040\007') # space and tab >lynx -dump http://www.sf-lug.org/ | >sed -ne \ >' > :t > /^['"$st"']*[^'"$st"'[]/,/^['"$st"']*$/{ > # first "real" paragraph and blank line > p > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > b n > } > } > n > b t > :n > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > # skip blank lines > n > b n > } > :2 > # 2nd real paragraph > p > n > /^['"$st"']*$/!b 2 > q >' | expand -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Tue Feb 5 18:32:41 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 18:32:41 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet In-Reply-To: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1360117961.1815.3.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Thank you Michael and Grant. I may be sufficiently shamed to go to the domain repo and repoint the .org name to the .com ip address. On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 13:08 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > Jim, et. al., > > Looks like it's gotten worse[1][3]. > Let me know if you need/want help fixing this[1]. At present, > http://www.sf-lug.org/ and http://sf-lug.org/ ... well, the results > aren't pretty[3] ... at least not pretty for SF-LUG, anyway. > > footnotes/references/excerpts: > 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2012q2/009300.html > 2. And/or optimizing, particularly along with [www.]sf-lug.{com,org} > 3. [4] > Welcome to CircleSoft > > CircleSoft is a premier computer system design and implementation > company with over 35 years of experience in architecting, specifying > and implementing cutting edge technology. The CircleSoft staff > understands digital technology from the silicon to the user's > application software. We have participated in a wide variety of > implementation projects from micro-chips to heavy iron VA medical > information systems. In short, CircleSoft brings more to the table, > a broad array of experience focused within a very small staff than > conventional technology design corporations must rely upon large > teams of staff members to even come close. > 4. > st=$(printf '\040\007') # space and tab > lynx -dump http://www.sf-lug.org/ | > sed -ne \ > ' > :t > /^['"$st"']*[^'"$st"'[]/,/^['"$st"']*$/{ > # first "real" paragraph and blank line > p > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > b n > } > } > n > b t > :n > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > # skip blank lines > n > b n > } > :2 > # 2nd real paragraph > p > n > /^['"$st"']*$/!b 2 > q > ' | expand > From jim at well.com Tue Feb 5 19:03:18 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 19:03:18 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet In-Reply-To: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> I think I fixed it at about 7 PM PST Tuesday 20130205. The service web site says it may take up to 24 hours to propagate; in my experience we should see the change within a couple of hours. Again, thank you, Michael and Grant. I value your support a lot. On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 13:08 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > Jim, et. al., > > Looks like it's gotten worse[1][3]. > Let me know if you need/want help fixing this[1]. At present, > http://www.sf-lug.org/ and http://sf-lug.org/ ... well, the results > aren't pretty[3] ... at least not pretty for SF-LUG, anyway. > > footnotes/references/excerpts: > 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2012q2/009300.html > 2. And/or optimizing, particularly along with [www.]sf-lug.{com,org} > 3. [4] > Welcome to CircleSoft > > CircleSoft is a premier computer system design and implementation > company with over 35 years of experience in architecting, specifying > and implementing cutting edge technology. The CircleSoft staff > understands digital technology from the silicon to the user's > application software. We have participated in a wide variety of > implementation projects from micro-chips to heavy iron VA medical > information systems. In short, CircleSoft brings more to the table, > a broad array of experience focused within a very small staff than > conventional technology design corporations must rely upon large > teams of staff members to even come close. > 4. > st=$(printf '\040\007') # space and tab > lynx -dump http://www.sf-lug.org/ | > sed -ne \ > ' > :t > /^['"$st"']*[^'"$st"'[]/,/^['"$st"']*$/{ > # first "real" paragraph and blank line > p > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > b n > } > } > n > b t > :n > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > # skip blank lines > n > b n > } > :2 > # 2nd real paragraph > p > n > /^['"$st"']*$/!b 2 > q > ' | expand > From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue Feb 5 19:28:44 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2013 19:28:44 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet In-Reply-To: <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130206032844.GD17635@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Jim Stockford (jim at well.com): > I think I fixed it at about 7 PM PST Tuesday 20130205. The service web > site says it may take up to 24 hours to propagate; in my experience we > should see the change within a couple of hours. That's because you have the DNS information's TTL set to 7200 seconds = 2 hours, by the way. (Don't forget, that's within your control, too.) Both of your authoritative nameservers now have the DNS change you made, so you're in effect just waiting for people's cached DNS data (if any) to exceed Time To Live. $ dig -t ns sf-lug.org. +short ns42.worldnic.com. ns41.worldnic.com. $ dig www.sf-lug.org. @ns41.worldnic.com. +short 208.96.15.252 $ dig www.sf-lug.org. @ns42.worldnic.com. +short 208.96.15.252 $ From jim at well.com Tue Feb 5 19:43:09 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 19:43:09 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet In-Reply-To: <20130206032844.GD17635@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130206032844.GD17635@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1360122189.1815.18.camel@jim-LAPTOP> You are terrific! Thanks for the info, very helpful. I noticed the 7200 box when I edited the domain info, tho' I didn't think to change it (seems pretty good as is). On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 19:28 -0800, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Jim Stockford (jim at well.com): > > > I think I fixed it at about 7 PM PST Tuesday 20130205. The service web > > site says it may take up to 24 hours to propagate; in my experience we > > should see the change within a couple of hours. > > That's because you have the DNS information's TTL set to 7200 seconds = > 2 hours, by the way. (Don't forget, that's within your control, too.) > > Both of your authoritative nameservers now have the DNS change you made, > so you're in effect just waiting for people's cached DNS data (if any) to > exceed Time To Live. > > $ dig -t ns sf-lug.org. +short > ns42.worldnic.com. > ns41.worldnic.com. > $ dig www.sf-lug.org. @ns41.worldnic.com. +short > 208.96.15.252 > $ dig www.sf-lug.org. @ns42.worldnic.com. +short > 208.96.15.252 > $ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From jim at systemateka.com Tue Feb 5 19:45:05 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 19:45:05 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet In-Reply-To: <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> http://www.sf-lug.org better? On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 19:03 -0800, jim wrote: > > I think I fixed it at about 7 PM PST Tuesday > 20130205. The service web site says it may take > up to 24 hours to propagate; in my experience we > should see the change within a couple of hours. > Again, thank you, Michael and Grant. I value > your support a lot. > > > > > On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 13:08 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > > Jim, et. al., > > > > Looks like it's gotten worse[1][3]. > > Let me know if you need/want help fixing this[1]. At present, > > http://www.sf-lug.org/ and http://sf-lug.org/ ... well, the results > > aren't pretty[3] ... at least not pretty for SF-LUG, anyway. > > > > footnotes/references/excerpts: > > 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2012q2/009300.html > > 2. And/or optimizing, particularly along with [www.]sf-lug.{com,org} > > 3. [4] > > Welcome to CircleSoft > > > > CircleSoft is a premier computer system design and implementation > > company with over 35 years of experience in architecting, specifying > > and implementing cutting edge technology. The CircleSoft staff > > understands digital technology from the silicon to the user's > > application software. We have participated in a wide variety of > > implementation projects from micro-chips to heavy iron VA medical > > information systems. In short, CircleSoft brings more to the table, > > a broad array of experience focused within a very small staff than > > conventional technology design corporations must rely upon large > > teams of staff members to even come close. > > 4. > > st=$(printf '\040\007') # space and tab > > lynx -dump http://www.sf-lug.org/ | > > sed -ne \ > > ' > > :t > > /^['"$st"']*[^'"$st"'[]/,/^['"$st"']*$/{ > > # first "real" paragraph and blank line > > p > > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > > b n > > } > > } > > n > > b t > > :n > > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > > # skip blank lines > > n > > b n > > } > > :2 > > # 2nd real paragraph > > p > > n > > /^['"$st"']*$/!b 2 > > q > > ' | expand > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue Feb 5 20:26:42 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2013 20:26:42 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet In-Reply-To: <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130206042641.GE17635@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Jim Stockford (jim at systemateka.com): > http://www.sf-lug.org > better? Jim, as I was trying to say upthread: _Yes._ Except for people whose local nameservers still are supplying the old DNS returned value as cached data because it's already there and within the published Time To Live TTL) of 7200 seconds = 2 hours. Herewith, one of my periodic efforts to reduce Linux users' confusion about DNS matters. (It's not really mysterious.) You said: 'I think I fixed it at about 7 PM PST Tuesday 20130205.' And so you did. Specifically, the two authoritative nameservers for the sf-lug-org domain, ns41.worldnic.com and ns42.worldnic.com, had until then been publishing this line for 'www.sf-lug.org': www.sf-lug.org. 7200 IN A 208.69.40.247 You changed that to this, switching to the same target IP address used for sf-lug.com: www.sf-lug.org. 7200 IN A 208.96.15.252 The '7200' you see there is the TTL, the Time To Live value associated with (and sent out with) this DNS record. TTL means 'Please consider this data stale and presumptively no good if it's older than this number of seconds.' You updated the published value at, let's say for the sake of illustration, exactly 7:00 PM local time. However, a bunch of SF-LUG people such as you, Machiel Paoli, me, and various others had been test-loading the Web page, thereby causing our local DNS nameservers to look up the DNS value during the 6 PM hour. So, those local nameservers of ours have lodged within their caches what the nameservers believe to be still-valid answers to the question 'What does the A record for www.sf-lug.org point to?', those being still valid because they were fetched less than 7200 seconds ago from the authoritative nameservers. The worldwide DNS system works largely because of extremely pervasive local caching, which is both a blessing and a curse. It's a blessing in that it's the only thing preventing worldwide DNS from burning down from excess traffic. It's a curse in that most DNS answers people use are cached values that are in no way guaranteed to necessarily match the current values offered by the domains' authoritative DNS servers. Where DNS is concerned, the 'dig' command is your kung-fu. You can answer just about any question with it. Please see my earlier post for some examples. From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Tue Feb 5 20:58:05 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 20:58:05 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] much better now (was: www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet) In-Reply-To: <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130205205805.11657terul9x9zvk@webmail.rawbw.com> Ah, yes, much better[1] :-). references/excerpts/footnotes: 1. Looks like critical/essentials covered, optimization(s) can be deferred. Also, potentially due to DNS TTLs, might not look better to all on The Internet ... quite yet. I didn't note in detail all the TTLs involved earlier, but the longest particularly applicable ones that caught my eye were 2 days. > From: jim > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so > good on The Internet > Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 19:45:05 -0800 > http://www.sf-lug.org > > better? > > > On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 19:03 -0800, jim wrote: >> >> I think I fixed it at about 7 PM PST Tuesday >> 20130205. The service web site says it may take >> up to 24 hours to propagate; in my experience we >> should see the change within a couple of hours. >> Again, thank you, Michael and Grant. I value >> your support a lot. >> >> >> >> >> On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 13:08 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: >> > Jim, et. al., >> > >> > Looks like it's gotten worse[1][3]. >> > Let me know if you need/want help fixing this[1]. At present, >> > http://www.sf-lug.org/ and http://sf-lug.org/ ... well, the results >> > aren't pretty[3] ... at least not pretty for SF-LUG, anyway. >> > >> > footnotes/references/excerpts: >> > 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2012q2/009300.html >> > 2. And/or optimizing, particularly along with [www.]sf-lug.{com,org} >> > 3. [4] >> > Welcome to CircleSoft >> > >> > CircleSoft is a premier computer system design and implementation >> > company with over 35 years of experience in architecting, specifying >> > and implementing cutting edge technology. The CircleSoft staff >> > understands digital technology from the silicon to the user's >> > application software. We have participated in a wide variety of >> > implementation projects from micro-chips to heavy iron VA medical >> > information systems. In short, CircleSoft brings more to the table, >> > a broad array of experience focused within a very small staff than >> > conventional technology design corporations must rely upon large >> > teams of staff members to even come close. >> > 4. >> > st=$(printf '\040\007') # space and tab >> > lynx -dump http://www.sf-lug.org/ | >> > sed -ne \ >> > ' >> > :t >> > /^['"$st"']*[^'"$st"'[]/,/^['"$st"']*$/{ >> > # first "real" paragraph and blank line >> > p >> > /^['"$st"']*$/{ >> > b n >> > } >> > } >> > n >> > b t >> > :n >> > /^['"$st"']*$/{ >> > # skip blank lines >> > n >> > b n >> > } >> > :2 >> > # 2nd real paragraph >> > p >> > n >> > /^['"$st"']*$/!b 2 >> > q >> > ' | expand From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Tue Feb 5 22:33:40 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 22:33:40 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Got meeting (up)dates? (web page updating of upcoming meeting dates) In-Reply-To: <1360122089.1815.16.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360117961.1815.3.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130206032104.GC17635@linuxmafia.com> <1360122089.1815.16.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130205223340.19464rx17rib5kao@webmail.rawbw.com> Well, with cron and some suitable tools, schedule of upcoming meeting date(s) can be automagically updated on web page(s). This topic/subject/discussion has come up before[1][2]. I also include example use[3] and example code[4] further below. references/excerpts(slightly redacted)/footnotes/examples: 1. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/berkeleylug/PPemp9zv_Jk/yHNW0B5zlD8J 2. > From: jim > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so > good on The Internet > Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 19:41:29 -0800 > I might be willing if allowed > PHP language, which does the date updates for > the SF-LUG.com site, but that it doesn't 3. $ ./upcoming_meetings usage: ./upcoming_meetings: {1st,2nd,3rd,[45]th,last} {Sun,Mon,Tues,Wednes,Thurs,Fri,Satur}day $ { ./upcoming_meetings 1st Sun | head -n 12 > ./upcoming_meetings 3rd Mon | head -n 12 > } | grep '^2013-' | sort 2013-02-18 2013-03-03 2013-03-18 2013-04-07 2013-04-15 2013-05-05 2013-05-20 2013-06-02 2013-06-17 2013-07-07 2013-07-15 2013-08-04 2013-08-19 2013-09-01 2013-09-16 2013-10-06 2013-10-21 2013-11-03 2013-11-18 2013-12-01 2013-12-16 4. $ expand -t 4 < upcoming_meetings #!/usr/bin/perl $^W=1; use strict; # vi(1) :se tabstop=4 use Date::Calc qw( Today Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year ) ; sub usage{ die("usage: $0: {1st,2nd,3rd,[45]th,last} {Sun,Mon,Tues,Wednes,Thurs,Fri,Satur}day\n"); }; if($#ARGV<1){ &usage; }; $_=$ARGV[0]; my $n; if(/^1(?:st)?$/io){ $n=1; }elsif(/^2(?:nd)?$/io){ $n=2; }elsif(/^3(?:rd)?$/io){ $n=3; }elsif(/^4(?:th)?$/io){ $n=4; }elsif(/^5(?:th)?$/io){ $n=5; }elsif(/^last$/io){ $n='l'; }else{ &usage; }; $_=$ARGV[1]; my $dow; if(/^Su(?:n(?:days?)?)?$/io){ $dow=7; }elsif(/^M(?:on(?:days?)?)?$/io){ $dow=1; }elsif(/^Tu(?:esdays?)?$/io){ $dow=2; }elsif(/^W(?:ed(?:nesdays?)?)?$/io){ $dow=3; }elsif(/^Th(?:ursdays?)?$/io){ $dow=4; }elsif(/^F(?:ri(?:days?)?)?$/io){ $dow=5; }elsif(/^Sa(?:t(?:urdays?)?)?$/io){ $dow=6; }else{ &usage; }; my ($year,$month,$day) = Today(); if($n ne 'l'){ my $day2=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,$n))[2]; printf( "%04d-%02d-%02d\n", ($year,$month,$day2) ) if defined($day2) && $day2 >= $day; undef $day2; while(1){ ++$month; if($month>12){ $month=1; exit(0) if ++$year > 9999; }; $day=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,$n))[2]; printf("%04d-%02d-%02d\n",$year,$month,$day) if defined($day); }; }else{ my $day2=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,5))[2]; $day2=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,4))[2] if !defined($day2); printf( "%04d-%02d-%02d\n", ($year,$month,$day2) ) if $day2 >= $day; undef $day2; while(1){ ++$month; if($month>12){ $month=1; exit(0) if ++$year > 9999; }; $day=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,5))[2]; $day=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,4))[2] if !defined($day); printf("%04d-%02d-%02d\n",$year,$month,$day); }; }; $ From jim at well.com Wed Feb 6 08:08:29 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2013 08:08:29 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet In-Reply-To: <20130206042641.GE17635@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130206042641.GE17635@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1360166909.1815.20.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Truly clarifying! Thanks. Worth reading for anyone learning about DNS. On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 20:26 -0800, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Jim Stockford (jim at systemateka.com): > > > http://www.sf-lug.org > > better? > > Jim, as I was trying to say upthread: _Yes._ Except for people whose > local nameservers still are supplying the old DNS returned value as > cached data because it's already there and within the published Time To > Live TTL) of 7200 seconds = 2 hours. > > Herewith, one of my periodic efforts to reduce Linux users' confusion > about DNS matters. (It's not really mysterious.) > > You said: 'I think I fixed it at about 7 PM PST Tuesday 20130205.' > And so you did. Specifically, the two authoritative nameservers for the > sf-lug-org domain, ns41.worldnic.com and ns42.worldnic.com, had until > then been publishing this line for 'www.sf-lug.org': > > www.sf-lug.org. 7200 IN A 208.69.40.247 > > You changed that to this, switching to the same target IP address used > for sf-lug.com: > > www.sf-lug.org. 7200 IN A 208.96.15.252 > > > The '7200' you see there is the TTL, the Time To Live value associated > with (and sent out with) this DNS record. TTL means 'Please consider > this data stale and presumptively no good if it's older than this number > of seconds.' > > You updated the published value at, let's say for the sake of > illustration, exactly 7:00 PM local time. However, a bunch of SF-LUG > people such as you, Machiel Paoli, me, and various others had been > test-loading the Web page, thereby causing our local DNS nameservers to > look up the DNS value during the 6 PM hour. So, those local nameservers > of ours have lodged within their caches what the nameservers believe to > be still-valid answers to the question 'What does the A record for > www.sf-lug.org point to?', those being still valid because they were > fetched less than 7200 seconds ago from the authoritative nameservers. > > The worldwide DNS system works largely because of extremely pervasive > local caching, which is both a blessing and a curse. It's a blessing in > that it's the only thing preventing worldwide DNS from burning down from > excess traffic. It's a curse in that most DNS answers people use are > cached values that are in no way guaranteed to necessarily match the > current values offered by the domains' authoritative DNS servers. > > Where DNS is concerned, the 'dig' command is your kung-fu. You can > answer just about any question with it. Please see my earlier post for > some examples. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From jim at systemateka.com Wed Feb 6 09:09:45 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2013 09:09:45 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] much better now (was: www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet) In-Reply-To: <20130205205805.11657terul9x9zvk@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130205205805.11657terul9x9zvk@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1360170585.1815.78.camel@jim-LAPTOP> I want to note to anyone learning regular expressions that at bottom is a really good sed example. On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 20:58 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > Ah, yes, much better[1] :-). > > references/excerpts/footnotes: > 1. Looks like critical/essentials covered, optimization(s) can be > deferred. Also, potentially due to DNS TTLs, might not look better > to all on The Internet ... quite yet. I didn't note in detail all > the TTLs involved earlier, but the longest particularly applicable > ones that caught my eye were 2 days. > > > From: jim > > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so > > good on The Internet > > Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 19:45:05 -0800 > > > http://www.sf-lug.org > > > > better? > > > > > > On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 19:03 -0800, jim wrote: > >> > >> I think I fixed it at about 7 PM PST Tuesday > >> 20130205. The service web site says it may take > >> up to 24 hours to propagate; in my experience we > >> should see the change within a couple of hours. > >> Again, thank you, Michael and Grant. I value > >> your support a lot. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 13:08 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > >> > Jim, et. al., > >> > > >> > Looks like it's gotten worse[1][3]. > >> > Let me know if you need/want help fixing this[1]. At present, > >> > http://www.sf-lug.org/ and http://sf-lug.org/ ... well, the results > >> > aren't pretty[3] ... at least not pretty for SF-LUG, anyway. > >> > > >> > footnotes/references/excerpts: > >> > 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2012q2/009300.html > >> > 2. And/or optimizing, particularly along with [www.]sf-lug.{com,org} > >> > 3. [4] > >> > Welcome to CircleSoft > >> > > >> > CircleSoft is a premier computer system design and implementation > >> > company with over 35 years of experience in architecting, specifying > >> > and implementing cutting edge technology. The CircleSoft staff > >> > understands digital technology from the silicon to the user's > >> > application software. We have participated in a wide variety of > >> > implementation projects from micro-chips to heavy iron VA medical > >> > information systems. In short, CircleSoft brings more to the table, > >> > a broad array of experience focused within a very small staff than > >> > conventional technology design corporations must rely upon large > >> > teams of staff members to even come close. > >> > 4. > >> > st=$(printf '\040\007') # space and tab > >> > lynx -dump http://www.sf-lug.org/ | > >> > sed -ne \ > >> > ' > >> > :t > >> > /^['"$st"']*[^'"$st"'[]/,/^['"$st"']*$/{ > >> > # first "real" paragraph and blank line > >> > p > >> > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > >> > b n > >> > } > >> > } > >> > n > >> > b t > >> > :n > >> > /^['"$st"']*$/{ > >> > # skip blank lines > >> > n > >> > b n > >> > } > >> > :2 > >> > # 2nd real paragraph > >> > p > >> > n > >> > /^['"$st"']*$/!b 2 > >> > q > >> > ' | expand From jim at well.com Wed Feb 6 09:13:27 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2013 09:13:27 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Got meeting (up)dates? (web page updating of upcoming meeting dates) In-Reply-To: <20130205223340.19464rx17rib5kao@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360117961.1815.3.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130206032104.GC17635@linuxmafia.com> <1360122089.1815.16.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130205223340.19464rx17rib5kao@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1360170807.1815.80.camel@jim-LAPTOP> (Just for clarity) I'm assuming that below the expand command after step 4. you've written the contents of the upcoming_meetings file, which is Perl code, yes? On Tue, 2013-02-05 at 22:33 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > Well, with cron and some suitable tools, schedule of upcoming meeting > date(s) can be automagically updated on web page(s). > > This topic/subject/discussion has come up before[1][2]. > I also include example use[3] and example code[4] further below. > > references/excerpts(slightly redacted)/footnotes/examples: > 1. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/berkeleylug/PPemp9zv_Jk/yHNW0B5zlD8J > 2. > > From: jim > > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so > > good on The Internet > > Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 19:41:29 -0800 > > > I might be willing if allowed > > PHP language, which does the date updates for > > the SF-LUG.com site, but that it doesn't > 3. > $ ./upcoming_meetings > usage: ./upcoming_meetings: {1st,2nd,3rd,[45]th,last} > {Sun,Mon,Tues,Wednes,Thurs,Fri,Satur}day > $ { ./upcoming_meetings 1st Sun | head -n 12 > > ./upcoming_meetings 3rd Mon | head -n 12 > > } | grep '^2013-' | sort > 2013-02-18 > 2013-03-03 > 2013-03-18 > 2013-04-07 > 2013-04-15 > 2013-05-05 > 2013-05-20 > 2013-06-02 > 2013-06-17 > 2013-07-07 > 2013-07-15 > 2013-08-04 > 2013-08-19 > 2013-09-01 > 2013-09-16 > 2013-10-06 > 2013-10-21 > 2013-11-03 > 2013-11-18 > 2013-12-01 > 2013-12-16 > 4. > $ expand -t 4 < upcoming_meetings > #!/usr/bin/perl > $^W=1; > use strict; > > # vi(1) :se tabstop=4 > > use Date::Calc qw( > Today > Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year > ) > ; > > sub usage{ > die("usage: $0: {1st,2nd,3rd,[45]th,last} > {Sun,Mon,Tues,Wednes,Thurs,Fri,Satur}day\n"); > }; > > if($#ARGV<1){ > &usage; > }; > > $_=$ARGV[0]; > my $n; > if(/^1(?:st)?$/io){ $n=1; > }elsif(/^2(?:nd)?$/io){ $n=2; > }elsif(/^3(?:rd)?$/io){ $n=3; > }elsif(/^4(?:th)?$/io){ $n=4; > }elsif(/^5(?:th)?$/io){ $n=5; > }elsif(/^last$/io){ $n='l'; > }else{ > &usage; > }; > > $_=$ARGV[1]; > my $dow; > if(/^Su(?:n(?:days?)?)?$/io){ $dow=7; > }elsif(/^M(?:on(?:days?)?)?$/io){ $dow=1; > }elsif(/^Tu(?:esdays?)?$/io){ $dow=2; > }elsif(/^W(?:ed(?:nesdays?)?)?$/io){ $dow=3; > }elsif(/^Th(?:ursdays?)?$/io){ $dow=4; > }elsif(/^F(?:ri(?:days?)?)?$/io){ $dow=5; > }elsif(/^Sa(?:t(?:urdays?)?)?$/io){ $dow=6; > }else{ > &usage; > }; > > my ($year,$month,$day) = Today(); > > if($n ne 'l'){ > my $day2=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,$n))[2]; > printf( > "%04d-%02d-%02d\n", > ($year,$month,$day2) > ) if defined($day2) && $day2 >= $day; > undef $day2; > > while(1){ > ++$month; > if($month>12){ > $month=1; > exit(0) if ++$year > 9999; > }; > $day=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,$n))[2]; > printf("%04d-%02d-%02d\n",$year,$month,$day) if defined($day); > }; > }else{ > my $day2=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,5))[2]; > $day2=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,4))[2] > if !defined($day2); > printf( > "%04d-%02d-%02d\n", > ($year,$month,$day2) > ) if $day2 >= $day; > undef $day2; > > while(1){ > ++$month; > if($month>12){ > $month=1; > exit(0) if ++$year > 9999; > }; > $day=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,5))[2]; > $day=(Nth_Weekday_of_Month_Year($year,$month,$dow,4))[2] > if !defined($day); > printf("%04d-%02d-%02d\n",$year,$month,$day); > }; > }; > $ > From maestro415 at gmail.com Wed Feb 6 17:18:28 2013 From: maestro415 at gmail.com (maestro) Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2013 17:18:28 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] www.sf-lug.org & sf-lug.org - not looking so good on The Internet In-Reply-To: <20130206042641.GE17635@linuxmafia.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130206042641.GE17635@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: # +1 with jim... # i just learned from you... # and in a clear way... # thank you... end comments message ends ________________________________________________________________________________________ On Tue, Feb 5, 2013 at 8:26 PM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Jim Stockford (jim at systemateka.com): > > > http://www.sf-lug.org > > better? > > Jim, as I was trying to say upthread: _Yes._ Except for people whose > local nameservers still are supplying the old DNS returned value as > cached data because it's already there and within the published Time To > Live TTL) of 7200 seconds = 2 hours. > > Herewith, one of my periodic efforts to reduce Linux users' confusion > about DNS matters. (It's not really mysterious.) > > You said: 'I think I fixed it at about 7 PM PST Tuesday 20130205.' > And so you did. Specifically, the two authoritative nameservers for the > sf-lug-org domain, ns41.worldnic.com and ns42.worldnic.com, had until > then been publishing this line for 'www.sf-lug.org': > > www.sf-lug.org. 7200 IN A 208.69.40.247 > > You changed that to this, switching to the same target IP address used > for sf-lug.com: > > www.sf-lug.org. 7200 IN A 208.96.15.252 > > > The '7200' you see there is the TTL, the Time To Live value associated > with (and sent out with) this DNS record. TTL means 'Please consider > this data stale and presumptively no good if it's older than this number > of seconds.' > > You updated the published value at, let's say for the sake of > illustration, exactly 7:00 PM local time. However, a bunch of SF-LUG > people such as you, Machiel Paoli, me, and various others had been > test-loading the Web page, thereby causing our local DNS nameservers to > look up the DNS value during the 6 PM hour. So, those local nameservers > of ours have lodged within their caches what the nameservers believe to > be still-valid answers to the question 'What does the A record for > www.sf-lug.org point to?', those being still valid because they were > fetched less than 7200 seconds ago from the authoritative nameservers. > > The worldwide DNS system works largely because of extremely pervasive > local caching, which is both a blessing and a curse. It's a blessing in > that it's the only thing preventing worldwide DNS from burning down from > excess traffic. It's a curse in that most DNS answers people use are > cached values that are in no way guaranteed to necessarily match the > current values offered by the domains' authoritative DNS servers. > > Where DNS is concerned, the 'dig' command is your kung-fu. You can > answer just about any question with it. Please see my earlier post for > some examples. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -- *~the quieter you become, the more you are able to hear...* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Thu Feb 7 14:56:33 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2013 14:56:33 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] xterm tek scope example Message-ID: At the last SF Linux Group Meeting a question came up about the differences between the gnome terminal and an xterm: I mentioned the ctrl-mousebutton menues, which include an unused feature of the xterm: a tec scope (vector output) emulator window. Below is an example which draws a simple graph in a window (you may submit from any terminal): xterm -e /bin/bash -l -c 'echo "1 50 3 80" |graph|plot -Ttek; sleep 5' Ken -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Thu Feb 7 18:51:51 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2013 18:51:51 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] xterm tek scope example In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1360291911.1815.124.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Thanks. It worked, kind of.... I got an xterm window with two error messages reporting the inability to find the graph or plot programs; after five seconds, poof! Are there more common commands I could use or is there a particular package that has both plot and graph? On Thu, 2013-02-07 at 14:56 -0800, Ken Shaffer wrote: > At the last SF Linux Group Meeting a question came up about the > differences between the > gnome terminal and an xterm: I mentioned the ctrl-mousebutton menues, > which include an unused feature of the xterm: > a tec scope (vector output) emulator window. > Below is an example which draws a simple graph in a window (you may > submit from any terminal): > xterm -e /bin/bash -l -c 'echo "1 50 3 80" |graph|plot -Ttek; sleep 5' > Ken > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Fri Feb 8 09:47:07 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 09:47:07 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] xterm tek scope example In-Reply-To: <1360291911.1815.124.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1360291911.1815.124.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: Jim, Both graph and plot are in the plotutils package on my Ubuntu system. The 5 seconds is from the sleep 5, increase it to keep things around longer. Have fun, Ken On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:51 PM, jim wrote: > > > Thanks. It worked, kind of.... I got an xterm > window with two error messages reporting the > inability to find the graph or plot programs; after > five seconds, poof! > Are there more common commands I could use or > is there a particular package that has both plot > and graph? > > > > On Thu, 2013-02-07 at 14:56 -0800, Ken Shaffer wrote: > > At the last SF Linux Group Meeting a question came up about the > > differences between the > > gnome terminal and an xterm: I mentioned the ctrl-mousebutton menues, > > which include an unused feature of the xterm: > > a tec scope (vector output) emulator window. > > Below is an example which draws a simple graph in a window (you may > > submit from any terminal): > > xterm -e /bin/bash -l -c 'echo "1 50 3 80" |graph|plot -Ttek; sleep 5' > > Ken > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From morganw8-nb at yahoo.com Fri Feb 8 09:56:23 2013 From: morganw8-nb at yahoo.com (Morgan.) Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 09:56:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Gnome 3 on 12.04 Message-ID: <1360346183.23574.YahooMailClassic@web184406.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Hi SF-LUG, I'm trying out Ubuntu 12.04 on my laptop.? It's okay, but I want to try Gnome 3 on it.? One website says to use one of these commands: ? $ sudo apt-get install gnome-session-fallback ??? -or- ? $ sudo apt-get install gnome-panel and another site says to use this command: ? $ sudo apt-get install ubuntu-gnome-desktop ubuntu-gnome-default-settings Can someone tell if there are any significant differences between these?? Thanks. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Fri Feb 8 10:04:55 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2013 10:04:55 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] xterm tek scope example In-Reply-To: References: <1360291911.1815.124.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <1360346695.1815.150.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Got it! I'll get it! and thanks. jim On Fri, 2013-02-08 at 09:47 -0800, Ken Shaffer wrote: > Jim, > Both graph and plot are in the plotutils package on my Ubuntu system. > The 5 seconds is from the sleep 5, increase it to keep things around > longer. > Have fun, > Ken > > On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:51 PM, jim wrote: > > > Thanks. It worked, kind of.... I got an xterm > window with two error messages reporting the > inability to find the graph or plot programs; after > five seconds, poof! > Are there more common commands I could use or > is there a particular package that has both plot > and graph? > > > > On Thu, 2013-02-07 at 14:56 -0800, Ken Shaffer wrote: > > At the last SF Linux Group Meeting a question came up about > the > > differences between the > > gnome terminal and an xterm: I mentioned the > ctrl-mousebutton menues, > > which include an unused feature of the xterm: > > a tec scope (vector output) emulator window. > > Below is an example which draws a simple graph in a window > (you may > > submit from any terminal): > > xterm -e /bin/bash -l -c 'echo "1 50 3 80" |graph|plot > -Ttek; sleep 5' > > Ken > > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > From jim at well.com Fri Feb 8 10:08:43 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2013 10:08:43 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] xterm tek scope example In-Reply-To: References: <1360291911.1815.124.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <1360346923.1815.152.camel@jim-LAPTOP> It works! Now, how to use it usefully? I'm guessing one needs a file that has captured some o'scope data, yes? Assuming so, got any pointers this way? On Fri, 2013-02-08 at 09:47 -0800, Ken Shaffer wrote: > Jim, > Both graph and plot are in the plotutils package on my Ubuntu system. > The 5 seconds is from the sleep 5, increase it to keep things around > longer. > Have fun, > Ken > > On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:51 PM, jim wrote: > > > Thanks. It worked, kind of.... I got an xterm > window with two error messages reporting the > inability to find the graph or plot programs; after > five seconds, poof! > Are there more common commands I could use or > is there a particular package that has both plot > and graph? > > > > On Thu, 2013-02-07 at 14:56 -0800, Ken Shaffer wrote: > > At the last SF Linux Group Meeting a question came up about > the > > differences between the > > gnome terminal and an xterm: I mentioned the > ctrl-mousebutton menues, > > which include an unused feature of the xterm: > > a tec scope (vector output) emulator window. > > Below is an example which draws a simple graph in a window > (you may > > submit from any terminal): > > xterm -e /bin/bash -l -c 'echo "1 50 3 80" |graph|plot > -Ttek; sleep 5' > > Ken > > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > From morganw8-nb at yahoo.com Fri Feb 8 12:59:56 2013 From: morganw8-nb at yahoo.com (Morgan.) Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 12:59:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Gnome 3 on 12.04 Message-ID: <1360357196.4933.YahooMailClassic@web184402.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> ...did some research, sorry, delete my request for input. --- On Fri, 2/8/13, Morgan. wrote: Subject: Gnome 3 on 12.04 To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Friday, February 8, 2013, 9:56 AM Hi SF-LUG, I'm trying out Ubuntu 12.04 on my laptop.? It's okay, but I want to try Gnome 3 on it.? One website says to use one of these commands: ? $ sudo apt-get install gnome-session-fallback ??? -or- ? $ sudo apt-get install gnome-panel and another site says to use this command: ? $ sudo apt-get install ubuntu-gnome-desktop ubuntu-gnome-default-settings Can someone tell if there are any significant differences between these?? Thanks. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Fri Feb 8 15:34:11 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 15:34:11 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] xterm tek scope example In-Reply-To: <1360346923.1815.152.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1360291911.1815.124.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360346923.1815.152.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: Jim, /usr/share/doc/plotutils/tek2plot should have some more demos, like the usmap.tek (compressed). Easy to run from the tek terminal, just zcat the file. I haven't done much with the tek terminal myself, just one more thing that makes xterm so big. I do use the font changer menu for xterms pretty regularly, but that's about it. When teaching using a projected terminal, I liked to make the font big enough to be easily seen by the pupils in the back row. Or just a little chfnt script: MYFNT=${1-8x16} echo -n -e "\033]50;$MYFNT\007" Ken On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 10:08 AM, jim wrote: > > It works! > > Now, how to use it usefully? I'm guessing one > needs a file that has captured some o'scope data, > yes? Assuming so, got any pointers this way? > > > > > > On Fri, 2013-02-08 at 09:47 -0800, Ken Shaffer wrote: > > Jim, > > Both graph and plot are in the plotutils package on my Ubuntu system. > > The 5 seconds is from the sleep 5, increase it to keep things around > > longer. > > Have fun, > > Ken > > > > On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:51 PM, jim wrote: > > > > > > Thanks. It worked, kind of.... I got an xterm > > window with two error messages reporting the > > inability to find the graph or plot programs; after > > five seconds, poof! > > Are there more common commands I could use or > > is there a particular package that has both plot > > and graph? > > > > > > > > On Thu, 2013-02-07 at 14:56 -0800, Ken Shaffer wrote: > > > At the last SF Linux Group Meeting a question came up about > > the > > > differences between the > > > gnome terminal and an xterm: I mentioned the > > ctrl-mousebutton menues, > > > which include an unused feature of the xterm: > > > a tec scope (vector output) emulator window. > > > Below is an example which draws a simple graph in a window > > (you may > > > submit from any terminal): > > > xterm -e /bin/bash -l -c 'echo "1 50 3 80" |graph|plot > > -Ttek; sleep 5' > > > Ken > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > sf-lug mailing list > > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Fri Feb 8 16:02:38 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2013 16:02:38 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] xterm tek scope example In-Reply-To: References: <1360291911.1815.124.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360346923.1815.152.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: The actual control sequences are documented: http://invisible-island.net/xterm/ctlseqs/ctlseqs.html#Tektronix%204014%20Mode As for using in a practical way, one person would output a big plot job to a tek scope just to see that the output looked reasonable -- avoids wasting expensive big sheets of paper. Ken -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at systemateka.com Sat Feb 9 08:27:56 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Sat, 09 Feb 2013 08:27:56 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] xterm tek scope example In-Reply-To: References: <1360291911.1815.124.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360346923.1815.152.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <1360427276.1815.160.camel@jim-LAPTOP> On Fri, 2013-02-08 at 16:02 -0800, Ken Shaffer wrote: > The actual control sequences are documented: > http://invisible-island.net/xterm/ctlseqs/ctlseqs.html#Tektronix% > 204014%20Mode JS: here's a TOC for the link above C1 (8-Bit) Control Characters VT100 Mode Alt and Meta Keys PC-Style Function Keys VT220-Style Function Keys VT52-Style Function Keys Sun-Style Function Keys HP-Style Function Keys The Alternate Screen Buffer Bracketed Paste Mode Title Modes Mouse Tracking Tektronix 4014 Mode VT52 Mode > As for using in a practical way, one person would output a big plot > job to a tek scope just to see that the output looked reasonable -- > avoids wasting expensive big sheets of paper. > Ken > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From nbs at sonic.net Sun Feb 10 23:46:56 2013 From: nbs at sonic.net (nbs) Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2013 23:46:56 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linux Users' Group of Davis, February 18: SugarCRM and Open Source Message-ID: <201302110746.r1B7kuUe010165@bolt.sonic.net> The Linux Users' Group of Davis (LUGOD) will be holding the following meeting: Monday February 18, 2013 7:00pm - 9:00pm Presentation: SugarCRM and Open Source Joseph Arruda, Senior Product Manager, SugarCRM This talk will discuss how a business like SugarCRM is Open Source-friendly, how it release its code, how it consumes 3rd-party code, and how it uses code review tools like BlackDuck with continuous integration. About the Speaker: Joseph Arruda is Senior Product Manager at SugarCRM, focusing on mobile and cloud-based initiatives for both outward bound products and internal tools. He has been described as an open source geek, a policy wonk, and even a bit of a creative illustrator. (Joe was also in attendance at LUGOD's second-ever meeting, in January 1999.) About SugarCRM: SugarCRM produces a customer relationship management (CRM) system that is available in both open source and commercial applications. SugarCRM's functionality includes sales-force automation, marketing campaigns, customer support, collaboration, mobile CRM, social CRM and reporting. Created as an open source project in April 2004, and founded as a company in June of the same year, SugarCRM is currently headquartered in Cupertino, California. It was named one of the 10 most successful open source projects in 2012 by Network World Magazine. This meeting will be held at a special location: Explorit Nature Center 3141 5th Street Davis, California 95616 For more details on this meeting, visit: http://www.lugod.org/meeting/ or simply: http://www.lugod.org/ (and follow the links) For maps, directions, public transportation schedules, etc., visit: http://www.lugod.org/meeting/explorit/ ------------ About LUGOD: ------------ The Linux Users' Group of Davis is a 501(c)7 non-profit organization dedicated to the Linux computer operating system and other Open Source and Free Software. Since 1999, LUGOD has held regular meetings with guest speakers in Davis, California, as well as other events in Davis and the greater Sacramento region. Events are always free and open to the public. You can find LUGOD on Facebook at: https://www.facebook.com/groups/lugod/ and on LinkedIn at: http://www.linkedin.com/groups?gid=35879 Please visit our website for more details: http://www.lugod.org/ -- Bill Kendrick pr at lugod.org Public Relations Officer Linux Users' Group of Davis http://www.lugod.org/ (Your address: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com ) From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Mon Feb 11 07:53:33 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2013 07:53:33 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF Lug Meets on Monday 18 February 2013 & some news. Message-ID: <511913FD.6000707@dslextreme.com> SF-LUG meets every every third Monday from 6 P.M. to 8 P.M. at the Cafe Enchante, 26th and Geary Boulevard. These meetings are usually lightly attended with a high for the year so far of 6 members. If you have a problem come along and maybe we can help but if not we can usually find someone who can. The last meeting on Sunday 3 February was lightly attended by the usual suspects, myself, the Schaeffers, Eric, John who was attending for the first time in a couple of years, and Jim Stockford. I showed off the Fedora 18 live distributions and believe i helped someone with something but nothing special, so here are some recent bits of news. The Linux Foundation Secure Boot Pre-boot-loader Released http://paritynews.com/software/item/614-the-linux-foundation-secure-boot-pre-bootloader-released http://blog.hansenpartnership.com/linux-foundation-secure-boot-system-released/ Some people have remarked that it seems a shambles but I maintain that it will work out to a systems that will be no more difficult to deal with than the present when time is given to the developers to work on the install procedures for the various distributions that will be using this. KDE releases 4.10! With lots of improvements and adaptations for mobile devices. If you are unfamiliar with the way releases are numbered this is indeed a higher release than say KDE 4.9.4 Hope to see some of us there next Monday. Bobbie Sellers From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Tue Feb 12 11:36:48 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2013 11:36:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1360697808.69019.YahooMailRC@web181406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From grantbow at ubuntu.com Tue Feb 12 12:53:23 2013 From: grantbow at ubuntu.com (Grant Bowman) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2013 12:53:23 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge In-Reply-To: <1360697808.69019.YahooMailRC@web181406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1360697808.69019.YahooMailRC@web181406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 11:36 AM, Joseph Puig wrote: > The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday > evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. > > Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San > Francisco. > > Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net > > Joseph Thank you for hosting this, Joseph. I wish I could be in two places at once. Every month a conflict exists between the Ubuntu Hour SF and the weekly sf-lug.org meeting at noisebridge.net. As we meet at the same time there is no reason the two groups can not collaborate via IRC and include anyone else on the Internet that happens to be around. All we need is one person at each location to login to IRC to supplement our in-person hosting efforts. Full details and a web-based login are available at http://ubuntu-california.org/chat/ Maybe we can experiment using a google hangout or other video connection too. Cheers, Grant From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Fri Feb 15 07:26:22 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2013 07:26:22 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] BALUG Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana; & other BALUG News Message-ID: <20130215072622.21236873r5h9migw@webmail.rawbw.com> BALUG Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana; & other BALUG News BALUG meeting Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana And don't forget, that's the day after President's Day, for those enjoying President's Day off. ------------------------------ items, details further below: BALUG Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana BALUG Tu 2013-03-19: Stefano Maffulli on OpenStack Book(s), CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. volunteering to help BALUG Twitter https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Bay Area Linux User Group (BALUG) meeting Tuesday 6:30 P.M. 2013-02-19 For our 2013-02-19 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana In October of 2012 Elizabeth Krumbach accompanied other volunteers from Computer Reach[1], a non-profit based out of Pittsburgh, PA, on a trip to Ghana in western Africa to assist with the deployment of 100 Edubuntu[2]-based desktop computers. In this talk she will share photos and details of the trip, along with some of the lessons they learned about doing such a deployment in a developing country, covering hardware, software and training requirements. For a bit more background, one can also have a look at her earlier Ubuntu User[3] article: Road Trip: Delivering Edbuntu systems to Ghana[4]. Elizabeth Krumbach works as a Linux Systems Administrator focused on continuous integration, holds a position on the Ubuntu Community Council[5] and is the Treasurer and a Director at the non-profit Partimus[6]. She has held a leadership position in the Ubuntu Women[7], Ubuntu Classroom[8] and Ubuntu News[9] projects for several years and recently took over as Marketing and Website lead for the Xubuntu[10] Linux distribution. Former coordinator for the Philadelphia area Linux Users Group[11], she is now living in San Francisco and is one of the leaders of the Ubuntu California[12] team where she coordinates Bay Area Ubuntu events and meetings, install fests, booths and hosts Debian dinners every couple months for Bay Area Debian[13]. 1. http://computereach.com/ 2. http://edubuntu.org/ 3. http://www.ubuntu-user.com/ 4. http://www.ubuntu-user.com/content/download/3340/22578/file/070-073_edubuntu.pdf 5. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncil 6. http://www.partimus.org/ 7. http://women.ubuntu.com/ 8. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom 9. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewsTeam 10. http://www.xubuntu.org/ 11. http://www.phillylinux.org/ 12. http://ubuntu-california.org/ 13. http://bad.debian.net/ Please RSVP if you're planning to come (see further below). So, if you'd like to join us please RSVP to: rsvp at balug.org **Why RSVP??** Well, don't worry we won't turn you away, but the RSVPs really help BALUG and the Four Seas Restaurant plan the meal and meeting, and with sufficient attendance, they also help ensure that we'll be able to eat upstairs in the private banquet room. Meeting Details... 6:30pm Tuesday, February 19th, 2012 2013-02-19 Four Seas Restaurant http://www.fourseasr.com/ 731 Grant Ave. San Francisco, CA 94108 Easy PARKING: Portsmouth Square Garage at 733 Kearny: http://www.sfpsg.com/ Cost: The meetings are always free, but for dinner, for your gift of $13 cash or more, we give you a gift of dinner - joining us for a yummy family-style Chinese dinner - tax and tip included (your gift also helps in our patronizing the restaurant venue and helping to defray BALUG costs such as treating our speakers to dinner). ------------------------------ For our 2013-03-19 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Stefano Maffulli[1] on OpenStack[2] Open source software for building private and public clouds. OpenStack is a global collaboration of developers and cloud computing technologists producing the ubiquitous open source cloud computing platform for public and private clouds. The project aims to deliver solutions for all types of clouds by being simple to implement, massively scalable, and feature rich. The technology consists of a series of interrelated projects[3] delivering various components for a cloud infrastructure solution. 1. http://www.openstack.org/blog/author/stefano/ 2. http://www.openstack.org/ 3. http://www.openstack.org/projects/ ------------------------------ Book(s), CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. Goodies we'll have at the meeting (at least the following): Book review copies For Tuesday's meeting, we should have (selection of) at least one of these books to give away: Ubuntu Unleashed 2013 Edition: Covering 12.10 and 13.04, 8th Edition DevOps Troubleshooting: Linux Server Best Practices details: http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2013-February/005012.html CDs/DVDs, etc. - have a peek here: http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc We may also be able to "burn" images per request or copy to USB flash, etc. Donations of blank or +-RW media, USB flash, or funding thereof, also appreciated. See the above URL for details. We've also got a few other miscellaneous items to be given away (e.g. got (more) cowbell?). ------------------------------ volunteering to help BALUG Want to volunteer to help out BALUG? Quite a variety of opportunities* Drop us a note at: balug-contact at balug.org Or come talk to us at a BALUG meeting. *e.g.: o assist on publicity o assist on speaker coordination/procurement, etc. o webmastering o archivist/history/retrieval/etc. o Linux Systems Administration (e.g. do/assist/learn, with/under some quite experienced and skilled Linux systems administrators). o chief/assistant cat herder o and other various/miscellaneous tasks BALUG "ought" to be doing or would be good to do (feel free to bring in ideas!) ------------------------------ Twitter - you can also follow BALUG on Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Feedback on our publicity/announcements (e.g. contacts or lists where we should get our information out that we're not presently reaching, or things we should do differently): publicity-feedback at balug.org ------------------------------ http://www.balug.org/ From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Sun Feb 17 01:56:41 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2013 01:56:41 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Learning regular expressions, sed(1), ... In-Reply-To: <1360170585.1815.78.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130205205805.11657terul9x9zvk@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360170585.1815.78.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130217015641.18433u2vjxps6t8g@webmail.rawbw.com> Well, regarding that example[1], I've covered some stuff on regular expressions before, e.g. [2]. And I've certainly also covered a fair bit on sed(1), e.g. [3]. It happens that sed fills a very interesting niche. Yes, sed has BREs[4][2], but notably ... well, as I've described it before[3]: < Useful stuff to keep in mind with sed. It doesn't have variables. One < can however use the pattern space, and the hold space. That, along with < how those spaces can generally be manipulated and how one can deal with < embedded newlines in those spaces, etc., that's essentially as close as < sed comes to having variables (perhaps think of it as a pair of stacks < or arrays). < < Also, sed doesn't have highly generalized flow control. It does however < have unconditional and limited conditional branching, and command < grouping, and label for points branched to. < < So, for things approaching slightly more generalized programmatic < (generally editing) tasks with sed, one can track state via conditionals < and branches, and what one has in the hold and/or pattern space. Oh, and yes, folks have actually written games in sed(1), e.g. [5]. references/excerpts/footnotes: 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2013q1/009840.html > From: jim > Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2013 09:09:45 -0800 > I want to note to anyone learning regular > expressions that at bottom is a really good > sed example. 2. http://www.rawbw.com/~mp/unix/regular_expressions/ 3. news:d85eb83f.0407302303.634ae761 at posting.google.com https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/comp.unix.questions/BEhuf25NVB4/lAGh9MXZ2fgJ 4. http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/basedefs/V1_chap09.html 5. http://sed.sourceforge.net/#gamez From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Sun Feb 17 02:37:07 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2013 02:37:07 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] perl: Re: Got meeting (up)dates? (web page updating of upcoming meeting dates) In-Reply-To: <1360170807.1815.80.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360117961.1815.3.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130206032104.GC17635@linuxmafia.com> <1360122089.1815.16.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130205223340.19464rx17rib5kao@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360170807.1815.80.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130217023707.395557mp6prmi6g4@webmail.rawbw.com> > From: jim > Subject: Re: Got meeting (up)dates? (web page updating of upcoming > meeting dates) > Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2013 09:13:27 -0800 > (Just for clarity) I'm assuming that below the > expand command after step 4. you've written the > contents of the upcoming_meetings file, which is > Perl code, yes? Yes[1]. Essentially I'd, earlier, done several different iterations of the program. $ ls -nort upcoming_meetings* -rwx------ 1 1003 1977 Apr 2 2011 upcoming_meetings.old -rwx------ 1 1003 794 Apr 20 2011 upcoming_meetings.Berkeley_Linux_Users_Group -rwx------ 1 1003 576 Apr 21 2011 upcoming_meetings.BALUG -rwx------ 1 1003 796 Apr 22 2011 upcoming_meetings.BUUG -rwx------ 1 1003 1775 Apr 22 2011 upcoming_meetings The first was quite crude[2] and didn't use Date::Calc, but a version shortly thereafter did[2], and was thus quite a bit better and more compact. Those were for the Berkeley Linux Users Group schedule. Then I did versions for BALUG and BUUG schedules, but I got tired of creating separate versions for each UG, so then I made a more generalized one that took arguments - that's the one shown and demonstrated in [1]. Why have, e.g. php, recalculate every time the web pages is hit, when (in SF-LUG case) that data only need be updated twice a month and could be driven by cron? :-) references/excerpts/footnotes: 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2013q1/009838.html http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2013q1/009841.html > From: jim > Subject: Re: Got meeting (up)dates? (web page updating of upcoming > meeting dates) > Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2013 09:13:27 -0800 > (Just for clarity) I'm assuming that below the > expand command after step 4. you've written the > contents of the upcoming_meetings file, which is > Perl code, yes? 2. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/berkeleylug/PPemp9zv_Jk/yHNW0B5zlD8J From jim at systemateka.com Sun Feb 17 09:13:16 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2013 09:13:16 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] perl: Re: Got meeting (up)dates? (web page updating of upcoming meeting dates) In-Reply-To: <20130217023707.395557mp6prmi6g4@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360117961.1815.3.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130206032104.GC17635@linuxmafia.com> <1360122089.1815.16.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130205223340.19464rx17rib5kao@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360170807.1815.80.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130217023707.395557mp6prmi6g4@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1361121196.1764.56.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Use cron to calculate a (relatively) rarely-used piece of data rather than having PHP burden the CPU every time someone accesses the page: of course! Thank you! On Sun, 2013-02-17 at 02:37 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > > From: jim > > Subject: Re: Got meeting (up)dates? (web page updating of upcoming > > meeting dates) > > Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2013 09:13:27 -0800 > > > (Just for clarity) I'm assuming that below the > > expand command after step 4. you've written the > > contents of the upcoming_meetings file, which is > > Perl code, yes? > > Yes[1]. Essentially I'd, earlier, done several different iterations of the > program. > $ ls -nort upcoming_meetings* > -rwx------ 1 1003 1977 Apr 2 2011 upcoming_meetings.old > -rwx------ 1 1003 794 Apr 20 2011 > upcoming_meetings.Berkeley_Linux_Users_Group > -rwx------ 1 1003 576 Apr 21 2011 upcoming_meetings.BALUG > -rwx------ 1 1003 796 Apr 22 2011 upcoming_meetings.BUUG > -rwx------ 1 1003 1775 Apr 22 2011 upcoming_meetings > The first was quite crude[2] and didn't use Date::Calc, but a version > shortly thereafter did[2], and was thus quite a bit better and more > compact. Those were for the Berkeley Linux Users Group schedule. Then > I did versions for BALUG and BUUG schedules, but I got tired of > creating separate versions for each UG, so then I made a more > generalized one that took arguments - that's the one shown and > demonstrated in [1]. > > Why have, e.g. php, recalculate every time the web pages is hit, when > (in SF-LUG case) that data only need be updated twice a month and could > be driven by cron? :-) > > references/excerpts/footnotes: > 1. > http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2013q1/009838.html > http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2013q1/009841.html > > From: jim > > Subject: Re: Got meeting (up)dates? (web page updating of upcoming > > meeting dates) > > Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2013 09:13:27 -0800 > > > (Just for clarity) I'm assuming that below the > > expand command after step 4. you've written the > > contents of the upcoming_meetings file, which is > > Perl code, yes? > 2. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/berkeleylug/PPemp9zv_Jk/yHNW0B5zlD8J > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From jim at systemateka.com Sun Feb 17 09:27:11 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2013 09:27:11 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Learning regular expressions, sed(1), ... In-Reply-To: <20130217015641.18433u2vjxps6t8g@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130205130818.19795rt244iurtog@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360119798.1815.8.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1360122305.1815.19.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130205205805.11657terul9x9zvk@webmail.rawbw.com> <1360170585.1815.78.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130217015641.18433u2vjxps6t8g@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1361122031.1764.60.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Thanks for isolating this tppic, too. Seems to me that while sed doesn't support variables, we pretty much always use sed as a command via the shell, often in a shell script, and the need for variable data can often be performed by the shell and passed to sed as arguments for each call. Maybe not all problems can be addressed in that way, but a lot of them. (Just sticking my nose out in case someone sees a way to whack it for fun.) On Sun, 2013-02-17 at 01:56 -0800, Michael Paoli wrote: > Well, regarding that example[1], I've covered some stuff on regular > expressions before, e.g. [2]. And I've certainly also covered a fair > bit on sed(1), e.g. [3]. It happens that sed fills a very interesting > niche. Yes, sed has BREs[4][2], but notably ... well, as I've described > it before[3]: > < Useful stuff to keep in mind with sed. It doesn't have variables. One > < can however use the pattern space, and the hold space. That, along with > < how those spaces can generally be manipulated and how one can deal with > < embedded newlines in those spaces, etc., that's essentially as close as > < sed comes to having variables (perhaps think of it as a pair of stacks > < or arrays). > < > < Also, sed doesn't have highly generalized flow control. It does however > < have unconditional and limited conditional branching, and command > < grouping, and label for points branched to. > < > < So, for things approaching slightly more generalized programmatic > < (generally editing) tasks with sed, one can track state via conditionals > < and branches, and what one has in the hold and/or pattern space. > > Oh, and yes, folks have actually written games in sed(1), e.g. [5]. > > references/excerpts/footnotes: > 1. http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2013q1/009840.html > > From: jim > > Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2013 09:09:45 -0800 > > > I want to note to anyone learning regular > > expressions that at bottom is a really good > > sed example. > 2. http://www.rawbw.com/~mp/unix/regular_expressions/ > 3. news:d85eb83f.0407302303.634ae761 at posting.google.com > https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/comp.unix.questions/BEhuf25NVB4/lAGh9MXZ2fgJ > 4. http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/basedefs/V1_chap09.html > 5. http://sed.sourceforge.net/#gamez > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Sun Feb 17 14:20:23 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2013 14:20:23 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] crowdfunding tool for open source projects In-Reply-To: <20130217234215.7ff2e972@telaviv1.shlomifish.org> References: <20130217234215.7ff2e972@telaviv1.shlomifish.org> Message-ID: <512157A7.6020604@gmail.com> here's an interesting idea: -------- Original Message -------- ------------------ Just wanted to let you know that the beta of www.catincan.com - crowdfunding for *existing* open source projects, has launched. 2 Big Things: 1. All Catincan fees will be waived for the first 6 months for all projects. 2. The first 25 projects that have a new feature funded will have the 10% successful funding *fee waived for life*. If you know any developer that has an open source project and could use some funding, please pass this along so they can be one of the first 25 as well. Last, we just want to be clear that on Catincan, only developers on existing open source projects can put new features up for crowdfunding. Users can of course send you messages to request features, but developers remain 100% in control of their projects. We just want to help more open source projects grow and thrive. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il at cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Feb 18 12:03:25 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2013 12:03:25 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Reminder: BALUG TOMORROW: Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana; & other BALUG News In-Reply-To: <20130215072622.21236873r5h9migw@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130215072622.21236873r5h9migw@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <20130218120325.127738z9836krwg0@webmail.rawbw.com> Reminder: BALUG TOMORROW: Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana; & other BALUG News Reminder: BALUG meeting TOMORROW Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana For those enjoying today - Presidents' Day - off, don't forget, that's Tuesday - TOMORROW! :-) ------------------------------ items, details further below: BALUG Tu 2013-02-19: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana BALUG Tu 2013-03-19: Stefano Maffulli on OpenStack Book(s), CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. volunteering to help BALUG Twitter https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Bay Area Linux User Group (BALUG) meeting Tuesday 6:30 P.M. 2013-02-19 For our 2013-02-19 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Elizabeth Krumbach on Linux deployments in Ghana In October of 2012 Elizabeth Krumbach accompanied other volunteers from Computer Reach[1], a non-profit based out of Pittsburgh, PA, on a trip to Ghana in western Africa to assist with the deployment of 100 Edubuntu[2]-based desktop computers. In this talk she will share photos and details of the trip, along with some of the lessons they learned about doing such a deployment in a developing country, covering hardware, software and training requirements. For a bit more background, one can also have a look at her earlier Ubuntu User[3] article: Road Trip: Delivering Edbuntu systems to Ghana[4]. Elizabeth Krumbach works as a Linux Systems Administrator focused on continuous integration, holds a position on the Ubuntu Community Council[5] and is the Treasurer and a Director at the non-profit Partimus[6]. She has held a leadership position in the Ubuntu Women[7], Ubuntu Classroom[8] and Ubuntu News[9] projects for several years and recently took over as Marketing and Website lead for the Xubuntu[10] Linux distribution. Former coordinator for the Philadelphia area Linux Users Group[11], she is now living in San Francisco and is one of the leaders of the Ubuntu California[12] team where she coordinates Bay Area Ubuntu events and meetings, install fests, booths and hosts Debian dinners every couple months for Bay Area Debian[13]. 1. http://computereach.com/ 2. http://edubuntu.org/ 3. http://www.ubuntu-user.com/ 4. http://www.ubuntu-user.com/content/download/3340/22578/file/070-073_edubuntu.pdf 5. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncil 6. http://www.partimus.org/ 7. http://women.ubuntu.com/ 8. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom 9. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewsTeam 10. http://www.xubuntu.org/ 11. http://www.phillylinux.org/ 12. http://ubuntu-california.org/ 13. http://bad.debian.net/ Please RSVP if you're planning to come (see further below). So, if you'd like to join us please RSVP to: rsvp at balug.org **Why RSVP??** Well, don't worry we won't turn you away, but the RSVPs really help BALUG and the Four Seas Restaurant plan the meal and meeting, and with sufficient attendance, they also help ensure that we'll be able to eat upstairs in the private banquet room. Meeting Details... 6:30pm Tuesday, February 19th, 2012 2013-02-19 Four Seas Restaurant http://www.fourseasr.com/ 731 Grant Ave. San Francisco, CA 94108 Easy PARKING: Portsmouth Square Garage at 733 Kearny: http://www.sfpsg.com/ Cost: The meetings are always free, but for dinner, for your gift of $13 cash or more, we give you a gift of dinner - joining us for a yummy family-style Chinese dinner - tax and tip included (your gift also helps in our patronizing the restaurant venue and helping to defray BALUG costs such as treating our speakers to dinner). ------------------------------ For our 2013-03-19 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Stefano Maffulli[1] on OpenStack[2] Open source software for building private and public clouds. OpenStack is a global collaboration of developers and cloud computing technologists producing the ubiquitous open source cloud computing platform for public and private clouds. The project aims to deliver solutions for all types of clouds by being simple to implement, massively scalable, and feature rich. The technology consists of a series of interrelated projects[3] delivering various components for a cloud infrastructure solution. 1. http://www.openstack.org/blog/author/stefano/ 2. http://www.openstack.org/ 3. http://www.openstack.org/projects/ ------------------------------ Book(s), CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. Goodies we'll have at the meeting (at least the following): Book review copies For Tuesday's meeting, we should have (selection of) at least one of these books to give away: Ubuntu Unleashed 2013 Edition: Covering 12.10 and 13.04, 8th Edition DevOps Troubleshooting: Linux Server Best Practices details: http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2013-February/005012.html CDs/DVDs, etc. - have a peek here: http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc We may also be able to "burn" images per request or copy to USB flash, etc. Donations of blank or +-RW media, USB flash, or funding thereof, also appreciated. See the above URL for details. We've also got a few other miscellaneous items to be given away (e.g. got (more) cowbell?). ------------------------------ volunteering to help BALUG Want to volunteer to help out BALUG? Quite a variety of opportunities* Drop us a note at: balug-contact at balug.org Or come talk to us at a BALUG meeting. *e.g.: o assist on publicity o assist on speaker coordination/procurement, etc. o webmastering o archivist/history/retrieval/etc. o Linux Systems Administration (e.g. do/assist/learn, with/under some quite experienced and skilled Linux systems administrators). o chief/assistant cat herder o and other various/miscellaneous tasks BALUG "ought" to be doing or would be good to do (feel free to bring in ideas!) ------------------------------ Twitter - you can also follow BALUG on Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Feedback on our publicity/announcements (e.g. contacts or lists where we should get our information out that we're not presently reaching, or things we should do differently): publicity-feedback at balug.org ------------------------------ http://www.balug.org/ From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Wed Feb 20 07:50:34 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2013 07:50:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1361375434.46103.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From einfeldt at gmail.com Sat Feb 23 12:19:16 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 12:19:16 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] notebook wont boot Message-ID: LAX > LAX Hilton for #scale11x. My notebook wont boot th newly installed Lubuntu 12.04. Grub not even booting. I do get a bios. IBM Thinkpad R50e. I installed Lubuntu 12.04 just fine a few days ago. Battery / power not an issue. Any ideas? Thx. -- Christian Einfeldt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Sat Feb 23 12:23:32 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 12:23:32 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] notebook wont boot In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <51292544.4070007@gmail.com> does the BIOS see the hard disk? i once had the drive connector get loose and symptoms were about what you describe. might be worth reseating drive anyway. m On 02/23/2013 12:19 PM, Christian Einfeldt wrote: > LAX > LAX Hilton for #scale11x. My notebook wont boot th newly installed > Lubuntu 12.04. Grub not even booting. I do get a bios. IBM Thinkpad R50e. > I installed Lubuntu 12.04 just fine a few days ago. Battery / power not > an issue. Any ideas? Thx. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Sat Feb 23 12:24:41 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 12:24:41 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] notebook wont boot In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <51292589.9030203@gmail.com> another idea: can you boot from a bootable thumbdrive? someone at SCALE probably has one. once booted, perhaps then you can mount your disk and see if it's damaged. On 02/23/2013 12:19 PM, Christian Einfeldt wrote: > LAX > LAX Hilton for #scale11x. My notebook wont boot th newly installed > Lubuntu 12.04. Grub not even booting. I do get a bios. IBM Thinkpad R50e. > I installed Lubuntu 12.04 just fine a few days ago. Battery / power not > an issue. Any ideas? Thx. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > From einfeldt at gmail.com Sat Feb 23 15:37:04 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 15:37:04 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] notebook wont boot In-Reply-To: <51292589.9030203@gmail.com> References: <51292589.9030203@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, thanks Michael. It turned out to be a bad CMOS battery. My machine thought that it was 1988, and so couldn't read files dated after that dates, such as the OS. Heh. On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 12:24 PM, Michael Shiloh < michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com> wrote: > another idea: can you boot from a bootable thumbdrive? someone at SCALE > probably has one. once booted, perhaps then you can mount your disk and see > if it's damaged. > > > On 02/23/2013 12:19 PM, Christian Einfeldt wrote: > >> LAX > LAX Hilton for #scale11x. My notebook wont boot th newly installed >> Lubuntu 12.04. Grub not even booting. I do get a bios. IBM Thinkpad R50e. >> I installed Lubuntu 12.04 just fine a few days ago. Battery / power not >> an issue. Any ideas? Thx. >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________**_________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/**listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >> >> > ______________________________**_________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/**listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -- Christian Einfeldt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Sat Feb 23 15:40:03 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 15:40:03 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] notebook wont boot In-Reply-To: References: <51292589.9030203@gmail.com> Message-ID: <51295353.90906@gmail.com> good to know. thanks, and glad you're back up. let us know how SCALE is. i went once years ago and really liked it. Great conference. On 02/23/2013 03:37 PM, Christian Einfeldt wrote: > Hi, > > thanks Michael. > > It turned out to be a bad CMOS battery. My machine thought that it was > 1988, and so couldn't read files dated after that dates, such as the OS. > Heh. > > On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 12:24 PM, Michael Shiloh < > michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com> wrote: > >> another idea: can you boot from a bootable thumbdrive? someone at SCALE >> probably has one. once booted, perhaps then you can mount your disk and see >> if it's damaged. >> >> >> On 02/23/2013 12:19 PM, Christian Einfeldt wrote: >> >>> LAX > LAX Hilton for #scale11x. My notebook wont boot th newly installed >>> Lubuntu 12.04. Grub not even booting. I do get a bios. IBM Thinkpad R50e. >>> I installed Lubuntu 12.04 just fine a few days ago. Battery / power not >>> an issue. Any ideas? Thx. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ______________________________**_________________ >>> sf-lug mailing list >>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/**listinfo/sf-lug >>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >>> >>> >> ______________________________**_________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/**listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >> > > > From einfeldt at gmail.com Sat Feb 23 19:55:57 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 19:55:57 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] notebook wont boot In-Reply-To: <51295353.90906@gmail.com> References: <51292589.9030203@gmail.com> <51295353.90906@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, I like SCALE. It is not big and corporate like LinuxWorld was. There are a lot of small sessions in which you can really talk with people. And the conference is held right here in the Hilton Hotel, so you don't have to go far to go from session to your room. I recommend it. On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 3:40 PM, Michael Shiloh wrote: > good to know. thanks, and glad you're back up. > > let us know how SCALE is. i went once years ago and really liked it. Great > conference. > > > On 02/23/2013 03:37 PM, Christian Einfeldt wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> thanks Michael. >> >> It turned out to be a bad CMOS battery. My machine thought that it was >> 1988, and so couldn't read files dated after that dates, such as the OS. >> Heh. >> >> On Sat, Feb 23, 2013 at 12:24 PM, Michael Shiloh < >> michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com> wrote: >> >> another idea: can you boot from a bootable thumbdrive? someone at SCALE >>> probably has one. once booted, perhaps then you can mount your disk and >>> see >>> if it's damaged. >>> >>> >>> On 02/23/2013 12:19 PM, Christian Einfeldt wrote: >>> >>> LAX > LAX Hilton for #scale11x. My notebook wont boot th newly installed >>>> Lubuntu 12.04. Grub not even booting. I do get a bios. IBM Thinkpad >>>> R50e. >>>> I installed Lubuntu 12.04 just fine a few days ago. Battery / power >>>> not >>>> an issue. Any ideas? Thx. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ______________________________****_________________ >>>> sf-lug mailing list >>>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/****listinfo/sf-lug >>>> >>>> > >>>> >>>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> ______________________________****_________________ >>> sf-lug mailing list >>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/****listinfo/sf-lug >>> >>> > >>> >>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >>> >>> >> >> >> -- Christian Einfeldt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From a_kleider at yahoo.com Sun Feb 24 10:46:24 2013 From: a_kleider at yahoo.com (Alex Kleider) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2013 10:46:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] curious name resolving problem Message-ID: <1361731584.87130.YahooMailClassic@web122304.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> I've got a puzzling situation in which ping works but ssh can't resolve a url. Can anyone suggest how this can be? I reckon if I understood that, I might be able to fix it. Here's the evidence: """alex at dp8:~$ ping kleico.net PING kleico.net (76.191.206.83) 56(84) bytes of data. 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net (76.191.206.83): icmp_req=1 ttl=251 time=21.6 ms 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net (76.191.206.83): icmp_req=2 ttl=251 time=21.5 ms 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net (76.191.206.83): icmp_req=3 ttl=251 time=20.8 ms ^C --- kleico.net ping statistics --- 3 packets transmitted, 3 received, 0% packet loss, time 2002ms rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 20.895/21.379/21.668/0.383 ms alex at dp8:~$ ssh -p5223 kleico.net ssh: Could not resolve hostname kleico.net: No address associated with hostname alex at dp8:~$ ssh -p5223 76.191.206.83 alex at 76.191.206.83's password: """ I've googled "ssh fails to resolve url" but only find references to situations when all resolving function fails, not when it seems to affect only ssh.? Firefox resolves kleico.net satisfacorily as does w3m: """ w3m http://kleico.net:5162 """ Can anyone shed some light?? It would be appreciated. alex ps Apologies to Rick for using "Security by Obscurity":-)? I was doing it before I first heard you disparage the practice and just simply never switched back- mainly because it's a way of getting to specific machines when there are more than one on the network. a_kleider at yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at systemateka.com Sun Feb 24 11:18:06 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2013 11:18:06 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] curious name resolving problem In-Reply-To: <1361731584.87130.YahooMailClassic@web122304.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1361731584.87130.YahooMailClassic@web122304.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1361733486.1826.98.camel@jim-LAPTOP> (assuming you're using the same system and you get the same results) please $ cat /etc/resolv.conf and share the contents. perhaps reboot blindly and hope things work-- I find this a useful approach (you have to be comfortable with "to hell with understanding why..). On Sun, 2013-02-24 at 10:46 -0800, Alex Kleider wrote: > I've got a puzzling situation in which ping works but ssh can't > resolve a url. > Can anyone suggest how this can be? I reckon if I understood that, I > might be able to fix it. > > Here's the evidence: > """alex at dp8:~$ ping kleico.net > PING kleico.net (76.191.206.83) 56(84) bytes of data. > 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net (76.191.206.83): > icmp_req=1 ttl=251 time=21.6 ms > 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net (76.191.206.83): > icmp_req=2 ttl=251 time=21.5 ms > 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net (76.191.206.83): > icmp_req=3 ttl=251 time=20.8 ms > ^C > --- kleico.net ping statistics --- > 3 packets transmitted, 3 received, 0% packet loss, time 2002ms > rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 20.895/21.379/21.668/0.383 ms > alex at dp8:~$ ssh -p5223 kleico.net > ssh: Could not resolve hostname kleico.net: No address associated with > hostname > alex at dp8:~$ ssh -p5223 76.191.206.83 > alex at 76.191.206.83's password: > """ > I've googled "ssh fails to resolve url" but only find references to > situations when all resolving function fails, not when it seems to > affect only ssh. Firefox resolves kleico.net satisfacorily as does > w3m: > """ > w3m http://kleico.net:5162 > """ > Can anyone shed some light? It would be appreciated. > alex > ps Apologies to Rick for using "Security by Obscurity":-) I was doing > it before I first heard you disparage the practice and just simply > never switched back- mainly because it's a way of getting to specific > machines when there are more than one on the network. > a_kleider at yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From a_kleider at yahoo.com Sun Feb 24 13:09:43 2013 From: a_kleider at yahoo.com (Alex Kleider) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2013 13:09:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] curious name resolving problem In-Reply-To: <1361733486.1826.98.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <1361740183.14217.YahooMailClassic@web122305.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> alex at dp8:~$ cat /etc/resolv.conf domain sonic.net search sonic.net nameserver 10.0.0.2 alex at dp8:~$ changed /etc/resolv.conf to be """ domain sonic.net search sonic.net nameserver 208.201.224.33 nameserver 208.201.224.11 nameserver 10.0.0.2 """ and now it all works fine. I still don't understand why the other programs could cope and ssh couldn't. (And would very much like to know.? Could it have something to do with Cache?) Thanks for steering me in the right direction. a_kleider at yahoo.com --- On Sun, 2/24/13, jim wrote: From: jim Subject: Re: [sf-lug] curious name resolving problem To: alex at kleico.net Cc: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Sunday, February 24, 2013, 11:18 AM ? ? (assuming you're using the same system and you get the same results) please $ cat /etc/resolv.conf and share the contents. ? ? perhaps reboot blindly and hope things work-- I find this a useful approach (you have to be comfortable with "to hell with understanding why..). On Sun, 2013-02-24 at 10:46 -0800, Alex Kleider wrote: > I've got a puzzling situation in which ping works but ssh can't > resolve a url. > Can anyone suggest how this can be? I reckon if I understood that, I > might be able to fix it. > > Here's the evidence: > """alex at dp8:~$ ping kleico.net > PING kleico.net (76.191.206.83) 56(84) bytes of data. > 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net (76.191.206.83): > icmp_req=1 ttl=251 time=21.6 ms > 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net (76.191.206.83): > icmp_req=2 ttl=251 time=21.5 ms > 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net (76.191.206.83): > icmp_req=3 ttl=251 time=20.8 ms > ^C > --- kleico.net ping statistics --- > 3 packets transmitted, 3 received, 0% packet loss, time 2002ms > rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 20.895/21.379/21.668/0.383 ms > alex at dp8:~$ ssh -p5223 kleico.net > ssh: Could not resolve hostname kleico.net: No address associated with > hostname > alex at dp8:~$ ssh -p5223 76.191.206.83 > alex at 76.191.206.83's password: > """ > I've googled "ssh fails to resolve url" but only find references to > situations when all resolving function fails, not when it seems to > affect only ssh.? Firefox resolves kleico.net satisfacorily as does > w3m: > """ > w3m http://kleico.net:5162 > """ > Can anyone shed some light?? It would be appreciated. > alex > ps Apologies to Rick for using "Security by Obscurity":-)? I was doing > it before I first heard you disparage the practice and just simply > never switched back- mainly because it's a way of getting to specific > machines when there are more than one on the network. > a_kleider at yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Sun Feb 24 13:41:06 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2013 13:41:06 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] curious name resolving problem In-Reply-To: <1361740183.14217.YahooMailClassic@web122305.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1361740183.14217.YahooMailClassic@web122305.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1361742066.1826.137.camel@jim-LAPTOP> I'm hoping Rick or Mike or Akkana or Ken or Michael or Jeff or Alison or Grant or anybody but (in addition to) me will chime in. Seems like caching may be part of the problem. That your DNS nameserver IP was 10.0.0.2, on the private LAN and unable to connect with the internet other than via the LAN gateway host suggests notions to keep in mind: * What is the host associated with 10.0.0.2? * Is it separate from the gateway host (I assume 10.0.0.1)? * Was there a problem the *2 host had in connecting to the gateway host? Note that "works fine" may mean that queries on your local machine are forwarded directly through the LAN gateway host to the DNS nameservers on the internet (208.*.*.{33,11} AND that the 10.0.0.2 host still may have problems connecting to the gateway host. It may be that thorough understanding why some apps (ping, ICMP) work and others seem not to (ssh, TCP) will only come with sufficient understanding of the underlying libraries responsible for networking. I donno. On Sun, 2013-02-24 at 13:09 -0800, Alex Kleider wrote: > alex at dp8:~$ cat /etc/resolv.conf > domain sonic.net > search sonic.net > nameserver 10.0.0.2 > alex at dp8:~$ > > changed /etc/resolv.conf to be > """ > domain sonic.net > search sonic.net > nameserver 208.201.224.33 > nameserver 208.201.224.11 > nameserver 10.0.0.2 > """ > and now it all works fine. > > I still don't understand why the other programs could cope and ssh > couldn't. > (And would very much like to know. Could it have something to do with > Cache?) > > Thanks for steering me in the right direction. > > > a_kleider at yahoo.com > > --- On Sun, 2/24/13, jim wrote: > > From: jim > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] curious name resolving problem > To: alex at kleico.net > Cc: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > Date: Sunday, February 24, 2013, 11:18 AM > > > > (assuming you're using the same system and you > get the same results) please > $ cat /etc/resolv.conf > and share the contents. > > perhaps reboot blindly and hope things work-- > I find this a useful approach (you have to be > comfortable with "to hell with understanding why..). > > > > On Sun, 2013-02-24 at 10:46 -0800, Alex Kleider wrote: > > I've got a puzzling situation in which ping works but ssh > can't > > resolve a url. > > Can anyone suggest how this can be? I reckon if I understood > that, I > > might be able to fix it. > > > > Here's the evidence: > > """alex at dp8:~$ ping kleico.net > > PING kleico.net (76.191.206.83) 56(84) bytes of data. > > 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net > (76.191.206.83): > > icmp_req=1 ttl=251 time=21.6 ms > > 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net > (76.191.206.83): > > icmp_req=2 ttl=251 time=21.5 ms > > 64 bytes from 76-191-206-83.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net > (76.191.206.83): > > icmp_req=3 ttl=251 time=20.8 ms > > ^C > > --- kleico.net ping statistics --- > > 3 packets transmitted, 3 received, 0% packet loss, time > 2002ms > > rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 20.895/21.379/21.668/0.383 ms > > alex at dp8:~$ ssh -p5223 kleico.net > > ssh: Could not resolve hostname kleico.net: No address > associated with > > hostname > > alex at dp8:~$ ssh -p5223 76.191.206.83 > > alex at 76.191.206.83's password: > > """ > > I've googled "ssh fails to resolve url" but only find > references to > > situations when all resolving function fails, not when it > seems to > > affect only ssh. Firefox resolves kleico.net satisfacorily > as does > > w3m: > > """ > > w3m http://kleico.net:5162 > > """ > > Can anyone shed some light? It would be appreciated. > > alex > > ps Apologies to Rick for using "Security by Obscurity":-) I > was doing > > it before I first heard you disparage the practice and just > simply > > never switched back- mainly because it's a way of getting to > specific > > machines when there are more than one on the network. > > a_kleider at yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Mon Feb 25 11:20:45 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2013 11:20:45 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF Lug meeting on Sunday 3 March 2013 Message-ID: <512BB98D.9070105@dslextreme.com> SF-LUG meets every first Sunday from 11 A.M. to 1 P.M. and at the Cafe Enchante, 26th and Geary Boulevard. These meetings are usually lightly attended with a high for the year so far of 4 members. If you have a problem come along and maybe we can help but if not we can usually find someone who can. If I can get a fresh issue of Linux Pro I will bring it along. The last meeting on President's day was basically Eric and myself with Jim Stockford showing up after 7 PM. Because of that I remind everyone that meeting times are nominal. I try to show up on time or actually ahead of time in case I have to trouble shoot my set-up. We leave if no other interested parties show up up by 7:30 PM. On the other hand bring an interesting problem or discussion and we may hang out until long after 8 PM. Thanks for your attention. Bobbie Sellers From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Mon Feb 25 14:54:23 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2013 14:54:23 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF Lug meeting on Sunday 3 March 2013 In-Reply-To: <20130225223433.GD5217@linuxmafia.com> References: <512BB98D.9070105@dslextreme.com> <20130225223433.GD5217@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <512BEB9F.6030204@dslextreme.com> On 02/25/2013 02:34 PM, Rick Moen wrote: Thanks Rick! > [offlist:] > > Quoting Bobbie Sellers (bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com): > >> SF-LUG meets every first Sunday from 11 A.M. to 1 P.M. and >> at the Cafe Enchante, 26th and Geary Boulevard. >> >> These meetings are usually lightly attended with a high for the >> year so far of 4 members. If you have a problem come along >> and maybe we can help but if not we can usually find someone >> who can. >> If I can get a fresh issue of Linux Pro I will bring it along. Rick believes the following paragraph needs clarification. >> >> The last meeting on President's day was basically Eric and myself >> with Jim Stockford showing up after 7 PM. That was the meeting on 18 February in the Evening. >> >> Because of that I remind everyone that meeting times are >> nominal. I try to show up on time or actually ahead of time >> in case I have to trouble shoot my set-up. We leave if no other >> interested parties show up up by 7:30 PM. On the other hand >> bring an interesting problem or discussion and we may hang >> out until long after 8 PM. So that was the warning about the nominal times for a Monday meeting. If we held a Sunday meeting and no one but myself showed up you could expect me to leave by 1230 or so. But usually at Sunday meetings we have Ken Schaeffer and his wife attending and often Eric and other members. So seldom do I leave before 1 PM though other people with more busy schedules may leave as soon as their questions are answered > Hi, Bobbie. You might want to post an update. > > Maybe it's just me, but to me a your concluding two paragraphs seem > confusing in a post about Sunday 11AM-1PM meetings. Seems like those > might have been mistakenly copied over from a post about Monday evening > meetings. As they were written but not copied off the top of my head this morning when I was barely conscious. Due to the rotten form of POP instituted by Google which is behind the dslextreme.com mail boxes I do not get to read my mail sent to this or other lists. Thanks again Rick. Bobbie Sellers From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Feb 25 16:02:06 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2013 16:02:06 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] SF Lug meeting on Sunday 3 March 2013 In-Reply-To: <512BEB9F.6030204@dslextreme.com> References: <512BB98D.9070105@dslextreme.com> <20130225223433.GD5217@linuxmafia.com> <512BEB9F.6030204@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <20130226000206.GF5217@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Bobbie Sellers (bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com): > Rick believes the following paragraph needs clarification. Could be just me. ;-> Anyway, thank you for posting these announcements. -- Cheers, English is essentially a text parser's way of getting Rick Moen faster processors built. rick at linuxmafia.com -- John M. Ford, http://ccil.org/~cowan/essential.html McQ! (4x80) From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Feb 25 20:59:21 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2013 20:59:21 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] curious name resolving problem In-Reply-To: <1361731584.87130.YahooMailClassic@web122304.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1361731584.87130.YahooMailClassic@web122304.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20130226045921.GL5217@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Alex Kleider (a_kleider at yahoo.com): > I've got a puzzling situation in which ping works but ssh can't resolve a url. > Can anyone suggest how this can be? I reckon if I understood that, I might be able to fix it. Something broken about your local DNS daemon. And here's a guy who had the same problem: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=147460 So, this is just a guess, but I think it''s a good one. I'm betting that it's a matter of your local DNS nameserver not fully supporting IPv6, and your ssh just happens to throw a tantrum and refuse to work because there's no 'AAAA' (IPv6) DNS record response from the nameserver, just an 'A' (IPv4) one -- whereas your ping client just doesn't care, and is perfectly content to receive just an 'A' response. Thus, your problem went away when you repointed /etc/resolv.conf to 208.201.224.33 & 208.201.224.11 because of the coincidence of those nameservers giving full dual-stack (IPv4 and IPv6) responses, whereas your own nameserver didn't. Or something like that. If you put your nameserver back into /etc/resolv.conf as the sole nameserver, and then re-try your ssh test using a '-4' option, I'll bet the ssh session suddenly will work. SSH(1) BSD General Commands Manual NAME ssh -- OpenSSH SSH client (remote login program) [...] -4 Forces ssh to use IPv4 addresses only. -6 Forces ssh to use IPv6 addresses only. IPv6 vs. IPv4 issues can make you want to tear your hair out -- or do something rash like sudo su - echo 'net.ipv6.conf.eth0.disable_ipv6 = 1' > /etc/sysctrl.d/disable-ipv6.conf echo 'net.ipv6.conf.all.disable_ipv6 = 1' >> /etc/sysctrl.d/disable-ipv6.conf sysctl -p exit ...and thereby disable IPv6 _entirely_ making all IPv6 problems go away. However, that's a bit short-sighted. From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Tue Feb 26 15:22:18 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 15:22:18 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linus say no change to Kernel to ease MS signing Message-ID: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> i wrote none of the following but am repeating it for the informative content. I have looked at the URL and it contains some remarks by Linus Torvalds and some interpretation of his words as well as commentary from other parties. Bobbie The rants of Linux creator Linus Torvalds often become public through the Linux Kernel Mailing List archive. The latest example comes from an argument between Torvalds and other Linux developers over whether the Linux kernel should include code that makes it easier to boot Linux on Windows PCs. This goes back to Microsoft requiring that PCs designed to run Windows 8 use UEFI firmware with the Secure Boot feature enabled. This has complicated the process of booting Linux on PCs that shipped with Windows 8, but it hasn't prevented people from doing so. There are workarounds, but some people are looking for a solution in the Linux kernel itself. http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/02/linus-torvalds-i-will-not-change-linux-to-deep-throat-microsoft/ From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue Feb 26 15:45:11 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 15:45:11 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linus say no change to Kernel to ease MS signing In-Reply-To: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> References: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <20130226234511.GS5217@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Bobbie Sellers (bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com): > i wrote none of the following but am repeating it for the > informative content. The three 'promoted comments' below the story, especially the last two, strike me as particularly good for understanding this matter in context. LWN.net subscribers will probably find that this Wednesday's edition includes thoughtful comments by Jon Corbet or someone similar. (Non-subscribers can read each weekly edition eight days after publication.) From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Wed Feb 27 11:55:01 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2013 11:55:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1361994901.31147.YahooMailRC@web181405.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From maestro415 at gmail.com Wed Feb 27 17:47:01 2013 From: maestro415 at gmail.com (maestro) Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2013 17:47:01 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linus say no change to Kernel to ease MS signing In-Reply-To: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> References: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: ^ i am frequently confused as to why beings don't 'wipe' the hard drive completely before installing whatever flavor linux they crave when not wanting to run windows on another partition of the same box... ^ 1. it wipes the hard drive of all jankee windows files and 'crap' ^ 2. you can run a piece of software (forget name in this moment and some see as overkill) that is open source and 'scrubs' the hard drive completely of everything... ^ 3. when you install the linux on the 'naked' drive your machine loves you, rolls on its back and awaits a tummy rub... message ends ______________________________________________________________________________ On Tue, Feb 26, 2013 at 3:22 PM, Bobbie Sellers < bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com> wrote: > i wrote none of the following but am repeating it for the > informative content. > I have looked at the URL and it contains some remarks by Linus > Torvalds and some interpretation of his words as well as commentary > from other parties. > Bobbie > > The rants of Linux creator Linus Torvalds often become public through > the Linux Kernel Mailing List archive. > > The latest example comes from an argument between Torvalds and other > Linux developers over whether the Linux kernel should include code that > makes it easier to boot Linux on Windows PCs. This goes back to > Microsoft requiring that PCs designed to run Windows 8 use UEFI firmware > with the Secure Boot feature enabled. This has complicated the process > of booting Linux on PCs that shipped with Windows 8, but it hasn't > prevented people from doing so. There are workarounds, but some people > are looking for a solution in the Linux kernel itself. > > http://arstechnica.com/**information-technology/2013/** > 02/linus-torvalds-i-will-not-**change-linux-to-deep-throat-**microsoft/ > > ______________________________**_________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/**listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -- *~the quieter you become, the more you are able to hear...* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Wed Feb 27 18:16:10 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2013 18:16:10 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linus say no change to Kernel to ease MS signing In-Reply-To: References: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> Message-ID: <20130228021609.GY5217@linuxmafia.com> Quoting maestro (maestro415 at gmail.com): > ^ 2. you can run a piece of software (forget name in this moment and some > see as overkill) that is open source and 'scrubs' the hard drive completely > of everything... dban = Darik's Boot and Nuke is probably what you're talking about. http://www.dban.org/ However, that's overkill if you just want a _functionally_ bare hard drive. For that purpose, it's sufficient to just delete (or depopulate) the partition table[1] in any of a large number of ways. One of many: Running from an Linux installation or maintenance media: dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda bs=512 count=1 This zeroes out the 512-byte first sector of the /dev/sda device (make sure you clobber the right one!), which includes the MBR program and partition table (if any). That's a _functionaly_ bare hard drive. dban is where you want the former contents to not be recoverable by forensic techniques available to anyone except very major governments and corporations willing to expend very major time and money. (If you want to keep them out, take the hard drive apart and feed the platters into a smelter.) [1] GPT systems have partition data in a bunch of other places, too. From einfeldt at gmail.com Thu Feb 28 09:27:27 2013 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 09:27:27 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linus say no change to Kernel to ease MS signing In-Reply-To: <20130228021609.GY5217@linuxmafia.com> References: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> <20130228021609.GY5217@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: Hi, On Wednesday, February 27, 2013, Rick Moen wrote: > > dban = Darik's Boot and Nuke is probably what you're talking about. > http://www.dban.org/ > > However, that's overkill How long does it take to run dban on an 80 gb hard drive? -- Christian Einfeldt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Thu Feb 28 10:42:06 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 10:42:06 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linus say no change to Kernel to ease MS signing In-Reply-To: References: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> <20130228021609.GY5217@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130228184206.GH4089@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Christian Einfeldt (einfeldt at gmail.com): > How long does it take to run dban on an 80 gb hard drive? Depends on the wipe method selected. The default 'autowipe' method[1] is maybe 4 hours. Technically, it depends on the CPU and hard drive speed (mostly the latter). There's a progress (percentage) indicator on-screen. [1] What is called '3-pass DoD wiping'. There are more-thorough wipiing options, too. From rick at linuxmafia.com Thu Feb 28 11:47:13 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 11:47:13 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linus say no change to Kernel to ease MS signing In-Reply-To: <20130226234511.GS5217@linuxmafia.com> References: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> <20130226234511.GS5217@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20130228194713.GA28894@linuxmafia.com> [about a recent Torvalds rant:] > LWN.net subscribers will probably find that this Wednesday's edition > includes thoughtful comments by Jon Corbet or someone similar. > (Non-subscribers can read each weekly edition eight days after > publication.) Subscriber link here, as predicted: https://lwn.net/Articles/540287/ The kernel does not run programs in Microsoft's Portable Executable (PE) format. So when a patch came along adding support for those binaries -- not to run programs, but to use them as a container for trusted keys -- the reaction was not entirely positive. [...] [T]here are some fundamental questions about how Linux should support the UEFI secure boot mechanism... [big snip] Security, [Torvalds] says, should be in the control of the users; it should not be a mechanism used to strengthen a big company's control. [...] The other reason that this patch is running into resistance is that there is widespread skepticism of the claim that the loading of unsigned modules must be blocked in the first place. [...] As I expect from Jon Corbet pieces, it's a good (i.e., enlightening and well-thought-out article. To read more, subscribe to LWN.net, which is a subscriber-supported magazine -- or wait a week. From mhigashi at gmail.com Thu Feb 28 14:01:42 2013 From: mhigashi at gmail.com (Mike Higashi) Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 14:01:42 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Linus say no change to Kernel to ease MS signing In-Reply-To: <20130228194713.GA28894@linuxmafia.com> References: <512D43AA.50502@dslextreme.com> <20130226234511.GS5217@linuxmafia.com> <20130228194713.GA28894@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 11:47 AM, Rick Moen wrote: > Subscriber link here, as predicted: https://lwn.net/Articles/540287/ > > [big snip] > > > The other reason that this patch is running into resistance is that > there is widespread skepticism of the claim that the loading of unsigned > modules must be blocked in the first place. [...] If you are distributing an OS that is easily rooted, then blocking unsigned modules is a logical way of securing your insecure product. Mike From a_kleider at yahoo.com Fri Mar 1 19:20:47 2013 From: a_kleider at yahoo.com (Alex Kleider) Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2013 19:20:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] curious name resolving problem In-Reply-To: <20130226045921.GL5217@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1362194447.47603.YahooMailClassic@web122302.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Thank you, Rick.? I think you've hit the nail on the head; not for the first time! cheers, alex a_kleider at yahoo.com --- On Mon, 2/25/13, Rick Moen wrote: From: Rick Moen Subject: Re: [sf-lug] curious name resolving problem To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Monday, February 25, 2013, 8:59 PM Quoting Alex Kleider (a_kleider at yahoo.com): > I've got a puzzling situation in which ping works but ssh can't resolve a url. > Can anyone suggest how this can be? I reckon if I understood that, I might be able to fix it. Something broken about your local DNS daemon.? And here's a guy who had the same problem: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=147460 So, this is just a guess, but I think it''s a good one.? I'm betting that it's a matter of your local DNS nameserver not fully supporting IPv6, and your ssh just happens to throw a tantrum and refuse to work because there's no 'AAAA' (IPv6) DNS record response from the nameserver, just an 'A' (IPv4) one -- whereas your ping client just doesn't care, and is perfectly content to receive just an 'A' response. Thus, your problem went away when you repointed /etc/resolv.conf to 208.201.224.33 & 208.201.224.11 because of the coincidence of those nameservers giving full dual-stack (IPv4 and IPv6) responses, whereas your own nameserver didn't.? Or something like that. If you put your nameserver back into /etc/resolv.conf as the sole nameserver, and then re-try your ssh test using a '-4' option, I'll bet the ssh session suddenly will work. SSH(1)? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ???BSD General Commands Manual NAME ? ???ssh -- OpenSSH SSH client (remote login program) [...] ? ???-4? ? ? Forces ssh to use IPv4 addresses only. ? ???-6? ? ? Forces ssh to use IPv6 addresses only. IPv6 vs. IPv4 issues can make you want to tear your hair out -- or do something rash like sudo su - echo? 'net.ipv6.conf.eth0.disable_ipv6 = 1' > /etc/sysctrl.d/disable-ipv6.conf echo? 'net.ipv6.conf.all.disable_ipv6 = 1' >> /etc/sysctrl.d/disable-ipv6.conf sysctl -p exit ...and thereby disable IPv6 _entirely_ making all IPv6 problems go away. However, that's a bit short-sighted. _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Sun Mar 3 12:02:14 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2013 12:02:14 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] reference for Maestro Message-ID: <5133AC46.70905@dslextreme.com> for help with resolution of your wifi problems try the following Bobbie Sellers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Tue Mar 5 12:45:53 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 12:45:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1362516353.31378.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From grantbow at ubuntu.com Wed Mar 6 11:07:43 2013 From: grantbow at ubuntu.com (Grant Bowman) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 11:07:43 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge In-Reply-To: <1362516353.31378.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1362516353.31378.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I am looking forward to attending today. I also hope those that can not attend physically will use the IRC #ubuntu-us-ca channel on freenode.net to participate. Web client: http://ubuntu-california.org/chat/ Cheers, Grant On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Joseph Puig wrote: > The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday > evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. > > Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San > Francisco. > > Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net > > Joseph From grantbow at partimus.org Wed Mar 6 19:59:41 2013 From: grantbow at partimus.org (Grant Bowman) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 19:59:41 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge In-Reply-To: References: <1362516353.31378.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: A question came up today about overlay or, more properly, union filesystems. I am not sure but I think UnionFS is used by the Ubuntu live usb creator program we used today. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_mount Cheers, Grant On Mar 6, 2013 11:07 AM, "Grant Bowman" wrote: > I am looking forward to attending today. I also hope those that can > not attend physically will use the IRC #ubuntu-us-ca channel on > freenode.net to participate. Web client: > http://ubuntu-california.org/chat/ > > Cheers, > > Grant > > > On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Joseph Puig wrote: > > The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at Noisebridge on > Wednesday > > evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. > > > > Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in > San > > Francisco. > > > > Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net > > > > Joseph > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Wed Mar 6 20:51:17 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Wed, 06 Mar 2013 20:51:17 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge In-Reply-To: References: <1362516353.31378.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1362631877.1759.4.camel@jim-LAPTOP> That link helped clarify a lot! (This evening at the SF-LUG Linux discussion group meeting at Noisebridge we put an ISO on a USB stick and created an overlay filesystem with the effect that the guy who brought the stick could use it "live-CD" style and was able to save files to it. Without the overlay filesystem he would not have been able to save files to the USB stick. All this thanks to Grant. More thanks, Grant! On Wed, 2013-03-06 at 19:59 -0800, Grant Bowman wrote: > A question came up today about overlay or, more properly, union > filesystems. I am not sure but I think UnionFS is used by the Ubuntu > live usb creator program we used today. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_mount > > Cheers, > > Grant > > On Mar 6, 2013 11:07 AM, "Grant Bowman" wrote: > I am looking forward to attending today. I also hope those > that can > not attend physically will use the IRC #ubuntu-us-ca channel > on > freenode.net to participate. Web client: > http://ubuntu-california.org/chat/ > > Cheers, > > Grant > > > On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Joseph Puig > wrote: > > The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at > Noisebridge on Wednesday > > evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing > classroom. > > > > Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near > 18th Street, in San > > Francisco. > > > > Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net > > > > Joseph > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From maestro415 at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 18:28:23 2013 From: maestro415 at gmail.com (maestro) Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2013 18:28:23 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge In-Reply-To: <1362631877.1759.4.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1362516353.31378.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <1362631877.1759.4.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: # +1 jim on grantbow... # thanks grant that was fun driving while we did it... # great having grant and jim back on same evening... end comments message ends _______________________________________________________________________________ On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 8:51 PM, jim wrote: > > > That link helped clarify a lot! > (This evening at the SF-LUG Linux discussion group > meeting at Noisebridge we put an ISO on a USB stick > and created an overlay filesystem with the effect that > the guy who brought the stick could use it "live-CD" > style and was able to save files to it. Without the > overlay filesystem he would not have been able to save > files to the USB stick. > All this thanks to Grant. > More thanks, Grant! > > > > > On Wed, 2013-03-06 at 19:59 -0800, Grant Bowman wrote: > > A question came up today about overlay or, more properly, union > > filesystems. I am not sure but I think UnionFS is used by the Ubuntu > > live usb creator program we used today. > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_mount > > > > Cheers, > > > > Grant > > > > On Mar 6, 2013 11:07 AM, "Grant Bowman" wrote: > > I am looking forward to attending today. I also hope those > > that can > > not attend physically will use the IRC #ubuntu-us-ca channel > > on > > freenode.net to participate. Web client: > > http://ubuntu-california.org/chat/ > > > > Cheers, > > > > Grant > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:45 PM, Joseph Puig > > wrote: > > > The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion meeting at > > Noisebridge on Wednesday > > > evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing > > classroom. > > > > > > Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near > > 18th Street, in San > > > Francisco. > > > > > > Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net > > > > > > Joseph > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -- *~the quieter you become, the more you are able to hear...* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Thu Mar 7 18:52:00 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2013 18:52:00 -0800 Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Reminder - SF-LUG Linux Discussion at Noisebridge In-Reply-To: References: <1362516353.31378.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20130308025200.GZ5217@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Grant Bowman (grantbow at partimus.org): > A question came up today about overlay or, more properly, union > filesystems. I am not sure but I think UnionFS is used by the Ubuntu live > usb creator program we used today. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_mount Ubuntu uses AUFS. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/aufsRootFileSystemOnUsbFlash One of the problems with that is that AUFS remains out-of-tree, i.e., has not been accepted by the mainline kernel developers. Last I heard, no implementation has yet passed muster on LKML, not Union FS, not AUFS, nor overlayfs. (My information might be out of date.) There is also a userspace (FUSE) implementation, FWIW, unionfs-fuse. From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Mon Mar 11 07:52:34 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 07:52:34 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] SF Lug meeting next Monday 18 March 2013 & notes from March 3 meeting Message-ID: <513DEFB2.3090602@dslextreme.com> SF-LUG meets every every third Monday from 6 P.M. to 8 P.M. at the Cafe Enchante, 26th and Geary Boulevard. These meetings are usually lightly attended with a high for the year so far of 4 members. If you have a problem come along and maybe we can help but if not we can usually find someone who can. I have a fresh issue of Linux Pro magazine & I will bring it along. Free BSD version 9.1 is one of the distros on the included disk and the other is called ZorinOS 6.1 Meeting times are strictly nominal which means that I try to show up on time or actually ahead of time, in case I have to trouble shoot my set-up. We leave if no other interested parties show up up by 7:30 Monday nights or 12:30 PM on Sundays . On the other hand if you bring an interesting problem or discussion we may hang out until long after the nominal time to end the meeting. On Sunday 3 March the meeting went something like this. Arrived about 1045 and setup. Shortly the Maestro from Noisebridge arrived. He was concerned with a problem seen frequently where wireless contact is difficult to obtain and maintain. I produced a copy of Knoppix 7.0.4 for him and looked up a some matters on the web related to the problem he was seeing. Ken Schaeffer arrived. Maestro at some point noted that the power bar we were using had not been turned on. Which noted helped to keep the batteries we all were using from being totally depleted. Jim Stockford showed up a bit before Noon. Maestro and he discussed setting up a server to run in a Virtual Box. 1300 we left. Thanks for your attention Bobbie Sellers From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 13 12:09:23 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 12:09:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG Linux Discussion/Problem Solving at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1363201763.34657.YahooMailRC@web181405.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion and Problem Solving meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From jim at systemateka.com Thu Mar 14 12:47:25 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 12:47:25 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice Message-ID: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Hiya, I'm running Ubuntu 10.04 on an Atom-based laptop. Support lapses sometime before May of 2013. I like support. I've got multiple partitions on my 500GB hard drive: /dev/sda1 on / ext4 --37GB total, 7GB used /dev/sda2 swap --1GB /dev/sda3 on /home ext4 (rw, user_xattr) -- 111GB total, 55GB used /dev/sda4 on /xtra ext4 (rw) -- 19GB total, 1GB used /dev/sda5 on /z_s ext4 (rw) -- 76GB total 180MB used I don't upgrade. I backup all files except OS files, then wipe the drive, then reinstall a new OS from some external media, then copy my files from backup to whatever partitions I've dreamed up this time. I'm entertaining the idea of two OSs, Ubuntu 13.04 and Knoppix 7.0.5; I want to get hard media for each. QUESTIONS: * Are these releases okay or good? (Should I get older releases or wait for an upcoming release?) * What are your recommendations for getting each distro on physical media (CD or DVD or USB stick)? I don't like downloading ISOs--my experience includes problems, primarily with corrupt images. I like paying money to support the development communities. * For previous Ubuntu releases I have added packages for word processors, graphics, and other applications. There is a lot of software overlap between Ubuntu and Knoppix and some differences: for example, I like Abi Word, which comes with Knoppix but not with Unbuntu (not 10.04, anyway). There may be differences in included libraries. The clean, simple, stupid (a good thing, fewer bugs) way is to install each distro in separate partitions and use dual boot to work with either. The complex, uber-smart, potentially hair-pulling way is to install each such that they use the same directories such as /var/ and /usr/ and /lib/ and possibly /etc/ and so on, differing only in the /boot/ directories for grub and kernel and other differences. This complex way will have to accommodate installation of new packages I'm sure there's a lot of middle ground between the two above install cases. There's even install Ubuntu 13.04 and carry a Knoppix USB stick (I don't like this one much). GOT IDEAS? RECOMMENDATIONS? THE EASY WAY? A MORE COMPLEX WAY THAT HAS BENEFITS? with thanks, jim From jackofnotrades at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 13:11:08 2013 From: jackofnotrades at gmail.com (Jeff Bragg) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 13:11:08 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: My $0.02 (or whatever worth you choose to assign it): - consider using 12.04 LTS instead of 13.04; this is mainly for the long-term support promised by the LTS designation - be careful if you choose to share directories between them; that could have unexpected consequences; I think I'd personally opt for completely segregated dual-boot On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 12:47 PM, jim wrote: > > > Hiya, > I'm running Ubuntu 10.04 on an Atom-based laptop. > Support lapses sometime before May of 2013. I like > support. > > I've got multiple partitions on my 500GB hard drive: > /dev/sda1 on / ext4 --37GB total, 7GB used > /dev/sda2 swap --1GB > /dev/sda3 on /home ext4 (rw, user_xattr) -- 111GB total, 55GB used > /dev/sda4 on /xtra ext4 (rw) -- 19GB total, 1GB used > /dev/sda5 on /z_s ext4 (rw) -- 76GB total 180MB used > > I don't upgrade. I backup all files except OS files, > then wipe the drive, then reinstall a new OS from some > external media, then copy my files from backup to > whatever partitions I've dreamed up this time. > > I'm entertaining the idea of two OSs, Ubuntu 13.04 > and Knoppix 7.0.5; I want to get hard media for each. > > QUESTIONS: > * Are these releases okay or good? (Should I get older > releases or wait for an upcoming release?) > * What are your recommendations for getting each distro > on physical media (CD or DVD or USB stick)? I don't > like downloading ISOs--my experience includes problems, > primarily with corrupt images. I like paying money to > support the development communities. > * For previous Ubuntu releases I have added packages for > word processors, graphics, and other applications. > There is a lot of software overlap between Ubuntu and > Knoppix and some differences: for example, I like Abi > Word, which comes with Knoppix but not with Unbuntu > (not 10.04, anyway). > There may be differences in included libraries. > > The clean, simple, stupid (a good thing, fewer bugs) > way is to install each distro in separate partitions and > use dual boot to work with either. > The complex, uber-smart, potentially hair-pulling > way is to install each such that they use the same > directories such as /var/ and /usr/ and /lib/ and > possibly /etc/ and so on, differing only in the /boot/ > directories for grub and kernel and other differences. > This complex way will have to accommodate installation > of new packages > I'm sure there's a lot of middle ground between the two > above install cases. There's even install Ubuntu 13.04 > and carry a Knoppix USB stick (I don't like this one much). > GOT IDEAS? RECOMMENDATIONS? THE EASY WAY? A MORE COMPLEX > WAY THAT HAS BENEFITS? > > with thanks, > jim > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -- There Are More Than Two Ways To Do It -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com Thu Mar 14 13:19:19 2013 From: bliss-sf4ever at dslextreme.com (Bobbie Sellers) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 13:19:19 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <514230C7.7020204@dslextreme.com> On 03/14/2013 12:47 PM, jim wrote: > > Hiya, > I'm running Ubuntu 10.04 on an Atom-based laptop. > Support lapses sometime before May of 2013. I like > support. > > I've got multiple partitions on my 500GB hard drive: > /dev/sda1 on / ext4 --37GB total, 7GB used > /dev/sda2 swap --1GB > /dev/sda3 on /home ext4 (rw, user_xattr) -- 111GB total, 55GB used > /dev/sda4 on /xtra ext4 (rw) -- 19GB total, 1GB used > /dev/sda5 on /z_s ext4 (rw) -- 76GB total 180MB used > > I don't upgrade. I backup all files except OS files, > then wipe the drive, then reinstall a new OS from some > external media, then copy my files from backup to > whatever partitions I've dreamed up this time. > > I'm entertaining the idea of two OSs, Ubuntu 13.04 > and Knoppix 7.0.5; I want to get hard media for each. > > QUESTIONS: > * Are these releases okay or good? (Should I get older > releases or wait for an upcoming release?) Knoppix is good but is 7.05 out? I think if you want to run Ubunto you should stick with 12.04 the long term support version and I would use Kubuntu. And I will point out that these are both Debian in disguise. Knoppix will give you a Debian install. I don't really know without booting it up if a 'buntu 12.04 has a facility to move the DVD contents to a bootable Flash drive but Knoppix does that. > * What are your recommendations for getting each distro > on physical media (CD or DVD or USB stick)? I don't > like downloading ISOs--my experience includes problems, > primarily with corrupt images. I like paying money to > support the development communities. Well too bad otherwise I would offer to download the ISOs you want and check them for errors as I do for the stuff I download for myself. And I will point out that these are both Debian in disguise. Knoppix will give you a Debian install. > * For previous Ubuntu releases I have added packages for > word processors, graphics, and other applications. > There is a lot of software overlap between Ubuntu and > Knoppix and some differences: for example, I like Abi > Word, which comes with Knoppix but not with Unbuntu > (not 10.04, anyway). > There may be differences in included libraries. > > The clean, simple, stupid (a good thing, fewer bugs) > way is to install each distro in separate partitions and > use dual boot to work with either. > The complex, uber-smart, potentially hair-pulling > way is to install each such that they use the same > directories such as /var/ and /usr/ and /lib/ and > possibly /etc/ and so on, differing only in the /boot/ > directories for grub and kernel and other differences. > This complex way will have to accommodate installation > of new packages Do that the simple way but create a separate partition labeled /home/data for the stuff you want to keep then create once your install(s) are complete, creat /data directory on /home/Jim/ or whatever your user name may be. and link the directory on home to the partition. I can bring information to the meeting about the further details of making your systems aware of the partition. Or you could look it up online yourself under "installing multiple Linux OSes", You might want to create separate swap partitions for each installation. That way if you use Hibernate or Suspend the activities on the one system won't corrupt the swap files from the other system. > I'm sure there's a lot of middle ground between the two > above install cases. There's even install Ubuntu 13.04 > and carry a Knoppix USB stick (I don't like this one much). Well following online advice I formerly had ExeLinux installed and it only takes at most 20 GiB then it will make sure that whatever other OSes you are installing are listed in Grub. When I tried to test an advanced version of Mandriva it overwrote my Grub so that I could no access my present version nor unfortunately was I able to configure it usefully. Unfortunately I had no time or energy to mess around but was able to get back to the workable version. > GOT IDEAS? RECOMMENDATIONS? THE EASY WAY? A MORE COMPLEX > WAY THAT HAS BENEFITS? > > with thanks, > jim > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > Bobbie Sellers From morganw8-nb at yahoo.com Thu Mar 14 14:39:46 2013 From: morganw8-nb at yahoo.com (Morgan.) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 14:39:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <1363297186.41196.YahooMailClassic@web184405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> There is an old command-line utility called md5sum to verify your ISO downloads when they're finished.? At the command line type: $ md5sum .iso It might take a few minutes to complete, and then it will print a long hex number.? Compare the number with the number provided at the download site.? --- On Thu, 3/14/13, jim wrote: Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Thursday, March 14, 2013, 12:47 PM Hiya, ? ? I'm running Ubuntu 10.04 on an Atom-based laptop. Support lapses sometime before May of 2013. I like support. ? ? I've got multiple partitions on my 500GB hard drive: /dev/sda1 on / ext4? --37GB total, 7GB used /dev/sda2 swap? --1GB /dev/sda3 on /home ext4 (rw, user_xattr)? -- 111GB total, 55GB used /dev/sda4 on /xtra ext4 (rw)? -- 19GB total, 1GB used /dev/sda5 on /z_s ext4 (rw)? -- 76GB total 180MB used ? ? I don't upgrade. I backup all files except OS files, then wipe the drive, then reinstall a new OS from some external media, then copy my files from backup to whatever partitions I've dreamed up this time. ? ? I'm entertaining the idea of two OSs, Ubuntu 13.04 and Knoppix 7.0.5; I want to get hard media for each. QUESTIONS: * Are these releases okay or good? (Should I get older ? releases or wait for an upcoming release?) * What are your recommendations for getting each distro ? on physical media (CD or DVD or USB stick)? I don't ? like downloading ISOs--my experience includes problems, ? primarily with corrupt images. I like paying money to ? support the development communities. * For previous Ubuntu releases I have added packages for ? word processors, graphics, and other applications. ? ? There is a lot of software overlap between Ubuntu and ? Knoppix and some differences: for example, I like Abi ? Word, which comes with Knoppix but not with Unbuntu ? (not 10.04, anyway). ? ? There may be differences in included libraries. ? ? The clean, simple, stupid (a good thing, fewer bugs) ? way is to install each distro in separate partitions and ? use dual boot to work with either. ? ? The complex, uber-smart, potentially hair-pulling ? way is to install each such that they use the same ? directories such as /var/ and /usr/ and /lib/ and ? possibly /etc/ and so on, differing only in the /boot/ ? directories for grub and kernel and other differences. ? This complex way will have to accommodate installation ? of new packages ? ? I'm sure there's a lot of middle ground between the two ? above install cases. There's even install Ubuntu 13.04 ? and carry a Knoppix USB stick (I don't like this one much). ? ? GOT IDEAS? RECOMMENDATIONS? THE EASY WAY? A MORE COMPLEX ? WAY THAT HAS BENEFITS? with thanks, jim _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mhigashi at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 18:27:09 2013 From: mhigashi at gmail.com (Mike Higashi) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 18:27:09 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: <1363297186.41196.YahooMailClassic@web184405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> References: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <1363297186.41196.YahooMailClassic@web184405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 2:39 PM, Morgan. wrote: > > There is an old command-line utility called md5sum to verify your ISO > downloads when they're finished. Another source of corrupted discs comes from burn process, either from using low-quality media, or a mis-match between the ideal burning speed for the media and for the burner. There's some tips on burning here: http://www.cloversystems.com/Duplication%20Tips.htm It's a few years old, but unless your burner is brand-new, the tips should still apply. Mike -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From akkana at shallowsky.com Thu Mar 14 18:53:43 2013 From: akkana at shallowsky.com (Akkana Peck) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 18:53:43 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130315015343.GC1915@shallowsky.com> jim writes: > I'm entertaining the idea of two OSs, Ubuntu 13.04 > and Knoppix 7.0.5; I want to get hard media for each. > > * Are these releases okay or good? (Should I get older > releases or wait for an upcoming release?) Nobody knows yet how good 13.04 is, since it won't be released for at least a month. Usually it takes about a month after release for people to get a sense of whether a new release is solid or flaky. Personally I still have my Ubuntu machines on 12.04, but I haven't heard anything bad about 12.10. I know nothing about Knoppix. > * For previous Ubuntu releases I have added packages for > word processors, graphics, and other applications. > There is a lot of software overlap between Ubuntu and > Knoppix and some differences: for example, I like Abi > Word, which comes with Knoppix but not with Unbuntu > (not 10.04, anyway). Ubuntu has always had abiword, though it's not in the default installation -- you have to apt-get it. > The clean, simple, stupid (a good thing, fewer bugs) > way is to install each distro in separate partitions and > use dual boot to work with either. That works fine. > The complex, uber-smart, potentially hair-pulling > way is to install each such that they use the same > directories such as /var/ and /usr/ and /lib/ and > possibly /etc/ and so on, differing only in the /boot/ > directories for grub and kernel and other differences. > This complex way will have to accommodate installation > of new packages I'd be extremely surprised if that worked. The two distros will use different versions of nearly every library and software package, so whenever you update one, you'll be overwriting packages from the other, even if apt-get doesn't notice the difference and complain. The resulting system is likely to be flaky and unpredictable, and of course neither Ubuntu people nor Knoppix people will be able to help you with problems since the software you're running is neither Ubuntu nor Knoppix. I do use one shared /home partition that I use from all distros. But if you use certain packages with complex config directories -- particularly firefox, gnome and kde -- you may not be able to do that, and may need to play with symlinks for any data you want shared among all distros. I do use firefox, but I run the same version everywhere (installed to /usr/local) so I don't have to worry about waiting while it reinstalls all its extensions every time I reboot to a different distro. > I'm sure there's a lot of middle ground between the two > above install cases. There's even install Ubuntu 13.04 > and carry a Knoppix USB stick (I don't like this one much). That works too, but why bother? Running from a USB stick is slow, and with 500GB you have no space issues. I usually reserve 4 partitions for OS installs, even though I typically use only one 80% of the time, You never know when you might want to try a new distro. ...Akkana From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 20:09:58 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:09:58 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: <20130315015343.GC1915@shallowsky.com> References: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> <20130315015343.GC1915@shallowsky.com> Message-ID: Hi Jim, My laptop is set up with two 25G partitions for OS installs, a swap, and a "big" data partition. I alternate between the OS partitions, keeping the previous version as a fallback, until I am ready to install the next version. Then I wipe the old OS directory and do a fresh install. I don't really go back and forth between the two a lot. If I hate the new installation, I just wait until the next one comes out and keep using the old one. Definitely don't think a shared home is a good idea. Too much desktop stuff gets written there, and who knows what the mix will produce. Just select some directories with your files to share. I'm trying something new this time -- making links from my home back to the previous installation for things like the Documents directory. Only doing this because my "big" data partition is still too small for it to be the permanent location for all of this stuff. Otherwise, I'd just have links from every home directory back to the data partition, and eliminate all cross-talk. I seem to be moving away from lots of little partitions, to bigger ones with link or mounted directories as needed -- seems to waste less space, and I'm never stuck with having the space, but spread out all over, making it useless. Definitely recommend against trying to "mix" the different OS's directories -- been there, done that, and never going to do it again! Red Hat had the little trick of using relative paths on some of their stuff, (../../whatever) and the backtrace on the links broke if you moved their directories around. I couldn't convince them the absolute paths were preferable. I've never had download problems, but I've heard that torrents put additional checking in place, so maybe you should try them if you haven't. Checksums work, but only to tell you to try the whole thing again -- very unsatisfactory for big downloads if you do get occasional glitches. I agree about using 12.04, that's what I migrated to from my 10.04. With the kernel slip-streaming into 12.04, that's no longer a reason to go to the latest release. Be sure and get the 12.04.2, since that has the 3.5 kernel as well as all the other package updates. I try new distros in kvm virtual machines -- it's so simple: 1)sudo apt-get install qemu-kvm Install the software 2)qemu-img create precise.img -f qcow2 6G Create a sparse 6G virtual image (takes only seconds) 3)kvm -m 750 -cdrom /usr/local/vm/natty/precise-desktop-i386.iso -boot d precise.img Install your favorite iso to the sparse image (does the standard install, I've always used an iso, but a cdrom works too I am told). 4)kvm -m990 myvm.img Run it And of course, you can add other gui management software if you want, but I don't bother. Good Luck, Ken -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Fri Mar 15 00:00:22 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 00:00:22 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1363290446.1790.73.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130315070022.GG5217@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Jim Stockford (jim at systemateka.com): > I'm entertaining the idea of two OSs, Ubuntu 13.04 > and Knoppix 7.0.5; I want to get hard media for each. I don't know if you're aware of this, but Knoppix really isn't designed or intended to be installed and maintained thereafter. A large part of the reason is that (last I heard) it consists of about 85% contents drawn from Debian-unstable, 10% cherry-picking of stuff from Mandriva, and 5% taken from god-knows-where. So, it all runs beautifully as a live-CD/DVD system, but installing it risks various problems over time going forward, thereafter. In my experience, it doesn't maintain very well, i.e., you get breakage that never entirely goes away. So, for that and other reasons, I'm left wondering what you're really trying to achieve. Why specifically Knoppix? Moreover, which Knoppix variant, LXDE? KDE 4.8? GNOME 3.4? Fluxbox? Openbox? Icewm? evilwm? twm?[1] I ask because there might be a more effective way of achieving your desired real objective -- unless the reason why you wish to install Knoppix involves some heretofore-unstated factor resulting in literally nothing but Knoppix sufficing. (OTOH, if you are installing Knoppix to HD just for better read performance than an optical disk can permit, and don't care about long-term maintainability of the distro, then fine -- but please read on.) Also, have you considered something more satifactory than dual-booting? Like a virtual machine setup such as VirtualBox? Many vexing problems go away if you do, and you get incidental benefits like concurrent use of multiple OSes rather than needing to shut down everything to switch between them. Again, the real question is: What problem are you _really_ trying to solve? > * Are these releases okay or good? (Should I get older > releases or wait for an upcoming release?) Knoppix 7.0.5 is very reliable as a live CD. I typically boot Knoppix into LXDE (default) or Openbox, so your mileage may differ if you prefer one of the bloatware desktop environments. Obviously _nobody_ can tell you what Ubuntu 13.04 release code will be, since it doesn't yet exist, only development code. > * What are your recommendations for getting each distro > on physical media (CD or DVD or USB stick)? I don't > like downloading ISOs--my experience includes problems, > primarily with corrupt images. I like paying money to > support the development communities. Are you asking whether someone is selling Knoppix media? If so, they're linked right from the front page of the Knoppix site. http://www.knopper.net/knoppix-vendors/index-en.php However, as others have observed, y'know, you really need to download either the accompanying *.sha1 or the accompanying *.md5 file in the same directory (http://ftp.uni-kl.de/pub/linux/knoppix-dvd/ and such) and run /usr/bin/md5sum or /usr/bin/sha1sum against your downloaded file, to verify it arrived correctly. For that matter, what _software_ are you using to download ISOs? Not a Web browser, I hope. If so, open a shell and do 'wget -c [URL]' using the URL copied to Clipboard from your Web browser. The '-c' is the 'continue' flag that permits you to resume a partial/aborted download automagically by running the command again. > * For previous Ubuntu releases I have added packages for > word processors, graphics, and other applications. Much omitted. I'm not 100% sure what your final question is, but my guess is it's 'What's the best way to install applications into a subtree that can be shared and useful between multiple differing Linux distributions.' If so: Don't try to do that. It really doesn't work. As others have said, even a shared /home directory can bite you in the ass with, particularly, dotfile directories/files relied on by GNOME, KDE, and Firefox if there is version skew between the distros, which there almost always is. From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Fri Mar 15 11:59:10 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 11:59:10 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] BALUG Tu 2013-03-19: Stefano Maffulli on OpenStack, 2013-04-16: Wikimedia Foundation; & other BALUG News Message-ID: <20130315115910.10875yhedsbn0okc@webmail.rawbw.com> BALUG Tu 2013-03-19: Stefano Maffulli on OpenStack, 2013-04-16: Wikimedia Foundation; & other BALUG News ------------------------------ items, details further below: BALUG Tu 2013-03-19: Stefano Maffulli on OpenStack BALUG Tu 2013-04-16: Wikimedia Foundation Saltstack BOF TODAY 5pm at PyCon (Santa Clara), etc. CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. volunteering to help BALUG Twitter https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Bay Area Linux User Group (BALUG) meeting Tuesday 6:30 P.M. 2013-03-19 For our 2013-03-19 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Stefano Maffulli[1] on OpenStack[2] - Open source software for building private and public clouds. Stafano's talk/presentation to include at least: An overview of OpenStack The history of the project, how it started, what problems it tries to solve, who's participating in the development of OpenStack and where the OpenStack Foundation[3] wants to take it. About OpenStack: OpenStack is a global collaboration of developers and cloud computing technologists producing the ubiquitous open source cloud computing platform for public and private clouds. The project aims to deliver solutions for all types of clouds by being simple to implement, massively scalable, and feature rich. The technology consists of a series of interrelated projects[4] delivering various components for a cloud infrastructure solution. About Stefano Maffulli: As OpenStack community manager, Stefano built his career around Free Software and open source: from pre-sales engineer and product manager at Italian GNU/Linux distribution MadeInLinux[5] to Italian Chancellor of the Free Software Foundation Europe[6], where he also created the FSFE Fellowship participation program. Later as community manager of leading mobile open source sync solution Funambol[7], his efforts boosted downloads and bolstered enterprise contributions. For Twitter[8], he led efforts to expand in the Italian market. In his spare time, he builds furniture and is learning how to sail in the San Francisco Bay. If you have a specific request or question for Stefano to cover, mention it on the BALUG-Talk List[9][10], or drop me a note at and I'll pass it along. 1. http://www.openstack.org/blog/author/stefano/ 2. http://www.openstack.org/ 3. http://www.openstack.org/foundation/ 4. http://www.openstack.org/projects/ 5. http://web.archive.org/web/20031014062555/http://www.madeinlinux.com/ 6. http://fsfe.org/index.en.html 7. http://www.funambol.com/ 8. https://twitter.com/ 9. http://lists.balug.org/listinfo.cgi/balug-talk-balug.org 10. http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2013-March/005017.html Please RSVP if you're planning to come (see further below). So, if you'd like to join us please RSVP to: rsvp at balug.org **Why RSVP??** Well, don't worry we won't turn you away, but the RSVPs really help BALUG and the Four Seas Restaurant plan the meal and meeting, and with sufficient attendance, they also help ensure that we'll be able to eat upstairs in the private banquet room. Meeting Details... 6:30pm Tuesday, March 19th, 2012 2013-03-19 Four Seas Restaurant http://www.fourseasr.com/ 731 Grant Ave. San Francisco, CA 94108 Easy PARKING: Portsmouth Square Garage at 733 Kearny: http://www.sfpsg.com/ Cost: The meetings are always free, but for dinner, for your gift of $13 cash or more, we give you a gift of dinner - joining us for a yummy family-style Chinese dinner - tax and tip included (your gift also helps in our patronizing the restaurant venue and helping to defray BALUG costs such as treating our speakers to dinner). ------------------------------ For our 2013-04-16 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: The Wikimedia Foundation[1] The Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. is a nonprofit charitable organization dedicated to encouraging the growth, development and distribution of free, multilingual content, and to providing the full content of these wiki-based projects to the public free of charge. The Wikimedia Foundation operates some of the largest collaboratively edited reference projects in the world, including Wikipedia[2], a top-ten internet property. 1. http://wikimediafoundation.org/ 2. http://www.wikipedia.org/ ------------------------------ Saltstack BOF TODAY 5pm at PyCon (Santa Clara), etc. And in follow-up from Corey Quinn's Salt talk/presentation at the 2012-05-15 BALUG meeting[2], one of our attendees is now also part of the core team of developers and also passes along notice[3] of a Saltstack BOF happening TODAY at 5pm[1] at PyCon in Santa Clara. 1. http://lanyrd.com/2013/saltpy/ 2. http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-announce-balug.org/2012-May/000189.html 3. http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2013-March/005019.html ------------------------------ CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. Goodies we'll have at the BALUG meeting (at least the following): CDs/DVDs, etc. - have a peek here: http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc We may also be able to "burn" images per request or copy to USB flash, etc. Donations of blank or +-RW media, USB flash, or funding thereof, also appreciated. See the above URL for details. We've also got at least a few other miscellaneous items up for grabs. ------------------------------ volunteering to help BALUG Want to volunteer to help out BALUG? Quite a variety of opportunities* Drop us a note at: balug-contact at balug.org Or come talk to us at a BALUG meeting. *e.g.: o assist on publicity o assist on speaker coordination/procurement, etc. o webmastering o archivist/history/retrieval/etc. o Linux Systems Administration (e.g. do/assist/learn, with/under some quite experienced and skilled Linux systems administrators). o chief/assistant cat herder o and other various/miscellaneous tasks BALUG "ought" to be doing or would be good to do (feel free to bring in ideas!) ------------------------------ Twitter - you can also follow BALUG on Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Feedback on our publicity/announcements (e.g. contacts or lists where we should get our information out that we're not presently reaching, or things we should do differently): publicity-feedback at balug.org ------------------------------ http://www.balug.org/ From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Mar 18 09:06:06 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 09:06:06 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] BALUG TOMORROW: Tu 2013-03-19: Stefano Maffulli on OpenStack; 2013-04-16: Wikimedia Foundation; & other BALUG News Message-ID: <20130318090606.42802pbcxfjaa1es@webmail.rawbw.com> BALUG TOMORROW: Tu 2013-03-19: Stefano Maffulli on OpenStack; 2013-04-16: Wikimedia Foundation; & other BALUG News REMINDER, or in case you didn't see it earlier: BALUG TOMORROW Tu 2013-03-19: Stefano Maffulli on OpenStack ------------------------------ items, details further below: BALUG TOMORROW Tu 2013-03-19: Stefano Maffulli on OpenStack BALUG Tu 2013-04-16: Wikimedia Foundation CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. volunteering to help BALUG Twitter https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Bay Area Linux User Group (BALUG) meeting Tuesday 6:30 P.M. 2013-03-19 For our 2013-03-19 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: Stefano Maffulli[1] on OpenStack[2] - Open source software for building private and public clouds. Stafano's talk/presentation to include at least: An overview of OpenStack The history of the project, how it started, what problems it tries to solve, who's participating in the development of OpenStack and where the OpenStack Foundation[3] wants to take it. About OpenStack: OpenStack is a global collaboration of developers and cloud computing technologists producing the ubiquitous open source cloud computing platform for public and private clouds. The project aims to deliver solutions for all types of clouds by being simple to implement, massively scalable, and feature rich. The technology consists of a series of interrelated projects[4] delivering various components for a cloud infrastructure solution. About Stefano Maffulli: As OpenStack community manager, Stefano built his career around Free Software and open source: from pre-sales engineer and product manager at Italian GNU/Linux distribution MadeInLinux[5] to Italian Chancellor of the Free Software Foundation Europe[6], where he also created the FSFE Fellowship participation program. Later as community manager of leading mobile open source sync solution Funambol[7], his efforts boosted downloads and bolstered enterprise contributions. For Twitter[8], he led efforts to expand in the Italian market. In his spare time, he builds furniture and is learning how to sail in the San Francisco Bay. If you have a specific request or question for Stefano to cover, mention it on the BALUG-Talk List[9][10], or drop me a note at and I'll pass it along. 1. http://www.openstack.org/blog/author/stefano/ 2. http://www.openstack.org/ 3. http://www.openstack.org/foundation/ 4. http://www.openstack.org/projects/ 5. http://web.archive.org/web/20031014062555/http://www.madeinlinux.com/ 6. http://fsfe.org/index.en.html 7. http://www.funambol.com/ 8. https://twitter.com/ 9. http://lists.balug.org/listinfo.cgi/balug-talk-balug.org 10. http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-talk-balug.org/2013-March/005017.html Please RSVP if you're planning to come (see further below). So, if you'd like to join us please RSVP to: rsvp at balug.org **Why RSVP??** Well, don't worry we won't turn you away, but the RSVPs really help BALUG and the Four Seas Restaurant plan the meal and meeting, and with sufficient attendance, they also help ensure that we'll be able to eat upstairs in the private banquet room. Meeting Details... 6:30pm Tuesday, March 19th, 2012 2013-03-19 Four Seas Restaurant http://www.fourseasr.com/ 731 Grant Ave. San Francisco, CA 94108 Easy PARKING: Portsmouth Square Garage at 733 Kearny: http://www.sfpsg.com/ Cost: The meetings are always free, but for dinner, for your gift of $13 cash or more, we give you a gift of dinner - joining us for a yummy family-style Chinese dinner - tax and tip included (your gift also helps in our patronizing the restaurant venue and helping to defray BALUG costs such as treating our speakers to dinner). ------------------------------ For our 2013-04-16 BALUG meeting, we're proud to present: The Wikimedia Foundation[1] The Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. is a nonprofit charitable organization dedicated to encouraging the growth, development and distribution of free, multilingual content, and to providing the full content of these wiki-based projects to the public free of charge. The Wikimedia Foundation operates some of the largest collaboratively edited reference projects in the world, including Wikipedia[2], a top-ten internet property. 1. http://wikimediafoundation.org/ 2. http://www.wikipedia.org/ ------------------------------ CDs/DVDs, and other "door prizes", etc. Goodies we'll have at the BALUG meeting (at least the following): CDs/DVDs, etc. - have a peek here: http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc We may also be able to "burn" images per request or copy to USB flash, etc. Donations of blank or +-RW media, USB flash, or funding thereof, also appreciated. See the above URL for details. We've also got at least a few other miscellaneous items up for grabs. ------------------------------ volunteering to help BALUG Want to volunteer to help out BALUG? Quite a variety of opportunities* Drop us a note at: balug-contact at balug.org Or come talk to us at a BALUG meeting. *e.g.: o assist on publicity o assist on speaker coordination/procurement, etc. o webmastering o archivist/history/retrieval/etc. o Linux Systems Administration (e.g. do/assist/learn, with/under some quite experienced and skilled Linux systems administrators). o chief/assistant cat herder o and other various/miscellaneous tasks BALUG "ought" to be doing or would be good to do (feel free to bring in ideas!) ------------------------------ Twitter - you can also follow BALUG on Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/BALUG_org ------------------------------ Feedback on our publicity/announcements (e.g. contacts or lists where we should get our information out that we're not presently reaching, or things we should do differently): publicity-feedback at balug.org ------------------------------ http://www.balug.org/ From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Mar 18 11:03:26 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 11:03:26 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130318110326.530025zv1zsgs7w0@webmail.rawbw.com> Trying not to be too redundant with excellent points made (and questions raised) from this "thread", my additions in-line: > Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 12:47:25 -0700 > From: jim > Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice > > I'm running Ubuntu 10.04 on an Atom-based laptop. > Support lapses sometime before May of 2013. I like > support. Support - especially security support, is a *good thing*! :-) > I don't upgrade. I backup all files except OS files, > then wipe the drive, then reinstall a new OS from some > external media, then copy my files from backup to > whatever partitions I've dreamed up this time. A perfectly valid "upgrade" approach. Has its advantages and disadvantages. Also, the relative pros/cons also vary among operating systems and distributions. Some are exceedingly excellent at upgrades (e.g. preserving most or all user and system settings and data, while well merging with updated configurations), some exceedingly suck at it (e.g. generally result in a broken system and back line professional engineering services spending more than a day trying to fix their mess from following their documented upgrade procedures) ... but most fall somewhere between those extremes. Regardless, there are inherent advantages and disadvantages to each approach. > and Knoppix 7.0.5; I want to get hard media for each. > > QUESTIONS: > * What are your recommendations for getting each distro > on physical media (CD or DVD or USB stick)? I don't > like downloading ISOs--my experience includes problems, > primarily with corrupt images. I like paying money to > support the development communities. Get thee to a (e.g. BALUG) meeting ;-) I may not have 'em burnt, but I have *lots* of ISO images - and the files to verify them (and yes, I've verified them). Bring USB "thumb" drive or the like with suitable available space, and I can not only give you copy of the ISOs, but, right along with 'em, all the files needed to verify the images again. See: http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc E.g. just some of files I've got: $ find KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN* ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-* -type f \ > -print | sort KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/0x0E573DA0F13969EF1DD5ACAA3798E3D757E37087.asc KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.md5 KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.md5.asc KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.sha1 KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.sha1.asc KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/verified KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.md5 KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.md5.asc KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.sha1 KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.sha1.asc KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/dpkg-l-cd-705.txt KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/knoppix-cheatcodes.txt ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/0xC5986B4F1257FFA86632CBA746181433FBB75451.asc ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/MD5SUMS ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/MD5SUMS-metalink ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/MD5SUMS-metalink.gpg ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/MD5SUMS.gpg ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/SHA1SUMS ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/SHA1SUMS.gpg ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/SHA256SUMS ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/SHA256SUMS.gpg ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/verified If I've got suitable optical media, I can "burn" 'em if I don't have 'em already burned - certainly CDs, anyway. DVDs I'm not 100% sure about quite yet - think I've only burned 3 so far, and don't think I've quite nailed down the process to the point I'm >99.5% satisfied with and confident in the results. And nothing prevents one from donating to one's favorite distribution(s)/organization(s)/cause(s) if one obtains that same data by means other than purchasing media in a manner that contributes back to the distribution. Besides, how much write-once not-so-recyclable media do we need to have manufactured and purchase? That's also a key reason I'm not "burning" much DVD/CD-R in advance of specific requests/needs - trying to reduce the waste (also trying to reduce volume of media I schlep to most meetings). > The complex, uber-smart, potentially hair-pulling > way is to install each such that they use the same > directories such as /var/ and /usr/ and /lib/ and Others have well made the point too. But I wouldn't share filesystems across distributions like that. Only areas I might consider sharing would possibly be /boot (but as each tries to play "top dog", that could frequently be hazardous/messy/disastrous) - but if, in case of only Ubuntu + Knoppix, if one relatively rarely "updates" Knoppix, and only does that quite carefully and manually, that might be fairly workable. But even in such a case, may be simpler, and safer, to have Knoppix first use its own separate /boot filesystem - and then manually and carefully move/copy/merge things over. /usr/local is another I'd consider sharing - certainly for architecture independent stuff, and, presuming architectures of OSes match (and hardware also - in this case it inherently does), then probably generally okay to also share binaries (executables, etc.). However that still may not work 100% - e.g. due to differences in libraries provided (and not provided) by the different OSes. And I wouldn't share /home, but possibly sharing some subdirectory of ordinary user's HOME directory *might* be okay. In theory user having same home directory across Unix-like operating systems *should* be okay, unfortunately reality is often not well matched to that theory. (Once upon a time, when it was much more common to have user's HOME directory (auto) NFS mounted on various Unix-like hosts, they often "played together" nicer in that regard. Now with a more often "everybody's got their own host machine", all too often sharing a common HOME doesn't play as well together as it ought to.) May be highly feasible to share some quite select application data filesystem(s), e.g. /var/local or filesystem below that point or similar local equivalent. But again, no guarantees - really quite depends what you've got there. From jim at systemateka.com Mon Mar 18 12:00:25 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 12:00:25 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: <20130318110326.530025zv1zsgs7w0@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130318110326.530025zv1zsgs7w0@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1363633225.1790.151.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Those __were__ a bunch of good responses, huh? I've added yours to the rest and am working to figure out how to present a summary or some other form of digestion. On Mon, 2013-03-18 at 11:03 -0700, Michael Paoli wrote: > Trying not to be too redundant with excellent points made (and questions > raised) from this "thread", my additions in-line: > > > Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 12:47:25 -0700 > > From: jim > > Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice > > > > I'm running Ubuntu 10.04 on an Atom-based laptop. > > Support lapses sometime before May of 2013. I like > > support. > > Support - especially security support, is a *good thing*! :-) > > > I don't upgrade. I backup all files except OS files, > > then wipe the drive, then reinstall a new OS from some > > external media, then copy my files from backup to > > whatever partitions I've dreamed up this time. > > A perfectly valid "upgrade" approach. Has its advantages and > disadvantages. Also, the relative pros/cons also vary among operating > systems and distributions. Some are exceedingly excellent at upgrades > (e.g. preserving most or all user and system settings and data, while > well merging with updated configurations), some exceedingly suck at it > (e.g. generally result in a broken system and back line professional > engineering services spending more than a day trying to fix their mess > from following their documented upgrade procedures) ... but most fall > somewhere between those extremes. Regardless, there are inherent > advantages and disadvantages to each approach. > > > and Knoppix 7.0.5; I want to get hard media for each. > > > > QUESTIONS: > > > * What are your recommendations for getting each distro > > on physical media (CD or DVD or USB stick)? I don't > > like downloading ISOs--my experience includes problems, > > primarily with corrupt images. I like paying money to > > support the development communities. > > Get thee to a (e.g. BALUG) meeting ;-) I may not have 'em burnt, but I > have *lots* of ISO images - and the files to verify them (and yes, I've > verified them). Bring USB "thumb" drive or the like with suitable > available space, and I can not only give you copy of the ISOs, but, > right along with 'em, all the files needed to verify the images again. > See: > http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:cds_and_images_etc > E.g. just some of files I've got: > $ find KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN* ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-* -type f \ > > -print | sort > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/0x0E573DA0F13969EF1DD5ACAA3798E3D757E37087.asc > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.md5 > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.md5.asc > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.sha1 > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.sha1.asc > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.verified/verified > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.md5 > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.md5.asc > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.sha1 > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN.iso.sha1.asc > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/dpkg-l-cd-705.txt > KNOPPIX_V7.0.5CD-2012-12-21-EN/knoppix-cheatcodes.txt > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/0xC5986B4F1257FFA86632CBA746181433FBB75451.asc > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/MD5SUMS > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/MD5SUMS-metalink > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/MD5SUMS-metalink.gpg > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/MD5SUMS.gpg > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/SHA1SUMS > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/SHA1SUMS.gpg > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/SHA256SUMS > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/SHA256SUMS.gpg > ubuntu-12.04.2-desktop-i386.iso.verified/verified > > If I've got suitable optical media, I can "burn" 'em if I don't have 'em > already burned - certainly CDs, anyway. DVDs I'm not 100% sure about > quite yet - think I've only burned 3 so far, and don't think I've quite > nailed down the process to the point I'm >99.5% satisfied with and > confident in the results. > > And nothing prevents one from donating to one's favorite > distribution(s)/organization(s)/cause(s) if one obtains that same data > by means other than purchasing media in a manner that contributes back > to the distribution. Besides, how much write-once not-so-recyclable > media do we need to have manufactured and purchase? That's also a key > reason I'm not "burning" much DVD/CD-R in advance of specific > requests/needs - trying to reduce the waste (also trying to reduce > volume of media I schlep to most meetings). > > > The complex, uber-smart, potentially hair-pulling > > way is to install each such that they use the same > > directories such as /var/ and /usr/ and /lib/ and > > Others have well made the point too. But I wouldn't share filesystems > across distributions like that. Only areas I might consider sharing > would possibly be /boot (but as each tries to play "top dog", that could > frequently be hazardous/messy/disastrous) - but if, in case of only > Ubuntu + Knoppix, if one relatively rarely "updates" Knoppix, and only > does that quite carefully and manually, that might be fairly workable. > But even in such a case, may be simpler, and safer, to have Knoppix > first use its own separate /boot filesystem - and then manually and > carefully move/copy/merge things over. > /usr/local is another I'd consider sharing - certainly for architecture > independent stuff, and, presuming architectures of OSes match (and > hardware also - in this case it inherently does), then probably > generally okay to also share binaries (executables, etc.). However that > still may not work 100% - e.g. due to differences in libraries provided > (and not provided) by the different OSes. > And I wouldn't share /home, but possibly sharing some subdirectory of > ordinary user's HOME directory *might* be okay. In theory user having > same home directory across Unix-like operating systems *should* be okay, > unfortunately reality is often not well matched to that theory. (Once > upon a time, when it was much more common to have user's HOME directory > (auto) NFS mounted on various Unix-like hosts, they often "played > together" nicer in that regard. Now with a more often "everybody's got > their own host machine", all too often sharing a common HOME doesn't > play as well together as it ought to.) > May be highly feasible to share some quite select application data > filesystem(s), e.g. /var/local or filesystem below that point or similar > local equivalent. But again, no guarantees - really quite depends what > you've got there. From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Mar 18 14:46:37 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 14:46:37 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] multisum - multiple sums/hashes in a single pass (e.g. check ISOs) Message-ID: <20130318144637.18031yql1dsdcda8@webmail.rawbw.com> Something I did a while ago (and tweaked earlier this year). Anyway, "useful enough" I though I'd put it out there publicly - and just did so today. It works similar to md5sum, sha1sum and the like. But where multiple such (check)sums/hashes are desired, its generally significantly more efficient, as it only reads input file(s) once, and calculates all the various sums in a single (read) pass. It can calculate a fair number of various sums. By default it calculates those provided for most Debian ISOs. :-) This can be particularly useful and efficient where multiple such sums are provided for an ISO image, and one wants to check more than one of them. More details and code, etc., go here: http://www.rawbw.com/~mp/perl/#multisum From jim at systemateka.com Mon Mar 18 15:10:32 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 15:10:32 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Anyone know of robust voice-actuated software? Message-ID: <1363644632.1790.157.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Someone on the Noisebridge list is asking for voice actuated software that lets the user issue commands to the operating system and input into various data files AND works reliably. I'm hoping there's an open source project that addresses this need. Do you know of any? with thanks, jim From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Mar 18 15:11:43 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 15:11:43 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] seeking update advice In-Reply-To: <1363633225.1790.151.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <20130318110326.530025zv1zsgs7w0@webmail.rawbw.com> <1363633225.1790.151.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: <20130318151143.14376s26gj3sxukg@webmail.rawbw.com> > From: jim > Subject: Re: seeking update advice > Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 12:00:25 -0700 > Those __were__ a bunch of good responses, huh? > I've added yours to the rest and am working to > figure out how to present a summary or some other > form of digestion. Perhaps wiki? Does also then make it much easier to further update/improve/correct as relevant, and a persistent URL to the location of the "latest" information on that. There is an SF-LUG wiki namespace (sf-lug) that BALUG has which is quite available[1] and came from the former SF-LUG.com wiki[2]. And keeping it as a separate dokuwiki namespace, it could always be fairly easily moved to SF-LUG(.org and/or .com) if/when that might be desired. footnotes/references: 1. http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?do=index&idx=sf-lug 2. http://www.wiki.balug.org/wiki/doku.php?id=balug:wiki http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2013q1/009898.html etc. From maestro415 at gmail.com Mon Mar 18 16:00:37 2013 From: maestro415 at gmail.com (maestro) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 16:00:37 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Anyone know of robust voice-actuated software? In-Reply-To: <1363644632.1790.157.camel@jim-LAPTOP> References: <1363644632.1790.157.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: * check with richard stallman's sites and the the F.O.S.S. guys @ MIT... * i seem to remember stallman (with others?) had written something for his 'totally free open' distros listed on the gnu.org but don't remember what it is called or how well it works... * it may be multi-platform as well... message ends ____________________________________________________________________________________________ On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 3:10 PM, jim wrote: > > Someone on the Noisebridge list is asking for > voice actuated software that lets the user issue > commands to the operating system and input into > various data files AND works reliably. > I'm hoping there's an open source project > that addresses this need. > Do you know of any? > with thanks, > jim > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -- *~the quieter you become, the more you are able to hear...* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From guacamolepandemonium at gmail.com Mon Mar 18 16:27:42 2013 From: guacamolepandemonium at gmail.com (Will) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 16:27:42 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] multisum - multiple sums/hashes in a single pass (e.g. check ISOs) In-Reply-To: <20130318144637.18031yql1dsdcda8@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130318144637.18031yql1dsdcda8@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: Interesting. Just recently I was doing something similar but used a bash one-liner stuff to do it. dd if=/dev/cdrom bs= count=2048 | tee >(md5sum 1>&2) >(sha1sum 1>&2) >(sha256sum 1>&2) > /dev/null Replace with your cdrom device. Here on Xubuntu there are multiple symlinks pointing to the real device. "count" and "bs" values can be swapped, but I've generally found the larger the "bs" value, the faster it all goes, so I try to put the larger of the two there. The "" is the number of 2048 sectors in the iso and can be found by dividing the iso filesize in bytes by 2048. Though having actual dedicated tools that make things easier are good. Especially when they get packaged. On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 2:46 PM, Michael Paoli < Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu> wrote: > Something I did a while ago (and tweaked earlier this year). Anyway, > "useful enough" I though I'd put it out there publicly - and just did so > today. It works similar to md5sum, sha1sum and the like. But where > multiple such (check)sums/hashes are desired, its generally > significantly more efficient, as it only reads input file(s) once, and > calculates all the various sums in a single (read) pass. It can > calculate a fair number of various sums. By default it calculates those > provided for most Debian ISOs. :-) > > This can be particularly useful and efficient where multiple such sums > are provided for an ISO image, and one wants to check more than one of > them. More details and code, etc., go here: > http://www.rawbw.com/~mp/perl/**#multisum > > > ______________________________**_________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/**listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Mon Mar 18 17:45:59 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 17:45:59 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Anyone know of robust voice-actuated software? In-Reply-To: References: <1363644632.1790.157.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Message-ID: Check out offerings from the Edinburgh Speech Technology Research site: http://www.cstr.ed.ac.uk/ Carniegi Mellon also had something called sphinx for voice recognition. Ken > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________________ > > On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 3:10 PM, jim wrote: > >> >> Someone on the Noisebridge list is asking for >> voice actuated software that lets the user issue >> commands to the operating system and input into >> various data files AND works reliably. >> I'm hoping there's an open source project >> that addresses this need. >> Do you know of any? >> with thanks, >> jim >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ >> > > > > -- > > *~the quieter you become, the more you are able to hear...* > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Tue Mar 19 19:46:51 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 19:46:51 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG Linux Discussion/Problem Solving at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1363747611.54603.YahooMailRC@web181401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion and Problem Solving meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Wed Mar 20 06:44:35 2013 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2013 06:44:35 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Anyone know of robust voice-actuated software? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130320064435.20135j0rtdfyfj8k@webmail.rawbw.com> > Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 17:45:59 -0700 > From: Ken Shaffer > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Anyone know of robust voice-actuated software? > > Carniegi Mellon also had something called sphinx for voice recognition. Bingo! ;-) >> On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 3:10 PM, jim wrote: >> >>> Someone on the Noisebridge list is asking for >>> voice actuated software that lets the user issue >>> commands to the operating system and input into >>> various data files AND works reliably. >>> I'm hoping there's an open source project >>> that addresses this need. >>> Do you know of any? Or, when in doubt, ask. And on a Debian system, with aptitude installed, or similarly on many Debian derivative distributions - perhaps even some that are "merely" .deb package based, we have something like: $ aptitude search '?description(~(speech~|voice~).*recogni)' p gcompris - Educational games for small children p libgsm-tools - User binaries for a GSM speech compressor i A libgsm1 - Shared libraries for GSM speech compressor p libgsm1-dbg - Shared libraries for GSM speech compressor p libgsm1-dev - Development libraries for a GSM speech com p libsphinx2-dev - speech recognition library - development k p libsphinx2g0 - speech recognition library p libtorch3-dev - State of the art machine learning library p libtorch3c2 - State of the art machine learning library p sphinx2-bin - speech recognition utilities p sphinx2-hmm-6k - speech recognition library - default acous p w3-recs - Recommendations of the World Wide Web Cons $ aptitude show sphinx2-bin Package: sphinx2-bin State: not installed Version: 0.6-2.1 Priority: optional Section: sound Maintainer: Isaac Clerencia Uncompressed Size: 528 k Depends: sphinx2-hmm-6k, libc6 (>= 2.7-1), libsphinx2g0 (>= 0.6) Description: speech recognition utilities Sphinx 2 is a real-time, speaker-independent speech recognition system. This package contains examples and utilities that use Sphinx. It also includes a sample language model that is capable of recognizing simple commands like "go forward ten meters" and other commands one might use to tell a robot where to move. Tags: accessibility::speech-recognition, interface::commandline, role::program, scope::utility, works-with::audio $ echo $(lsb_release -d; uname -m) Description: Debian GNU/Linux 6.0.7 (squeeze) x86_64 $ aptitude --simulate install sphinx2-bin The following NEW packages will be installed: libsphinx2g0{a} sphinx2-bin sphinx2-hmm-6k{a} 0 packages upgraded, 3 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded. Need to get 6404 kB of archives. After unpacking 24.2 MB will be used. Do you want to continue? [Y/n/?] n Abort. For Debian, one can also search here: http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages#search_packages From jim at systemateka.com Wed Mar 20 07:41:46 2013 From: jim at systemateka.com (jim) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2013 07:41:46 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Anyone know of robust voice-actuated software? In-Reply-To: <20130320064435.20135j0rtdfyfj8k@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <20130320064435.20135j0rtdfyfj8k@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1363790506.1776.23.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Thank you, Michael; I've been passing all replies to the questioner. If she can handle this one, I'm gonna suggest she joins this SF-LUG mailing list. On Wed, 2013-03-20 at 06:44 -0700, Michael Paoli wrote: > > Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 17:45:59 -0700 > > From: Ken Shaffer > > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Anyone know of robust voice-actuated software? > > > > Carniegi Mellon also had something called sphinx for voice recognition. > > Bingo! ;-) > > >> On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 3:10 PM, jim wrote: > >> > >>> Someone on the Noisebridge list is asking for > >>> voice actuated software that lets the user issue > >>> commands to the operating system and input into > >>> various data files AND works reliably. > >>> I'm hoping there's an open source project > >>> that addresses this need. > >>> Do you know of any? > > Or, when in doubt, ask. And on a Debian system, with aptitude installed, > or similarly on many Debian derivative distributions - perhaps even > some that are "merely" .deb package based, we have something like: > > $ aptitude search '?description(~(speech~|voice~).*recogni)' > p gcompris - Educational games for small children > p libgsm-tools - User binaries for a GSM speech > compressor > i A libgsm1 - Shared libraries for GSM speech > compressor > p libgsm1-dbg - Shared libraries for GSM speech > compressor > p libgsm1-dev - Development libraries for a GSM > speech com > p libsphinx2-dev - speech recognition library - > development k > p libsphinx2g0 - speech recognition library > p libtorch3-dev - State of the art machine > learning library > p libtorch3c2 - State of the art machine > learning library > p sphinx2-bin - speech recognition utilities > p sphinx2-hmm-6k - speech recognition library - > default acous > p w3-recs - Recommendations of the World > Wide Web Cons > $ aptitude show sphinx2-bin > Package: sphinx2-bin > State: not installed > Version: 0.6-2.1 > Priority: optional > Section: sound > Maintainer: Isaac Clerencia > Uncompressed Size: 528 k > Depends: sphinx2-hmm-6k, libc6 (>= 2.7-1), libsphinx2g0 (>= 0.6) > Description: speech recognition utilities > Sphinx 2 is a real-time, speaker-independent speech recognition system. > > This package contains examples and utilities that use Sphinx. It > also includes > a sample language model that is capable of recognizing simple > commands like "go > forward ten meters" and other commands one might use to tell a robot where to > move. > > Tags: accessibility::speech-recognition, interface::commandline, > role::program, > scope::utility, works-with::audio > > $ echo $(lsb_release -d; uname -m) > Description: Debian GNU/Linux 6.0.7 (squeeze) x86_64 > $ aptitude --simulate install sphinx2-bin > The following NEW packages will be installed: > libsphinx2g0{a} sphinx2-bin sphinx2-hmm-6k{a} > 0 packages upgraded, 3 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded. > Need to get 6404 kB of archives. After unpacking 24.2 MB will be used. > Do you want to continue? [Y/n/?] n > Abort. > > For Debian, one can also search here: > http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages#search_packages > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 17:26:51 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 17:26:51 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] For those COMCAST customers having trouble mailing -- time to switch ports Message-ID: Well, Comcast finally got around to killing access to their simple mail transport protocol (smtp) server's use of port 25 (for unencrypted mail). The usual error you see is a failure to authenticate, and your mail is not sent. Switch to port 465 from 25 for your outgoing mail (just selecting the SSL option works in some mail clients). If you have devices not capable of encryption, (can't use 465), switch from 25 to 587, and things should work again. See the Comcast internet forums for their reasoning -- security of course. Apologies in advance for any inexact terminology. Ken -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue Mar 26 20:22:18 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 20:22:18 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] For those COMCAST customers having trouble mailing -- time to switch ports In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130327032218.GI5217@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Ken Shaffer (kenshaffer80 at gmail.com): > Well, Comcast finally got around to killing access to their simple mail > transport protocol (smtp) server's use of port 25 (for unencrypted mail). > The usual error you see is a failure to authenticate, and your mail is not > sent. Switch to port 465 from 25 for your outgoing mail (just selecting > the SSL option works in some mail clients). If you have devices not > capable of encryption, (can't use 465), switch from 25 to 587, and things > should work again. See the Comcast internet forums for their reasoning -- > security of course. Apologies in advance for any inexact terminology. You covered it commendably! Some recent SVLUG posts on the same matter: http://lists.svlug.org/archives/svlug/2013-March/057950.html Florin Andrei asks help http://lists.svlug.org/archives/svlug/2013-March/057951.html Robert Lanning says it's Comcast Residential, but not Business http://lists.svlug.org/archives/svlug/2013-March/057956.html Steve Litt suggests alternatives to running an MTA http://lists.svlug.org/archives/svlug/2013-March/057957.html Yrs. truly describes 587/tcp and 465/tcp setup http://lists.svlug.org/archives/svlug/2013-March/057959.html Yrs. truly agrees that Raw Bandwidth Communications rules. From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 10:17:25 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 10:17:25 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] what software can i use to track an object (hand) in a box using a webcam? Message-ID: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> i'm having trouble figuring out the best search words to find what i'm looking for. basically, i'm looking for crude kinect-like behavior. i don't expect perfect recognition or tracking, but surely something along these lines is available. my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts his/her hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i would mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the x and y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have the box dark and use infrared lighting. there are no other objects in the box, and only one hand at a time. thoughts? From jbpuig at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 27 10:37:16 2013 From: jbpuig at sbcglobal.net (Joseph Puig) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 10:37:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG Linux Discussion/Problem Solving at Noisebridge Message-ID: <1364405836.63211.YahooMailRC@web181405.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The SF-LUG hosts a general Linux Discussion and Problem Solving meeting at Noisebridge on Wednesday evenings, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM (or so) in the Turing classroom. Noisebridge is located at 2169 Mission Street, very near 18th Street, in San Francisco. Info: www.sf-lug.com and www.noisebridge.net Joseph From kai.salmon.chang at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 10:49:03 2013 From: kai.salmon.chang at gmail.com (Kai Chang) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 10:49:03 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] what software can i use to track an object (hand) in a box using a webcam? In-Reply-To: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> References: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> Message-ID: This is a similar concept to the Leap. It's not open-source. https://www.leapmotion.com/ I used a developer version of the device to record some hand gestures. These are the X/Y positions of the fingertips (in the plane of the screen). http://fleetinbeing.net/leap-play/recorder-gallery.html Here's a video of me using the device to rotate/scale a map projection. This one uses the normal vector of the palm, and Y position of the hand. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PZs7VHhypk Anyways, probably not too helpful to your original problem of creating a device from scratch. Cheers, Kai On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 10:17 AM, Michael Shiloh wrote: > i'm having trouble figuring out the best search words to find what i'm > looking for. > > basically, i'm looking for crude kinect-like behavior. i don't expect > perfect recognition or tracking, but surely something along these lines is > available. > > my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts his/her > hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i would > mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the x and > y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to > differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or > clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have the > box dark and use infrared lighting. > > there are no other objects in the box, and only one hand at a time. > > thoughts? > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 11:23:55 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 11:23:55 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] how can we use leapmotion with linux? In-Reply-To: References: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5153393B.60708@gmail.com> But very interesting nonetheless. I was hoping to use the Leap but was disgusted with the process of becoming a developer. I still haven't received confirmation that I was accepted. I (and I suspect the larger Linux community) would be very interested in learning more. Did you develop under Linux? In what language(s) can you program? Is there a well documented API? Is it a library or a client/server arrangement? Can you share the API with us? What else can you tell us? Michael On 03/27/2013 10:49 AM, Kai Chang wrote: > This is a similar concept to the Leap. It's not open-source. > > https://www.leapmotion.com/ > > I used a developer version of the device to record some hand gestures. > These are the X/Y positions of the fingertips (in the plane of the > screen). > > http://fleetinbeing.net/leap-play/recorder-gallery.html > > Here's a video of me using the device to rotate/scale a map > projection. This one uses the normal vector of the palm, and Y > position of the hand. > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PZs7VHhypk > > Anyways, probably not too helpful to your original problem of creating > a device from scratch. > > Cheers, > Kai > > On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 10:17 AM, Michael Shiloh > wrote: >> i'm having trouble figuring out the best search words to find what i'm >> looking for. >> >> basically, i'm looking for crude kinect-like behavior. i don't expect >> perfect recognition or tracking, but surely something along these lines is >> available. >> >> my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts his/her >> hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i would >> mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the x and >> y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to >> differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or >> clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have the >> box dark and use infrared lighting. >> >> there are no other objects in the box, and only one hand at a time. >> >> thoughts? >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From kai.salmon.chang at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 11:40:19 2013 From: kai.salmon.chang at gmail.com (Kai Chang) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 11:40:19 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] how can we use leapmotion with linux? In-Reply-To: <5153393B.60708@gmail.com> References: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> <5153393B.60708@gmail.com> Message-ID: I borrowed an OS X computer to develop. Unfortunately I can't share details of the developer program, but there are Linux drivers that will probably be released before May. I'll email the list when this happens. I can share the data I collected. These are the JSON files that I recorded off the device. They include all the 3-D and orientation information as well as fingertip positions. https://github.com/syntagmatic/leap-play/tree/master/data/gestures All of my open-source JavaScript examples are in that directory as well. Supported languages are C++, C#, Objective-C, Python, Java, JavaScript, and Unity. The device uses two cameras and three infrared emitters, with some onboard processing. You can find YouTube videos of early dev kits that don't have the shiny casing. http://youtu.be/LY3Ya__6BHw?t=2m42s I'd also be happy to bring the device to user group meetup when the Linux drivers are released. On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:23 AM, Michael Shiloh wrote: > But very interesting nonetheless. I was hoping to use the Leap but was > disgusted with the process of becoming a developer. I still haven't received > confirmation that I was accepted. > > I (and I suspect the larger Linux community) would be very interested in > learning more. > > Did you develop under Linux? > > In what language(s) can you program? > > Is there a well documented API? Is it a library or a client/server > arrangement? Can you share the API with us? > > What else can you tell us? > > Michael > > > > On 03/27/2013 10:49 AM, Kai Chang wrote: >> >> This is a similar concept to the Leap. It's not open-source. >> >> https://www.leapmotion.com/ >> >> I used a developer version of the device to record some hand gestures. >> These are the X/Y positions of the fingertips (in the plane of the >> screen). >> >> http://fleetinbeing.net/leap-play/recorder-gallery.html >> >> Here's a video of me using the device to rotate/scale a map >> projection. This one uses the normal vector of the palm, and Y >> position of the hand. >> >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PZs7VHhypk >> >> Anyways, probably not too helpful to your original problem of creating >> a device from scratch. >> >> Cheers, >> Kai >> >> On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 10:17 AM, Michael Shiloh >> wrote: >>> >>> i'm having trouble figuring out the best search words to find what i'm >>> looking for. >>> >>> basically, i'm looking for crude kinect-like behavior. i don't expect >>> perfect recognition or tracking, but surely something along these lines >>> is >>> available. >>> >>> my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts >>> his/her >>> hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i would >>> mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the x >>> and >>> y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to >>> differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or >>> clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have >>> the >>> box dark and use infrared lighting. >>> >>> there are no other objects in the box, and only one hand at a time. >>> >>> thoughts? >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> sf-lug mailing list >>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 11:43:46 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 11:43:46 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] how can we use leapmotion with linux? In-Reply-To: References: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> <5153393B.60708@gmail.com> Message-ID: <51533DE2.4030707@gmail.com> I would be most interested in hearing about the Linux drivers when possible. You mentioned you used an OSX computer. Are the drivers also available on Windows? Since I teach, I need to support all 3 operating systems. Besides the drivers, is anything else required? I will check out your code. Thanks very much for the link. Michael On 03/27/2013 11:40 AM, Kai Chang wrote: > I borrowed an OS X computer to develop. > > Unfortunately I can't share details of the developer program, but > there are Linux drivers that will probably be released before May. > I'll email the list when this happens. > > I can share the data I collected. These are the JSON files that I > recorded off the device. They include all the 3-D and orientation > information as well as fingertip positions. > > https://github.com/syntagmatic/leap-play/tree/master/data/gestures > > All of my open-source JavaScript examples are in that directory as well. > > Supported languages are C++, C#, Objective-C, Python, Java, > JavaScript, and Unity. > > The device uses two cameras and three infrared emitters, with some > onboard processing. You can find YouTube videos of early dev kits that > don't have the shiny casing. > > http://youtu.be/LY3Ya__6BHw?t=2m42s > > I'd also be happy to bring the device to user group meetup when the > Linux drivers are released. > > On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:23 AM, Michael Shiloh > wrote: >> But very interesting nonetheless. I was hoping to use the Leap but was >> disgusted with the process of becoming a developer. I still haven't received >> confirmation that I was accepted. >> >> I (and I suspect the larger Linux community) would be very interested in >> learning more. >> >> Did you develop under Linux? >> >> In what language(s) can you program? >> >> Is there a well documented API? Is it a library or a client/server >> arrangement? Can you share the API with us? >> >> What else can you tell us? >> >> Michael >> >> >> >> On 03/27/2013 10:49 AM, Kai Chang wrote: >>> >>> This is a similar concept to the Leap. It's not open-source. >>> >>> https://www.leapmotion.com/ >>> >>> I used a developer version of the device to record some hand gestures. >>> These are the X/Y positions of the fingertips (in the plane of the >>> screen). >>> >>> http://fleetinbeing.net/leap-play/recorder-gallery.html >>> >>> Here's a video of me using the device to rotate/scale a map >>> projection. This one uses the normal vector of the palm, and Y >>> position of the hand. >>> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PZs7VHhypk >>> >>> Anyways, probably not too helpful to your original problem of creating >>> a device from scratch. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Kai >>> >>> On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 10:17 AM, Michael Shiloh >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> i'm having trouble figuring out the best search words to find what i'm >>>> looking for. >>>> >>>> basically, i'm looking for crude kinect-like behavior. i don't expect >>>> perfect recognition or tracking, but surely something along these lines >>>> is >>>> available. >>>> >>>> my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts >>>> his/her >>>> hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i would >>>> mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the x >>>> and >>>> y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to >>>> differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or >>>> clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have >>>> the >>>> box dark and use infrared lighting. >>>> >>>> there are no other objects in the box, and only one hand at a time. >>>> >>>> thoughts? >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> sf-lug mailing list >>>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >>>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From mhigashi at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 11:56:18 2013 From: mhigashi at gmail.com (Mike Higashi) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 11:56:18 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] what software can i use to track an object (hand) in a box using a webcam? In-Reply-To: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> References: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 10:17 AM, Michael Shiloh < michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com> wrote: > i'm having trouble figuring out the best search words to find what i'm > looking for. > > basically, i'm looking for crude kinect-like behavior. i don't expect > perfect recognition or tracking, but surely something along these lines is > available. > > my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts > his/her hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i > would mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the > x and y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to > differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or > clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have the > box dark and use infrared lighting. > There's the Gesture Recognition Toolkit. It's open source (MIT license) and uses C++. http://www.nickgillian.com/software/grt Wikipedia has an article on gesture recognition, with links to other resources. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gesture_recognition Mike -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 12:04:38 2013 From: michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com (Michael Shiloh) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 12:04:38 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] what software can i use to track an object (hand) in a box using a webcam? In-Reply-To: References: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> Message-ID: <515342C6.40802@gmail.com> On 03/27/2013 11:56 AM, Mike Higashi wrote: > On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 10:17 AM, Michael Shiloh < > michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com> wrote: > >> i'm having trouble figuring out the best search words to find what i'm >> looking for. >> >> basically, i'm looking for crude kinect-like behavior. i don't expect >> perfect recognition or tracking, but surely something along these lines is >> available. >> >> my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts >> his/her hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i >> would mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the >> x and y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to >> differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or >> clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have the >> box dark and use infrared lighting. >> > > There's the Gesture Recognition Toolkit. It's open source (MIT license) > and uses C++. > > http://www.nickgillian.com/software/grt > > > Wikipedia has an article on gesture recognition, with links to other > resources. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gesture_recognition Excellent resources. Thanks. Michael From kai.salmon.chang at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 12:05:26 2013 From: kai.salmon.chang at gmail.com (Kai Chang) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 12:05:26 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] how can we use leapmotion with linux? In-Reply-To: <51533DE2.4030707@gmail.com> References: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> <5153393B.60708@gmail.com> <51533DE2.4030707@gmail.com> Message-ID: Yes, there are also Windows drivers that I've used. That's all that's required. There's an SDK, but for JavaScript only the drivers are necessary to develop. You just need to listen to a websocket for the messages coming from the drivers (examples in that repo). There is also a JavaScript library, but it's not well-documented. https://github.com/leapmotion/leapjs On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:43 AM, Michael Shiloh wrote: > I would be most interested in hearing about the Linux drivers when possible. > > You mentioned you used an OSX computer. Are the drivers also available on > Windows? Since I teach, I need to support all 3 operating systems. > > Besides the drivers, is anything else required? > > I will check out your code. Thanks very much for the link. > > Michael > > > On 03/27/2013 11:40 AM, Kai Chang wrote: >> >> I borrowed an OS X computer to develop. >> >> Unfortunately I can't share details of the developer program, but >> there are Linux drivers that will probably be released before May. >> I'll email the list when this happens. >> >> I can share the data I collected. These are the JSON files that I >> recorded off the device. They include all the 3-D and orientation >> information as well as fingertip positions. >> >> https://github.com/syntagmatic/leap-play/tree/master/data/gestures >> >> All of my open-source JavaScript examples are in that directory as well. >> >> Supported languages are C++, C#, Objective-C, Python, Java, >> JavaScript, and Unity. >> >> The device uses two cameras and three infrared emitters, with some >> onboard processing. You can find YouTube videos of early dev kits that >> don't have the shiny casing. >> >> http://youtu.be/LY3Ya__6BHw?t=2m42s >> >> I'd also be happy to bring the device to user group meetup when the >> Linux drivers are released. >> >> On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:23 AM, Michael Shiloh >> wrote: >>> >>> But very interesting nonetheless. I was hoping to use the Leap but was >>> disgusted with the process of becoming a developer. I still haven't >>> received >>> confirmation that I was accepted. >>> >>> I (and I suspect the larger Linux community) would be very interested in >>> learning more. >>> >>> Did you develop under Linux? >>> >>> In what language(s) can you program? >>> >>> Is there a well documented API? Is it a library or a client/server >>> arrangement? Can you share the API with us? >>> >>> What else can you tell us? >>> >>> Michael >>> >>> >>> >>> On 03/27/2013 10:49 AM, Kai Chang wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> This is a similar concept to the Leap. It's not open-source. >>>> >>>> https://www.leapmotion.com/ >>>> >>>> I used a developer version of the device to record some hand gestures. >>>> These are the X/Y positions of the fingertips (in the plane of the >>>> screen). >>>> >>>> http://fleetinbeing.net/leap-play/recorder-gallery.html >>>> >>>> Here's a video of me using the device to rotate/scale a map >>>> projection. This one uses the normal vector of the palm, and Y >>>> position of the hand. >>>> >>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PZs7VHhypk >>>> >>>> Anyways, probably not too helpful to your original problem of creating >>>> a device from scratch. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Kai >>>> >>>> On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 10:17 AM, Michael Shiloh >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> i'm having trouble figuring out the best search words to find what i'm >>>>> looking for. >>>>> >>>>> basically, i'm looking for crude kinect-like behavior. i don't expect >>>>> perfect recognition or tracking, but surely something along these lines >>>>> is >>>>> available. >>>>> >>>>> my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts >>>>> his/her >>>>> hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i >>>>> would >>>>> mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the x >>>>> and >>>>> y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to >>>>> differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or >>>>> clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have >>>>> the >>>>> box dark and use infrared lighting. >>>>> >>>>> there are no other objects in the box, and only one hand at a time. >>>>> >>>>> thoughts? >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> sf-lug mailing list >>>>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>>>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >>>>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From shane at faultymonk.org Wed Mar 27 13:50:21 2013 From: shane at faultymonk.org (Shane Tzen) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 13:50:21 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] what software can i use to track an object (hand) in a box using a webcam? In-Reply-To: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> References: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 10:17 AM, Michael Shiloh < michaelshiloh1010 at gmail.com> wrote: > my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts > his/her hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i > would mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the > x and y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to > differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or > clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have the > box dark and use infrared lighting. > > there are no other objects in the box, and only one hand at a time. > > thoughts? > Not sure if you've seen his fingertip tracking stuff, but: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0awjPUkBXOU http://johnnylee.net/projects/wii/ http://procrastineering.blogspot.com/2007/12/wiimote-finger-tracking-faq-and-adv.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kai.salmon.chang at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 15:48:01 2013 From: kai.salmon.chang at gmail.com (Kai Chang) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 15:48:01 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] how can we use leapmotion with linux? In-Reply-To: References: <515329A5.3000208@gmail.com> <5153393B.60708@gmail.com> <51533DE2.4030707@gmail.com> Message-ID: Leap Motion now supports Linux. The drivers were released today. http://www.ubuntuvibes.com/2013/03/the-leap-motion-controller-now-supports.html On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 12:05 PM, Kai Chang wrote: > Yes, there are also Windows drivers that I've used. > > That's all that's required. There's an SDK, but for JavaScript only > the drivers are necessary to develop. You just need to listen to a > websocket for the messages coming from the drivers (examples in that > repo). > > There is also a JavaScript library, but it's not well-documented. > > https://github.com/leapmotion/leapjs > > On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:43 AM, Michael Shiloh > wrote: >> I would be most interested in hearing about the Linux drivers when possible. >> >> You mentioned you used an OSX computer. Are the drivers also available on >> Windows? Since I teach, I need to support all 3 operating systems. >> >> Besides the drivers, is anything else required? >> >> I will check out your code. Thanks very much for the link. >> >> Michael >> >> >> On 03/27/2013 11:40 AM, Kai Chang wrote: >>> >>> I borrowed an OS X computer to develop. >>> >>> Unfortunately I can't share details of the developer program, but >>> there are Linux drivers that will probably be released before May. >>> I'll email the list when this happens. >>> >>> I can share the data I collected. These are the JSON files that I >>> recorded off the device. They include all the 3-D and orientation >>> information as well as fingertip positions. >>> >>> https://github.com/syntagmatic/leap-play/tree/master/data/gestures >>> >>> All of my open-source JavaScript examples are in that directory as well. >>> >>> Supported languages are C++, C#, Objective-C, Python, Java, >>> JavaScript, and Unity. >>> >>> The device uses two cameras and three infrared emitters, with some >>> onboard processing. You can find YouTube videos of early dev kits that >>> don't have the shiny casing. >>> >>> http://youtu.be/LY3Ya__6BHw?t=2m42s >>> >>> I'd also be happy to bring the device to user group meetup when the >>> Linux drivers are released. >>> >>> On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:23 AM, Michael Shiloh >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> But very interesting nonetheless. I was hoping to use the Leap but was >>>> disgusted with the process of becoming a developer. I still haven't >>>> received >>>> confirmation that I was accepted. >>>> >>>> I (and I suspect the larger Linux community) would be very interested in >>>> learning more. >>>> >>>> Did you develop under Linux? >>>> >>>> In what language(s) can you program? >>>> >>>> Is there a well documented API? Is it a library or a client/server >>>> arrangement? Can you share the API with us? >>>> >>>> What else can you tell us? >>>> >>>> Michael >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 03/27/2013 10:49 AM, Kai Chang wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> This is a similar concept to the Leap. It's not open-source. >>>>> >>>>> https://www.leapmotion.com/ >>>>> >>>>> I used a developer version of the device to record some hand gestures. >>>>> These are the X/Y positions of the fingertips (in the plane of the >>>>> screen). >>>>> >>>>> http://fleetinbeing.net/leap-play/recorder-gallery.html >>>>> >>>>> Here's a video of me using the device to rotate/scale a map >>>>> projection. This one uses the normal vector of the palm, and Y >>>>> position of the hand. >>>>> >>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PZs7VHhypk >>>>> >>>>> Anyways, probably not too helpful to your original problem of creating >>>>> a device from scratch. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> Kai >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 10:17 AM, Michael Shiloh >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> i'm having trouble figuring out the best search words to find what i'm >>>>>> looking for. >>>>>> >>>>>> basically, i'm looking for crude kinect-like behavior. i don't expect >>>>>> perfect recognition or tracking, but surely something along these lines >>>>>> is >>>>>> available. >>>>>> >>>>>> my plan is to mount 2 or 3 webcams in a small box. the user inserts >>>>>> his/her >>>>>> hand in the box, and i'd like to track the tips of their fingers. i >>>>>> would >>>>>> mount the webcams at right angles so as to track location in both the x >>>>>> and >>>>>> y (and z) planes. the inside of the box can be painted any color to >>>>>> differentiate from the hand, which i can require be free of gloves or >>>>>> clothing. i can light the box, although later it might be nicer to have >>>>>> the >>>>>> box dark and use infrared lighting. >>>>>> >>>>>> there are no other objects in the box, and only one hand at a time. >>>>>> >>>>>> thoughts? >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> sf-lug mailing list >>>>>> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >>>>>> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >>>>>> Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ From listmail at b79.net Wed Mar 27 23:51:30 2013 From: listmail at b79.net (John Magolske) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 23:51:30 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] International Space Station Linux Migration Message-ID: <20130328065130.GB31544@s70206.gridserver.com> Looks like the International Space Station will be migrating from Windows to Linux. The first humanoid robot in space (R2) will be running on Linux as well: It's hard to get tech support 400 kilometers away from the Earth, which is why Keith Chuvala of United Space Alliance, a NASA contractor deeply involved in Space Shuttle and International Space Station (ISS) operations, decided to migrate to Linux. As leader of the Laptops and Network Integration Teams, Chuvala oversees the developers in charge of writing and integrating software for the Station's "OpsLAN" -- a network of laptops that provide the ISS crew with vital capabilities for day-to-day operations, from telling the astronauts where they are, to inventory control of the equipment used, to interfacing with the cameras that capture photos and videos. "We migrated key functions from Windows to Linux because we needed an operating system that was stable and reliable -- one that would give us in-house control. So if we needed to patch, adjust or adapt, we could." [...] Along with the ongoing laptop support, a new challenge for Chuvala?s team is headed to the ISS -- Robonaut (R2). Designed to take over some of the astronaut?s responsibilities, R2 will be the first humanoid robot in space. Running on Linux, the robot can be manipulated by onboard astronauts with ground controllers commanding it into position and performing operations. http://www.linux.com/news/featured-blogs/191-linux-training/711318-linux-foundation-training-prepares-the-international-space-station-for-linux-migration -- John Magolske http://B79.net/contact From jim at well.com Wed Mar 27 23:55:34 2013 From: jim at well.com (jim) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 23:55:34 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] International Space Station Linux Migration In-Reply-To: <20130328065130.GB31544@s70206.gridserver.com> References: <20130328065130.GB31544@s70206.gridserver.com> Message-ID: <1364453734.2288.2.camel@jim-LAPTOP> Thank you, thank you, John! On Wed, 2013-03-27 at 23:51 -0700, John Magolske wrote: > Looks like the International Space Station will be migrating from > Windows to Linux. The first humanoid robot in space (R2) will be > running on Linux as well: > > It's hard to get tech support 400 kilometers away from the Earth, > which is why Keith Chuvala of United Space Alliance, a NASA > contractor deeply involved in Space Shuttle and International Space > Station (ISS) operations, decided to migrate to Linux. As leader > of the Laptops and Network Integration Teams, Chuvala oversees the > developers in charge of writing and integrating software for the > Station's "OpsLAN" -- a network of laptops that provide the ISS > crew with vital capabilities for day-to-day operations, from telling > the astronauts where they are, to inventory control of the equipment > used, to interfacing with the cameras that capture photos and > videos. > > "We migrated key functions from Windows to Linux because we needed > an operating system that was stable and reliable -- one that would > give us in-house control. So if we needed to patch, adjust or adapt, > we could." > > [...] > > Along with the ongoing laptop support, a new challenge for > Chuvala?s team is headed to the ISS -- Robonaut (R2). Designed to > take over some of the astronaut?s responsibilities, R2 will be the > first humanoid robot in space. Running on Linux, the robot can be > manipulated by onboard astronauts with ground controllers commanding > it into position and performing operations. > > http://www.linux.com/news/featured-blogs/191-linux-training/711318-linux-foundation-training-prepares-the-international-space-station-for-linux-migration > > From maestro415 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 08:40:43 2013 From: maestro415 at gmail.com (maestro) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 08:40:43 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] International Space Station Linux Migration In-Reply-To: <20130328065130.GB31544@s70206.gridserver.com> References: <20130328065130.GB31544@s70206.gridserver.com> Message-ID: # +1... # thank you... ## end comments message ends ______________________________________________________________________ On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:51 PM, John Magolske wrote: > Looks like the International Space Station will be migrating from > Windows to Linux. The first humanoid robot in space (R2) will be > running on Linux as well: > > It's hard to get tech support 400 kilometers away from the Earth, > which is why Keith Chuvala of United Space Alliance, a NASA > contractor deeply involved in Space Shuttle and International Space > Station (ISS) operations, decided to migrate to Linux. As leader > of the Laptops and Network Integration Teams, Chuvala oversees the > developers in charge of writing and integrating software for the > Station's "OpsLAN" -- a network of laptops that provide the ISS > crew with vital capabilities for day-to-day operations, from telling > the astronauts where they are, to inventory control of the equipment > used, to interfacing with the cameras that capture photos and > videos. > > "We migrated key functions from Windows to Linux because we needed > an operating system that was stable and reliable -- one that would > give us in-house control. So if we needed to patch, adjust or adapt, > we could." > > [...] > > Along with the ongoing laptop support, a new challenge for > Chuvala?s team is headed to the ISS -- Robonaut (R2). Designed to > take over some of the astronaut?s responsibilities, R2 will be the > first humanoid robot in space. Running on Linux, the robot can be > manipulated by onboard astronauts with ground controllers commanding > it into position and performing operations. > > > http://www.linux.com/news/featured-blogs/191-linux-training/711318-linux-foundation-training-prepares-the-international-space-station-for-linux-migration > > > -- > John Magolske > http://B79.net/contact > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -- *~the quieter you become, the more you are able to hear...* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From voyager640 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 11:28:52 2013 From: voyager640 at gmail.com (James Sheldon) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 11:28:52 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] International Space Station Linux Migration In-Reply-To: <20130328065130.GB31544@s70206.gridserver.com> References: <20130328065130.GB31544@s70206.gridserver.com> Message-ID: Maybe they'd be willing to host a virtual installfest from the ISS? On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 11:51 PM, John Magolske wrote: > Looks like the International Space Station will be migrating from > Windows to Linux. The first humanoid robot in space (R2) will be > running on Linux as well: > > It's hard to get tech support 400 kilometers away from the Earth, > which is why Keith Chuvala of United Space Alliance, a NASA > contractor deeply involved in Space Shuttle and International Space > Station (ISS) operations, decided to migrate to Linux. As leader > of the Laptops and Network Integration Teams, Chuvala oversees the > developers in charge of writing and integrating software for the > Station's "OpsLAN" -- a network of laptops that provide the ISS > crew with vital capabilities for day-to-day operations, from telling > the astronauts where they are, to inventory control of the equipment > used, to interfacing with the cameras that capture photos and > videos. > > "We migrated key functions from Windows to Linux because we needed > an operating system that was stable and reliable -- one that would > give us in-house control. So if we needed to patch, adjust or adapt, > we could." > > [...] > > Along with the ongoing laptop support, a new challenge for > Chuvala?s team is headed to the ISS -- Robonaut (R2). Designed to > take over some of the astronaut?s responsibilities, R2 will be the > first humanoid robot in space. Running on Linux, the robot can be > manipulated by onboard astronauts with ground controllers commanding > it into position and performing operations. > > http://www.linux.com/news/featured-blogs/191-linux-training/711318-linux-foundation-training-prepares-the-international-space-station-for-linux-migration > > > -- > John Magolske > http://B79.net/contact > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ -- @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ @ james sheldon @ http://www.jamessheldon.com @ "those who fail to reread @ are obliged to read the same story everywhere" @ -- Roland Barthes, S/Z (1970) @ voyager640 at gmail.com @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ From kenshaffer80 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 11:32:22 2013 From: kenshaffer80 at gmail.com (Ken Shaffer) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 11:32:22 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Notes on a Secure Boot, Ubuntu Install on a Toshiba Message-ID: I recently got to look at putting Ubuntu on a new Toshiba Satellite S855-S5378. Since my old HP laptop is always potentially just a day away from its third motherboard meltdown, I am always looking at laptops when they are on sale. Toshibas like this one have been offered by OfficeDepot (and TigerDirect with rebate), for about four months. I was aware that this was far from an ideal Linux machine -- secure boot key problems, ethernet problems, and wireless problems. Secure Boot could be disabled, but there was no legacy BIOS support. I didn't have high hopes but was pleasantly surprised. The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly, Summary Good: 1) Boots the Ubuntu 64 bit versions of 12.10 and 12.04.2 in secure mode. 2) Installs Ubuntu just fine (the first time). 3) The first (wireless) update fixes ethernet, getting the needed alx driver. 4) Wireless for the rtl8723e chip does have an available tarball which works, its just not directly from the vendor: rtl_92ce_92se_92de_8723ae_ linux_mac80211_0007.0809.2012.tar.gz 5) Video, sound, bluetooth, and the webcam all work fine. 6) The secure boot keys have been straightened out with firmware 6.60, which came with the machine. 7) The USB3 ports work fine as USB2, even for booting. 8) Runs cool, no overheating here. 9) USB live-media created on the system still work in non-UEFI machines. Bad: 1) Wipes out Windows boot at the first Ubuntu install -- WAIT, maybe that's GOOD, depending upon your viewpoint. 2) Wipes out the Ubuntu EFI files the second install (maybe third) (added myself to bug 1090829). 3) Cannot boot Windows from grub (bug 1091434) on this machine. 4) The live-media USB stick, set up on either a 32 bit 12.04 laptop with persistence, or the current 64 bit 12.10 Secure Boot/UEFI machine, loses persistence when booted on the Secure Boot/UEFI machine (bug 1159016). 5) Installing to a GPT USB stick, and selecting grub location to be the stick, will still result in writing the Ubuntu info to the EFI hard disk, and wiping out the Windows boot. Should probably get a warning when leaving off the EFI partition, like when you leave off the swap partition. Ugly: 1) Really a lot of confusing/conflicting info on the web about secure boot and UEFI. Each vendor may have a different set of problems. Things are in rapid flux, and last year's problems/solutions are not necessariy applicable. Even Toshiba got the key databases mixed up, and needed a firmware update (to 6.60) to enable Ubuntu secure boot. 2) The Ubuntu installer seems to clobber it's own files at times, leaving things in a bad state whose fix is not obvious. It is really easy to leave a machine unbootable from it's hard disk. 3) Basic problems still are present, like Grub2 not being able to chainload the Windows boot manager on some (like this one) machines. But on the whole, there is a lot of Good, and I am happy to report that a working secure Ubuntu/Windows dual boot is possible (albeit using a USB stick to boot Ubuntu running on the hard disk). If you're quick on the F12 key at boot time, you can even boot Windows off the hard disk without having to remove the USB stick. Oh, about secure boot on the stick: Put the shim.efi file into EFI/Boot and rename it to bootx64.efi. Put the signed grubx64.efi into EFI/Boot, and put the grub.cfg into EFI/ubuntu. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eriktrips at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 19:00:14 2013 From: eriktrips at gmail.com (Erik Schneider) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 19:00:14 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Dual-booting #! Linux (Debian-based) and OS X on a MacBook Air Message-ID: Thought someone out there might be interested in, or know someone else interested in, a distilled account of a successful dual-boot install of Crunchbang Linux on a disk with an existing OS X Lion install, using the system EFI partition directly without the mediation of rEFIt or rEFInd. Two weeks ago I did not know what EFI was, really. :) I think I know a little bit more about it now. The story is long and aimed at Linux dilettantes such as myself, who are adventurous but unschooled. I put in more details than many Linux geeks might need, hoping that assembling the results of several googles would save someone else time. But so rather than clog up your inbox with it, I invite you to take a look at http://tinyurl.com/d89m3ze Comments are welcome, but please be kind. I'm just a humanities nerd with a technological itch, and I make no claims as to knowledge or method in any field whatsoever. Erik Erik JM Schneider blog.eriktrips.com onelastditch.com undia.gnosed.net From larry.cafiero at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 19:28:41 2013 From: larry.cafiero at gmail.com (Larry Cafiero) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 19:28:41 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Dual-booting #! Linux (Debian-based) and OS X on a MacBook Air In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Nice work, Erik. On Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 7:00 PM, Erik Schneider wrote: > Thought someone out there might be interested in, or know someone else > interested in, a distilled account of a successful dual-boot install of > Crunchbang Linux on a disk with an existing OS X Lion install, using the > system EFI partition directly without the mediation of rEFIt or rEFInd. > > Two weeks ago I did not know what EFI was, really. :) > I think I know a little bit more about it now. > > The story is long and aimed at Linux dilettantes such as myself, who are > adventurous but unschooled. I put in more details than many Linux geeks > might need, hoping that assembling the results of several googles would > save someone else time. > > But so rather than clog up your inbox with it, I invite you to take a look > at > > http://tinyurl.com/d89m3ze > > Comments are welcome, but please be kind. I'm just a humanities nerd with > a technological itch, and I make no claims as to knowledge or method in any > field whatsoever. > > Erik > > > Erik JM Schneider > blog.eriktrips.com > onelastditch.com > undia.gnosed.net > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > Information about SF-LUG is at http://www.sf-lug.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Sun Mar 31 21:48:52 2013 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 21:48:52 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Dual-booting #! Linux (Debian-based) and OS X on a MacBook Air In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130401044852.GD5217@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Erik Schneider (eriktrips at gmail.com): > Thought someone out there might be interested in, or know someone else > interested in, a distilled account of a successful dual-boot install > of Crunchbang Linux on a disk with an existing OS X Lion install, > using the system EFI partition directly without the mediation of rEFIt > or rEFInd. Very nicely done, sir. I would ask if you would please submit your http://eriktrips.com/2013/03/31/dual-booting-crunchbang-linux-and-os-x-lion-on-a-macbook-air-41/ page as a new entry on http://www.linux-on-laptops.com/apple.html ...and also on http://tuxmobil.org/apple.html Thanks!