From jim at well.com Mon Apr 2 12:39:06 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2007 12:39:06 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] recommendations on file system In-Reply-To: References: <45F9B216.8010104@sfsu.edu> <20070315224028.GR28151@linuxmafia.com><460966BC.9070902@sfsu.edu> <20070327215156.GD32312@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: me, i have. On Mar 30, 2007, at 10:37 AM, Peters, Ola ((MSCIBARRA)) wrote: > Has anyone heard from Jim lately? > > Thanks, > > Ola > > -----Original Message----- > From: sf-lug-bounces at linuxmafia.com > [mailto:sf-lug-bounces at linuxmafia.com] On Behalf Of Rick Moen > Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 2:52 PM > To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] recommendations on file system > > Quoting Sameer Verma (sverma at sfsu.edu): > >> I came across another Ext2 FileSystem driver for Windows: >> http://ext2fsd.sourceforge.net/ >> I've been using it for some time now. Seems to work well. Given the >> choice of NTFS and Ext2/3, I decided to go with Ext camp simply >> because we know how it works and its not going to be [potentially] >> held hostage by a third party. Cannot say the same for NTFS. > > Probably more likely over the long term to be maintained and debugged, > compared to the Ext2 IFS for Windows implementation I cited earlier, > because it's GNU GPL rather than proprietary. Good find. (Duly noted > in my knowledgebase.) > > -- > Cheers, "Transported to a surreal landscape, a young girl kills > the > first > Rick Moen woman she meets, and then teams up with three complete > strangers > rick at linuxmafia.com to kill again." -- Rick Polito's That TV Guy > column, > describing the movie _The Wizard of Oz_ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------------------------------------------------- > > NOTICE: If received in error, please destroy and notify sender. Sender > does not intend to waive confidentiality or privilege. Use of this > email is prohibited when received in error. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From Ola.Peters at mscibarra.com Mon Apr 2 12:41:05 2007 From: Ola.Peters at mscibarra.com (Peters, Ola (MSCIBARRA)) Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2007 15:41:05 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] recommendations on file system In-Reply-To: References: <45F9B216.8010104@sfsu.edu> <20070315224028.GR28151@linuxmafia.com><460966BC.9070902@sfsu.edu> <20070327215156.GD32312@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: Must have missed the note where you were going to be gone... Geeze..scare a person. Hey, need a crash course in scripting, etc, before Wed...is it possible??? Please...that job I want, I got the interview Wednesday. I think I told you I had the second one, right? -----Original Message----- From: jim stockford [mailto:jim at well.com] Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 12:39 PM To: Peters, Ola (MSCIBARRA) Cc: Rick Moen; sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Subject: Re: [sf-lug] recommendations on file system me, i have. On Mar 30, 2007, at 10:37 AM, Peters, Ola ((MSCIBARRA)) wrote: > Has anyone heard from Jim lately? > > Thanks, > > Ola > > -----Original Message----- > From: sf-lug-bounces at linuxmafia.com > [mailto:sf-lug-bounces at linuxmafia.com] On Behalf Of Rick Moen > Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 2:52 PM > To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] recommendations on file system > > Quoting Sameer Verma (sverma at sfsu.edu): > >> I came across another Ext2 FileSystem driver for Windows: >> http://ext2fsd.sourceforge.net/ >> I've been using it for some time now. Seems to work well. Given the >> choice of NTFS and Ext2/3, I decided to go with Ext camp simply >> because we know how it works and its not going to be [potentially] >> held hostage by a third party. Cannot say the same for NTFS. > > Probably more likely over the long term to be maintained and debugged, > compared to the Ext2 IFS for Windows implementation I cited earlier, > because it's GNU GPL rather than proprietary. Good find. (Duly noted > in my knowledgebase.) > > -- > Cheers, "Transported to a surreal landscape, a young girl kills > the > first > Rick Moen woman she meets, and then teams up with three complete > strangers > rick at linuxmafia.com to kill again." -- Rick Polito's That TV Guy > column, > describing the movie _The Wizard of Oz_ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------------------------------------------------- > > NOTICE: If received in error, please destroy and notify sender. Sender > does not intend to waive confidentiality or privilege. Use of this > email is prohibited when received in error. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------------------------------------------------- NOTICE: If received in error, please destroy and notify sender. Sender does not intend to waive confidentiality or privilege. Use of this email is prohibited when received in error. From jim at well.com Mon Apr 2 12:56:00 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2007 12:56:00 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] recommendations on file system In-Reply-To: References: <45F9B216.8010104@sfsu.edu> <20070315224028.GR28151@linuxmafia.com><460966BC.9070902@sfsu.edu> <20070327215156.GD32312@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <7c69ea6c669f99d23c3f5c0060cd42ea@well.com> sure it's possible. did you read the bash tutorial? that's all about scripting. read and ask questions. get on the box and write some shell scripts. write at least one that spits out a to-do list or calendar or anything each day (write the shell script then set up a cron job that runs it o, say, 3 AM). i'm sick in bed, thanks to the guy sitting next to me on the way down. i'll check my mail, you can call me. jim On Apr 2, 2007, at 12:41 PM, Peters, Ola ((MSCIBARRA)) wrote: > Must have missed the note where you were going to be gone... > > Geeze..scare a person. Hey, need a crash course in scripting, etc, > before Wed...is it possible??? Please...that job I want, I got the > interview Wednesday. I think I told you I had the second one, right? > > -----Original Message----- > From: jim stockford [mailto:jim at well.com] > Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 12:39 PM > To: Peters, Ola (MSCIBARRA) > Cc: Rick Moen; sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] recommendations on file system > > > me, i have. > > On Mar 30, 2007, at 10:37 AM, Peters, Ola ((MSCIBARRA)) wrote: > >> Has anyone heard from Jim lately? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Ola >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: sf-lug-bounces at linuxmafia.com >> [mailto:sf-lug-bounces at linuxmafia.com] On Behalf Of Rick Moen >> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 2:52 PM >> To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> Subject: Re: [sf-lug] recommendations on file system >> >> Quoting Sameer Verma (sverma at sfsu.edu): >> >>> I came across another Ext2 FileSystem driver for Windows: >>> http://ext2fsd.sourceforge.net/ >>> I've been using it for some time now. Seems to work well. Given the >>> choice of NTFS and Ext2/3, I decided to go with Ext camp simply >>> because we know how it works and its not going to be [potentially] >>> held hostage by a third party. Cannot say the same for NTFS. >> >> Probably more likely over the long term to be maintained and debugged, > >> compared to the Ext2 IFS for Windows implementation I cited earlier, >> because it's GNU GPL rather than proprietary. Good find. (Duly noted > >> in my knowledgebase.) >> >> -- >> Cheers, "Transported to a surreal landscape, a young girl kills >> the >> first >> Rick Moen woman she meets, and then teams up with three complete >> strangers >> rick at linuxmafia.com to kill again." -- Rick Polito's That TV > Guy >> column, >> describing the movie _The Wizard of Oz_ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> -------------------------------------------------------- >> >> NOTICE: If received in error, please destroy and notify sender. Sender > >> does not intend to waive confidentiality or privilege. Use of this >> email is prohibited when received in error. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> > -------------------------------------------------------- > > NOTICE: If received in error, please destroy and notify sender. Sender > does not intend to waive confidentiality or privilege. Use of this > email is prohibited when received in error. > From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Apr 2 22:48:25 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2007 22:48:25 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] crash course in scripting, etc In-Reply-To: References: <45F9B216.8010104@sfsu.edu> <20070315224028.GR28151@linuxmafia.com><460966BC.9070902@sfsu.edu> <20070327215156.GD32312@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1175579304.4611eaa90186c@webmail.rawbw.com> Ah, gee, I'd be inclined to suggest BUUG, but that would be a bit too late ... presuming you're talking this Wednesday (BUUG is 1st & 3rd Thursdays). In the meantime, this may come in fairly handy too: http://www.rawbw.com/~mp/unix/sh/ It's a wee bit dated (starts from ye olde Borne shell), but *most* of the important stuff is still the same - particularly when it comes to scripting/programming. There's also a lot less to bite off at once (ye olde Bourne shell from UNIX 7th edition - the man page is *only* 6 pages! ... but it is packed pretty densely with information ... contrast that to roughly 50 pages for the man "page" for bash or ksh ... and multiply that by about 4 or so to get up to a book that covers such fairly well in terms of a programming/scripting training manual and reference). Anyway, at the URL I note above, there's also a fair bit of examples and syntax examples. If you can go through all that and well understand it all, you'll be pretty well on your way. Comparing current standards and de facto standards (BASH, POSIX/SUS) to ye olde Bourne shell (from UNIX 7th edition) most of what one needs to know for programming/scripting is about the same. There's lots of "bells and whistles" added to Bash (and Korn) that make it much handier for interactive use ... but most of that is of little consequence to the actual coding of shell scripts/programs themselves. Some of the syntax for trap is a bit different now (the former being deprecated or (just barely) obsoleted (by a slight difference)), there are now two forms for doing command substitution (the newer form being much more sane if one needs to nest command substitutions), there's use of -- even with built-ins such as set ... those are the few differences that jump to mind. Current day Bourne/Korn/Bash and the applicable standards (POSIX/SUS/LSB/...) are quite highly backwards compatible (but not quite fully 100% backwards compatible) with ye olde Borne shell. Also, another random useful reference - go over the relevant FAQ(s), and understand both the questions, and their answers, e.g.: ftp://ftp.cwru.edu/pub/bash/FAQ and for UNIX (or LINUX) context, probably also: http://www.faqs.org/faqs/unix-faq/faq/ There are probably a fair number of other similarly useful resources out there (e.g. searching on news:comp.unix.shell may turn up many useful resources). Of course there are also good shell programming books and guides and such out there too. Use whatever works for you that you can best utilize with the time you have to work with. And if you're looking for yet more examples, on the sf-lug.com. host under ~mpaoli - if you can get to it (e.g. read and/or execute it) with mere mortal user (e.g. without becoming superuser ("root") access, consider it fair game to inspect, learn from, etc. references/excerpts: BUUG http://www.buug.org/ Quoting "Peters, Ola (MSCIBARRA)" : > Must have missed the note where you were going to be gone... > > Geeze..scare a person. Hey, need a crash course in scripting, etc, > before Wed...is it possible??? Please...that job I want, I got the > interview Wednesday. I think I told you I had the second one, right? From paul.matthews at opensourcehowto.org Thu Apr 5 21:27:25 2007 From: paul.matthews at opensourcehowto.org (Paul Matthews) Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2007 14:27:25 +1000 (EST) Subject: [sf-lug] OpenSourceHowTo.org Changes Message-ID: <51499.58.165.85.40.1175833645.squirrel@www.opensourcehowto.org> Hi Everyone, This is my second e-mail about OpenSourceHowTo.Org because I got such a big response from my last e-mail about it I wanted to let everyone know about all my changes that I?ve made. It?s all new, different and hopefully will be more appealing to the Open Source/Free Software & Linux community. http://www.opensourcehowto.org * 2007-04-01 - Added irc://irc.freenode.net/opensourcehowto * 2007-04-01 - Added 'OpenSourceHowTo.Org Daily News' * 2007-03-31 - Started working on getting the Announcements page working with RSS. * 2007-03-29 - Removed up to 75 ads from OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-03-29 - Ads locked down, no more offence ads (hopefully) & more relevant ads now in place. * 2007-03-28 - New skin now working on all browsers, IE6, IE7, FireFox, Oprea, Safri. * 2007-03-27 - New skin released for OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-03-24 - Started working on new skin for OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-03-23 - Started transfering data from Wiki.OpenSourceHowTo.org to OpenWiki.OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-03-20 - OpenWiki was installed on OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-03-16 - A translation module was added for OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-03-14 - Video How-to's are being made & added * 2007-03-11 - Content was added to Wiki.OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-03-10 - Wiki.OpenSourceHowTo.Org was launched * 2007-03-06 - Ads were added to OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-02-28 - Screen-shots are being added to each of the how-to's * 2007-02-27 - The content is finished being formatted. * 2007-02-22 - The content on OpenSourceHowTo.Org is being formatted, links being added & content ... * 2007-02-18 - Content is finished being added for OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-02-12 - Content is being added for OpenSourceHowTo.Org * 2007-02-06 - OpenSourceHowTo.Org is opened This information can be found at http://www.opensourcehowto.org/announcements/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- OpenSourceHowTo.org [url]http://www.opensourcehowto.org/[/url] Wiki.OpenSourceHowTo.org [url]http://wiki.opensourcehowto.org/[/url] My ServerSetup Scripts [url]http://evilperson85.110mb.com[/url] Please Support OpenSourceHowTo.org [url]http://www.opensourcehowto.org/how-to/welcome/support-opensourcehowto.org.html[/url] From sverma at sfsu.edu Sat Apr 7 19:27:41 2007 From: sverma at sfsu.edu (Sameer Verma) Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2007 19:27:41 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] [Fwd: Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 updated] Message-ID: <4618531D.9030001@sfsu.edu> FYI, for those of you who use Debian. Make sure to edit /etc/apt/sources.list network sources to refer to `sarge' instead of `stable'. Sameer -- Dr. Sameer Verma, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Information Systems San Francisco State University San Francisco CA 94132 USA http://verma.sfsu.edu/ http://opensource.sfsu.edu/ -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: Alexander Schmehl Subject: Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 updated Date: Sun, 8 Apr 2007 00:46:22 +0200 Size: 8462 URL: From sverma at sfsu.edu Sun Apr 8 11:37:56 2007 From: sverma at sfsu.edu (Sameer Verma) Date: Sun, 08 Apr 2007 11:37:56 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] [Fwd: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 released] Message-ID: <46193684.1090006@sfsu.edu> More Debian news. Considered miraculous by some, Debian 4.0 is out!!! Sameer -- Dr. Sameer Verma, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Information Systems San Francisco State University San Francisco CA 94132 USA http://verma.sfsu.edu/ http://opensource.sfsu.edu/ -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: Alexander Schmehl Subject: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 released Date: Sun, 8 Apr 2007 15:15:36 +0200 Size: 8805 URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Apr 9 17:27:02 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2007 17:27:02 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] [Fwd: Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 updated] In-Reply-To: <4618531D.9030001@sfsu.edu> References: <4618531D.9030001@sfsu.edu> Message-ID: <20070410002701.GE6236@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Sameer Verma (sverma at sfsu.edu): > FYI, for those of you who use Debian. Make sure to edit > /etc/apt/sources.list network sources to refer to `sarge' instead of > `stable'. Emphasis added: Users _who would like to continue using Debian GNU/Linux 3.1_ are advised to update their /etc/apt/sources.list network sources to refer to `sarge' instead of `stable'. Begs the question of why one _would_ prefer to stay on a development branch that'll soon be put out to pasture permanently and cease to get maintenance updates. I find that people who are unclear on Debian's release process often make that choice in error. From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Apr 9 21:13:04 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2007 21:13:04 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] [Fwd: Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 updated] In-Reply-To: <20070410002701.GE6236@linuxmafia.com> References: <4618531D.9030001@sfsu.edu> <20070410002701.GE6236@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1176178384.461b0ed013078@webmail.rawbw.com> I think perhaps you accidentally confused "sarge" with "etch" (or perhaps with "lenny"). Debian 3.1 GNU/Linux a.k.a. "sarge" is now the old stable. Debian 4.0 GNU/Linux a.k.a. "etch" is the just-released stable. Debian GNU/Linux a.k.a. "lenny" will be the next stable release (not to be confused with update) after "etch". The reason for folks to potentially change their /etc/apt/sources.list from "stable" to "sarge", is if they want to continue running 3.1 and not inadvertently find themselves updating to 4.0 or packages from 4.0. Such inadvertent upgrades might cause interesting surprises/problems for the users, and it also might hit various potential problems. The 4.0 release notes cover how to do the 3.1 to 4.0 upgrade. To have a high probability of success of upgrade from 3.1 to 4.0, one should read the release notes and heed the instructions/advice contained therein. Quoting Rick Moen : > Emphasis added: > > Users _who would like to continue using Debian GNU/Linux 3.1_ are > advised to update their /etc/apt/sources.list network sources to refer > to `sarge' instead of `stable'. > > Begs the question of why one _would_ prefer to stay on a development > branch that'll soon be put out to pasture permanently and cease > to get maintenance updates. I find that people who are unclear on > Debian's release process often make that choice in error. From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue Apr 10 01:44:54 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 01:44:54 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] [Fwd: Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 updated] In-Reply-To: <1176178384.461b0ed013078@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <4618531D.9030001@sfsu.edu> <20070410002701.GE6236@linuxmafia.com> <1176178384.461b0ed013078@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <20070410084454.GJ960@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Michael Paoli (Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu): > I think perhaps you accidentally confused "sarge" with "etch" > (or perhaps with "lenny"). No, I most certainly did not. (I've administered a large number of Debian boxen since 2.1 slink days, by the way, and maintain a sizeable amount documentation on the Debian system.) > The reason for folks to potentially change their /etc/apt/sources.list > from "stable" to "sarge", is if they want to continue running 3.1 and > not inadvertently find themselves updating to 4.0 or packages from 4.0. I'm aware of this "reason" -- but that reason is just not reasonable. It hasn't ever been during any of the prior release switchovers, and isn't now, either, in my view. (The only exception I can think of would be people tied to some hopelessly brittle piece of proprietary software that is likely to break if you allow your Debian box to follow the normal automated transition to a new stable branch.) If you appreciated the utter stability, extreme distance from the cutting edge, and rather desperate boredom of stable=sarge, then by the same logic you should appreciate those same qualities in its stable=etch replacement -- and the fact that the entire release process, right down to the slightly antique glibc version that etch is still stuck on, was designed to make that transition (from stable=sarge to stable=etch) about as seamless and painless as one is likely to ever get on Linux. > Such inadvertent upgrades might cause interesting surprises/problems > for the users, and it also might hit various potential problems. Um, despite the fact that I haven't had the slightest personal interest in the stable branch for quite a few years, I _did_ skim-read the release notes for i386 and PPC. The "potential problems" struck me as a little risible, but maybe that's just me. From jim at well.com Wed Apr 11 08:06:40 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 08:06:40 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: [vox] [fwd] California AB 1668 [mandate open document formats for the California state government] Message-ID: seen on LUGOD... Begin forwarded message: > From: Bill Kendrick > Date: April 11, 2007 7:57:22 AM PDT > To: LUGOD , SacLUG lug-nuts > Subject: [vox] [fwd] California AB 1668 [mandate open document formats > for the California state government] > Reply-To: "LUGOD's general discussion mailing list" > > > > Seen on SVLUG... > > ----- Forwarded message from Cyrus Mack ----- > > Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:41:18 -0700 > From: Cyrus Mack > Subject: [svlug] California AB 1668 > > For those of you unaware, California AB 1668 would mandate open > document formats for the California state government. See the text > here - > > http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/07-08/bill/asm/ab_1651-1700/ > ab_1668_bill_20070223_introduced.html > > I'm putting together a web site at http://www.bytesfree.org/ > > Find your local assemblymember and write them. If they happen to be on > the committee for which a hearing is scheduled on April 17, even > better. The committee in question is the Committee on Jobs, Economic > Development and the Economy. The breakdown is 4 democrats to 2 > republicans. > > Apparently, Microsoft is already lobbying hard to defeat it and > prevent it from getting out of committee. > > Please forward this to other interested groups. > > Sincerely, > Cyrus Mack > > ----- End forwarded message ----- > > -- > -bill! > bill at newbreedsoftware.com > http://www.newbreedsoftware.com/ > _______________________________________________ > vox mailing list > vox at lists.lugod.org > http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox > From jim at well.com Wed Apr 11 11:25:45 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 11:25:45 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: BayLISA Monitoring SIG Today (Weds April 11 7PM) Message-ID: on Townsend near 2nd street in SF. > > Hi Jim: > > Just got your email: the SIG's today. Sorry, I thought you were on my > distribution list already. Can you make it? And let the other LUG > members know too. > > -Peter. > > > > ================================================= > > > April '07 BayLISA Monitoring SIG: SIGnificant Monitoring Tools > > > Everybody gets to chime in this month as part of our effort to > document and disseminate best monitoring practices. At an earlier SIG > meeting we classified monitoring functionality into four broad > categories: Generation, Collection, Analysis, and Presentation. We'll > flesh this out by 1) defining the specific monitoring capability that > goes in each category and 2) fitting available monitoring tools into > these categories. Newbies: bring your thorniest (or most basic) > monitoring questions and issues. Not-So-Newbies: come prepared to > share your experiences re. successful deployment, knowledge of > specific tools and techniques, etc. > > > What: BayLISA Monitoring SIG VI: SIGnificant Monitoring Tools > Who: Anyone interested in IT monitoring issues and tools (newbies > particularly welcome!) > When: Wednesday, April 11 2007, 7PM > Where: GroundWork Open Source, 139 Townsend St., San Francisco > How: 139 Townsend St. is very near AT&T Park. It is two blocks from > the CalTrain Depot. Take the new MUNI T (or J?) trolley to 2nd and > King (ballpark stop) or take the 30 or 45 bus (among others) > crosstown. Free evening street parking can probably be found because > the Giants are out of town that evening. > Cost: Free!! > > > A potpourri of oven fresh vegetarian and non-vegetarian pizzas, > carbonated and non-carbonated drinks, and high- and low -calorie > snacks will be provided by GroundWork. We'll open up the doors at 6:30 > or so and start the formal part of the meeting promptly at 7PM. > > RSVP (not necessary, but helpful): Peter Mui, > pmui at groundworkopensource.com, 415 992 4573 > From colinross at gmail.com Fri Apr 13 11:17:11 2007 From: colinross at gmail.com (Colin Ross) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 11:17:11 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Online Linux Course @ CCSF Message-ID: This is an online class, although it DOES have a couple class meetings I believe. Just FYI, for more information, see: http://www.ccsf.edu/Catalog/Computer/cscors.html#CS+160A *CS 160A* * Introduction to Unix/Linux 2.0* Satisfies core requirement for CS Unix/Linux administration certificate. 51799 831 Onl HOURS ARR 06/18-07/27 Conner, C CS 160A-831 Online Course: After registering, students *should email instructor at cconner at ccsf.edu * ** colin -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Fri Apr 13 19:34:02 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 19:34:02 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Looking for SW developers with Linux experience Message-ID: <0c0a20e7635440f543b2534729d3f193@well.com> this is a tight little job posting. Anybody want a linux coding job in Fremont? Begin forwarded message: > From: "Bordin, John" > Date: April 13, 2007 6:11:51 PM PDT > To: > Subject: Looking for SW developers with Linux experience > > Hi there, Jim, > > Avocent is looking for SW developers with Linux experience. > Please see details in the links provided below. > > Thanks, > John > > http://career.pereless.com/index.cfm? > fuseaction=8311.viewjobdetail&CID=8 > 311&JID=32054¬es_id=760&dept_no=AVT&cfcend > http://career.pereless.com/index.cfm? > fuseaction=8311.viewjobdetail&CID=8 > 311&JID=38532¬es_id=760&dept_no=AVT&cfcend > > --- > John Bordin > Management Systems Division > Avocent Corporation > 3541 Gateway Blvd > Fremont, CA 94538 > phone: +1 510-771-6337 > cell: +1 510-648-4653 > fax: +1 510-771-6200 > email: john.bordin at avocent.com > From jim at well.com Fri Apr 13 19:52:22 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 19:52:22 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Monday meeting at the Javacat 6 PM Message-ID: <04dd2167b199f4c8648ae71fb0eb16ab@well.com> Come on down, eat and drink, talk Linux. Monday April 16 from 6:00 to 8:00 PM (or so) at the Javacat on Geary Blvd at 20th Avenue in San Francisco. From jim at well.com Sat Apr 14 17:14:07 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 17:14:07 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] balug meeting Tuesday night Message-ID: <411eb25b6660dd04af94dd13ba140a3c@well.com> We've got our SF-LUG meeting Monday night from 6 to 8 at the Javacat on Geary at 20th, and here's the BALUG info for Tuesday night: For our April 17, 2007 BALUG meeting, we have: Mike Ray: Linux Data Recovery and How to Avoid It. Hard drives are getting larger while their warranties get shorter. Disk failure and data corruption are facts of life that no Linux power-user can ignore. Mike Ray, formerly of DataSavers, offers techniques for dealing with your direst disk dilemmas using freely available tools. He also discusses best practices to prevent crisis situations, and offers horror stories from the field for your Schadenfreude. Meeting time, location, etc. (also on the BALUG web site): 7:00 P.M. US/Pacific $11.00 fee for dinner Four Seas Restaurant 731 Grant Ave. near Sacramento St. San Francisco, CA 94108-2113 http://www.fourseasr.com/ Feel free to join us as early as 6:30 P.M. at the bar for social chat, etc. before the main meeting. Other - there may be some door prize / giveaway items: Okay, perhaps nothing excruciatingly exciting, but likely some: Red Hat CDs & documentation (mostly AS 3.0, some AS 2.1, no activation/entitlement keys - but generally everything else that comes in the boxed Red Hat set - including the box). LINUX and other (generally reasonably) related magazines and publications - These may be a slight bit older (e.g. from LinuxWorld Expo. last year), but still contain lots of useful information and articles and such (and are often more convenient to read on a crowded bus or train than on-line versions ... and some of these don't have on-line versions or free on-line versions). Miscellaneous: I may also bring some other stuff too (e.g. a LINUX book, vendor t-shirt(s)). http://www.balug.org/ From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Sat Apr 14 19:16:00 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 19:16:00 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG 2007-04-16 & administrators of sf-lug.com. host Message-ID: <1176603360.46218ae074814@webmail.rawbw.com> SF-LUG 2007-04-16 & administrators of sf-lug.com. host So, ... I'm curious - any idea how many of the system administrators of the sf-lug.com. host will be at the SF-LUG 2007-04-16 meeting? I was thinking of attending that meeting (a bit out of my way, but would be good to have some discussions regarding administration of the system). If you're planning to attend the SF-LUG 2007-04-16 meeting please feel free to drop me a note. I do also plan to be at the BALUG meeting 2007-04-17, which is also in San Francisco (and probably BAD on 2007-04-18, and almost certainly BUUG on 2007-04-19 ... okay, so I usually don't make it to *that* many user group meetings in a single week). At least some of the various issues/questions/topics for discussion that come up (or at least I think of) for the host include items such as: o better defining "rules of the road" to avoid potential conflicts or problems o does sf-lug *really* want most of the host administrative chatter on the sf-lug list, or might it be preferable to have a separate list for that? (or maybe decide if/when that becomes an issue) o /etc/motd and /home/sflug/{admin,rhcte,python}/policies - /etc/motd ... a bit long, but it references those policies files, but what those files state, and the reality reflected on the system seem to be becoming increasingly out-of-sync. E.g. /home/sflug/admin/policies notes that there are 5 users in /etc/sudoers ... there are in fact 9 that have unrestricted superuser (root) access (access to or exceeding unrestricted general shell as root). That file also indicates "currently all persons with login accounts on this host are members of the webmasters group and the sflug group" ... in fact at least some aren't members of group sflug ... which makes reading the /home/sflug/{admin,rhcte,python}/policies files referenced in /etc/motd rather difficult: drwxrwx--- 23 sflug sflug 4096 Feb 11 12:13 /home/sflug Now, I certainly wouldn't want to presume that permissions there should be o+rx for the directory(/ies) and o+r for the files, as it might possibly well be the case that someone intended to prevent those that aren't members of group sflug from accessing some files/directories (or even determining the names of the files) in, or beneath the /home/sflug directory. o What's the role of sf-lug.org. vs. sf-lug.com.? Will users (most notably web site visitors) get confused if/when they're not identical or if/when they contain distinct and conflicting information? Anyway, ... many potential areas to examine, but that at least scratches the surface of examples of some areas that may call for some closer examination and discussion. From jim at well.com Sat Apr 14 19:26:32 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 19:26:32 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG 2007-04-16 & administrators of sf-lug.com. host In-Reply-To: <1176603360.46218ae074814@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <1176603360.46218ae074814@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <9ce92062b5aa69cb080c8436a225875e@well.com> Super, hope you make it. Great topics. There's the usual neglect common to LUGs and other by-the-people, for-the-people hosts. There is no hard-and-fast policy and most things are easy to change (and should be changed/updated). I'll be at the Monday night meeting for sure. Looking forward. jim On Apr 14, 2007, at 7:16 PM, Michael Paoli wrote: > SF-LUG 2007-04-16 & administrators of sf-lug.com. host > > So, ... I'm curious - any idea how many of the system administrators > of the sf-lug.com. host will be at the SF-LUG 2007-04-16 meeting? I > was thinking of attending that meeting (a bit out of my way, but would > be good to have some discussions regarding administration of the > system). > > If you're planning to attend the SF-LUG 2007-04-16 meeting please feel > free to drop me a note. I do also plan to be at the BALUG meeting > 2007-04-17, which is also in San Francisco (and probably BAD on > 2007-04-18, and almost certainly BUUG on 2007-04-19 ... okay, so I > usually don't make it to *that* many user group meetings in a single > week). > > At least some of the various issues/questions/topics for discussion > that come up (or at least I think of) for the host include items such > as: > o better defining "rules of the road" to avoid potential conflicts or > problems > o does sf-lug *really* want most of the host administrative chatter on > the sf-lug list, or might it be preferable to have a separate list > for that? (or maybe decide if/when that becomes an issue) > o /etc/motd and /home/sflug/{admin,rhcte,python}/policies - /etc/motd > ... a bit long, but it references those policies files, but what > those files state, and the reality reflected on the system seem to > be becoming increasingly out-of-sync. E.g. > /home/sflug/admin/policies notes that there are 5 users in > /etc/sudoers ... there are in fact 9 that have unrestricted > superuser (root) access (access to or exceeding unrestricted general > shell as root). That file also indicates "currently all persons > with login accounts on this host are members of the webmasters group > and the sflug group" ... in fact at least some aren't members of > group sflug ... which makes reading the > /home/sflug/{admin,rhcte,python}/policies files referenced in > /etc/motd rather difficult: > drwxrwx--- 23 sflug sflug 4096 Feb 11 12:13 /home/sflug > Now, I certainly wouldn't want to presume that permissions there > should be o+rx for the directory(/ies) and o+r for the files, as it > might possibly well be the case that someone intended to prevent > those that aren't members of group sflug from accessing some > files/directories (or even determining the names of the files) in, > or beneath the /home/sflug directory. > o What's the role of sf-lug.org. vs. sf-lug.com.? Will users (most > notably web site visitors) get confused if/when they're not > identical or if/when they contain distinct and conflicting > information? > Anyway, ... many potential areas to examine, but that at least > scratches the surface of examples of some areas that may call for some > closer examination and discussion. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From jim.stockford at gmail.com Sun Apr 15 11:09:04 2007 From: jim.stockford at gmail.com (Jim Stockford) Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 11:09:04 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net> References: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net> Message-ID: i get things like this from time to time. What do you all think? ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Abe Osman Date: Apr 14, 2007 1:02 PM Subject: Help Linux Flourish Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their Linux Linux has been making tremendous progress and has become superior to Windows. Although it is steadily flourishing, it is still not wide spread like it should have and deserves. A group of guys have started organizing a marketing project to help Linux proliferate. You can find more information at the following site. http://tux500.com/ http://www.tux500.com/goal.php http://lobby4linux.com/ http://linux-blog.org/index.php?/archives/198-Indy-500-and-Linux-Not-Newsworthy.html http://LXer.com This is the same approach that Mozilla Foundation used to publicize and advance FireFox and has proven to be effective and worth the effort in increasing its rate of adoption. If you fell this is not what you agree with, please do contribute whatever you can and make your suggestion how the fund to be used. There will be other programs that were (Linux bumper-sticker) or can be suggested to be initiated in the future. It is very important to grab this opportunity to participate to advance Linux usage. I apologize for having to send this message in mass e-mail, but we just wanted to make sure that all the LUGs are aware of this project and we really need the help of everyone. It is also important not to procrastinate since this is very novel effort and keep in mind that only Dollars will make a big difference. Please, feel free to pass this information on and forward this message to all your LUG members so everyone could participate and help make this project very successful. Sincerely, -Abe Osman -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Sun Apr 15 18:41:47 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 18:41:47 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: References: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net> Message-ID: <1176687707.4622d45b16697@webmail.rawbw.com> Quoting Jim Stockford: > i get things like this from time to time. What do > you all think? Perhaps just my opinion, but I tend to think: Build, and support the building of, quality Open Source software. E.g. write and contribute code, bug fixes, help troubleshoot, test, document, teach/train/educate/support (and yes, evangelize a bit too). Donate what one can of the above and/or other resources, e.g. expertise, equipment, facilities, funding, etc. Donate to organizations that help make and promote Open Source, e.g. support Debian and GNU via Software in the Public Interest: http://www.spi-inc.org/ I tend to think making Open Source an unquestionably superior "product" is the best way to "promote" it. It then quite effectively mostly just "sells" and promotes itself. Of course some general advocacy/promotion is good too - but it needs to be well founded, realistic, and not over-hyped. I think it's also appropriate to protect Open Source software from ill-conceived legislation or other actions that might act to squash or unfairly penalize Open Source. In that regard, political action, watching what one's government is up to or considering, and/or supporting groups (e.g. EFF) that do excellent work in such realms is well advised. I guess I'd be rather hesitant to toss money at "the new kid on the block" - I tend to want to see how much is being collected, where the money is going and/or what's being accomplished with the funds. Other (semi-?)random item. I'd like to see LinuxFund work out another card deal to support Linux and Open Source projects. Or if they can't manage to do that or get it together to do that, perhaps some other group that well works to fund Open Source work could work out a similar card deal (in the meantime, I'll be looking at what credit card will get the majority of my transactions come 2007-07; references: http://linux.slashdot.org/linux/07/04/07/1939236.shtml http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=38790 http://community.linux.com/community/07/04/02/1356254.shtml?tid=11 http://www.linuxfund.org/ ) > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Abe Osman > Date: Apr 14, 2007 1:02 PM > Subject: Help Linux Flourish > > Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their Linux > Linux has been making tremendous progress and has become superior to > Windows. > Although it is steadily flourishing, it is still not wide spread like it > should have and deserves. > > A group of guys have started organizing a marketing project to help Linux > proliferate. You can find more information at the following site. > > http://tux500.com/ > http://www.tux500.com/goal.php > http://lobby4linux.com/ > > http://linux-blog.org/index.php?/archives/198-Indy-500-and-Linux-Not-Newsworthy.html > http://LXer.com > > This is the same approach that Mozilla Foundation used to publicize > and > advance FireFox and has proven to be effective and worth the effort in > increasing its rate of adoption. If you fell this is not what you agree > with, > please do contribute whatever you can and make your suggestion how the fund > to be used. There will be other programs that were (Linux bumper-sticker) > or > can be suggested to be initiated in the future. > It is very important to grab this opportunity to participate to > advance Linux > usage. I apologize for having to send this message in mass e-mail, but we > just wanted to make sure that all the LUGs are aware of this project and we > really need the help of everyone. > It is also important not to procrastinate since this is very novel > effort and > keep in mind that only Dollars will make a big difference. > Please, feel free to pass this information on and forward this > message to all > your LUG members so everyone could participate and help make this project > very successful. > > Sincerely, > -Abe Osman > From jturner at nonzerosums.org Mon Apr 16 09:10:40 2007 From: jturner at nonzerosums.org (Jason Turner) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 09:10:40 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] SF-LUG 2007-04-16 & administrators of sf-lug.com. host In-Reply-To: <1176603360.46218ae074814@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <1176603360.46218ae074814@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <5D32F64F-9956-43A3-AD51-0E66D5D98D00@nonzerosums.org> As one of the 9(?) sudoers on the box, I'll be there this evening. -- jt On Apr 14, 2007, at 7:16 PM, Michael Paoli wrote: > SF-LUG 2007-04-16 & administrators of sf-lug.com. host > > So, ... I'm curious - any idea how many of the system administrators > of the sf-lug.com. host will be at the SF-LUG 2007-04-16 meeting? I > was thinking of attending that meeting (a bit out of my way, but would > be good to have some discussions regarding administration of the > system). > [...] From jim at well.com Mon Apr 16 14:39:28 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 14:39:28 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: USENIX Discounts & Give-Aways Message-ID: <5434857175b708bf54cba4b7192979e5@well.com> Here's another tidbit sent to SF-LUG c/o me. I've asked Jennifer to send any physical stuff she wants and I'll bring it to a meeting. Begin forwarded message: > From: Jennifer Peterson > Date: April 16, 2007 2:29:53 PM PDT > To: jim at well.com > Cc: Anne Dickison > Subject: USENIX Discounts & Give-Aways > > Hi Jim, > > USENIX '07 is approaching! We would like to send some Annual Tech > brochures and USENIX give-aways to hand out at your next meeting. If > interested, please respond with your mailing information and we'll > mail them out to you the following day. Send 5 or more people from > your group and each person attending will receive $100 off their > registration! See below for further USENIX '07 details. > > Join us in Santa Clara, CA, June 17-22, 2007, for the 2007 USENIX > Annual Technical Conference (USENIX '07). This year's program includes > 6 full days of training by industry experts such as Peter Baer Galvin, > Aeleen Frisch, and Richard Bejtlich; starting June 20, technical > sessions including the Refereed Papers track; keynote address by > Mendel Rosenblum, Stanford University; plenary closing by Mary Lou > Jepsen, One Laptop per Child; and other Invited Talks by speakers > including Werner Vogels, Amazon.com. Learn the latest groundbreaking > practices from researchers from around the globe. Topics include: > system administration, Linux, open source, security, networking, and > more. > > Register at http://www.usenix.org/events/usenix07/ by June 1 and save > up to $300! > > Thank you! > > Jennifer Peterson > Marketing & Conference Assistant > USENIX Association > 2560 Ninth St., Suite 215 > Berkeley, CA 94710 > ph 510-528-8649 x26 > fax 510-548-5738 > jpeterson at usenix.org > From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon Apr 16 15:33:35 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 15:33:35 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: References: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Jim Stockford (jim.stockford at gmail.com): > i get things like this from time to time. What do you all think? I think that the Linux User Group HOWTO has a list of worthy Linux-relevant organisations that might merit your donation dollars. http://en.tldp.org/HOWTO/User-Group-HOWTO-4.html#ss4.4 From jim at well.com Mon Apr 16 16:18:19 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 16:18:19 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: <20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com> References: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net> <20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <87b499370a6427383ac80e42722bc520@well.com> boy, that's quite a page. It suggests users toss in the non-unreasonable amount of $100, roughly the amount, as they say, of NOT upgrading to the next MSFT product with the result of hundreds of millions of dollars. Gee, just $10 bucks each would be a huge pile. For the record, to embarrass myself and hopefully everyone else, I did give $ to some do-gooder Open Source joints in 2005, but not in 2006; I promise to in 2007. Anyone want to go in or start a money-giving movement? On Apr 16, 2007, at 3:33 PM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Jim Stockford (jim.stockford at gmail.com): > >> i get things like this from time to time. What do you all think? > > I think that the Linux User Group HOWTO has a list of worthy > Linux-relevant organisations that might merit your donation dollars. > http://en.tldp.org/HOWTO/User-Group-HOWTO-4.html#ss4.4 > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From kevin.kempter at dataintellect.com Mon Apr 16 16:28:12 2007 From: kevin.kempter at dataintellect.com (Kevin Kempter) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 17:28:12 -0600 Subject: [sf-lug] recommendation for a 64bit laptop Message-ID: <200704161728.12469.kevin.kempter@dataintellect.com> Hi List; I'm thinking about getting a 64bit laptop so I can run 64bit FC5/FC6 however I must have wireless working. Any suggestions? From paul at astropaul.com Mon Apr 16 17:14:29 2007 From: paul at astropaul.com (Paul Reilly) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 01:14:29 +0100 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: <20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com> References: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net> <20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1176768869.46241165aba8e@mail.third-rock.net> What I would like to see is something like the community Firefox competition that happened a year or two ago. Where members of the community make great ads like this: www.firefoxflicks.com They were cool. I think the idea is the best one would be funded by the community and play on prime time TV. Maybe there is something similar for linux? Even a veteren command line junkie such as I have been suprised to see the development in Linux GUI with Berly. This really impressed me: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHrT-W7DcNc&NR=1 I had no idea Linux GUI's were at this level already. I doubt others are aware of it either. Paul From jim at well.com Tue Apr 17 10:06:51 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 10:06:51 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Notes re last night's SF-LUG meeting about the colo box Message-ID: <6224f005ac943c26109c6b1ee5364d32@well.com> Here follow notes from last night's SF-LUG meeting about the colo box (a computer at the ServePath facility on Spear Street that hosts the sf-lug.com web site and soon the BALUG web site, too). * Jim claims the colo has given us 4 IP addresses. Michael wants one for BALUG. BUT: Upon review, it looks like three of the four IP addresses are dedicated to a VLAN setup: i.e. only one IP address is available for use. * Michael proposes each LUG has scripts with an identifying suffix, notably startup scripts for daemons. * Administrators will use the wiki for most documentation, but there will be a /home/admin directory that contains flat files with some policy and how-to information. We must set up a structure to divide issues about the box itself, SF-LUG issues, and BALUG issues (e.g. how each LUG wants to manage its web pages). * Remote backup. Jim proposed NFS-over-internet. Michael proposes rsync over ssh, which is what we'll use to back some data to a remote location. * sudoers: currently pretty much anyone who has a ssh login account has been put in the sudoers file. THIS WILL CHANGE! if you have a ssh account on the box, take note. <-------------------------------------------------- We'll remove all but people with administrative duties. If you want an account, we'll gladly give it. If you want extended privileges, ask and we'll see what we can do short of full root privileges. * Michael proposes reviewing the contacts for box administrators. Nathan has listed pager monkeys to include Nathan and Jim. Michael will the our newest pager monkey. Probably three persons is enough, though having a second BALUGer would be good. * We need policies for maintenance. These will be on the wiki primarily. Anything that might reveal security flaws should be doc'ed in /home/admin. When are good times to bring the box down for hardware changes (other than as soon as possible after something breaks)? We have nagios and osiris running on the box, with thanks to Nathan. Should we have hours of business, i.e. a service agreement to guarantee box uptime during certain hours, days...? Probably not, it seems, at least not at this time. * Jim will ask ServePath if there's a means of getting console access to the box: i.e., something other than ssh access in the event the box goes down or nuts. Currently we either ask the Spear Street staff to turn the box back on or we drive down and do things. * Jason (JT) has installed PHP BB. How shall we use it? There was some discussion comparing the merits of Bulletin Boards ("forums") against good ol' mail, which is archivable and web accessible. * Seems okay to "yummify" the box, at least with respect to osiris and nagios. Policy currently is that administrators can yum away whenever. * There is an Apache restart nicely command of some sort that minimizes httpd downtime (e.g. for re-reading a revised config file). * Nathan has got a DNS server working on the box. Currently it works with respect to Nathan's universe and not with the internet namespace as a matter of proof of concept. Given a little testing and then getting access to a couple of internet aware DNS servers up the stream, we can switch our DNS server over to see the internet. From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue Apr 17 15:31:16 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 15:31:16 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: <20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com> References: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net> <20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20070417223116.GA15286@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Jim Stockford (jim.stockford at gmail.com): > i get things like this from time to time. What do you all think? In my first reply, I took the lazy way out, and referred people to the list of worthwhile (Linux-relevant) donation causes that I maintain inside the LDP's Linux User Group HOWTO. I call that course of action "lazy" because it ducked your implied question about whether I consider the referenced "Tux500" cause, the one at these sites, to likewise merit financial support: http://tux500.com/ http://www.tux500.com/goal.php http://lobby4linux.com/ http://linux-blog.org/index.php?/archives/198-Indy-500-and-Linux-Not-Newsworthy.html Here in California, local culture dictates that we must never be judgemental -- doing which is considered Bad and Wrong. I was born here but raised elsewhere, so y'all are welcome to regard me as an uncouth auslander: I'm about to be judgemental, Bad and Wrong. In short: no. > This is the same approach that Mozilla Foundation used to publicize > and advance FireFox and has proven to be effective and worth the > effort in increasing its rate of adoption. Mozilla Foundation was not, and is not, a bunch of often-juvenile-acting OS-advocacy people. They had and have a realistic and long-term plan for publicity. They have names, rather than just pseudonymous handles like "helios". They took the trouble to set up an actual foundation with accountability to the public. If you read a sampling of Lobby4Linux's materials, you may or may not have the same impression, but I recomment at minimum considering carefully whether you want to rely on their projects' longevity or give them money. From jim at well.com Tue Apr 17 15:44:10 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 15:44:10 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: <20070417223116.GA15286@linuxmafia.com> References: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net> <20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com> <20070417223116.GA15286@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: i like straight-talking opinions, thanks. On Apr 17, 2007, at 3:31 PM, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Jim Stockford (jim.stockford at gmail.com): > >> i get things like this from time to time. What do you all think? > > In my first reply, I took the lazy way out, and referred people to the > list of worthwhile (Linux-relevant) donation causes that I maintain > inside the LDP's Linux User Group HOWTO. > > I call that course of action "lazy" because it ducked your implied > question about whether I consider the referenced "Tux500" cause, the > one > at these sites, to likewise merit financial support: > > http://tux500.com/ > http://www.tux500.com/goal.php > http://lobby4linux.com/ > > http://linux-blog.org/index.php?/archives/198-Indy-500-and-Linux-Not- > Newsworthy.html > > Here in California, local culture dictates that we must never be > judgemental -- doing which is considered Bad and Wrong. I was born > here > but raised elsewhere, so y'all are welcome to regard me as an uncouth > auslander: I'm about to be judgemental, Bad and Wrong. > > In short: no. > > >> This is the same approach that Mozilla Foundation used to publicize >> and advance FireFox and has proven to be effective and worth the >> effort in increasing its rate of adoption. > > Mozilla Foundation was not, and is not, a bunch of > often-juvenile-acting > OS-advocacy people. They had and have a realistic and long-term plan > for publicity. They have names, rather than just pseudonymous handles > like "helios". They took the trouble to set up an actual foundation > with accountability to the public. > > If you read a sampling of Lobby4Linux's materials, you may or may not > have the same impression, but I recomment at minimum considering > carefully whether you want to rely on their projects' longevity or give > them money. > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From Ola.Peters at mscibarra.com Tue Apr 17 15:50:19 2007 From: Ola.Peters at mscibarra.com (Peters, Ola (MSCIBARRA)) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 18:50:19 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] Sun solaris differences... In-Reply-To: References: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net><20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com><20070417223116.GA15286@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: I have a potential opportunity...but I need a quick refresher on Sun Solaris 9. And what are the differences between 8, 9 and 10?? Anyone out there that could help me?? Thanks in advance, Ola -------------------------------------------------------- NOTICE: If received in error, please destroy and notify sender. Sender does not intend to waive confidentiality or privilege. Use of this email is prohibited when received in error. From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue Apr 17 16:07:08 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 16:07:08 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Sun solaris differences... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20070417230708.GH21603@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Peters, Ola (MSCIBARRA) (Ola.Peters at mscibarra.com): > Anyone out there that could help me?? Maybe a Solaris user group? From jim at well.com Tue Apr 17 17:22:50 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 17:22:50 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Upcoming Technical Job Fair - San Francisco - 5/8/07 Message-ID: <6fe84a7b1f81bde62227ca60d1a659de@well.com> another inbound tidbit.... Begin forwarded message: > From: "Megan Scroggins" > Date: April 17, 2007 5:04:46 PM PDT > To: > Subject: Upcoming Technical Job Fair - San Francisco - 5/8/07 > > Please help spread the word about the upcoming San Francisco Technical > HIREvent Job Fair taking place on May 8 at the Hotel Whitcomb > (formerly the Ramada Plaza). > > [click for location details] > > You can print out the flyer below and post it in a public place, > and/or email it to anyone who may benefit. > > http://www.jobjournal.com/pdf/201_tech_att.pdf > > > Thank you, > > ___________________________ > > Megan Scroggins > > TEL: 800-655-5627 ext. 321 > > FAX: (916) 925-0101 > > mscroggins at jobjournal.com > > www.jobjournal.com > > ? From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue Apr 17 18:45:20 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 18:45:20 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: <20070417223116.GA15286@linuxmafia.com> References: <200704141602.37150.ISOsman@comcast.net> <20070416223334.GU21603@linuxmafia.com> <20070417223116.GA15286@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20070418014520.GA21111@linuxmafia.com> I wrote (about "tux500.com"): > If you read a sampling of Lobby4Linux's materials, you may or may not > have the same impression, but I recomment at minimum considering > carefully whether you want to rely on their projects' longevity or give > them money. Subsequent to that, entirely by accident, I came across: http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?p=289&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1 "Is the Tux500 racecar advertizing project a scam?" http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?p=290&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1 "Tux500 scam - news and links history" http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?p=291&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1 "the tux500 scam of the Linux community" Make up your own minds, of course. Me, I considered the entire thing to smell _very_ dodgy within aobut five seconds. But then, any vague-sounding "Send us a bunch of money for a great cause" appeal pushed by two guys identified only as "helios" and "devnet" starts with a severe credibility deficit, in my book. Oddly enough, Pete ("Penguin Pete") Trbovich starts out the first of his three entries as follows: It smells fishy. I have no proof. Just a gut feeling trained by street smarts. But very soon thereafter, he did get much more specific. (People sometimes think I'm overly suspicious of Internet pseudonymity. I certainly don't think it's used _only_ by questionable characters, but can't help notice it often is -- and that, if you _do_ happen to be an irresponsible screw-up, jerking people around from behind a fake name makes it much easier to evade consequences, later.) From bliss at california.com Tue Apr 17 19:24:45 2007 From: bliss at california.com (bobbie sellers) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 19:24:45 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Jim Stockford, on 04/15/07, you wrote: > i get things like this from time to time. What do > you all think? > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Abe Osman > Date: Apr 14, 2007 1:02 PM > Subject: Help Linux Flourish > Now is the time for all good men to come to the aid of their > Linux Linux has been making tremendous progress and has become > superior to Windows. > Although it is steadily flourishing, it is still not wide > spread like it should have and deserves. > A group of guys have started organizing a marketing project to > help Linux proliferate. You can find more information at the > following site. > http://tux500.com/ > http://www.tux500.com/goal.php > http://lobby4linux.com/ > http://linux-blog.org/index.php?/archives/198-Indy-500-and-Linux-Not-Newsworthy.html > http://LXer.com > This is the same approach that Mozilla Foundation used > to publicize and > advance FireFox and has proven to be effective and worth the > effort in increasing its rate of adoption. If you fell this is > not what you agree with, > please do contribute whatever you can and make your suggestion > how the fund to be used. There will be other programs that were > (Linux bumper-sticker) or can be suggested to be initiated in > the future. > It is very important to grab this opportunity to > participate to advance Linux > usage. I apologize for having to send this message in mass > e-mail, but we just wanted to make sure that all the LUGs are > aware of this project and we really need the help of everyone. > It is also important not to procrastinate since this is > very novel effort and > keep in mind that only Dollars will make a big difference. > Please, feel free to pass this information on and > forward this message to all > your LUG members so everyone could participate and help make > this project very successful. > Sincerely, > -Abe Osman I think what others think about this group has been stated but on the theme of "Help Linux Flourish", I think the best thing we can do is learn the systems as well as we can and share that information with others. When I get out of debt if I am still alive I will contribute to the various organisations but in the meantime I will try to learn as much about GNU/Linux as I can and try to share it with others. Just as I did with the Amiga. But just as with the Amiga several groups attempted to collect money and promote the platform with generally poor results though I applaud the individual efforts. Linus didn't do the work for money but for his own education. later bliss -- bobbie sellers - (Back to Angband) Team *AMIGA* SF-LUG bliss at california dot com "Penalties against possession of a drug should not be more damaging to an individual than the use of the drug itself." --President Jimmy Carter, Message to Congress, August 2, 1977 From usr.bin.sh at gmail.com Wed Apr 18 14:06:50 2007 From: usr.bin.sh at gmail.com (Usr Bin Sh) Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 14:06:50 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Help Linux Flourish Message-ID: <109760a70704181406g5e89ddfejcbfdb9b366eb817f@mail.gmail.com> When somebody asking me for donation (money or my "Man-hours"), I always think about consequences: how well the donation will be spent. If I donated, I'm in part responsible for actions of the person/organization that receives the money. I want to be sure that my effort helps somebody, not hurting anybody This Linux race car sounds cool, but I suspect that "Helios and Co" just on the way to take a credit for their marketing genius (i assume its as best case scenario). I don't see a huge benefit for the community. My answer: I'm not ready to donate money to tux500. I prefer Linux advocacy/teaching option and Linux financing through the donation or purchasing of distros I'm familiar with. That way I can, more or less, control the donation. -- Pavel From vinubalaji at gmail.com Wed Apr 18 23:11:00 2007 From: vinubalaji at gmail.com (Vinubalaji Gopal) Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 23:11:00 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] recommendation for a 64bit laptop In-Reply-To: <200704161728.12469.kevin.kempter@dataintellect.com> References: <200704161728.12469.kevin.kempter@dataintellect.com> Message-ID: <7d8fb81e0704182311s5a9c21e5h11c0de0df7c9922@mail.gmail.com> On 4/16/07, Kevin Kempter wrote: > I'm thinking about getting a 64bit laptop so I can run 64bit FC5/FC6 however I > must have wireless working. Any suggestions? I got a macbook (Core 2 Duo) which can run Linux. There are some documentation on how to get things working :) (the mactel site). The wifi driver works without encryption (without WEP or WPA) after installing madwifi drivers. I am sure that it will have support for WEP, etc soon (and I am eagerly waiting for that). All Intel Core 2 duo laptops can run 64 bit Linux. The newer wifi cards may not be supported, so do check them before buying. I am running FC6..First had 64 bit installed, but then had to reinstall FC6 32bit version since Flash 9 is not supported on 64 bit platforms :(. Ofcourse the same holds true for the wifi drivers as well, which did not have 64 bit versions at that time (I had to use Ndiswrapper to run the binary version of the driver). Not sure if the new madwifi driver I have now will work on 64 bit platform. -- Vinu In a world without fences who needs Gates? From jim at well.com Fri Apr 20 08:39:28 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 08:39:28 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: UG News--New Life for Old Electronics on April 22 Message-ID: <1c3c3035be9a57be7929d723e56249d1@well.com> > From: "Marsee Henon" > Date: April 18, 2007 3:17:25 PM PDT > To: jim at well.com > Subject: UG News--New Life for Old Electronics on April 22 > > Hi-- > > Please pass along if your members have items to contribute for > this Earth Day event. > > New Life for Old Electronics! This Earth Day, April 22, makers will > find > new uses for abandoned electronics when Alameda County Computer > Resource > Center (ACCRC) and Make magazine kick off a three-part Earth Day > extravaganza. On Earth Day, ACCRC and Make will be collecting any > household electronics?including old projects, failed inventions, and > half finished prototypes. > > Once all of the electronics have been collected, a team of makers will > work for 24 hours, April 28-29, to create new, amusing and quirky > items. > ACCRC will provide internet, sleeping quarters, food, and plenty of > toys > to aid makers in the quest for creating the ultimate new gadget. > > The reused items will then be displayed at this year?s Maker Faire; May > 19-20 at the San Mateo Fairgrounds, showcasing how a little innovation > can make the old, new again. > > ACCRC is a 13-year old award winning electronics recycler. Their > primary > focus is computers and the charitable placement of F/OSS computers in > the hands of those who do not have access. A secondary focus is on > finding a re-use for everything else that comes in and they get a lot > of > stuff. ACCRC will be creating Silicon Death Valley at this year?s Maker > Faire. > > Alameda County Computer Resource Center > 1501 East Shore Highway in Berkeley > http://www.accrc.org/ > > Maker Faire Bay Area: May 19 & 20, 2007--San Mateo Fairgrounds > http://makerfaire.com/ > > Make Magazine: > http://makezine.com/ > > Thanks, > > Marsee > > > ================================================================ > O'Reilly > 1005 Gravenstein Highway North > Sebastopol, CA 95472 > http://ug.oreilly.com/ http://ug.oreilly.com/creativemedia/ > ================================================================ > From david at sterryit.com Fri Apr 20 10:48:44 2007 From: david at sterryit.com (David Sterry) Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 10:48:44 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Help Linux Flourish In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4628FCFC.9050402@sterryit.com> > I think what others think about this group has been stated > but on the theme of "Help Linux Flourish", I think the best > thing we can do is learn the systems as well as we can and > share that information with others. In the interest of teaching people, I created two videos doing an intro to Ubuntu and how to get help once you're in the thick of it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMp7B_91RzQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhtjyjpHJAE Then I made another video that's an spoof of the most popular video on YouTube. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDisnYe38io You can also check out ubuntuvideo.com if you want to see more videos on Ubuntu or search YouTube for linux and you'll see a lot of screen caps of Beryl and stuff. -Dave From dymondog at yahoo.com Sat Apr 21 03:34:22 2007 From: dymondog at yahoo.com (Robert Briley) Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2007 03:34:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Small business automation and internet presence. In-Reply-To: <1c3c3035be9a57be7929d723e56249d1@well.com> Message-ID: <15283.93410.qm@web43142.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Greetings Everyone, I am trying to set-up a small business and I need to meet a few technology challenges. The first is that I need to have an internet presence complete with online ordering, and second that my bookkeeper who will be helping me set up and monitor my finances is in another city and we both should have access to the accounting and inventory info. My plan at this point is to start off using Yahoo or one of the other small business hosting services for ecommerce and and I will have to flounder on the phone to the bookkeeper as I set-up and use quickbooks. But in the long-run I will probably be better off with a web-based ERP package and perhaps some form of e-commerce software if it is not built in. Right now I am a one-man show and will probably remain so for at least a year. I don't need anything fancy, but I think an integrated and web-enabled package will require less work and maintenance in the long run. At this point I have been looking at SQL ledger, Tiny ERP and Compire. I use to be a DBA, and I enjoy technology, but I need to focus on getting things done with a minimum of hassle, and I don't have money for a lot of consulting. While any comments on the above scheme are appreciated, I would most like to know 1) am I buying more or less headaches by moving to a small ERP? 2) Do any of you have experince with a web-based package that you could comment on for or against? Again, any insights will be appreciated. TIA -R Robert (415) 806-0705 "There is no precedent in any modern White House for what is going on in this one: a complete lack of a policy apparatus," "What you've got is everything - and I mean everything - being run by the political arm." John DiIulio, Original director of the office of faith-based initiatives --------------------------------- Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Sat Apr 21 10:32:34 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2007 10:32:34 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Small business automation and internet presence. In-Reply-To: <15283.93410.qm@web43142.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <15283.93410.qm@web43142.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <875a1e6287cdc839127ef2ce5eebdd54@well.com> there are linux-based money management programs for individuals and businesses. Don't know if any are quickbooks compatible. Some are very powerful. A very important topic, sorry i'm ignorant; i'd love to know what accounting/inventory/payroll/tax... programs are available for small businesses. One model that might work is that you maintain your data separately and migrate that part for the web to the web and that part for the bookkeeper to the bookkeeper. You can keep your data totally secure and manage your exports pretty securely. On Apr 21, 2007, at 3:34 AM, Robert Briley wrote: > Greetings Everyone, > > I am trying to set-up a small business and I need to meet a few > technology challenges.? The first is that I need to have an internet > presence complete with online ordering, and second that my bookkeeper > who will be helping me set up and monitor my finances is in another > city and we both should have access to the accounting and inventory > info. > > My plan at this point is to start off using Yahoo or one of the other > small business hosting services for ecommerce and and I will have to > flounder on the phone to the bookkeeper as I set-up and use > quickbooks.? But in the long-run I will probably be better off with a > web-based ERP package and perhaps some form of e-commerce software if > it is not built in.? Right now I am a one-man show and will probably > remain so for at least a year. I don't need anything fancy, but I > think an integrated and web-enabled? package will require less work > and maintenance in the long run.? At this point I have been looking at > SQL ledger, Tiny ERP and Compire.? > > I use to be a DBA, and I enjoy technology, but I need to focus on > getting things done with a minimum of hassle, and I don't have money > for a lot of consulting.? While any comments on the above scheme are > appreciated, I would most like to know 1) am I buying more or less > headaches by moving to a small ERP? ? 2) Do any of you have experince > with a web-based package that you could comment on for or against? > > Again, any insights will be appreciated. > > TIA? > -R > > > Robert > (415) 806-0705 > > "There is no precedent in any modern White House for what is going on > in this one: a complete lack of a policy apparatus," "What you've got > is everything - and I mean everything - being run by the political > arm." > John DiIulio, Original director of the office of faith-based > initiatives? > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? > Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. From david at sterryit.com Sat Apr 21 11:22:25 2007 From: david at sterryit.com (David Sterry) Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2007 11:22:25 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Small business automation and internet presence. In-Reply-To: <15283.93410.qm@web43142.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <15283.93410.qm@web43142.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <462A5661.5070308@sterryit.com> Hello Robert, I'm in a similar boat as yourself. I've been using something that I built myself using Access but wanted something web enabled that I could get to from a few different trusted computers and make the system accessible to partners/employees. What I found was that packages like Compiere and SugarCRM are pretty big and really too much for what I needed. I wanted something that I could get in a tweak mainly to do job time tracking and automated invoices. The best one I found was phpBMS. It's under active development and the coding by the developers has impressed me as I work with it. It's not a really mature project but it does quite a lot from a business operations standpoint. You can check out the online demo at phpbms.org. Since you'll likely be living with this system for a while, I'd advise going through every operation you can think of on a test setup of whatever packages you narrow down to. I'm currently doing a module for phpBMS that allows invoice line items to be entered over time and that will be automatically assembled into an invoice and emailed when the time is right. It's a good thing if you bill variable numbers of hours over time. Finally, once you decide to go live, definitely use SSL and .htaccess to secure it at a minimum. -Dave Robert Briley wrote: > Greetings Everyone, > > I am trying to set-up a small business and I need to meet a few technology challenges. The first is that I need to have an internet presence complete with online ordering, and second that my bookkeeper who will be helping me set up and monitor my finances is in another city and we both should have access to the accounting and inventory info. > > My plan at this point is to start off using Yahoo or one of the other small business hosting services for ecommerce and and I will have to flounder on the phone to the bookkeeper as I set-up and use quickbooks. But in the long-run I will probably be better off with a web-based ERP package and perhaps some form of e-commerce software if it is not built in. Right now I am a one-man show and will probably remain so for at least a year. I don't need anything fancy, but I think an integrated and web-enabled package will require less work and maintenance in the long run. At this point I have been looking at SQL ledger, Tiny ERP and Compire. > > I use to be a DBA, and I enjoy technology, but I need to focus on getting things done with a minimum of hassle, and I don't have money for a lot of consulting. While any comments on the above scheme are appreciated, I would most like to know 1) am I buying more or less headaches by moving to a small ERP? 2) Do any of you have experince with a web-based package that you could comment on for or against? > > Again, any insights will be appreciated. > > TIA > -R > > > Robert > (415) 806-0705 > > "There is no precedent in any modern White House for what is going on in this one: a complete lack of a policy apparatus," "What you've got is everything - and I mean everything - being run by the political arm." > John DiIulio, Original director of the office of faith-based initiatives > > > > --------------------------------- > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From usr.bin.sh at gmail.com Sun Apr 22 11:55:01 2007 From: usr.bin.sh at gmail.com (Usr Bin Sh) Date: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 11:55:01 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Small business automation and internet presence. Message-ID: <109760a70704221155l7cd1bf1q9f51779b150acff5@mail.gmail.com> > 1. Small business automation and internet presence. (Robert Briley) I'm not an expert for the Subj... But did you have a chance to try http://www.netsuite.com? -- Pavel From colinross at gmail.com Sun Apr 22 12:46:20 2007 From: colinross at gmail.com (Colin Ross) Date: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 12:46:20 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Sun solaris differences... In-Reply-To: <20070417230708.GH21603@linuxmafia.com> References: <20070417230708.GH21603@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: IIRC, Solaris 10 was the first to be RELEASED as open source. But thats more of a political difference. 10 was also when the JDS (Java Desktop System) was introduced. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solaris_Operating_Environment#Desktop_environments for more. c On 4/17/07, Rick Moen wrote: > > Quoting Peters, Ola (MSCIBARRA) (Ola.Peters at mscibarra.com): > > > Anyone out there that could help me?? > > Maybe a Solaris user group? > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Tue Apr 24 07:50:58 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 07:50:58 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com. box "rules of the road" / policies, etc. Message-ID: <1177426258.462e1952c419c@webmail.rawbw.com> Just a bit of a start (I plan to add more), but I put some of the information on the wiki. Feel free to correct anything that's incorrect, improve formatting/presentation, etc. http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box file://sf-lug.com/home/admin/ From bill at wards.net Tue Apr 24 17:04:44 2007 From: bill at wards.net (Bill Ward) Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 17:04:44 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] PenLUG this week - NEW LOCATION - "Linux Appliance Design" Message-ID: <3d2fe1780704241704v24e9297as199cd3c246588259@mail.gmail.com> The Peninsula Linux Users' Group has a new location and sponsor (Qualys) and we will be meeting this week on Thursday, April 26, 2007 at 7pm. New location, courtesy of Qualys: Bayshore Technology Park 1300 Island Drive Redwood Shores, CA 94065 Suite 108 - Boardroom I For directions and more information visit www.penlug.org If you plan to attend please send mail to rsvp at penlug.org (not required, but helps us to plan the meeting). If you need help finding a carpool partner send mail to carpool at penlug.org. Bob Smith and Bill Pierce, Linux Appliance Design Join us as Bob Smith and Bill Pierce, two of the authors of No Starch's book Linux Appliance Design describe the components used in the book's sample appliance. The talk will focus on what each appliance component does, why you might want the component in your appliance, how the component ties to the other components, and how to install and configure the component. A partial list of the components to be covered includes: * Appliance architecture * Run-Time-Access: How to talk to a running daemon * Two ways to use logging to respond to appliance events * A sample front panel interface * How to use AJAX to build an event triggered web interface * Framebuffer and LIRC interfaces * A command line interface * An SNMP interface You can preview the book's table of contents and examine the underlying technologies at the book's Web site. Copies of Linux Appliance Design will be given out as door prizes, and also available for purchase for $30 per copy (half price). Bob Smith and Bill Pierce have experience in embedded systems, commercial Linux appliances, and network management systems. Bob has contributed several articles to The Linux Gazette and frequents comp.os.linux.embedded. Bill built the bootable CD that comes with book and did the framebuffer and LIRC chapters. This message is being sent to PenLUG, SVLUG, SFLUG, BALUG, and BayLISA. Please feel free to forward to any and all interested parties. Not CC'ing Conspire/CABAL due to list policy on cross-posting. From jim at well.com Tue Apr 24 18:39:10 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 18:39:10 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: [Baypiggies] BASS Meeting (SF), Wed. April 25 Message-ID: <2ae624a873a321f60092005e99b13685@well.com> I think this used to have a perl focus and now is more general. This Wednesday night for those who're interested Begin forwarded message: > From: Rich Morin > Date: April 24, 2007 5:06:50 PM PDT > To: ba-rb at yahoogroups.com, san-francisco-ruby at googlegroups.com, > baypiggies at python.org, sanfrancisco-pm at pm.org > Subject: [Baypiggies] BASS Meeting (SF), Wed. April 25 > > The Beer and Scripting SIG rides again! If you'd like to > eat good Italian food, chat with other local scripters, > and possibly take a look at laptop-demoed scripting hacks, > this is the place to do it! > > For your convenience, here are the critical details: > > Date: Wednesday, April 25, 2007 (4th. Wed.) > Time: 8:00 pm > Place: Pasquales Pizzeria > 701 Irving St. (At 8th. Ave.) > San Francisco, California, USA > 415/661-2140 > > -r > -- > http://www.cfcl.com/rdm Rich Morin > http://www.cfcl.com/rdm/resume rdm at cfcl.com > http://www.cfcl.com/rdm/weblog +1 650-873-7841 > > Technical editing and writing, programming, and web development > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Wed Apr 25 07:39:18 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 07:39:18 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", policies, etc. In-Reply-To: <1177426258.462e1952c419c@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <1177426258.462e1952c419c@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1177511958.462f681692e5d@webmail.rawbw.com> sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", policies, etc. Still documenting more, but a few questions along the way ... appropriate outage notification and out-of-band status page? We earlier discussed outages, planned outages, etc. Even have a place to document that further (http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:appropriate_outage_notification on http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box). Two particular items/questions occurred to me regarding that. First of all, for planned outages, *who* do we want to notify, and *how* do we want to notify them? Might that also depend on circumstances, nature of outage (whole box down, or just some important service(s)), duration and timing? Would we want to: * do a wall on the system * edit /etc/motd and/or /etc/issue * e-mail the "pagermonkeys" on the box * e-mail the sf-lug list * and/or other? and do we want to come up with "rules" (/guidelines) on what method(s) should be used under what circumstances? Also out-of-band status page? It would be potentially very useful to have some out-of-band (independent of that box, and preferably also independent of that colo) status/notification page. E.g. it can be highly useful to have an independent web page (could just be a wiki web page somewhere) that indicates some status information (most notably if/when any unexpected outage occurs - to indicate status and estimate/guestimate on return to service, but also a place for folks to look during scheduled outages - such as if they didn't know in advance about the outage). E.g. rather like: out-of-band status page: http://lambdamoo.blogspot.com/ for status of: telnet://lambda.moo.mud.org.:8888 Hardware documentation? Although it's possible to use standard LINUX/CentOS tools to get some information on the hardware (e.g. CPU, disk sizes, some bits of chipset information here and there), could someone document the hardware details - e.g. make and model of the system, any particular details of hardware/options installed, etc. Having such information known (and documented!) could come in rather to quite handy in troubleshooting any items that may be hardware related, planning certain optimizations and potential upgrades, etc. If someone is able to at least provide the basic hardware information, we could probably get that up on a wiki page, including hunting down relevant reference information (e.g. links to more detailed hardware specifications for particular make/model of items identified). More documentation/log stuff ... I started two log files on the box - feel free to have a look at the /home/admin/log* files (most notably /home/admin/log). The general idea there is human readable (and fairly searchable by date, or other criteria) log of system changes made, issues/bugs noted/corrected, etc. Most notably the idea here is to keep lots of less details regarding such off of and from piling up ad nauseum on wiki pages (could eventually get quite long), and it's also often much easier to drop information straight into flat file or copy/paste from such, and not have to worry about wiki formatting goop and how to get something to render as plain text. The wiki pages are probably much more suitable for more general documentation (e.g. policies, how-to, etc.) - such as things likely to be revised over time (as opposed to continually appended to and not as likely to be of more general interest). For a bit more of an idea, have a look at /home/admin/log - it's already up to 82 lines - and that's just covering a bit of usage/syntax, and noting and dealing with a few minor issues. As I noted, such can get quite long (e.g. on my two home systems, the equivalent file I maintain on each have grown to be in excess of 10,000 lines long (not that we have to be *that* detailed on the sf-lug.com. box - on my home systems, I log, for example, all package additions/removals/upgrades - including package version information, bugs and hardware issues/problems encountered, hardware changes, etc.; capturing/noting at least more noteworthy changes/issues for the sf-lug.com. box would probably be a good thing.)). Code of ethics? Should we add to the "rules of the road" / policy something indicating an appropriate code of ethics? The more experienced systems administrators likely think such would be quite applicable anyway, but, most notably for those that may be much newer to the field, explicitly noting, or at least referencing such, would help call attention to such, introduce such to those not already familiar with such, and help develop and foster appropriate professionalism. E.g. could add something roughly like: " Users of the system, and most notably systems administrators and any other persons with any type of privileged access to the system, should exercise appropriate professionalism and follow appropriate code of ethics, e.g. the LOPSA/SAGE/USENIX code of ethics: http://www.sage.org/ethics/ethics.html http://lopsa.org/CodeOfEthics " Quoting Michael Paoli: > Just a bit of a start (I plan to add more), but I put some of the > information on the wiki. Feel free to correct anything that's incorrect, > improve formatting/presentation, etc. > > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box > file://sf-lug.com/home/admin/ From jim at well.com Wed Apr 25 08:46:32 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 08:46:32 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", policies, etc. In-Reply-To: <1177511958.462f681692e5d@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <1177426258.462e1952c419c@webmail.rawbw.com> <1177511958.462f681692e5d@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <1f512baf65497128050331a403b714cf@well.com> i've got a very busy day today, hence a brief reply: * thanks lots! great note. * nathan, michael, jim are box janitors; one more from balug would be good. I, jim, am willing to be first responder to go down there if need be. * out-of-band could be on circle (sf-lug.org). * I'll doc the hardware (I bought the box, what the hey). On Apr 25, 2007, at 7:39 AM, Michael Paoli wrote: > sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", > policies, etc. > Still documenting more, but a few questions along the way ... > > appropriate outage notification and out-of-band status page? > We earlier discussed outages, planned outages, etc. > Even have a place to document that further > (http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > appropriate_outage_notification > on > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box). > Two particular items/questions occurred to me regarding that. > First of all, for planned outages, *who* do we want to notify, > and *how* do we want to notify them? Might that also depend on > circumstances, nature of outage (whole box down, or just some > important service(s)), duration and timing? Would we want to: > * do a wall on the system > * edit /etc/motd and/or /etc/issue > * e-mail the "pagermonkeys" on the box > * e-mail the sf-lug list > * and/or other? > and do we want to come up with "rules" (/guidelines) on what method(s) > should be used under what circumstances? > Also out-of-band status page? It would be potentially very useful to > have some out-of-band (independent of that box, and preferably also > independent of that colo) status/notification page. E.g. it can be > highly useful to have an independent web page (could just be a wiki web > page somewhere) that indicates some status information (most notably > if/when any unexpected outage occurs - to indicate status and > estimate/guestimate on return to service, but also a place for folks to > look during scheduled outages - such as if they didn't know in advance > about the outage). E.g. rather like: > out-of-band status page: > http://lambdamoo.blogspot.com/ > for status of: > telnet://lambda.moo.mud.org.:8888 > > Hardware documentation? > Although it's possible to use standard LINUX/CentOS tools to get some > information on the hardware (e.g. CPU, disk sizes, some bits of > chipset information here and there), could someone document the > hardware details - e.g. make and model of the system, any particular > details of hardware/options installed, etc. Having such information > known (and documented!) could come in rather to quite handy in > troubleshooting any items that may be hardware related, planning > certain optimizations and potential upgrades, etc. If someone is > able to at least provide the basic hardware information, we could > probably get that up on a wiki page, including hunting down relevant > reference information (e.g. links to more detailed hardware > specifications for particular make/model of items identified). > > More documentation/log stuff ... > I started two log files on the box - feel free to have a look at > the /home/admin/log* files (most notably /home/admin/log). The > general idea there is human readable > (and fairly searchable by date, or other criteria) log of system > changes > made, issues/bugs noted/corrected, etc. Most notably the idea here is > to keep lots of less details regarding such off of and from > piling up ad nauseum on wiki pages (could eventually get quite long), > and it's also often much easier to drop information straight into flat > file or copy/paste from such, and not have to worry about wiki > formatting goop and how to get something to render as plain text. > The wiki pages are probably much more suitable for more general > documentation (e.g. policies, how-to, etc.) - such as things likely to > be revised over time (as opposed to continually appended to and not as > likely to be of more general interest). For a bit more of an idea, > have a look at /home/admin/log - it's already up to 82 lines - and > that's just covering a bit of usage/syntax, and noting and dealing with > a few minor issues. As I noted, such can get quite long (e.g. on my > two > home systems, the equivalent file I maintain on each have grown to be > in excess of 10,000 lines long (not that we have to be *that* detailed > on the sf-lug.com. box - on my home systems, I log, for example, all > package additions/removals/upgrades - including package version > information, bugs and hardware issues/problems encountered, hardware > changes, etc.; capturing/noting at least more noteworthy changes/issues > for the sf-lug.com. box would probably be a good thing.)). > > Code of ethics? Should we add to the "rules of the road" / policy > something indicating an appropriate code of ethics? The more > experienced systems administrators likely think such would be quite > applicable anyway, but, most notably for those that may be much newer > to > the field, explicitly noting, or at least referencing such, would help > call attention to such, introduce such to those not already familiar > with such, and help develop and foster appropriate professionalism. > E.g. could add something roughly like: > " > Users of the system, and most notably systems administrators and any > other persons with any type of privileged access to the system, should > exercise appropriate professionalism and follow appropriate code of > ethics, > e.g. the LOPSA/SAGE/USENIX code of ethics: > http://www.sage.org/ethics/ethics.html > http://lopsa.org/CodeOfEthics > " > > Quoting Michael Paoli: > >> Just a bit of a start (I plan to add more), but I put some of the >> information on the wiki. Feel free to correct anything that's >> incorrect, >> improve formatting/presentation, etc. >> >> http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php >> > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box >> file://sf-lug.com/home/admin/ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From jim at well.com Thu Apr 26 14:04:44 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 14:04:44 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Need San Francisco volunteers on May 8th and 10th Message-ID: Begin forwarded message: > From: Deborah Nicholson > Date: April 26, 2007 8:32:17 AM PDT > To: info-member at gnu.org > Subject: Need San Francisco volunteers on May 8th and 10th > Reply-To: membership at fsf.org > > Hi, > The Free Software Foundation is going to have a table at an event in > San > Francisco on May 8th and May 10th. I'm writing because we need > volunteers to help run the table. The conference will be right in the > center of downtown at Market and 3rd. > > Talking to folks at tech conferences is a great way to help spread the > word about free software and a great way to help us increase our > membership base. And as it turns out, it's also fun! > > For this particular event we only have so many passes so I'd love to > find a volunteer who is willing to do either one whole day (or close to > it) or either both mornings or both afternoons. I'll be at the table > with you, so we'll be able to switch off for lunch. > > Here are the times: > Tuesday May 8th > 11:30-7:00 > > Thursday May 10th > 11:30-4:00 > > Let me know if you have any questions. > See you in San Francisco! > Thanks! > Deborah > > > > _______________________________________________ > Info-member mailing list > > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/info-member > From aldenm at gmail.com Thu Apr 26 11:05:00 2007 From: aldenm at gmail.com (Alden Meneses) Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 11:05:00 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] server options Message-ID: <221610dc0704261105q5590c7fao603873aeada889a5@mail.gmail.com> I am getting ready to purchase some equipment to build a server to act as a file repository and development/web sandbox but wanted to get your opinions on what sort of OS I will settle on. I need something stable and being a newbie easy to learn. I was thinking of the following OS - UBUNTU server, Solaris 10, and Debian. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Fri Apr 27 10:14:18 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 10:14:18 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] server options In-Reply-To: <221610dc0704261105q5590c7fao603873aeada889a5@mail.gmail.com> References: <221610dc0704261105q5590c7fao603873aeada889a5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: For newbies, Ubuntu seems to be a popularly approved choice. Seems to me the key points are good device driver support and some limits to keep newbies from driving into ditches. I like Red Hat, which means Fedora or CentOS, mainly because it seems still to have the best support in terms of books and online documentation and local gurus. Debian, I'm told, is not for newbies. There's a very good book, Debian System, Concepts and Techniques, by Martin Krafft (No Starch Press), that includes a Debian DVD (sarge, I believe). The most lauded Debian feature is updating-- it's easy to get updates as the package manager does a good job of addressing dependencies. Seems to me that you should investigate your pool of geek pals--who's available to help you and will keep their commitments to stick out the tough parts. If you don't have any geek pals, I'd say develop some (in this and in other groups) before you commit seriously to systems. Also, don't let anything stop you, get going now. It shouldn't matter which OS you use as you're certain to do things badly at first--get something, cut your teeth, re-do it, cut more teeth, get pals involved, and at some point you'll be ready to set up system that works as you want it to. My guess is won't take you long, judging from your email. On Apr 26, 2007, at 11:05 AM, Alden Meneses wrote: > I am getting ready to purchase some equipment to build a server to act > as a file repository and development/web sandbox but wanted to get > your opinions on what sort of OS I will settle on. I need something > stable and being a newbie easy to learn. > ? > I was thinking of the following OS - UBUNTU server, Solaris 10, and > Debian._______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From sverma at sfsu.edu Fri Apr 27 10:32:41 2007 From: sverma at sfsu.edu (Sameer Verma) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 10:32:41 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] [Fwd: [svlug] Andrew Morton Talk] Message-ID: <463233B9.9070903@sfsu.edu> FYI -- Dr. Sameer Verma, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Information Systems San Francisco State University San Francisco CA 94132 USA http://verma.sfsu.edu/ http://opensource.sfsu.edu/ -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: "Leslie Hawthorn" Subject: [svlug] Andrew Morton Talk Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 15:42:01 -0700 Size: 5931 URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Fri Apr 27 10:51:13 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 10:51:13 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] server options In-Reply-To: References: <221610dc0704261105q5590c7fao603873aeada889a5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20070427175113.GB10586@linuxmafia.com> Quoting jim stockford (jim at well.com): > The most lauded Debian feature is... ...policy. http://www.advogato.org/article/169.html (The autoupdating and dependency-checking _software_ of popular distributions tends to be about equally capable. However, how well it works in practice over time depends much less on the tools than on enforcement of a coherent distro policy.) My advice to our correspondent is: http://linuxmafia.com/~rick/faq/index.php?page=kicking#distro From jim at well.com Fri Apr 27 11:55:47 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 11:55:47 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", policies, etc. In-Reply-To: <1177511958.462f681692e5d@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <1177426258.462e1952c419c@webmail.rawbw.com> <1177511958.462f681692e5d@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <0d36f1d006444e217cd7f48a5205bb89@well.com> my tho'ts interspersed within: On Apr 25, 2007, at 7:39 AM, Michael Paoli wrote: > sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", > policies, etc. > Still documenting more, but a few questions along the way ... > > appropriate outage notification and out-of-band status page? > We earlier discussed outages, planned outages, etc. > Even have a place to document that further > (http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > appropriate_outage_notification > on > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box). > Two particular items/questions occurred to me regarding that. > First of all, for planned outages, *who* do we want to notify, jim at well.com # nathan and michael may wish to add their names to this list > and *how* do we want to notify them? email seems best. > Might that also depend on > circumstances, nature of outage (whole box down, or just some > important service(s)), duration and timing? Anything that seems amiss, no need to classify at this point. > Would we want to: > * do a wall on the system probably not necessary. > * edit /etc/motd and/or /etc/issue yes in the case of on-going fixes and updates. > * e-mail the "pagermonkeys" on the box yes. > * e-mail the sf-lug list probably not. > * and/or other? > and do we want to come up with "rules" (/guidelines) on what method(s) > should be used under what circumstances? the above seems sufficient to me. > Also out-of-band status page? It would be potentially very useful to > have some out-of-band (independent of that box, and preferably also > independent of that colo) status/notification page. E.g. it can be > highly useful to have an independent web page (could just be a wiki web > page somewhere) that indicates some status information (most notably > if/when any unexpected outage occurs - to indicate status and > estimate/guestimate on return to service, but also a place for folks to > look during scheduled outages - such as if they didn't know in advance > about the outage). E.g. rather like: > out-of-band status page: > http://lambdamoo.blogspot.com/ > for status of: > telnet://lambda.moo.mud.org.:8888 i suggest sf-lug.org which is hosted by circlesoft.com I am struggling to figure out whether I want an internet presence coming out of my home, way out at the beach fed by corroded overloaded telephone wires and no possible higher speed than lowest DSL. If I decide so, that would be an additional external resource. > Hardware documentation? > Although it's possible to use standard LINUX/CentOS tools to get some > information on the hardware (e.g. CPU, disk sizes, some bits of > chipset information here and there), could someone document the > hardware details - e.g. make and model of the system, any particular > details of hardware/options installed, etc. Having such information > known (and documented!) could come in rather to quite handy in > troubleshooting any items that may be hardware related, planning > certain optimizations and potential upgrades, etc. If someone is > able to at least provide the basic hardware information, we could > probably get that up on a wiki page, including hunting down relevant > reference information (e.g. links to more detailed hardware > specifications for particular make/model of items identified). i volunteer to do this given that I own the box. I'll have to go down there. Anybody want to come visit the box in its colo environment? > More documentation/log stuff ... > I started two log files on the box - feel free to have a look at > the /home/admin/log* files (most notably /home/admin/log). The > general idea there is human readable > (and fairly searchable by date, or other criteria) log of system > changes > made, issues/bugs noted/corrected, etc. Most notably the idea here is > to keep lots of less details regarding such off of and from > piling up ad nauseum on wiki pages (could eventually get quite long), > and it's also often much easier to drop information straight into flat > file or copy/paste from such, and not have to worry about wiki > formatting goop and how to get something to render as plain text. strong agreement. Permissions for /home/admin currently are 755 for root owner, root group, unwashed. Ergo only root can make changes, all can read. Is that best? What about an admin group such that permissions are 775 root owner, admin group, unwashed. This allows a group of administrators that may not have su - privileges. Current permissions assume administrators su - (which is okay by me, just bringing it up). > The wiki pages are probably much more suitable for more general > documentation (e.g. policies, how-to, etc.) - such as things likely to > be revised over time (as opposed to continually appended to and not as > likely to be of more general interest). seems right. For http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box I suggest revising the existing wiki text bullet points under the Objectives section to be * support command-line activities of users. * provide an educational playground for users who want to explore using Unix. * support web pages for users. * support web pages and activities of a Red Hat Certification study group. * support web pages and activities of users learning the Python programming language. * support other open-source focussed community groups. > For a bit more of an idea, > have a look at /home/admin/log - it's already up to 82 lines - and > that's just covering a bit of usage/syntax, and noting and dealing with > a few minor issues. As I noted, such can get quite long (e.g. on my > two > home systems, the equivalent file I maintain on each have grown to be > in excess of 10,000 lines long (not that we have to be *that* detailed > on the sf-lug.com. box - on my home systems, I log, for example, all > package additions/removals/upgrades - including package version > information, bugs and hardware issues/problems encountered, hardware > changes, etc.; capturing/noting at least more noteworthy changes/issues > for the sf-lug.com. box would probably be a good thing.)). I think /home/admin/log* files are outstanding! I hope the administrators will follow the style. > Code of ethics? Should we add to the "rules of the road" / policy > something indicating an appropriate code of ethics? The more > experienced systems administrators likely think such would be quite > applicable anyway, but, most notably for those that may be much newer > to > the field, explicitly noting, or at least referencing such, would help > call attention to such, introduce such to those not already familiar > with such, and help develop and foster appropriate professionalism. > E.g. could add something roughly like: > " > Users of the system, and most notably systems administrators and any > other persons with any type of privileged access to the system, should > exercise appropriate professionalism and follow appropriate code of > ethics, > e.g. the LOPSA/SAGE/USENIX code of ethics: > http://www.sage.org/ethics/ethics.html > http://lopsa.org/CodeOfEthics > " don't like the word "professional*". How about "...access to the system should follow the code of ethics described in: " > Quoting Michael Paoli: > >> Just a bit of a start (I plan to add more), but I put some of the >> information on the wiki. Feel free to correct anything that's >> incorrect, >> improve formatting/presentation, etc. >> >> http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php >> > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box >> file://sf-lug.com/home/admin/ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From aldenm at gmail.com Fri Apr 27 13:16:33 2007 From: aldenm at gmail.com (Alden Meneses) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 13:16:33 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", policies, etc. In-Reply-To: <0d36f1d006444e217cd7f48a5205bb89@well.com> References: <1177426258.462e1952c419c@webmail.rawbw.com> <1177511958.462f681692e5d@webmail.rawbw.com> <0d36f1d006444e217cd7f48a5205bb89@well.com> Message-ID: <221610dc0704271316x2f1e0814k42d68a7f6c8f98f8@mail.gmail.com> Ever hear of ITIL? Maybe we can use that standard to base the "rules of the road"? Just a thought. On 4/27/07, jim stockford wrote: > > > my tho'ts interspersed within: > > On Apr 25, 2007, at 7:39 AM, Michael Paoli wrote: > > > sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", > > policies, etc. > > Still documenting more, but a few questions along the way ... > > > > appropriate outage notification and out-of-band status page? > > We earlier discussed outages, planned outages, etc. > > Even have a place to document that further > > (http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > > appropriate_outage_notification > > on > > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box). > > Two particular items/questions occurred to me regarding that. > > First of all, for planned outages, *who* do we want to notify, > jim at well.com > # nathan and michael may wish to add their names to this list > > > and *how* do we want to notify them? > email seems best. > > > Might that also depend on > > circumstances, nature of outage (whole box down, or just some > > important service(s)), duration and timing? > Anything that seems amiss, no need to classify at this point. > > > Would we want to: > > * do a wall on the system > probably not necessary. > > * edit /etc/motd and/or /etc/issue > yes in the case of on-going fixes and updates. > > * e-mail the "pagermonkeys" on the box > yes. > > * e-mail the sf-lug list > probably not. > > * and/or other? > > and do we want to come up with "rules" (/guidelines) on what method(s) > > should be used under what circumstances? > the above seems sufficient to me. > > > Also out-of-band status page? It would be potentially very useful to > > have some out-of-band (independent of that box, and preferably also > > independent of that colo) status/notification page. E.g. it can be > > highly useful to have an independent web page (could just be a wiki web > > page somewhere) that indicates some status information (most notably > > if/when any unexpected outage occurs - to indicate status and > > estimate/guestimate on return to service, but also a place for folks to > > look during scheduled outages - such as if they didn't know in advance > > about the outage). E.g. rather like: > > out-of-band status page: > > http://lambdamoo.blogspot.com/ > > for status of: > > telnet://lambda.moo.mud.org.:8888 > i suggest sf-lug.org which is hosted by circlesoft.com > > I am struggling to figure out whether I want an internet > presence coming out of my home, way out at the beach > fed by corroded overloaded telephone wires and no > possible higher speed than lowest DSL. If I decide so, > that would be an additional external resource. > > > Hardware documentation? > > Although it's possible to use standard LINUX/CentOS tools to get some > > information on the hardware (e.g. CPU, disk sizes, some bits of > > chipset information here and there), could someone document the > > hardware details - e.g. make and model of the system, any particular > > details of hardware/options installed, etc. Having such information > > known (and documented!) could come in rather to quite handy in > > troubleshooting any items that may be hardware related, planning > > certain optimizations and potential upgrades, etc. If someone is > > able to at least provide the basic hardware information, we could > > probably get that up on a wiki page, including hunting down relevant > > reference information (e.g. links to more detailed hardware > > specifications for particular make/model of items identified). > i volunteer to do this given that I own the box. I'll have > to go down there. Anybody want to come visit the box > in its colo environment? > > > More documentation/log stuff ... > > I started two log files on the box - feel free to have a look at > > the /home/admin/log* files (most notably /home/admin/log). The > > general idea there is human readable > > (and fairly searchable by date, or other criteria) log of system > > changes > > made, issues/bugs noted/corrected, etc. Most notably the idea here is > > to keep lots of less details regarding such off of and from > > piling up ad nauseum on wiki pages (could eventually get quite long), > > and it's also often much easier to drop information straight into flat > > file or copy/paste from such, and not have to worry about wiki > > formatting goop and how to get something to render as plain text. > strong agreement. Permissions for /home/admin currently are > 755 for root owner, root group, unwashed. Ergo only root can > make changes, all can read. Is that best? > What about an admin group such that permissions are > 775 root owner, admin group, unwashed. This allows a > group of administrators that may not have su - privileges. > Current permissions assume administrators su - (which is > okay by me, just bringing it up). > > > The wiki pages are probably much more suitable for more general > > documentation (e.g. policies, how-to, etc.) - such as things likely to > > be revised over time (as opposed to continually appended to and not as > > likely to be of more general interest). > seems right. For > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box > > I suggest revising the existing wiki text bullet points under > the Objectives section to be > * support command-line activities of users. > * provide an educational playground for users who want to explore using > Unix. > * support web pages for users. > * support web pages and activities of a Red Hat Certification study > group. > * support web pages and activities of users learning the Python > programming language. > * support other open-source focussed community groups. > > > > For a bit more of an idea, > > have a look at /home/admin/log - it's already up to 82 lines - and > > that's just covering a bit of usage/syntax, and noting and dealing with > > a few minor issues. As I noted, such can get quite long (e.g. on my > > two > > home systems, the equivalent file I maintain on each have grown to be > > in excess of 10,000 lines long (not that we have to be *that* detailed > > on the sf-lug.com. box - on my home systems, I log, for example, all > > package additions/removals/upgrades - including package version > > information, bugs and hardware issues/problems encountered, hardware > > changes, etc.; capturing/noting at least more noteworthy changes/issues > > for the sf-lug.com. box would probably be a good thing.)). > I think /home/admin/log* files are outstanding! > I hope the administrators will follow the style. > > > Code of ethics? Should we add to the "rules of the road" / policy > > something indicating an appropriate code of ethics? The more > > experienced systems administrators likely think such would be quite > > applicable anyway, but, most notably for those that may be much newer > > to > > the field, explicitly noting, or at least referencing such, would help > > call attention to such, introduce such to those not already familiar > > with such, and help develop and foster appropriate professionalism. > > E.g. could add something roughly like: > > " > > Users of the system, and most notably systems administrators and any > > other persons with any type of privileged access to the system, should > > exercise appropriate professionalism and follow appropriate code of > > ethics, > > e.g. the LOPSA/SAGE/USENIX code of ethics: > > http://www.sage.org/ethics/ethics.html > > http://lopsa.org/CodeOfEthics > > " > don't like the word "professional*". How about > "...access to the system should follow the code of ethics described in: > " > > > Quoting Michael Paoli: > > > >> Just a bit of a start (I plan to add more), but I put some of the > >> information on the wiki. Feel free to correct anything that's > >> incorrect, > >> improve formatting/presentation, etc. > >> > >> http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php > >> > > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box > >> file://sf-lug.com/home/admin/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aldenm at gmail.com Fri Apr 27 13:16:33 2007 From: aldenm at gmail.com (Alden Meneses) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 13:16:33 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", policies, etc. In-Reply-To: <0d36f1d006444e217cd7f48a5205bb89@well.com> References: <1177426258.462e1952c419c@webmail.rawbw.com> <1177511958.462f681692e5d@webmail.rawbw.com> <0d36f1d006444e217cd7f48a5205bb89@well.com> Message-ID: <221610dc0704271316x2f1e0814k42d68a7f6c8f98f8@mail.gmail.com> Ever hear of ITIL? Maybe we can use that standard to base the "rules of the road"? Just a thought. On 4/27/07, jim stockford wrote: > > > my tho'ts interspersed within: > > On Apr 25, 2007, at 7:39 AM, Michael Paoli wrote: > > > sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", > > policies, etc. > > Still documenting more, but a few questions along the way ... > > > > appropriate outage notification and out-of-band status page? > > We earlier discussed outages, planned outages, etc. > > Even have a place to document that further > > (http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > > appropriate_outage_notification > > on > > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box). > > Two particular items/questions occurred to me regarding that. > > First of all, for planned outages, *who* do we want to notify, > jim at well.com > # nathan and michael may wish to add their names to this list > > > and *how* do we want to notify them? > email seems best. > > > Might that also depend on > > circumstances, nature of outage (whole box down, or just some > > important service(s)), duration and timing? > Anything that seems amiss, no need to classify at this point. > > > Would we want to: > > * do a wall on the system > probably not necessary. > > * edit /etc/motd and/or /etc/issue > yes in the case of on-going fixes and updates. > > * e-mail the "pagermonkeys" on the box > yes. > > * e-mail the sf-lug list > probably not. > > * and/or other? > > and do we want to come up with "rules" (/guidelines) on what method(s) > > should be used under what circumstances? > the above seems sufficient to me. > > > Also out-of-band status page? It would be potentially very useful to > > have some out-of-band (independent of that box, and preferably also > > independent of that colo) status/notification page. E.g. it can be > > highly useful to have an independent web page (could just be a wiki web > > page somewhere) that indicates some status information (most notably > > if/when any unexpected outage occurs - to indicate status and > > estimate/guestimate on return to service, but also a place for folks to > > look during scheduled outages - such as if they didn't know in advance > > about the outage). E.g. rather like: > > out-of-band status page: > > http://lambdamoo.blogspot.com/ > > for status of: > > telnet://lambda.moo.mud.org.:8888 > i suggest sf-lug.org which is hosted by circlesoft.com > > I am struggling to figure out whether I want an internet > presence coming out of my home, way out at the beach > fed by corroded overloaded telephone wires and no > possible higher speed than lowest DSL. If I decide so, > that would be an additional external resource. > > > Hardware documentation? > > Although it's possible to use standard LINUX/CentOS tools to get some > > information on the hardware (e.g. CPU, disk sizes, some bits of > > chipset information here and there), could someone document the > > hardware details - e.g. make and model of the system, any particular > > details of hardware/options installed, etc. Having such information > > known (and documented!) could come in rather to quite handy in > > troubleshooting any items that may be hardware related, planning > > certain optimizations and potential upgrades, etc. If someone is > > able to at least provide the basic hardware information, we could > > probably get that up on a wiki page, including hunting down relevant > > reference information (e.g. links to more detailed hardware > > specifications for particular make/model of items identified). > i volunteer to do this given that I own the box. I'll have > to go down there. Anybody want to come visit the box > in its colo environment? > > > More documentation/log stuff ... > > I started two log files on the box - feel free to have a look at > > the /home/admin/log* files (most notably /home/admin/log). The > > general idea there is human readable > > (and fairly searchable by date, or other criteria) log of system > > changes > > made, issues/bugs noted/corrected, etc. Most notably the idea here is > > to keep lots of less details regarding such off of and from > > piling up ad nauseum on wiki pages (could eventually get quite long), > > and it's also often much easier to drop information straight into flat > > file or copy/paste from such, and not have to worry about wiki > > formatting goop and how to get something to render as plain text. > strong agreement. Permissions for /home/admin currently are > 755 for root owner, root group, unwashed. Ergo only root can > make changes, all can read. Is that best? > What about an admin group such that permissions are > 775 root owner, admin group, unwashed. This allows a > group of administrators that may not have su - privileges. > Current permissions assume administrators su - (which is > okay by me, just bringing it up). > > > The wiki pages are probably much more suitable for more general > > documentation (e.g. policies, how-to, etc.) - such as things likely to > > be revised over time (as opposed to continually appended to and not as > > likely to be of more general interest). > seems right. For > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box > > I suggest revising the existing wiki text bullet points under > the Objectives section to be > * support command-line activities of users. > * provide an educational playground for users who want to explore using > Unix. > * support web pages for users. > * support web pages and activities of a Red Hat Certification study > group. > * support web pages and activities of users learning the Python > programming language. > * support other open-source focussed community groups. > > > > For a bit more of an idea, > > have a look at /home/admin/log - it's already up to 82 lines - and > > that's just covering a bit of usage/syntax, and noting and dealing with > > a few minor issues. As I noted, such can get quite long (e.g. on my > > two > > home systems, the equivalent file I maintain on each have grown to be > > in excess of 10,000 lines long (not that we have to be *that* detailed > > on the sf-lug.com. box - on my home systems, I log, for example, all > > package additions/removals/upgrades - including package version > > information, bugs and hardware issues/problems encountered, hardware > > changes, etc.; capturing/noting at least more noteworthy changes/issues > > for the sf-lug.com. box would probably be a good thing.)). > I think /home/admin/log* files are outstanding! > I hope the administrators will follow the style. > > > Code of ethics? Should we add to the "rules of the road" / policy > > something indicating an appropriate code of ethics? The more > > experienced systems administrators likely think such would be quite > > applicable anyway, but, most notably for those that may be much newer > > to > > the field, explicitly noting, or at least referencing such, would help > > call attention to such, introduce such to those not already familiar > > with such, and help develop and foster appropriate professionalism. > > E.g. could add something roughly like: > > " > > Users of the system, and most notably systems administrators and any > > other persons with any type of privileged access to the system, should > > exercise appropriate professionalism and follow appropriate code of > > ethics, > > e.g. the LOPSA/SAGE/USENIX code of ethics: > > http://www.sage.org/ethics/ethics.html > > http://lopsa.org/CodeOfEthics > > " > don't like the word "professional*". How about > "...access to the system should follow the code of ethics described in: > " > > > Quoting Michael Paoli: > > > >> Just a bit of a start (I plan to add more), but I put some of the > >> information on the wiki. Feel free to correct anything that's > >> incorrect, > >> improve formatting/presentation, etc. > >> > >> http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php > >> > > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: > > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box > >> file://sf-lug.com/home/admin/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Fri Apr 27 16:22:34 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 16:22:34 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", policies, etc. In-Reply-To: <221610dc0704271316x2f1e0814k42d68a7f6c8f98f8@mail.gmail.com> References: <1177426258.462e1952c419c@webmail.rawbw.com> <1177511958.462f681692e5d@webmail.rawbw.com> <0d36f1d006444e217cd7f48a5205bb89@well.com> <221610dc0704271316x2f1e0814k42d68a7f6c8f98f8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1bd5332a8804e9a70dbcc0505e9bfa8c@well.com> No, not until now, and thanks. It's big. Seems a good point of reference. Opinions? On Apr 27, 2007, at 1:16 PM, Alden Meneses wrote: > Ever hear of ITIL? Maybe we can use that standard to base the "rules > of the road"? Just a thought. > > On 4/27/07, jim stockford wrote: >> my tho'ts interspersed within: >> >> On Apr 25, 2007, at 7:39 AM, Michael Paoli wrote: >> >> > sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", >> > policies, etc. >> > Still documenting more, but a few questions along the way ... >> > >> > appropriate outage notification and out-of-band status page? >> > We earlier discussed outages, planned outages, etc. >> > Even have a place to document that further >> > (http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: >> > appropriate_outage_notification >> > on >> > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: >> > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box). >> > Two particular items/questions occurred to me regarding that. >> > First of all, for planned outages, *who* do we want to notify, >> jim at well.com >> # nathan and michael may wish to add their names to this list >> >> > and *how* do we want to notify them? >> email seems best. >> >> > Might that also depend on >> > circumstances, nature of outage (whole box down, or just some >> > important service(s)), duration and timing? >> Anything that seems amiss, no need to classify at this point. >> >> > Would we want to: >> > * do a wall on the system >> probably not necessary. >> > * edit /etc/motd and/or /etc/issue >> yes in the case of on-going fixes and updates. >> > * e-mail the "pagermonkeys" on the box >> yes. >> > * e-mail the sf-lug list >> probably not. >> > * and/or other? >> > and do we want to come up with "rules" (/guidelines) on what >> method(s) >> > should be used under what circumstances? >> the above seems sufficient to me. >> >> > Also out-of-band status page???It would be potentially very useful >> to >> > have some out-of-band (independent of that box, and preferably also >> > independent of that colo) status/notification page.?? E.g. it can be >> > highly useful to have an independent web page (could just be a wiki >> web >> > page somewhere) that indicates some status information (most notably >> > if/when any unexpected outage occurs - to indicate status and >> > estimate/guestimate on return to service, but also a place for >> folks to >> > look during scheduled outages - such as if they didn't know in >> advance >> > about the outage).??E.g. rather like: >> > out-of-band status page: >> > http://lambdamoo.blogspot.com/ >> > for status of: >> > telnet://lambda.moo.mud.org.:8888 >> i suggest sf-lug.org which is hosted by circlesoft.com >> >> I am struggling to figure out whether I want an internet >> presence coming out of my home, way out at the beach >> fed by corroded overloaded telephone wires and no >> possible higher speed than lowest DSL. If I decide so, >> that would be an additional external resource. >> >> > Hardware documentation? >> > Although it's possible to use standard LINUX/CentOS tools to get >> some >> > information on the hardware (e.g. CPU, disk sizes, some bits of >> > chipset information here and there), could someone document the >> > hardware details - e.g. make and model of the system, any particular >> > details of hardware/options installed, etc.??Having such information >> > known (and documented!) could come in rather to quite handy in >> > troubleshooting any items that may be hardware related, planning >> > certain optimizations and potential upgrades, etc.??If someone is >> > able to at least provide the basic hardware information, we could >> > probably get that up on a wiki page, including hunting down relevant >> > reference information (e.g. links to more detailed hardware >> > specifications for particular make/model of items identified). >> i volunteer to do this given that I own the box. I'll have >> to go down there. Anybody want to come visit the box >> in its colo environment? >> >> > More documentation/log stuff ... >> > I started two log files on the box - feel free to have a look at >> > the /home/admin/log* files (most notably /home/admin/log).??The >> > general idea there is human readable >> > (and fairly searchable by date, or other criteria) log of system >> > changes >> > made, issues/bugs noted/corrected, etc.??Most notably the idea here >> is >> > to keep lots of less details regarding such off of and from >> > piling up ad nauseum on wiki pages (could eventually get quite >> long), >> > and it's also often much easier to drop information straight into >> flat >> > file or copy/paste from such, and not have to worry about wiki >> > formatting goop and how to get something to render as plain text. >> strong agreement. Permissions for /home/admin currently are >> 755 for root owner, root group, unwashed. Ergo only root can >> make changes, all can read. Is that best? >> What about an admin group such that permissions are >> 775 root owner, admin group, unwashed. This allows a >> group of administrators that may not have su - privileges. >> Current permissions assume administrators su - (which is >> okay by me, just bringing it up). >> >> > The wiki pages are probably much more suitable for more general >> > documentation (e.g. policies, how-to, etc.) - such as things likely >> to >> > be revised over time (as opposed to continually appended to and not >> as >> > likely to be of more general interest). >> seems right. For >> http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: >> system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box >> >> I suggest revising the existing wiki text bullet points under >> the Objectives section to be >> * support command-line activities of users. >> * provide an educational playground for users who want to explore >> using >> Unix. >> * support web pages for users. >> * support web pages and activities of a Red Hat Certification study >> group. >> * support web pages and activities of users learning the Python >> programming language. >> * support other open-source focussed community groups. >> >> >> > For a bit more of an idea, >> > have a look at /home/admin/log - it's already up to 82 lines - and >> > that's just covering a bit of usage/syntax, and noting and dealing >> with >> > a few minor issues.??As I noted, such can get quite long ( e.g. on >> my >> > two >> > home systems, the equivalent file I maintain on each have grown to >> be >> > in excess of 10,000 lines long (not that we have to be *that* >> detailed >> > on the sf-lug.com. box - on my home systems, I log, for example, all >> > package additions/removals/upgrades - including package version >> > information, bugs and hardware issues/problems encountered, hardware >> > changes, etc.; capturing/noting at least more noteworthy >> changes/issues >> > for the sf-lug.com. box would probably be a good thing.)). >> I think /home/admin/log* files are outstanding! >> I hope the administrators will follow the style. >> >> > Code of ethics???Should we add to the "rules of the road" / policy >> > something indicating an appropriate code of ethics???The more >> > experienced systems administrators likely think such would be quite >> > applicable anyway, but, most notably for those that may be much >> newer >> > to >> > the field, explicitly noting, or at least referencing such, would >> help >> > call attention to such, introduce such to those not already familiar >> > with such, and help develop and foster appropriate professionalism. >> > E.g. could add something roughly like: >> > " >> > Users of the system, and most notably systems administrators and any >> > other persons with any type of privileged access to the system, >> should >> > exercise appropriate professionalism and follow appropriate code of >> > ethics, >> > e.g. the LOPSA/SAGE/USENIX code of ethics: >> > http://www.sage.org/ethics/ethics.html >> > http://lopsa.org/CodeOfEthics >> > " >> don't like the word "professional*". How about >> "...access to the system should follow the code of ethics described >> in: >> " >> >> > Quoting Michael Paoli: >> > >> >> Just a bit of a start (I plan to add more), but I put some of the >> >> information on the wiki.??Feel free to correct anything that's >> >> incorrect, >> >> improve formatting/presentation, etc. >> >> >> >> http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php >> >> >> > http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system: >> > system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box >> >> file://sf-lug.com/home/admin/ >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > sf-lug mailing list >> > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug >> > >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From jim at well.com Fri Apr 27 20:14:53 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 20:14:53 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] python, subversion, jdk on the colo box Message-ID: I'd like to put one or more additional versions of Python on the colo box. I'd like to install subversion, which requires jvm, which implies, at least to me, jdk. Opinions? Advice? jim From rick at linuxmafia.com Fri Apr 27 22:06:20 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 22:06:20 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] python, subversion, jdk on the colo box In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20070428050620.GB19445@linuxmafia.com> Quoting jim stockford (jim at well.com): > I'd like to install subversion, which requires jvm, > which implies, at least to me, jdk. Huh? Something's wrong. svn's dependencies are: o Apache Portable Runtime o zlib o SQLlite (required for server-end only) o neon or serf HTTP-client library (depending on how svn is compiled) o OpenSSL (optional; again, depends on how svn is compiled) o BerkeleyDB (iff svn is compiled for that, as opposed to the preferable FSFS back-end)) o Cyrus SASL library (optional) o Apache httpd 2.x (optional, for server end) See: http://svn.collab.net/repos/svn/trunk/INSTALL From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Fri Apr 27 22:57:54 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 22:57:54 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] python, subversion, jdk on the colo box In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1177739874.4632e262333f5@webmail.rawbw.com> My first inclination would be to go with whatever the operating system / distribution offers, ... in this case CentOS release 4.4 (Final) If that's sufficiently reasonable and works well enough, it should be pretty straight-forward. If not, ... well, things start to get more interesting. Sure there's source, ... but how much of that does one want to have to track and maintain independent of some reasonable package management system (and/or incorporate and maintain into some type of package management system)? The answer to that will often depend on the scope and complexity of the software, and requirements of the operating environment (e.g. security and stability considerations). Also, some distributions (e.g. Debian) have a very good mechanism (the "alternatives" system, in Debian) of simultaneously having multiple packages installed that cover some overlapping functionality - and one can configure which is used by default, yet have multiple of them installed (e.g. vim and nvi - and vi will use exactly one of those, but both vim and nvi can coexist quite nicely on the same system). I don't know that CentOS (or Red Hat) yet has any similar capability. Whether or not this may be an issue or not probably depends on degree of overlap of the version(s) and what functionality they cover. $ date; hostname; sudo up2date --showall | grep -i '^python' Fri Apr 27 22:54:58 PDT 2007 sf-lug python-2.3.4-14.3.i386 python-devel-2.3.4-14.3.i386 python-docs-2.3.4-14.3.i386 python-elementtree-1.2.6-4.2.1.i386 python-ldap-2.0.1-2.i386 python-sqlite-1.1.7-1.2.i386 python-tools-2.3.4-14.3.i386 python-urlgrabber-2.9.8-2.noarch $ Quoting jim stockford : > I'd like to put one or more additional versions > of Python on the colo box. > I'd like to install subversion, which requires jvm, > which implies, at least to me, jdk. > Opinions? Advice? From a_kleider at yahoo.com Fri Apr 27 23:56:48 2007 From: a_kleider at yahoo.com (Alex Kleider) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 23:56:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] www.aboutdebian.com In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <331622.20640.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In response to the comments about distro choice: as a relative newbie (I've been one for so long perhaps I don't qualify anymore!) I've been using Debian and have recently discovered www.aboutdebian.com I highly recommend that everyone (even those using other distros) check it out. I find it to be the perfect source for info that fills the gap between theory (as in the specialty books) and the simple how toos that are explained in the intro.to.linux books. The person who maintains this site deserves a lot of gratitude, I think. alex at kleider.net __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Sat Apr 28 01:00:34 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2007 01:00:34 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com. box questions, documentation, "rules of the road", policies, etc. In-Reply-To: <0d36f1d006444e217cd7f48a5205bb89@well.com> References: <1177426258.462e1952c419c@webmail.rawbw.com> <1177511958.462f681692e5d@webmail.rawbw.com> <0d36f1d006444e217cd7f48a5205bb89@well.com> Message-ID: <1177747234.4632ff22e9464@webmail.rawbw.com> Okay :-) ... my comments mixed in below, ... substantially snipped, more full earlier text (to which this is a reply) available at: http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2007q2/001454.html Quoting jim stockford : > On Apr 25, 2007, at 7:39 AM, Michael Paoli wrote: > > appropriate outage notification and out-of-band status page? Okay, thus far now have at least: http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:appropriate_outage_notification based upon summary of what we seem to have come up with thus far. And random subsequent thought on out-of-band status pages. Could also set up such a page on sf-lug.com. for status of sf-lug.org., and vice versa - could make for a fairly elegant symetry. > > Hardware documentation? > i volunteer to do this given that I own the box. I'll have > to go down there. Anybody want to come visit the box > in its colo environment? At the 2007-04-16 SF-LUG meeting, there was discussion of potentially arranging to do this on a Monday evening when SF-LUG doesn't meet. Want to just pick a suitable day that's a week or more out? I'd be interested in having a look (or at least otherwise covering various hardware and colo questions), I'd think probably at least some of the sysadmins and others would also be interested. Don't know what's the max. number of folks you could escort through there (might want to check in advance with the colo, in case that could be an issue - and possibly do some RSVP) ... and may want to coordinate timing if there are folks you think are "essential" to get the "tour" or whatever. Other than that, I'd say pick a date. :-) > > More documentation/log stuff ... > > I started two log files on the box - feel free to have a look at > > the /home/admin/log* files (most notably /home/admin/log). The > strong agreement. Permissions for /home/admin currently are > 755 for root owner, root group, unwashed. Ergo only root can > make changes, all can read. Is that best? > What about an admin group such that permissions are > 775 root owner, admin group, unwashed. This allows a > group of administrators that may not have su - privileges. > Current permissions assume administrators su - (which is > okay by me, just bringing it up). That was pretty intentional, ... there are pros and cons of using various permissions there. My first concern was that it be rather difficult (reduced probability) for anyone to accidentally or intentionally mess up (e.g. remove or squash) at least those particular log files - hence the tight write permissions. I could have allowed group or world write permissions on the directory and set the sticky bit on the directory, but that still has some possible downsides (more mischief/accidents can be done by folks there, and the directory could get a bit more clogged with various stuff dropped there - I wanted to keep it relatively "clean"). What I was thinking would be most likely "solutions" - using the existing permissions there - is if/when some other (functional, not necessarily UNIX/LINUX) group (such as SF-LUG webmaster or BALUG webmaster if/when those are quite distinct roles) wants to write some similar set of log files, root could either: A) create a file or subdirectory within that directory that has the permissions allowing the relevant folks to write, or B) drop in a suitably named symbolic link to wherever such group(s) write the relevant data/logs Either of the two approaches noted above would make them pretty findable from that fairly centralized location, and would also maintain a rather high degree of integrity of files where root wouldn't want other IDs mucking with those few (two thus far) specific files. It also allows different functionality/roles to be split out a fairly reasonable bit - e.g. routine "day to day" things that a webmaster may want to note and log may, for the most part, be of little to no interest to the systems administrator(s), or vice versa (but most of the sysadmin stuff is readable for those who want to know, and the sysadmin has the technical ability to read whatever, and presuming it's invited or appropriate can look at other logs or such). Certainly not the only way to slice and dice it ... but it's what I came up with when I gave it about 20 seconds thought the other day (takes a wee bit longer to type that up). Also, another idea which crossed my mind shortly after making the world readable file - we could also serve that up via the webserver. Though it wouldn't make that text into a wiki, it would make that accessible for all on the Internet to read (which might be much more convenient for many folks, and would also serve as more of an educational/training resource with the greater availability). > > The wiki pages are probably much more suitable for more general > seems right. For Yup, ... as I suspected, the "right" answer is neither "do it all (or even most all) in wiki" or "do it all in flat text files", but rather use what's most appropriate and fitting and where it fits (and the "boundaries" of that can generally always be tweaked later). > I suggest revising the existing wiki text bullet points under > the Objectives section to be "done" - not sure if I got it precisely as you had in mind. I still kept some of the high availability and related objective stuff up towards the top, and mostly updated/added where the updated text you suggested started to essentially overlap some of the existing stuff written on the wiki. I also did a s/Unix/LINUX/ substitution. If I didn't get it quite right, feel free to tweak and/or let me know. > > Code of ethics? Should we add to the "rules of the road" / policy > don't like the word "professional*". How about Okay, ... added something on that based upon your suggestion. Again, feel free to tweak or let me know if it's not suitably to your liking. references: http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2007q2/001454.html http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box http://sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:appropriate_outage_notification From rick at linuxmafia.com Sat Apr 28 02:40:26 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2007 02:40:26 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] www.aboutdebian.com In-Reply-To: <331622.20640.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <331622.20640.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20070428094026.GC19445@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Alex Kleider (a_kleider at yahoo.com): > As a relative newbie (I've been one for so long perhaps I don't > qualify anymore!) I've been using Debian and have recently discovered > www.aboutdebian.com I highly recommend that everyone (even those using > other distros) check it out. http://www.debian-administration.org/ seriously rocks, too. From jim at well.com Sat Apr 28 10:27:46 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2007 10:27:46 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: CHM Presents Arthur Rock - May 1, 2007 Message-ID: <7877d9465cc11a66b462e9b297a22750@well.com> Begin forwarded message: > From: "Computer History Museum" > Date: April 28, 2007 4:09:51 AM PDT > To: jim at well.com > Subject: CHM Presents Arthur Rock - May 1, 2007 > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Arthur_Rock_email_graphics.gif Type: image/gif Size: 16425 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > A 1951 graduate of Harvard Business School, Arthur Rock began his > career as a security analyst in New York City before joining the > corporate finance department of Hayden, Stone & Co. In 1957 he worked > with Alfred ?Bud? Coyle to raise financing from Sherman Fairchild to > found Fairchild Semiconductor, the company that established Silicon > Valley as a world center of innovation in integrated circuit > technology. > > Mr. Rock moved to California in 1961 and formed a partnership with > Tommy Davis. Together they invested $3 million and returned $100 > million to their investors. After establishing his own firm, Arthur > Rock & Co in 1968, he worked with Fairchild co-founders Gordon Moore > and Robert Noyce to launch Intel Corporation, the largest, and by many > measures, the most successful semiconductor company in the world > today. He notes that ?It was one of the few times that I helped start > a company that I absolutely knew in my own mind was going to be a big > success. I raised the money just on the telephone in something like > two days.? > > Arthur Rock served as Intel?s first Chairman of the Board and > Chairman of the Executive Committee. Based on this experience he has > proclaimed Rock?s Law, a corollary to Moore?s Law, which says that > ?the cost of capital equipment to build semiconductors will double > every four years.? > > Mr. Rock also invested in and held early stage board positions at > pioneering scientific computing company, Scientific Data Systems; at > Teledyne, which grew into one of the most successful technology > conglomerates in the history of American business, and at Apple > Computer. He has contributed to the local community by supporting the > San Francisco Museum of Modern Art, the San Francisco Opera, and the > California Institute of Technology. In 2003 he donated $25 Million to > establish the Arthur Rock Center for Entrepreneurship at Harvard > Business School. Professor of Business Administration Howard H. > Stevenson says ?"Arthur Rock is part of the history of American > business and entrepreneurship." > > Where > ?? > Computer History Museum > Hahn Auditorium > 1401 N. Shoreline Blvd. > Mountain View, CA 94043 > Directions > > When > ?? > > Tuesday, May 1, 2007 > 6 -7 pm Member Reception > Wine provided by The Mountain Winery -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Winery_logo.gif Type: image/gif Size: 1962 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > > 7 - 8:30 pm Lecture > > Registration > ?? > > Free. > To register or for more information on the event, please visit the > Museum's website at: > www.computerhistory.org/rock_05012007 > or Call (650) 810-1005. > > Background > ?? > > The CHM Presents speaker series is an exclusive platform for open, > passionate discussions for presenting the computing revolution and its > impact on the human experience. These landmark presentations and panel > discussions present > inside stories and personal insights of top information age leaders > from industry, government and academia, and assist the Museum in > bringing computing history to life. > > ? > > Calendar of Events > > SUNDAY, April 29, 2007 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: CCRMA.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 5006 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > > > A Celebration of Max Mathews and 50 years of Computer Music > Time: 4 pm Pre-concert talk l 5 pm "Influences: A Tribute Concert" l > 6:30 pm Reception > Place: Computer History Museum > For more information > > TUESDAY, May 15, 2007 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: CHM_PRESENTS_logo_SM.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4086 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > > > An Evening with Industry Analyst Marketplace Pioneer Gideon Gartner > in conversation with Neill Brownstein > Time: 6:30 pm Lecture l 8 pm Member Reception > Place: Computer History Museum > For more information > > MONDAY, June 4, 2007 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: CHM_PRESENTS_logo_SM.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4086 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > > > An Evening with Former Apple Industrial Designers Robert Brunner and > Jerry Manock, with moderator Bill Moggridge > Time: 6 pm Member Reception; Photography exhibit and book-signing of > Core Memory: A Visual Survey of Vintage Computers Featuring Machines > from the Computer History Museum presenting photographs by noted Bay > Area photographer Mark Richards. > 7 pm Lecture > Place: Computer History Museum > For more information > > TUESDAY, October 16, 2007 > 20th Anniversary Computer History Museum Fellow Awards > "Celebrating the Stories of the Information Age" > Time: 6 pm Reception l 7 pm Dinner & Ceremony > Place: Computer History Museum > ? > > Community Pulse > > SATURDAY, April 28, 2007 > The Tech Museum of Innovation Presents > The 20th Anniversary Tech Challenge: Mars Crater Mission > Watch young innovators demonstrate ingenious robots designed to > survive a 12-foot fall and climb a steep crater wall. > Free to the Public > Best Viewing Hours: 11:00 am to 3:00 pm > Place: The Tech Museum of Innovation > For more information > > Weeklong sessions starting in June going through August > iD Tech Camps: Hands-on Tech Fun! > Send your child to the largest, most recommended computer camp. iD > Tech Camps provides weeklong, day and overnight, hands-on technology > programs for ages 7-17 at 50 prestigious universities nationwide. > For more information > > 3 week sessions throughout the summer > iD Gaming Academy > Teens immerse in the dynamic world of video game development. > Students create their own mini game portfolio with levels and > interactivity in this intensive 3 week program at Stanford University > and UC Berkeley. > For more information > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > The Computer History Museum in Mountain View, California, a public > benefit organization with a 25-year history as part of the former > Boston Computer Museum, preserves and presents for posterity the > artifacts and stories of the information age. The Museum is dedicated > to exploring the social impact of computing and is home to the world's > largest and most significant collection of computing-related items -- > from hardware (mainframes, PCs, handhelds, integrated circuits), to > software, to computer graphics systems, to the Internet and > networking. The collection also includes photos, films, videos, > documents, publications, and advertising and marketing materials. > > Currently in its first phase, the Museum brings computing history to > life through its popular speaker series, seminars, oral histories and > workshops. The Museum also offers self-guided and docent-led tours of > "Visible Storage," where nearly 600 objects from the collection are on > display. A recent exhibit, ?Mastering The Game: A History of Computer > Chess,? opened in September 2005. Please check the website for open > hours. Future phases will feature full museum exhibits and educational > programs, including a timeline of computing history, theme galleries, > a research center, and much more. For more information, please visit > www.computerhistory.org or call (650) 810-1010. > > > > You are currently part of the Lecture announcement list of the > Computer History Museum. To unsubscribe, please reply to this message > with the word "remove" in the subject line. > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: CHM_logo2.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 5275 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jim at well.com Sun Apr 29 13:18:56 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2007 13:18:56 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: SF-LUG Job Postings--revised info location Message-ID: <3bb16674e8f36ecb73b45afd5d52ccac@well.com> Begin forwarded message: > From: Michael Paoli > Date: April 29, 2007 12:01:45 PM PDT > To: jim at well.com > Subject: Re: SF-LUG Job Postings > > There's substantially updated information here: > http://www.rawbw.com/~mp/job_openings.html > (Ah, if I'd only put it *there* to begin with). > Anyway, if you want to point folks to that, that should > provide them the relevant information on those two positions > that I'm quite familiar with (and any relevant updates I become aware > of and can publicly note about those two position). > > Quoting Michael Paoli : > >> Some LINUX/UNIX job(s). >> >> You can snag basic information from: >> http://www.weak.org/pipermail/buug/2007-April/002931.html >> or use the body and subject from that for "posting" (or web page or >> whatever). And also, this: >> http://bad.debian.net/list/2007-April/003140.html >> pretty well answers the question "And how much of that is Debian?" >> >> Or let me know if you want me to draft up a little web page for it. >> >> "Job Postings: current policy is job posters use email to submit job >> postings to jim at well dot com and jim will post your listing on a >> separate web page and notify the sf-lug mailing list." >> >> Also, that "separate page": >> http://64.81.61.186/test/sf-lug/sf-lugJobs.html >> linked from http://www.sf-lug.org/ >> doesn't appear to be working presently (timeout when attemtping to >> connect to port 80 of 64.81.61.186). > From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Sun Apr 29 15:04:33 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2007 15:04:33 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug.com. box developments, documentation, etc. Message-ID: <1177884273.46351671e1b74@webmail.rawbw.com> sf-lug.com. box developments, documentation, etc. For the interested, curious, or bored ... A fair amount of updates on the host - mostly notably documentation. One of the key log files is now Internet accessible: http://www.sf-lug.com/log.txt A fair bit of the documentation has been updated. Most or all of that can be navigated to from: http://www.sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php (or if you forget that, http://www.sf-lug.com/wiki or: http://www.sf-lug.com/wiki/ will also get you there). Some key updates: flushed out and updated policy / rules of the road some more: http://www.sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box IP address reserved for BALUG is now also configured (e.g., see: http://www.sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:ip_addresses ) From jim at well.com Thu May 3 15:11:25 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Thu, 3 May 2007 15:11:25 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Complimentary Open Source Conference in San Francisco Message-ID: <1f327ada7b9be5343c181efac521dd4b@well.com> it's free, May 7, at Moscone with thanks to Bill Ward of PenLUG: > Sun Microsystems presents: > > You're Invited - Complimentary Open Source Conference in San Francisco > > Monday, May 7, 10:00am-7:30pm, San Francisco > > MORE INFO: http://www.cplan.com/sun/communityone2007/registration/ > > Join Sun Microsystems in San Francisco at The Moscone Center on May 7, > 2007 for CommunityOne, an open environment of participation, > contribution, > and innovation. In just one day you can explore groundbreaking open > source > and community-based environments, technologies and platforms including > Web > 2.0, the NetBeans IDE, OpenJDK, Mobile and Embedded, the GlassFish > project, and the OpenSolaris operating system. CommunityOne, a > complimentary event, brings you together with passionate developers and > leading technologists. > > At CommunityOne you'll: > - Get involved with communities at the leading edge of innovation > - Advance your development and deployment skills in sessions on*: >> Web 2.0 collaboration >> Ajax applications made easy >> JRuby on Rails >> Scripting and the Java platform >> Creating offline Web 2.0 applications >> Open-source licensing >> x86 Virtualization >> And more > - Hear James Gosling discuss the future of developer tools and the rich > client platform in the NetBeans Software Day general session > - Starting-up? Come together with fellow entrepreneurs at the StartUp > Camp, a face-to-face collaborative meetup > - Explore the current and future impact of participation, in sessions > led > by analysts from RedMonk > - Learn how to boost your productivity with standards-based tool sets > and > development environments > - Develop an infrastructure robust and flexible enough to thrive in a > Web > 2.0 world > - Share your ideas with open-source peers at the CommunityOne reception > > Agenda > General Session: 10:00 - 11:00a.m. > Morning Sessions: 11:00a.m. - 12:00p.m. > Lunch: 12:00 - 1:00p.m. > Afternoon Sessions: 1:00 - 6:00p.m. > Reception: 6:00 - 7:30p.m. > > DATE & TIME: > Monday, May 7 > 10:00am-7:30pm > > LOCATION: > The Moscone Center > 747 Howard Street > San Francisco, CA, 94103 > http://www.moscone.com/contact.html > > COST & REGISTRATION: > FREE. > http://www.cplan.com/sun/communityone2007/registration/ > > MORE INFO: > Website: http://www.cplan.com/sun/communityone2007/registration/ > > SVEvents is a free open Silicon Valley Tech events' annoncements list. > To subscribe - visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SVEvents/join > or send mail to:SVEvents-subscribe at yahoogroups.com > From a_kleider at yahoo.com Thu May 3 21:04:58 2007 From: a_kleider at yahoo.com (Alex Kleider) Date: Thu, 3 May 2007 21:04:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] ddclient problems/trying to set up bind9 under Debian Message-ID: <684456.49905.qm@web36604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> can anyone suggest what the problem might be that results in # ddclient responding with Use of uninitialized value in string ne at /etc/sbin/ddclient line 1828. and this error message is repeated eight times. Seems to want to make a point! The other computers on the network complain that the DNS server is not responding so I suspect there are more than just problems with ddclient. If only ddclient was the problem, I'd imagine the server would respond, just wouldn't be able to get the info from easydns.com. Any help or suggestions would be great. alex at kleider.net __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From jason at jcorcoran.net Fri May 4 03:26:08 2007 From: jason at jcorcoran.net (Jason Corcoran) Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 11:26:08 +0100 Subject: [sf-lug] Intro. Message-ID: <20070504102608.GA9909@jcorcoran.net> Hi there, I am moving from Dublin, Ireland to SF on the 31st of May. I have been a member of the Irish LUG for the last 8 odd years and mostly use debian based distro's. I will be working as a software engineer in our parent companies HQ in Redwood city. So just a quick howdy from me. Jason. -- Jason. Fortune : The rolling stones concert down the road caused a brown out From darose at darose.net Fri May 4 05:28:35 2007 From: darose at darose.net (David Rosenstrauch) Date: Fri, 04 May 2007 08:28:35 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] ddclient problems/trying to set up bind9 under Debian In-Reply-To: <684456.49905.qm@web36604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <684456.49905.qm@web36604.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <463B26F3.8080906@darose.net> Alex Kleider wrote: > can anyone suggest what the problem might be that results in > # ddclient > responding with > Use of uninitialized value in string ne at /etc/sbin/ddclient line > 1828. > and this error message is repeated eight times. Seems to want to make a > point! > The other computers on the network complain that the DNS server is not > responding so I suspect there are more than just problems with > ddclient. > If only ddclient was the problem, I'd imagine the server would respond, > just wouldn't be able to get the info from easydns.com. > Any help or suggestions would be great. > > alex at kleider.net If you post your /etc/sbin/ddclient file I might be able to help. (With username/passwords obscured, obviously.) DR From jim at well.com Fri May 4 13:37:23 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 13:37:23 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] meeting Sunday, 5/6 at 11 AM at the Javacat Message-ID: <9f512c1af621ebedb217915c17f1186b@well.com> come on down! San Francisco Linux Users' Group meeting this Sunday, May 6, from 11 AM till 1:00 PM (or so) at the Javacat, in San Francisco, on Geary Blvd at 20th Avenue. some of us get there a little early, like 10:30 or so. Parking starts to suck by 11 AM. From jim at well.com Fri May 4 14:14:45 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 14:14:45 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help research law school courses and "intellectual property" Message-ID: <638f1ec2e8ec23dcd9a42aed4d3d336d@well.com> Begin forwarded message: > If you are at a university which has a law school, please go to the > university > archives, and check the old course catalogs to see when classes in the > law > school began using the propaganda term "intellectual property" (see > http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/not-ipr.html) in the names of courses. > Please > send the date, school, course title and description to rms at gnu.org. > > http://badvista.org > http://www.gnu.org > http://www.fsf.org > > "Microsoft put all those functionality-crippling features into Vista > because it > wants to own the entertainment industry. This isn't how Microsoft > spins it, of > course. It maintains that it has no choice...It's all complete > nonsense." > --Bruce Schneier, "DRM in Windows Vista" > _______________________________________________ > Info-member mailing list > > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/info-member > From mblanc at znet.com Sun May 6 19:59:32 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 19:59:32 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] thanks for all the help today Message-ID: <000701c79053$bd65d000$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> I was glad to meet everyone this afternoon, and thank you all for the advice. The Puppy CD booted up just fine (and even easier after I had given the drive some cleaning!) It loaded a 2.6 series kernel, and I was able to mount an NTFS device to peek into the Windoze volume. I'm confident that the old system h/w will support what I need to do with it. Thanks, Bobbi -- I'll return the CD next time. There is still some heartburn with my CD-ROM reader. The Ubuntu may not be usable until I get another drive. Though it looks like I finally managed to load some MEPIS distribution... So it goes. Thanks again. mike b -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Mon May 7 08:53:43 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Mon, 7 May 2007 08:53:43 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Python: bayPIGgies newbies night this Thursday Message-ID: Overview of the Python Programming Language, Part 1 On May 10 at Google, bayPIGgies features Newbies Night, part one. Alex Martelli will present the first half of his Python for Programmers talk, with time for questions and answers. The talk presents an overview of current features of the Python programming language. This "newbie night" talk is suitable for people who already have programming experience in other languages. Those who are entirely new to programming are welcome, but are warned--the talk presumes familiarity with programming concepts. Newbies Night, part two, will be held on Thursday, July 12, when Alex will present the second half of his talk. BayPIGgies is the Bay area Python Interest Group. BayPIGgies holds its meetings on the 2nd Thursday of every month from 7:30 PM - 9 PM at Google 1600 Amphitheatre Pkwy, Mtn View 94043 Bldg 43, Tunis room If you plan to attend, try to sign up on the wiki at http://wiki.python.org/moin/BayPiggiesGoogleMeetings and you'll have a badge waiting for you. Otherwise, you're welcome but you'll have to register at the door (come a little early to allow time). Join the BayPIGgies mailing list at http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies From nbs at sonic.net Tue May 8 06:52:05 2007 From: nbs at sonic.net (Bill Kendrick) Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 06:52:05 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Volunteers needed for LUGOD's booth at Whole Earth Festival this weekend (May 11th-13th @ UC Davis) Message-ID: <20070508135205.GF9919@sonic.net> The Linux Users' Group of Davis will have a table at this year's Whole Earth Festival at UC Davis [1] this weekend, Friday May 11th through Sunday May 13th. http://www.lugod.org/projects/wef/ LUGOD needs additional volunteers to help make this a successful event! We need help burning CDROMs for give-aways at the event [2], and people to help staff our booth and talk to visitors. If you can help, please contact Nick Schmalenberger at nick at schmalenberger.us, or post a message to LUGOD's "vox-outreach" mailing list [3]. Thank you! -bill! pr at lugod.org http://www.lugod.org/ Linux Users' Group of Davis [1] Official Whole Earth Festival page: http://wef.ucdavis.edu/ ), [2] Help burn CDs for LUGOD: http://www.lugod.ort/cdburns/ [3] Info about LUGOD's "vox-outreach" mailing list: http://www.lugod.org/mailinglists/#vox-outreach From aldenm at gmail.com Tue May 8 12:30:02 2007 From: aldenm at gmail.com (Alden Meneses) Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 12:30:02 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Python: bayPIGgies newbies night this Thursday In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <221610dc0705081230s6f137e3bm50b1b49d91d17fc1@mail.gmail.com> I signed up. Would be nice to know if anyone else in the group is planning on going. Jim - Thanks for the post. On 5/7/07, jim stockford wrote: > > > > Overview of the Python Programming Language, Part 1 > > On May 10 at Google, bayPIGgies features Newbies > Night, part one. > Alex Martelli will present the first half of his > Python for Programmers talk, with time for questions > and answers. > The talk presents an overview of current features > of the Python programming language. > > This "newbie night" talk is suitable for people who > already have programming experience in other languages. > Those who are entirely new to programming are welcome, > but are warned--the talk presumes familiarity with > programming concepts. > > Newbies Night, part two, will be held on Thursday, > July 12, when Alex will present the second half of his > talk. > > BayPIGgies is the Bay area Python Interest Group. > BayPIGgies holds its meetings on the 2nd Thursday > of every month from 7:30 PM - 9 PM at > Google > 1600 Amphitheatre Pkwy, Mtn View 94043 > Bldg 43, Tunis room > > If you plan to attend, try to sign up on the wiki at > http://wiki.python.org/moin/BayPiggiesGoogleMeetings > and you'll have a badge waiting for you. Otherwise, > you're welcome but you'll have to register at the > door (come a little early to allow time). > > Join the BayPIGgies mailing list at > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jturner at nonzerosums.org Tue May 8 20:20:51 2007 From: jturner at nonzerosums.org (Jason Turner (JT)) Date: Tue, 08 May 2007 20:20:51 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Python: bayPIGgies newbies night this Thursday In-Reply-To: <221610dc0705081230s6f137e3bm50b1b49d91d17fc1@mail.gmail.com> References: <221610dc0705081230s6f137e3bm50b1b49d91d17fc1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <46413E13.3000600@nonzerosums.org> Just signed up. Already have a question though -- Alden, Jim. Double check your sign-up. I only see 4 people, including myself, under the May 10 date. I would have moved your names but perhaps I'm parsing the page incorrectly? -- jt Alden Meneses wrote: > I signed up. Would be nice to know if anyone else in the group is > planning on going. > > Jim - Thanks for the post. > > > On 5/7/07, *jim stockford* > wrote: > > > > Overview of the Python Programming Language, Part 1 > > On May 10 at Google, bayPIGgies features Newbies > Night, part one. > Alex Martelli will present the first half of his > Python for Programmers talk, with time for questions > and answers. > The talk presents an overview of current features > of the Python programming language. > > This "newbie night" talk is suitable for people who > already have programming experience in other languages. > Those who are entirely new to programming are welcome, > but are warned--the talk presumes familiarity with > programming concepts. > > Newbies Night, part two, will be held on Thursday, > July 12, when Alex will present the second half of his > talk. > > BayPIGgies is the Bay area Python Interest Group. > BayPIGgies holds its meetings on the 2nd Thursday > of every month from 7:30 PM - 9 PM at > Google > 1600 Amphitheatre Pkwy, Mtn View 94043 > Bldg 43, Tunis room > > If you plan to attend, try to sign up on the wiki at > http://wiki.python.org/moin/BayPiggiesGoogleMeetings > and you'll have a badge waiting for you. Otherwise, > you're welcome but you'll have to register at the > door (come a little early to allow time). > > Join the BayPIGgies mailing list at > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From rondosxx at yahoo.com Wed May 9 13:07:11 2007 From: rondosxx at yahoo.com (ron) Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 13:07:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Python: bayPIGgies newbies night this Thursday Message-ID: <303497.186.qm@web52504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I tried to sign up last night, couldn't find the link. Also the webpage was talking about april meeting, not may. I followed the link that Jim posted. I decided to just stand in line tomorrow. How long could the line be? ____________________________________________________________________________________ Finding fabulous fares is fun. Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains. http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097 From krmdv at aim.com Thu May 10 13:03:50 2007 From: krmdv at aim.com (krmdv at aim.com) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 16:03:50 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI Message-ID: <8C9615575F52257-179C-55C7@WEBMAIL-DC14.sysops.aol.com> Sorry for not making any of the recent meetings, but duty calls with work sometimes :) Anyway, I thought my friends in the SF LUG would like to hear the announcement of AMD is going to Open Source its Graphic Drivers. AMD will soon deliver open graphics drivers, said Henri Richard just a few minutes ago, and the audience at the opening keynote of the Red Hat Summit broke into applause and cheers. Richard, AMD?s executive vice president of sales and marketing, promised: ?I?m here to commit to you that it?s going to get done.? He also promised that AMD is ?going to be very proactive in changing way we interface with the Linux community.?...... http://enterpriselinuxlog.blogs.techtarget.com/2007/05/09/amd-will-deliver-open-graphics-drivers/ Hope to see you all very soon! DK -- David Kramer, RHCE Solutions Architect Red Hat, Inc. c. 650.302.7889 ________________________________________________________________________ Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and industry-leading spam and email virus protection. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From johnlowry at gmail.com Thu May 10 15:05:43 2007 From: johnlowry at gmail.com (John Jefferson Lowry IV) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 17:05:43 -0500 Subject: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI In-Reply-To: <8C9615575F52257-179C-55C7@WEBMAIL-DC14.sysops.aol.com> References: <8C9615575F52257-179C-55C7@WEBMAIL-DC14.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <528b20610705101505q4450fa23g93a65288114381bb@mail.gmail.com> Oh, that is so sweet, I am totally gonna buy and AMD/ATI system just because of that. On 5/10/07, krmdv at aim.com wrote: > > Sorry for not making any of the recent meetings, but duty calls with work > sometimes :) Anyway, I thought my friends in the SF LUG would like to hear > the announcement of AMD is going to Open Source its Graphic Drivers. > > AMD will soon deliver open graphics drivers, said Henri Richard just a > few minutes ago, and the audience at the opening keynote of the Red Hat > Summit broke into applause and cheers. Richard, AMD's executive vice > president of sales and marketing, promised: "I'm here to commit to you > that it's going to get done." He also promised that AMD is "going to be > very proactive in changing way we interface with the Linux > community."...... > > > http://enterpriselinuxlog.blogs.techtarget.com/2007/05/09/amd-will-deliver-open-graphics-drivers/ > > Hope to see you all very soon! > > DK > > -- > David Kramer, RHCE > Solutions Architect > Red Hat, Inc. > c. 650.302.7889 > > > > > > ------------------------------ > *Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail*-- 2 GB of storage and industry-leading spam and email virus protection. > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > -- John Lowry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Thu May 10 15:12:06 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 15:12:06 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI In-Reply-To: <8C9615575F52257-179C-55C7@WEBMAIL-DC14.sysops.aol.com> References: <8C9615575F52257-179C-55C7@WEBMAIL-DC14.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <20070510221206.GB9155@linuxmafia.com> Quoting krmdv at aim.com (krmdv at aim.com): > Sorry for not making any of the recent meetings, but duty calls with > work sometimes :) Anyway, I thought my friends in the SF LUG would > like to hear the announcement of AMD is going to Open Source its > Graphic Drivers. > >> AMD will soon deliver open graphics drivers, said Henri Richard just >> a few minutes ago, and the audience at the opening keynote of the Red >> Hat Summit broke into applause and cheers. Richard, AMD's executive >> vice president of sales and marketing, promised: "I'm here to commit >> to you that it's going to get done." He also promised that AMD is >> "going to be very proactive in changing way we interface with the >> Linux community."... > > http://enterpriselinuxlog.blogs.techtarget.com/2007/05/09/amd-will-deliver-open-graphics-drivers/ We can certainly hope that Henri Richard actually _meant_ what the unidentified TechTarget blogger claimed he said -- but less giddy listeners have pointed out that Richard seems to have, actually, carefully avoiding stating any specific commitment, and never actually said anything about _open source_ drivers at all; that such comments are strictly in the minds of others _about_ what he said. Don Marti at http://www.linuxworld.com/community/?q=node/556 has: ATI getting its act together on licensing? Submitted by dmarti on Wed, 05/09/2007 - 6:12pm. Live from the Red Hat summit: ATI marketing guy makes happy noises about open source drivers, promises nothing specific. [link] (That's one step ahead of the old "our customers prefer proprietary drivers" line.) Chris Ball comments,[link] "If AMD/ATI were serious, the first thing they could do would be to allow Dave Airlie to release the open-source drivers he's *already written*." Is Intel's pioneering move on drivers having an effect? See you at FreedomHEC[link] -- yes, we'll have Jamey Sharp of X there along with many of the kernel crowd. Commentary at Christopher Blizzard's blog entry (Don's first link) includes other skeptics. Kernel coder Dave Jones said: I had conversations with ATI years ago at OLS where they said pretty much the same thing. I wouldn't hold your breath. "Axel" wrote: "commited to fixing the problem" could mean anything. Once there are actual open source drivers for modern ATI graphics cards, I will celebrate. Until then, I'm just waiting for Intel to release a standalone graphics card with DVI out. Christopher Blizzard replied: Well see what they do. Spot pointed out that he didn't say "open source", but the context for the statement was that they want to open up specs for people to be able to use the GPUs as more general purpose processors. I don't care if they open up their drivers or not, just as long as we have the support and the specs to be able to write our own. People are skeptical, and rightfully so, but I suspect that something here has changed. I'll try to gather more information during this week and see if I can get something more concrete on the topic. (And, in conclusion, Go, Intel i965!) From jim at well.com Thu May 10 15:25:05 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 15:25:05 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Help Preserve Computing History! Message-ID: I believe i'm gonna pungle up. any of you interested in donating? Begin forwarded message: > From: "Computer History Museum" > Date: May 10, 2007 2:38:37 PM PDT > To: Jim * > Subject: Help Preserve Computing History! > Reply-To: Computer History Museum > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: oahcMs*26ha5.hMRgFf*26k8a.hMfF*26aWMy7E3q-3yv*26WtMz.hcw4.gif Type: image/gif Size: 43 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > > ? -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: oahcMs*26ha5.hMRgFf*26k8a.hMfF*26aWMy7E3q-3yv*26WtMz.hcw4.gif Type: image/gif Size: 43 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > Donate Now -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: oahcMs*26ha5.hMRgFf*26k8a.hMfF*26aWMy7E3q-3yv*26WtMz.hcw4.gif Type: image/gif Size: 43 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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We also continue to build upon the world's largest collection of > computing-related artifacts. With the help of global software leader > SAP, we were able to save an invaluable collection of rare computing > artifacts from Germany. > > ? We received a grant of over $546k from the Gordon and Betty Moore > Foundation to help increase science literacy among Bay Area high > school students on the paradigm-shiting developement of the integrated > circuit. > Thank you again for your interest and support and we look forward to > seeing you at the Museum in the near future. > > Sincerely, -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: oahcMs*26ha5.hMgssss*5CX*26k8a.hMfF*26aWMy7E3q-eBq3*26WtM9.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 5131 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Make a secure donation online. > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: oahcMs*26ha5.hMRggY*26k8a.hMfF*26aWMy7E3q-3yv*26WtMtcNW_haW9w4.gif Type: image/gif Size: 98 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: oahcMs*26ha5.hMfbss*26k8a.hM*5Cg*26aWMy7E3q-3yv*26WtMC.4iW_hr9ic9w4.gif Type: image/gif Size: 171 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > ? > Computer History Museum > 1401 N. Shoreline Blvd., Mountain View CA 94043 > Ph: 650.810.1010 > > If you no longer wish to receive this type of email from us, please > click here. > Follow this link to read our full privacy policy. > > ? 2007 Computer History Museum. All Rights Reserved. > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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When I try to get it going I get the following error message: # /etc/inid.d/bind9 force-reload Reloading domain name service... : bindrndc: connect failed: 127.0.0.1#953: connection refused failed! # I can only find references to rndc but only in a book dedicated to BIND and I can't figure out how it applies to me. I can find no reference to bindrndc. I'll be very grateful if someone can steer me towards a solution. alex alex at kleider.net ____________________________________________________________________________________Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more. http://mobile.yahoo.com/go?refer=1GNXIC From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon May 14 21:44:40 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 21:44:40 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] bindrndc In-Reply-To: <585525.33393.qm@web36606.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <585525.33393.qm@web36606.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1179204280.46493ab8cff29@webmail.rawbw.com> You can find lots of information about BIND on the ISC site, e.g.: http://www.isc.org/sw/bind/arm94/ For rndc to communicate properly with BIND (named) and thus be able to control it and such, they both need to communicate on a common port (953 by default) and on an IP they can both access (generally 127.0.0.1 is used by default, for security reasons). They also need to be set up with a shared secret to use to authenticate (e.g. so named can "know" that the request it is getting is legitimate and authenticated by the shared secret, and not just some random user or process on the host that decided to start talking to that port to see what it could manage to get away with). You may want to use netstat - or similar tools, to see that named is listening on the expected port and IP, check that you can connect to it (e.g. that it's not firewalled off), and see that they both have access to the same key. The diagnostics you provide would seem to imply that named isn't listening on port 953, or it's somehow blocked/firewalled, such that the connection is being refused. Also, rndc won't start BIND (named) for you - it's used to communicate with a running named. Perhaps you need to start it first? Quoting Alex Kleider : > Perhaps someone might be able to offer some help regarding DNS. > I am attempting to set up my own DNS server: BIND9, on a Debian Etch > system. > When I try to get it going I get the following error message: > # /etc/inid.d/bind9 force-reload > Reloading domain name service... : bindrndc: connect failed: > 127.0.0.1#953: connection refused > failed! > # > I can only find references to rndc but only in a book dedicated to BIND > and I can't figure out how it applies to me. > I can find no reference to bindrndc. > I'll be very grateful if someone can steer me towards a solution. > alex > > alex at kleider.net From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon May 14 22:01:38 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 22:01:38 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] bindrndc In-Reply-To: <585525.33393.qm@web36606.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <585525.33393.qm@web36606.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20070515050138.GD3141@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Alex Kleider (a_kleider at yahoo.com): > Perhaps someone might be able to offer some help regarding DNS. > I am attempting to set up my own DNS server: BIND9, on a Debian Etch > system. > When I try to get it going I get the following error message: > # /etc/inid.d/bind9 force-reload > Reloading domain name service... : bindrndc: connect failed: > 127.0.0.1#953: connection refused > failed! > # > I can only find references to rndc but only in a book dedicated to BIND > and I can't figure out how it applies to me. > I can find no reference to bindrndc. > I'll be very grateful if someone can steer me towards a solution. > alex The error message isn't very well worded, is it? It's _trying_ (badly) to say that the "rndc" utility provided as part of BIND9 is failing to connect to the necessary network socket on localhost. When you run the /etc/inid.d/bind9 script, I vaguely recall that for some (but not all) operations it invokes rndc behind the scenes. "rndc" stands for the (I think) Remote Nameserver Daemon Controller utility. The name indicates that it's _potentially_ able to carry out control of a nameserver from elsewhere, where "control" includes fine-grained operations short of stopping/starting/restopping the entire nameserver. E.g., you can force the reload of just one zone, without having to interrupt and restart the entire daemon. I hear you asking: "OK, so rndc is crashing and burning. _Why_ is rndc crashing and burning?" I'm going to answer that question, but first you get to hear a little story about my being a doofus. When I upgraded my own nameserver from BIND8 to the BIND9 from-scratch codebase rewrite, I had two problems: (1) BIND9 rejected all of my BIND8 zonefiles, and its alleged diagnostic messages gave no clue about _what_ syntax error BIND9 was upset about, merely that something made it run screaming in terror. Only a bit of Web searching revealed the secret: I didn't have any "$TTL" line. Once this was added to each zonefile, they parsed perfectly. In this, I was lucky, because BIND9 was picky about syntax in a way that BIND8 never had been, and many other sysadmins were going through eight kinds of hell debugging their glitches. (2) The SysVInit script's "start" directive worked, but the "stop" (and thus also "restart") ones always mysteriously failed. I couldn't figure this out, despite vague mumblings in the logfiles about something called rndc being unable to connect. So, for several years, whenever I needed to stop BIND9, I did it with the "kill" command. Eventually, years later, I got around to looking up what rndc was, and why it wasn't working. Because rndc's intended functionality includes _remote_ control (thus the "r") of the nameserver daemon, it operates using a public-key keypair for authentication. For localhost-only, that would be a little silly, but the idea is for remote connections to be feasible when/if you need them. Cutting to the chase, installation of my BIND9 package -- and presumably yours -- had not run the utility required to generate that keypair. So, rndc was inherently unable to authenticate. Therefore, it couldn't issue the command to stop that is part of the reload instruction. Anyhow: $ zcat /usr/share/doc/bind9/README.Debian.gz | more [...] If you installed an early version of the Debian bind9 packages, prior to version 1:9.2.0-2 to be more precise, you may have an /etc/bind/rndc.conf configuration file still on your system. There's nothing wrong with that, and if you've explicitly configured keys for using rndc you may well want to leave things exactly as they are! However, since 9.2.0 BIND 9.X has supported an rndc.key file that both named and rndc will read to obtain a shared key for rndc use against a daemon on the same host. The rndc-confgen program will easily create a suitable key file. To take advantage of this mechanism, you may want to: remove the /etc/bind/rndc.conf file remove the rndc key specification in the /etc/bind/named.conf file rndc-confgen -r /dev/urandom -a Alternatively, you can 'purge' the bind9 packages and reinstall them and you will end up with the new behavior since it is now the default. This is more secure than using a static key that isn't generated on a per-host basis, and is an easy alternative to more complex key schemes if you only need to use rndc to talk to named on the same host. [...] I believe that's probably all you need. In general, when in doubt about random strangeness on a Debian system, taking a peek at /usr/share/doc/[pkgname]/* is often a really good idea. From rick at linuxmafia.com Mon May 14 22:15:57 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 22:15:57 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] bindrndc In-Reply-To: <20070515050138.GD3141@linuxmafia.com> References: <585525.33393.qm@web36606.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20070515050138.GD3141@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20070515051557.GE3141@linuxmafia.com> I wrote: > Cutting to the chase, installation of my BIND9 package -- and presumably > yours -- had not run the utility required to generate that keypair. So, > rndc was inherently unable to authenticate. Therefore, it couldn't > issue the command to stop that is part of the reload instruction. Oh, and, as Michael suggests, one additional way I _could_ have been a doofus, but thankfully didn't manage, would have been to firewall off port 953/tcp even from localhost. Don't do that. ;-> This article tells more, including the older, more-fussy method of writing a /etc/bind/rndc.conf configuration file -- as opposed to the newer method of just running rndc-confgen to generate /etc/bind/rndc.key, detailed in a series of comments below the article (and in my earlier posting here): http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/343 From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon May 14 23:23:52 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 23:23:52 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] bindrndc In-Reply-To: <20070515051557.GE3141@linuxmafia.com> References: <585525.33393.qm@web36606.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20070515050138.GD3141@linuxmafia.com> <20070515051557.GE3141@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1179210231.464951f800e73@webmail.rawbw.com> Another niceity I stumbled across - at least in BIND 9.x, is that the rndc configuration file (e.g. /etc/rndc.conf) also respects the include statement - so by using include statement in both rndc.conf and named.conf, they can both access a common key file that way. Note that with chroot things get slightly more interesting (one will need the symbolic links and files in the appropriate places, e.g.: ls -l \ /etc/named-balug.conf \ /etc/rndc-balug.conf \ /etc/rndc-balug.key \ /var/named/chroot-balug/etc/named-balug.conf \ /var/named/chroot-balug/etc/rndc-balug.key \ /var/named/chroot-balug/var/run/named-balug.pid \ /var/run/named-balug.pid lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 44 May 12 09:05 /etc/named-balug.conf -> /var/named/chroot-balug/etc/named-balug.conf -rw-r----- 1 root balugdns 1163 May 12 09:37 /etc/rndc-balug.conf lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 42 May 12 09:05 /etc/rndc-balug.key -> /var/named/chroot-balug/etc/rndc-balug.key -rw-r----- 1 root balugdns 2079 May 13 08:08 /var/named/chroot-balug/etc/named-balug.conf -rw-r----- 1 root balugdns 138 May 12 09:19 /var/named/chroot-balug/etc/rndc-balug.key -rw-r--r-- 1 balugdns balugdns 5 May 13 08:25 /var/named/chroot-balug/var/run/named-balug.pid lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 47 May 13 08:25 /var/run/named-balug.pid -> /var/named/chroot-balug/var/run/named-balug.pid ) The example above is from a non-Debian system, ... so things may be a wee bit different for Etch (not to mention the above was customized to separate it out from the default nameserver chroot configuration - including also customized init scripts and some other tweaks). Quoting Rick Moen : > I wrote: > > > Cutting to the chase, installation of my BIND9 package -- and presumably > > yours -- had not run the utility required to generate that keypair. So, > > rndc was inherently unable to authenticate. Therefore, it couldn't > > issue the command to stop that is part of the reload instruction. > > Oh, and, as Michael suggests, one additional way I _could_ have been a > doofus, but thankfully didn't manage, would have been to firewall off > port 953/tcp even from localhost. Don't do that. ;-> > > This article tells more, including the older, more-fussy method of > writing a /etc/bind/rndc.conf configuration file -- as opposed to the > newer method of just running rndc-confgen to generate /etc/bind/rndc.key, > detailed in a series of comments below the article (and in my earlier > posting here): > > http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/343 From bill at wards.net Tue May 15 10:57:44 2007 From: bill at wards.net (Bill Ward) Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 10:57:44 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] PenLUG next week (NEW LOCATION): Building Scalable, Reliable Web Services using Open Source Technologies Message-ID: <3d2fe1780705151057s463f250dxadb603632280b543@mail.gmail.com> Join us on Thursday, May 24 for a presentation by Brett Thomas on "Building Scalable, Reliable Web Services using Open Source Technologies." Date: Thursday, May 24th, 2007 Time: meeting 7:00 - 9:00 PM, social/networking until 10 PM Location: Bayshore Technology Park 1300 Island Drive Redwood City, CA 94065 Suite 106 - Training Room (two doors down from the room we met in last time) Meeting room and food/drinks (FREE PIZZA!) courtesy of Qualys. Thanks, Qualys!! See www.penlug.org for more information, including directions (both driving and public transit). If you can, please RSVP by mailing rsvp at penlug.org to indicate you are coming and how many people you're bringing with you. It's not required but it helps us plan the right amount of food/drinks etc. We encourage you to take public transit (best bet: bicycle via Caltrain) or carpool to this meeting. Send mail to carpool at penlug.org for help finding a carpool buddy. Indicate where you are coming from / returning to, and whether you are willing/able to drive or not. About this month's presentation: Using real-world examples, learn how to design a complex, scalable web services system using open source technologies such as Linux, Apache, Perl, SOAP and Postgres. Discover the unexpected challenges as well as the rich opportunities available. Overall approach will be adaptable to any similar open source platforms. Before Vindicia, Mr. Thomas was Executive Vice President of Technology for EMusic, joining Mr. Hoffman shortly after the company was founded. While at EMusic, Mr. Thomas led a team of sixty-five employees and oversaw the technical integration of several geographically diverse enterprises utilizing multiple platforms. Mr. Thomas has been a professional software developer since 1989, and has management, contract and technical experience through roles at Network Associates, PGP, NCR, MCI and IBM. Mr. Thomas has particular expertise in the design and implementation of high transaction volume e-commerce systems, large-payload download infrastructures, conversion of paper documents to electronic formats, encryption and security. Note: The meeting will be in Bayshore Technology Park, Suite 106 - Training Room (same building, two doors down from the room where we met in April). The meeting is hosted by Qualys, whose offices are located in the Bayshore Technology Park. The meeting room is not, however, in the Qualys office itself. From krmdv at aim.com Tue May 15 11:49:40 2007 From: krmdv at aim.com (krmdv at aim.com) Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 14:49:40 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI In-Reply-To: <20070510221206.GB9155@linuxmafia.com> References: <8C9615575F52257-179C-55C7@WEBMAIL-DC14.sysops.aol.com> <20070510221206.GB9155@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <8C96538EDF1EDE0-1830-2358@mblk-r16.sysops.aol.com> I finally had a chance to speak with Spot about Christopher Blizzard's blog, and Spot did say that AMD was very vague with their statement at the Summit. One thing to note, during the Red Hat Annual Kickoff meeting in March, AMD was a keynote speaker on one of the days. AMD is obviously pushing their new AMD V chip sets and really want to continue the success they have had over Intel the past few years. Obviously with the Pentium-D chipsets, AMD took a step forward while Intel had to fix their cooling problem. Then multi-core hit, and next was Virtualization. Intel has pretty much caught up from the Pent-D days, and are now starting to take more market share with the Virtualization support they provide. Believe you me, AMD is watching this very closely and are pushing their AMD V chips very hard. When we started the Q&A session, I was the first to ask AMD what their plans were for Graphic Driver Support. They did give me the song and dance, but we at Red Hat have made it VERY clear that AMD must solve this problem. I stressed that they open source frglx drivers and leverage the open source community. They countered this quesitoning at the Summit with the response I had sent earlier. Will this come to fruition? I bevlieve it will. AMD knows they need to get this fixed or Intel will leave them in the dust. I work daily with one of the first T60p's that IBM/Intel released, and everday I wish I had a new T60p Developer model with the Intel i965 graphics chips. If any of you have seen the new Gnome Desktop affects on RHEL5, then you will understand why I want the Intel Graphics chip :) I work with virtualization everyday and battle with the lack of graphics driver support for ATI with Xen. There is one patch that is extremely outdated surfing around the net, but its not being maintained anymore :( It really should not be that difficult for ATI, but I guess I we will have to wait and see... Hope to see you all really soon! DK -----Original Message----- From: rick at linuxmafia.com To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Sent: Thu, 10 May 2007 3:12 PM Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI Quoting krmdv at aim.com (krmdv at aim.com): > Sorry for not making any of the recent meetings, but duty calls with > work sometimes :) Anyway, I thought my friends in the SF LUG would > like to hear the announcement of AMD is going to Open Source its > Graphic Drivers. > >> AMD will soon deliver open graphics drivers, said Henri Richard just >> a few minutes ago, and the audience at the opening keynote of the Red >> Hat Summit broke into applause and cheers. Richard, AMD's executive >> vice president of sales and marketing, promised: "I'm here to commit >> to you that it's going to get done." He also promised that AMD is >> "going to be very proactive in changing way we interface with the >> Linux community."... > > http://enterpriselinuxlog.blogs.techtarget.com/2007/05/09/amd-will-deliver-open-graphics-drivers/ We can certainly hope that Henri Richard actually _meant_ what the unidentified TechTarget blogger claimed he said -- but less giddy listeners have pointed out that Richard seems to have, actually, carefully avoiding stating any specific commitment, and never actually said anything about _open source_ drivers at all; that such comments are strictly in the minds of others _about_ what he said. Don Marti at http://www.linuxworld.com/community/?q=node/556 has: ATI getting its act together on licensing? Submitted by dmarti on Wed, 05/09/2007 - 6:12pm. Live from the Red Hat summit: ATI marketing guy makes happy noises about open source drivers, promises nothing specific. [link] (That's one step ahead of the old "our customers prefer proprietary drivers" line.) Chris Ball comments,[link] "If AMD/ATI were serious, the first thing they could do would be to allow Dave Airlie to release the open-source drivers he's *already written*." Is Intel's pioneering move on drivers having an effect? See you at FreedomHEC[link] -- yes, we'll have Jamey Sharp of X there along with many of the kernel crowd. Commentary at Christopher Blizzard's blog entry (Don's first link) includes other skeptics. Kernel coder Dave Jones said: I had conversations with ATI years ago at OLS where they said pretty much the same thing. I wouldn't hold your breath. "Axel" wrote: "commited to fixing the problem" could mean anything. Once there are actual open source drivers for modern ATI graphics cards, I will celebrate. Until then, I'm just waiting for Intel to release a standalone graphics card with DVI out. Christopher Blizzard replied: Well see what they do. Spot pointed out that he didn't say "open source", but the context for the statement was that they want to open up specs for people to be able to use the GPUs as more general purpose processors. I don't care if they open up their drivers or not, just as long as we have the support and the specs to be able to write our own. People are skeptical, and rightfully so, but I suspect that something here has changed. I'll try to gather more information during this week and see if I can get something more concrete on the topic. (And, in conclusion, Go, Intel i965!) _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug ________________________________________________________________________ Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and industry-leading spam and email virus protection. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alamozzz at yahoo.com Tue May 15 18:38:47 2007 From: alamozzz at yahoo.com (Adrien Lamothe) Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 18:38:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI In-Reply-To: <8C96538EDF1EDE0-1830-2358@mblk-r16.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <417695.5063.qm@web50504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> ATI made it very clear, a couple of months ago, that they have no plans to open up the drivers. In their statement, they cited concerns over DRM as the reason to stay closed. AMD may have purchased ATI, but that doesn't mean they can completely dictate policy at ATI. Intel opened up their graphics specs because they had nothing to lose and something to gain. ATI apparently thinks they will suffer a loss by opening specs to their graphics processors. krmdv at aim.com wrote: I finally had a chance to speak with Spot about Christopher Blizzard's blog, and Spot did say that AMD was very vague with their statement at the Summit. One thing to note, during the Red Hat Annual Kickoff meeting in March, AMD was a keynote speaker on one of the days. AMD is obviously pushing their new AMD V chip sets and really want to continue the success they have had over Intel the past few years. Obviously with the Pentium-D chipsets, AMD took a step forward while Intel had to fix their cooling problem. Then multi-core hit, and next was Virtualization. Intel has pretty much caught up from the Pent-D days, and are now starting to take more market share with the Virtualization support they provide. Believe you me, AMD is watching this very closely and are pushing their AMD V chips very hard. When we started the Q&A session, I was the first to ask AMD what their plans were for Graphic Driver Support. They did give me the song and dance, but we at Red Hat have made it VERY clear that AMD must solve this problem. I stressed that they open source frglx drivers and leverage the open source community. They countered this quesitoning at the Summit with the response I had sent earlier. Will this come to fruition? I bevlieve it will. AMD knows they need to get this fixed or Intel will leave them in the dust. I work daily with one of the first T60p's that IBM/Intel released, and everday I wish I had a new T60p Developer model with the Intel i965 graphics chips. If any of you have seen the new Gnome Desktop affects on RHEL5, then you will understand why I want the Intel Graphics chip :) I work with virtualization everyday and battle with the lack of graphics driver support for ATI with Xen. There is one patch that is extremely outdated surfing around the net, but its not being maintained anymore :( It really should not be that difficult for ATI, but I guess I we will have to wait and see... Hope to see you all really soon! DK -----Original Message----- From: rick at linuxmafia.com To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Sent: Thu, 10 May 2007 3:12 PM Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI Quoting krmdv at aim.com (krmdv at aim.com): > Sorry for not making any of the recent meetings, but duty calls with > work sometimes :) Anyway, I thought my friends in the SF LUG would > like to hear the announcement of AMD is going to Open Source its > Graphic Drivers. > >> AMD will soon deliver open graphics drivers, said Henri Richard just >> a few minutes ago, and the audience at the opening keynote of the Red >> Hat Summit broke into applause and cheers. Richard, AMD's executive >> vice president of sales and marketing, promised: "I'm here to commit >> to you that it's going to get done." He also promised that AMD is >> "going to be very proactive in changing way we interface with the >> Linux community."... > > http://enterpriselinuxlog.blogs.techtarget.com/2007/05/09/amd-will-deliver-open-graphics-drivers/ We can certainly hope that Henri Richard actually _meant_ what the unidentified TechTarget blogger claimed he said -- but less giddy listeners have pointed out that Richard seems to have, actually, carefully avoiding stating any specific commitment, and never actually said anything about _open source_ drivers at all; that such comments are strictly in the minds of others _about_ what he said. Don Marti at http://www.linuxworld.com/community/?q=node/556 has: ATI getting its act together on licensing? Submitted by dmarti on Wed, 05/09/2007 - 6:12pm. Live from the Red Hat summit: ATI marketing guy makes happy noises about open source drivers, promises nothing specific. [link] (That's one step ahead of the old "our customers prefer proprietary drivers" line.) Chris Ball comments,[link] "If AMD/ATI were serious, the first thing they could do would be to allow Dave Airlie to release the open-source drivers he's *already written*." Is Intel's pioneering move on drivers having an effect? See you at FreedomHEC[link] -- yes, we'll have Jamey Sharp of X there along with many of the kernel crowd. Commentary at Christopher Blizzard's blog entry (Don's first link) includes other skeptics. Kernel coder Dave Jones said: I had conversations with ATI years ago at OLS where they said pretty much the same thing. I wouldn't hold your breath. "Axel" wrote: "commited to fixing the problem" could mean anything. Once there are actual open source drivers for modern ATI graphics cards, I will celebrate. Until then, I'm just waiting for Intel to release a standalone graphics card with DVI out. Christopher Blizzard replied: Well see what they do. Spot pointed out that he didn't say "open source", but the context for the statement was that they want to open up specs for people to be able to use the GPUs as more general purpose processors. I don't care if they open up their drivers or not, just as long as we have the support and the specs to be able to write our own. People are skeptical, and rightfully so, but I suspect that something here has changed. I'll try to gather more information during this week and see if I can get something more concrete on the topic. (And, in conclusion, Go, Intel i965!) _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug --------------------------------- Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and industry-leading spam and email virus protection. _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug --------------------------------- Got a little couch potato? Check out fun summer activities for kids. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alamozzz at yahoo.com Tue May 15 18:48:00 2007 From: alamozzz at yahoo.com (Adrien Lamothe) Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 18:48:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI In-Reply-To: <8C96538EDF1EDE0-1830-2358@mblk-r16.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <188801.10424.qm@web50506.mail.re2.yahoo.com> AMD processors apparently are about to leapfrog Intel again. AMD expects to soon regain the performance lead and keep it until the end of 2008. Despite this, AMD definitely has to do something to gain market share. They actually have been doing well in the low and mid-range server market, where Sun Microsystems has been selling AMD based servers like they were hot cakes. The big problem system vendors face, especially in the "consumer" end of the computer market, is that once they completely break away from Microsoft and WinTel, they may not be able to go back. So, unless they can make as much or more money after the break, they will be in big trouble. For this reason, I expect Linux to establish itself in a number of niche markets, with newer system manufacturers appearing to service those markets. Companies like ATI have to decide if the sum of those niche players equals the size of their current market. krmdv at aim.com wrote: I finally had a chance to speak with Spot about Christopher Blizzard's blog, and Spot did say that AMD was very vague with their statement at the Summit. One thing to note, during the Red Hat Annual Kickoff meeting in March, AMD was a keynote speaker on one of the days. AMD is obviously pushing their new AMD V chip sets and really want to continue the success they have had over Intel the past few years. Obviously with the Pentium-D chipsets, AMD took a step forward while Intel had to fix their cooling problem. Then multi-core hit, and next was Virtualization. Intel has pretty much caught up from the Pent-D days, and are now starting to take more market share with the Virtualization support they provide. Believe you me, AMD is watching this very closely and are pushing their AMD V chips very hard. When we started the Q&A session, I was the first to ask AMD what their plans were for Graphic Driver Support. They did give me the song and dance, but we at Red Hat have made it VERY clear that AMD must solve this problem. I stressed that they open source frglx drivers and leverage the open source community. They countered this quesitoning at the Summit with the response I had sent earlier. Will this come to fruition? I bevlieve it will. AMD knows they need to get this fixed or Intel will leave them in the dust. I work daily with one of the first T60p's that IBM/Intel released, and everday I wish I had a new T60p Developer model with the Intel i965 graphics chips. If any of you have seen the new Gnome Desktop affects on RHEL5, then you will understand why I want the Intel Graphics chip :) I work with virtualization everyday and battle with the lack of graphics driver support for ATI with Xen. There is one patch that is extremely outdated surfing around the net, but its not being maintained anymore :( It really should not be that difficult for ATI, but I guess I we will have to wait and see... Hope to see you all really soon! DK -----Original Message----- From: rick at linuxmafia.com To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Sent: Thu, 10 May 2007 3:12 PM Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI Quoting krmdv at aim.com (krmdv at aim.com): > Sorry for not making any of the recent meetings, but duty calls with > work sometimes :) Anyway, I thought my friends in the SF LUG would > like to hear the announcement of AMD is going to Open Source its > Graphic Drivers. > >> AMD will soon deliver open graphics drivers, said Henri Richard just >> a few minutes ago, and the audience at the opening keynote of the Red >> Hat Summit broke into applause and cheers. Richard, AMD's executive >> vice president of sales and marketing, promised: "I'm here to commit >> to you that it's going to get done." He also promised that AMD is >> "going to be very proactive in changing way we interface with the >> Linux community."... > > http://enterpriselinuxlog.blogs.techtarget.com/2007/05/09/amd-will-deliver-open-graphics-drivers/ We can certainly hope that Henri Richard actually _meant_ what the unidentified TechTarget blogger claimed he said -- but less giddy listeners have pointed out that Richard seems to have, actually, carefully avoiding stating any specific commitment, and never actually said anything about _open source_ drivers at all; that such comments are strictly in the minds of others _about_ what he said. Don Marti at http://www.linuxworld.com/community/?q=node/556 has: ATI getting its act together on licensing? Submitted by dmarti on Wed, 05/09/2007 - 6:12pm. Live from the Red Hat summit: ATI marketing guy makes happy noises about open source drivers, promises nothing specific. [link] (That's one step ahead of the old "our customers prefer proprietary drivers" line.) Chris Ball comments,[link] "If AMD/ATI were serious, the first thing they could do would be to allow Dave Airlie to release the open-source drivers he's *already written*." Is Intel's pioneering move on drivers having an effect? See you at FreedomHEC[link] -- yes, we'll have Jamey Sharp of X there along with many of the kernel crowd. Commentary at Christopher Blizzard's blog entry (Don's first link) includes other skeptics. Kernel coder Dave Jones said: I had conversations with ATI years ago at OLS where they said pretty much the same thing. I wouldn't hold your breath. "Axel" wrote: "commited to fixing the problem" could mean anything. Once there are actual open source drivers for modern ATI graphics cards, I will celebrate. Until then, I'm just waiting for Intel to release a standalone graphics card with DVI out. Christopher Blizzard replied: Well see what they do. Spot pointed out that he didn't say "open source", but the context for the statement was that they want to open up specs for people to be able to use the GPUs as more general purpose processors. I don't care if they open up their drivers or not, just as long as we have the support and the specs to be able to write our own. People are skeptical, and rightfully so, but I suspect that something here has changed. I'll try to gather more information during this week and see if I can get something more concrete on the topic. (And, in conclusion, Go, Intel i965!) _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug --------------------------------- Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and industry-leading spam and email virus protection. _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug --------------------------------- Need Mail bonding? Go to the Yahoo! Mail Q&A for great tips from Yahoo! Answers users. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Wed May 16 13:07:03 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Wed, 16 May 2007 13:07:03 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Hot From the Red Hat Press: AMD to Open Source ATI In-Reply-To: <417695.5063.qm@web50504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <8C96538EDF1EDE0-1830-2358@mblk-r16.sysops.aol.com> <417695.5063.qm@web50504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20070516200702.GC31697@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Adrien Lamothe (alamozzz at yahoo.com): > ATI made it very clear, a couple of months ago, that they have no > plans to open up the drivers. In their statement, they cited concerns > over DRM as the reason to stay closed. AMD may have purchased ATI, but > that doesn't mean they can completely dictate policy at ATI. > > Intel opened up their graphics specs because they had nothing to lose > and something to gain. ATI apparently thinks they will suffer a loss > by opening specs to their graphics processors. Thank you for that. I certainly don't take personal offence at the frantic PR spin (still) emerging from ATI/AMD, but it (still) shouldn't be confused with anything real. Something real might emerge from ATI in the future, but, in the meantime, "Go, Intel i965!" Flashback: In 2000, Adaptec sent a delegation of engineers to $BIG_LINUX_FIRM where I was working, seeking help learning how to work with the open source community and improve the state of the Linux drivers for their SCSI HBAs. Now, you might ask, why would Adaptec need to do this, when for years their announcements of support for Linux and open source had been at least as fervent as ATI's are now? Why? Because those announcements had been bullshit, because Linux sysadmins hadn't been fooled, and because Adaptec management noticed massive mindshare loss in the small but vital Linux market to Buslogic/Mylex, whose HBAs and kernel-mainline drivers worked better on Linux. There's a lesson there, somewhere. From jim at well.com Wed May 16 17:34:36 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 16 May 2007 17:34:36 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: USENIX Super User Group Meeting Message-ID: <5b1afef5bd2a405b36cabc39dfa7b63d@well.com> the annual tech is in Santa Clara June 17-22, per Jennifer's email to us c/o me. opinions? > From: Jennifer Peterson > Date: May 16, 2007 3:30:03 PM PDT > To: jim stockford > Subject: USENIX Super User Group Meeting > > Hi Jim, > > I hope you received the Annual Tech brochures and USENIX give-aways. I > just wanted to see if your group would be interested in holding its > June meeting at the conference, or if you would be interested in > working together on a Super User Group Meeting at Annual Tech. > > Also, would you be willing to put the USENIX Annual Tech button on > your website in exchange for a registration discount for your members? > > Please let me know if you'd be interested. > > Thank you! > > Jennifer Peterson > Marketing & Conference Assistant > USENIX Association > 2560 Ninth St., Suite 215 > Berkeley, CA 94710 > ph 510-647-6726 > fax 510-548-5738 > jpeterson at usenix.org > From Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com Wed May 16 19:47:42 2007 From: Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com (Blake Haggerty) Date: 16 May 2007 22:47:42 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] Makers Fair!! Message-ID: <32671494.1179370065062.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> Not sure if this has been brought to the attention of the list yet but this weekend there is a Makers fair in San Mateo. There will be all sorts of cool projects on display and stuff you can fiddle with yourselves. I figure since all open source users are makers at heart this would be something cool to check out. Build, Craft, Hack, Play MAKE http://makerfaire.com/ Also I highly recomend a subscription to this magazine ( a little pricey but worth it ) www.makezine.com Best Regards, Blake M. Haggerty Technical Recruiter Sapphire Technologies Phone #415-788-8488 Fax #415-788-2592 The information transmitted in this e-mail is for the exclusive use of the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain privileged or confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from reading, printing, duplicating, disseminating or otherwise using or acting in reliance upon this information. If you have received this information in error, please notify the sender at Sapphire Technologies immediately, delete this information from your computer and destroy all copies of the information. Thank you. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Thu May 17 06:23:41 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 06:23:41 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] meeting Monday evening at Javacat Message-ID: SF-LUG meeting come on down to the Javacat on Geary at 20th avenue in SF from 6 PM to 8 PM or so. From jim at well.com Thu May 17 06:27:46 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 06:27:46 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] the bin full of laptops Message-ID: I tho't some of you'd be interested, after the noise, that this is actually in the works. the mysterious person has given me, jim, the bin full of laptops with the expressed wish to pass them out to veterans, per Susan's request. I've got to gussy them up a bit--get the old data off, put linux on, one needs a hard drive (which is coming, compliments of the mysterious person). The linux distro that I'm considering is Ubuntu. Anybody got opinions? the laptops do not have wi-fi, so wi-fi is a matter of getting PCMCIA cards. Opinions are welcome. From jasonstone at gmail.com Thu May 17 07:19:33 2007 From: jasonstone at gmail.com (jason stone) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 07:19:33 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] the bin full of laptops In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <308CBC60-6680-412E-97C7-3775DE6BB14D@gmail.com> I would recommend DBAN for wiping the drives - http://dban.sourceforge.net/ and instead of plain vanilla Ubuntu on these older laptops, install Xubuntu, which skips the vanilla and is still usable, but lighter in weight. Among other things, it uses XFCE instead of Gnome. - http://www.xubuntu.org/ -jasonstone On May 17, 2007, at 6:27 AM, jim stockford wrote: > > I tho't some of you'd be interested, after the noise, > that this is actually in the works. > > the mysterious person has given me, jim, the bin > full of laptops with the expressed wish to pass them > out to veterans, per Susan's request. > I've got to gussy them up a bit--get the old data off, > put linux on, one needs a hard drive (which is > coming, compliments of the mysterious person). > The linux distro that I'm considering is Ubuntu. > Anybody got opinions? > the laptops do not have wi-fi, so wi-fi is a matter > of getting PCMCIA cards. Opinions are welcome. > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From mthaddon at yahoo.com Thu May 17 07:34:46 2007 From: mthaddon at yahoo.com (Tom Haddon) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 07:34:46 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] the bin full of laptops In-Reply-To: <308CBC60-6680-412E-97C7-3775DE6BB14D@gmail.com> References: <308CBC60-6680-412E-97C7-3775DE6BB14D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1179412486.13800.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2007-05-17 at 07:19 -0700, jason stone wrote: > I would recommend DBAN for wiping the drives > - http://dban.sourceforge.net/ > > and instead of plain vanilla Ubuntu on these older laptops, install > Xubuntu, which skips the vanilla and is still usable, but lighter in > weight. Among other things, it uses XFCE instead of Gnome. > - http://www.xubuntu.org/ > I think that would depend on the specs. Personally if they have more than 256MB RAM (ideally 512MB or more), I would go with vanilla Ubuntu, otherwise I'd defer to the Xubuntu suggestion... > > -jasonstone > > > > > On May 17, 2007, at 6:27 AM, jim stockford wrote: > > > > > I tho't some of you'd be interested, after the noise, > > that this is actually in the works. > > > > the mysterious person has given me, jim, the bin > > full of laptops with the expressed wish to pass them > > out to veterans, per Susan's request. > > I've got to gussy them up a bit--get the old data off, > > put linux on, one needs a hard drive (which is > > coming, compliments of the mysterious person). > > The linux distro that I'm considering is Ubuntu. > > Anybody got opinions? > > the laptops do not have wi-fi, so wi-fi is a matter > > of getting PCMCIA cards. Opinions are welcome. > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug Tom Haddon mailto:mthaddon at yahoo.com Q: How many hardware engineers does it take to change a light bulb? A: None. We'll fix it in software. Q: How many system programmers does it take to change a light bulb? A: None. The application can work around it. Q: How many software engineers does it take to change a light bulb? A: None. We'll document it in the manual. Q: How many tech writers does it take to change a light bulb? A: None. The user can figure it out. ----------------- Random quotes courtesy of fortune. From bliss at california.com Thu May 17 13:04:41 2007 From: bliss at california.com (bobbie sellers) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 13:04:41 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] the bin full of laptops In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi jim stockford, n 05/17/07, you wrote: > I tho't some of you'd be interested, after the noise, > that this is actually in the works. > the mysterious person has given me, jim, the bin > full of laptops with the expressed wish to pass them > out to veterans, per Susan's request. > I've got to gussy them up a bit--get the old data off, > put linux on, one needs a hard drive (which is > coming, compliments of the mysterious person). > The linux distro that I'm considering is Ubuntu. > Anybody got opinions? > the laptops do not have wi-fi, so wi-fi is a matter > of getting PCMCIA cards. Opinions are welcome. I will see if the homecare provider who wishes to have a laptop feels she can afford to pay for a wireless card and offer her my assistance in the ordering of same. Meantime I downloaded the current DSL iso and made a boot install disk which might be useful for those binned machines with a cd-rom and a smaller capacity drive and less memory. later bliss -- bobbie sellers - (Back to Angband) Team *AMIGA* bliss at california dot com I like pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals. -- Winston Churchill From aldenm at gmail.com Thu May 17 13:23:29 2007 From: aldenm at gmail.com (Alden Meneses) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 13:23:29 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] the bin full of laptops In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <221610dc0705171323w25877391p31821fe93f17fc57@mail.gmail.com> are we going to handle the laptops during the meeting on Monday? On 5/17/07, bobbie sellers wrote: > > Hi jim stockford, n 05/17/07, you wrote: > > > > I tho't some of you'd be interested, after the noise, > > that this is actually in the works. > > > the mysterious person has given me, jim, the bin > > full of laptops with the expressed wish to pass them > > out to veterans, per Susan's request. > > I've got to gussy them up a bit--get the old data off, > > put linux on, one needs a hard drive (which is > > coming, compliments of the mysterious person). > > The linux distro that I'm considering is Ubuntu. > > Anybody got opinions? > > the laptops do not have wi-fi, so wi-fi is a matter > > of getting PCMCIA cards. Opinions are welcome. > > I will see if the homecare provider who wishes to have > a laptop feels she can afford to pay for a wireless card and > offer her my assistance in the ordering of same. > > Meantime I downloaded the current DSL iso and made a boot > install disk which might be useful for those binned machines > with a cd-rom and a smaller capacity drive and less memory. > > later > bliss > > -- > bobbie sellers - (Back to Angband) Team *AMIGA* > bliss at california dot com > > I like pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs > treat us as equals. -- Winston Churchill > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rondosxx at yahoo.com Fri May 18 15:00:33 2007 From: rondosxx at yahoo.com (ron) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 15:00:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] the bin full of laptops Message-ID: <510539.54611.qm@web52503.mail.re2.yahoo.com> jim, starting next week I can volunteer to help with whatever needs to be done to rehabilitate the bin of laptops. Spring semester will be over for me Monday night at 9 pm! ron ____________________________________________________________________________________Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Fri May 18 22:46:04 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 22:46:04 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] wanted: DNS "slaves" (/"secondaries") for BALUG Message-ID: <1179553564.464e8f1c43204@webmail.rawbw.com> wanted: DNS "slaves" (/"secondaries") for BALUG The Bay Area Linux Users Group (BALUG) is seeking organizations/entities/persons that would be interested in and able to donate DNS "slave" (/"secondary") services to BALUG. If you are able to do so (also feel free to forward this along if you may know someone who can do so), please drop a quick e-mail reply to me containing at least: geographic location(s) of potential slave servers: (city, state/province, and country is sufficiently detailed, we're mostly interested in locations outside of San Francisco, as our primary master will be in colo facility in San Francisco) terse synopsis of how high (or not so highly) available: (e.g. static IP on dialup, or high availability service virtualized on redundant systems at a colocation facility, or ???) supported by: (would it be supported by an individual, or an organization/company, or ???) Note that we'll likely want "slaves" in place and operational before making the more significant TLD delegation changes (until that's completed, our DNS data will closely parallel the Internet delegated DNS data). Oh, ... and yes we can also probably generally provide "slave"(/"secondary") DNS services for those interested (just let me know if you're interested in that; as our colo space and bandwidth is being donated to us, we might not be able to offer such to commercial entities, but can probably cover individuals, non-profits, user groups, and the like). Much thanks for any and all DNS "slave" offers. Apologies in advance if I don't respond to all such offers (we may receive more offers than we could possibly make practical use of; much thanks in any case!). If you're interested in our providing secondary services, just let me know, and I will get back to you. From paul at astropaul.com Tue May 22 02:27:37 2007 From: paul at astropaul.com (Paul Reilly) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 10:27:37 +0100 Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? Message-ID: <1179826057.4652b7899a834@mail.third-rock.net> Hello, I'm just wondering what is the hourly going rate for sysadmin work? For example, I need someone to install a few things, write a few scripts to automate the process, and generally get a box up & running quickly, installing various apps etc. What's the going rate? Paul From agrimm at gmail.com Tue May 22 06:57:48 2007 From: agrimm at gmail.com (Andy Grimm) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 06:57:48 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? In-Reply-To: <1179826057.4652b7899a834@mail.third-rock.net> References: <1179826057.4652b7899a834@mail.third-rock.net> Message-ID: <6d4878ee0705220657q1452d484s2de4e2e6b3c4214d@mail.gmail.com> I think your answer is going to vary widely depending on the complexity of the work, and whether you want some college kid working for beer money or a proper consultant who's trying to feed a family. On the low end you might find somebody for $25/hr. The high end could cost you over three times that. (I am speculating on the low end a bit). --andy On 5/22/07, Paul Reilly wrote: > > Hello, > > I'm just wondering what is the hourly going rate for > sysadmin work? For example, I need someone to install > a few things, write a few scripts to automate the process, > and generally get a box up & running quickly, installing > various apps etc. > > What's the going rate? > > Paul > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From lantechie at yahoo.com Tue May 22 07:29:25 2007 From: lantechie at yahoo.com (Ola Peters) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 07:29:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Sysadmin work hourly rates? Message-ID: <549537.51594.qm@web80601.mail.mud.yahoo.com> average for this kind of work is between $40 and $45 an hour, maybe a little more if it's short term. Paul Reilly wrote: Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 10:27:37 +0100 From: Paul Reilly To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? Hello, I'm just wondering what is the hourly going rate for sysadmin work? For example, I need someone to install a few things, write a few scripts to automate the process, and generally get a box up & running quickly, installing various apps etc. What's the going rate? Paul _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Tue May 22 09:45:16 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 09:45:16 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? In-Reply-To: <1179826057.4652b7899a834@mail.third-rock.net> References: <1179826057.4652b7899a834@mail.third-rock.net> Message-ID: <20070522164516.GB5662@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Paul Reilly (paul at astropaul.com): > I'm just wondering what is the hourly going rate for sysadmin work? One reason you won't see much discussion of this subject online is that it risks directly contravening the laws against price-fixing. Quoting the Wikipedia article, on same: Under American law, exchanging prices among competitors can also violate the antitrust laws. This includes exchanging prices with either the intent to fix prices or if the exchange affects the prices individual competitors set. Proof that competitors have shared prices can be used as part of the evidence of an illegal price fixing agreement. Experts generally advise that competitors avoid even the appearance of agreeing on price. Under U.S. law, price fixing is illegal only if it is intentional and comes about via communication or agreement between firms or individuals. It is not illegal for a firm to copy the price movements of a de facto market leader called price leadership, which has been seen to be the case in markets for breakfast cereals and cigarettes. But informal agreements or unspoken agreements to fix price also can violate the antitrust laws. The Linux User Group HOWTO, at http://en.tldp.org/HOWTO/User-Group-HOWTO-7.html includes this warning: 7.2 Other legal issues [...] Antitrust It's healthy to discuss the consulting business in general in user group forums, but for antitrust legal reasons it's a bad idea to get into "How much do you charge to do [foo]?" discussions, there. -- Cheers, "Of course, NIMBYism is perfectly fine for other Rick Moen places, but we certainly shouldn't allow it in rick at linuxmafia.com _our_ town." -- Rick M., going meta on his $SPOUSE From paul at astropaul.com Tue May 22 22:11:44 2007 From: paul at astropaul.com (Paul Reilly) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 06:11:44 +0100 Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? In-Reply-To: <20070522164516.GB5662@linuxmafia.com> References: <1179826057.4652b7899a834@mail.third-rock.net> <20070522164516.GB5662@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1179897104.4653cd1072780@mail.third-rock.net> OK thanks all. That gives me an idea of what to expect. Also thanks Rick for the interesting take on it! I wonder how that relates to salary surveys, like that conducted by SAGE? http://www.sage.org/salsurv/ Paul From rick at linuxmafia.com Wed May 23 15:28:22 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 15:28:22 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? In-Reply-To: <1179897104.4653cd1072780@mail.third-rock.net> References: <1179826057.4652b7899a834@mail.third-rock.net> <20070522164516.GB5662@linuxmafia.com> <1179897104.4653cd1072780@mail.third-rock.net> Message-ID: <20070523222822.GB25427@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Paul Reilly (paul at astropaul.com): > Also thanks Rick for the interesting take on it! > I wonder how that relates to salary surveys, like > that conducted by SAGE? http://www.sage.org/salsurv/ Basically: Salary surveys are not an arrangement made among a group of competitors to coordinate prices. The more something resembles the latter, the more it risks being the target of a legal action to curb price-fixing. From sverma at sfsu.edu Wed May 23 17:26:02 2007 From: sverma at sfsu.edu (Sameer Verma) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 17:26:02 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu Live Message-ID: <4654DB9A.60804@sfsu.edu> Dear SF-LUG'ers, I am presenting at Ubuntu Live this year (http://www.ubuntulive.com/cs/ubuntu/view/e_spkr/3457). UbuntuLive has passed along a special 35% discount for folks planning to attend. Enter code ubu07ucm in the Discount Code field in Registration http://www.ubuntulive.com/pub/w/60/register.html Early registration discount ends June 4th, and the above discount can be used in conjunction with the early registration discount (an additional $150) for greater savings, so you may want to sign up before June 4. Hope this is useful to some of you. cheers, Sameer -- Dr. Sameer Verma, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Information Systems San Francisco State University San Francisco CA 94132 USA http://verma.sfsu.edu/ http://opensource.sfsu.edu/ From opeters at pacbell.net Wed May 23 19:58:31 2007 From: opeters at pacbell.net (Ola Peters) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 19:58:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? Message-ID: <757704.37370.qm@web80615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Forgive me Father, for I have sinned and recommended a consulting rate. ;-) Rick Moen wrote: Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 15:28:22 -0700 To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com From: Rick Moen Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? Quoting Paul Reilly (paul at astropaul.com): > Also thanks Rick for the interesting take on it! > I wonder how that relates to salary surveys, like > that conducted by SAGE? http://www.sage.org/salsurv/ Basically: Salary surveys are not an arrangement made among a group of competitors to coordinate prices. The more something resembles the latter, the more it risks being the target of a legal action to curb price-fixing. _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Wed May 23 21:09:16 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 21:09:16 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? In-Reply-To: <757704.37370.qm@web80615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <757704.37370.qm@web80615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20070524040915.GA11128@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Ola Peters (opeters at pacbell.net): > Forgive me Father, for I have sinned and recommended a consulting rate. > > ;-) What was that old (probably apocryphal) story about the traditional Chinese curse? "May you live in interesting times. May you get everything you wish for. May you come to the attention of people in high places. May your friends always be at your back. And may your enemies be patient." Generally, as long as you never land in the middle of money disputes, nor come to the attention of people in high places, you can indulge risky habits and not regret it. Until the day when you do regret it, of course. ;-> From colinross at gmail.com Thu May 24 00:13:25 2007 From: colinross at gmail.com (Colin Ross) Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 00:13:25 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? In-Reply-To: <20070524040915.GA11128@linuxmafia.com> References: <757704.37370.qm@web80615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20070524040915.GA11128@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: If not charging a flat-rate, I charge $40 an hour for install/configure/etc. If it a troubleshooting/advanced project / custom scripting etc. it can be more. ...and if they wanna 'crack down' on me for saying that, I'm movin' to Europe. ;) Colin On 5/23/07, Rick Moen wrote: > > Quoting Ola Peters (opeters at pacbell.net): > > > Forgive me Father, for I have sinned and recommended a consulting rate. > > > > ;-) > > What was that old (probably apocryphal) story about the traditional > Chinese curse? > > "May you live in interesting times. May you get everything you wish > for. May you come to the attention of people in high places. May your > friends always be at your back. And may your enemies be patient." > > Generally, as long as you never land in the middle of money disputes, > nor come to the attention of people in high places, you can indulge > risky habits and not regret it. > > Until the day when you do regret it, of course. ;-> > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Thu May 24 00:24:57 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 00:24:57 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? In-Reply-To: References: <757704.37370.qm@web80615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20070524040915.GA11128@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <20070524072457.GA13326@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Colin Ross (colinross at gmail.com): > If not charging a flat-rate, I charge $40 an hour for > install/configure/etc. If it a troubleshooting/advanced project / > custom scripting etc. it can be more. > > ...and if they wanna 'crack down' on me for saying that, I'm movin' to > Europe. ;) With all respect for your business -- and may it thrive -- I honestly doubt any prosecutor will allege conspiracy to drive up sysadmin consulting rates to the extortionate level of $40/hour. ;-> From bill at wards.net Thu May 24 07:08:17 2007 From: bill at wards.net (Bill Ward) Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 07:08:17 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] PenLUG tonight (NEW LOCATION): Building Scalable, Reliable Web Services using Open Source Technologies Message-ID: <3d2fe1780705240708t42c75846h8f1a964e244ba57d@mail.gmail.com> Join us TONIGHT, Thursday, May 24 for a presentation by Brett Thomas on "Building Scalable, Reliable Web Services using Open Source Technologies." Date: Thursday, May 24th, 2007 Time: meeting 7:00 - 9:00 PM, social/networking until 10 PM Location: Bayshore Technology Park 1300 Island Drive Redwood City, CA 94065 Suite 106 - Training Room (two doors down from the room we met in last time) Meeting room and food/drinks (FREE PIZZA!) courtesy of Qualys. Thanks, Qualys!! See www.penlug.org for more information, including directions (both driving and public transit). If you can, please RSVP by mailing rsvp at penlug.org to indicate you are coming and how many people you're bringing with you. It's not required but it helps us plan the right amount of food/drinks etc. We encourage you to take public transit (best bet: bicycle via Caltrain) or carpool to this meeting. Send mail to carpool at penlug.org for help finding a carpool buddy. Indicate where you are coming from / returning to, and whether you are willing/able to drive or not. About this month's presentation: Using real-world examples, learn how to design a complex, scalable web services system using open source technologies such as Linux, Apache, Perl, SOAP and Postgres. Discover the unexpected challenges as well as the rich opportunities available. Overall approach will be adaptable to any similar open source platforms. Before Vindicia, Mr. Thomas was Executive Vice President of Technology for EMusic, joining Mr. Hoffman shortly after the company was founded. While at EMusic, Mr. Thomas led a team of sixty-five employees and oversaw the technical integration of several geographically diverse enterprises utilizing multiple platforms. Mr. Thomas has been a professional software developer since 1989, and has management, contract and technical experience through roles at Network Associates, PGP, NCR, MCI and IBM. Mr. Thomas has particular expertise in the design and implementation of high transaction volume e-commerce systems, large-payload download infrastructures, conversion of paper documents to electronic formats, encryption and security. Note: The meeting will be in Bayshore Technology Park, Suite 106 - Training Room (same building, two doors down from the room where we met in April). The meeting is hosted by Qualys, whose offices are located in the Bayshore Technology Park. The meeting room is not, however, in the Qualys office itself. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lantechie at yahoo.com Thu May 24 07:18:46 2007 From: lantechie at yahoo.com (Ola Peters) Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 07:18:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? Message-ID: <211577.80911.qm@web80601.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Lived in Italy for a few years and I am telling ya, it was great!!! But keep in mind, :::snerk:::, they have tax police that pay surprise visits and check your books.... Colin Ross wrote: Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 00:13:25 -0700 From: "Colin Ross" To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Sysadmin work hourly rates? If not charging a flat-rate, I charge $40 an hour for install/configure/etc. If it a troubleshooting/advanced project / custom scripting etc. it can be more. ...and if they wanna 'crack down' on me for saying that, I'm movin' to Europe. ;) Colin On 5/23/07, Rick Moen wrote: Quoting Ola Peters (opeters at pacbell.net): > Forgive me Father, for I have sinned and recommended a consulting rate. > > ;-) What was that old (probably apocryphal) story about the traditional Chinese curse? "May you live in interesting times. May you get everything you wish for. May you come to the attention of people in high places. May your friends always be at your back. And may your enemies be patient." Generally, as long as you never land in the middle of money disputes, nor come to the attention of people in high places, you can indulge risky habits and not regret it. Until the day when you do regret it, of course. ;-> _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From rick at linuxmafia.com Thu May 24 12:13:00 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 12:13:00 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] (forw) Re: [Evals] Linux at the Indy 500 Message-ID: <20070524191300.GC13326@linuxmafia.com> To give them credit, Starks and Devine actually _did_ do something with the donation money. ----- Forwarded message from Rick Moen ----- Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 12:10:20 -0700 To: evals at lists.merlins.org From: Rick Moen Subject: Re: [Evals] Linux at the Indy 500 Quoting Ed Holden (ed.holden at verari.com): > http://news.com.com/Photos+Linux+penguin+to+race+in+the+Indy+500/2300-11 > 389_3-6186004-1.html?part=rss&tag=6186004&subj=news Promoters of this initiative are Kenneth Starks ("helios") and Derrick Devine aka Derrick Penner ("devnet"), who've been running a noisy money-raising campaign at Linux-community Web/news sites. I'm impressed at how much attention their _campaign_ has gotten. By comparison, honestly, what's the likelihood a couple of tiny, expensive penguin stickers[1] on an Indy 500 car (a car that probably won't even be a contender, being in starting position #31) will even _register_ with the Indy-watching public, let alone build awareness about a computer operating system? I predict that, if people notice it at all, they'll assume "Linux" is some obscure soft drink not carried by their local supermarkets. I also predict that, when _that_ happens, Starks and Devine will blame the "community" for donating insufficient money. [1] I also see advertising logos on the car for Miller-Eads, Honda, Firestone, TMD(?), Chastain Motorsports, and several others.) ----- End forwarded message ----- From wombat at zork.net Thu May 24 16:14:01 2007 From: wombat at zork.net (Willy Lee) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 00:14:01 +0100 Subject: [sf-lug] Dell preinstalling Ubuntu machines Message-ID: <7cr6p5hl1i.fsf@frotz.zork.net> http://www.dell.com/open Hmm, maybe worth a look! =wl -- The grand leap of the whale up the Fall of Niagara is esteemed, by all who have seen it, as one of the finest spectacles in nature. -- Benjamin Franklin. From colinross at gmail.com Thu May 24 21:52:48 2007 From: colinross at gmail.com (Colin Ross) Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 21:52:48 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Dell preinstalling Ubuntu machines In-Reply-To: <7cr6p5hl1i.fsf@frotz.zork.net> References: <7cr6p5hl1i.fsf@frotz.zork.net> Message-ID: Nice for consumers, although they have been offering preinstalls of a couple flavors of linux on there servers for a couple years now... colin On 5/24/07, Willy Lee wrote: > > http://www.dell.com/open > > Hmm, maybe worth a look! > > =wl > -- > The grand leap of the whale up the Fall of Niagara is esteemed, by all > who have seen it, as one of the finest spectacles in nature. > -- Benjamin Franklin. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Sat May 26 08:34:38 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 08:34:38 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Linux volunteer Message-ID: any one want to help Ubuntu-fy P-II boxes for this project? Begin forwarded message: > From: "Kami Griffiths" > Date: May 18, 2007 11:45:07 AM PDT > To: > Subject: Linux volunteer > > > Jim, > ? > I am working with the International Institute of San Francisco, they > provide provides a variety of services to immigrant communities. They > have 12 old Pentium II computers that they?d like to put in a senior > housing complex and are hoping to salvage them by using Ubuntu. Do you > know of anyone who would be interested in volunteering to help with > this project? > ? > Thanks! > _________________________________ > Kami Griffiths > CompuMentor, Senior Program Associate > 525 Brannan Street,? Suite 300 > San Francisco, CA 94107 > P: 415-633-9392? F: 415-633-9400 > kami at compumentor.org > ? > www.compumentor.org?? Bringing people and technology together to > strengthen our communities > www.techsoup.org? Technology served the way nonprofits need it, > powered by CompuMentor > ? From sverma at sfsu.edu Sat May 26 10:26:05 2007 From: sverma at sfsu.edu (Sameer Verma) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 10:26:05 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Linux volunteer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <46586DAD.60502@sfsu.edu> jim stockford wrote: > any one want to help Ubuntu-fy P-II boxes for > this project? > Given that these are PII boxes, I would suggest Xubuntu (XFCE-based) instead of Ubuntu (GNOME-based) or Kubuntu (KDE-based). If all these machines will be in the same room, they should also look into the possibility of using LTSP which is a breeze to install and configure under Ubuntu 7.04 and its variants. The PII boxes in the LTSP example will boot off the network and will need a 100Mbps switch and a server in the back. I'm busy with end-of-semester duties, so I cannot personally assist. Sameer -- Dr. Sameer Verma, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Information Systems San Francisco State University San Francisco CA 94132 USA http://verma.sfsu.edu/ http://opensource.sfsu.edu/ From cathjone at eskimo.com Sat May 26 11:08:40 2007 From: cathjone at eskimo.com (Catherine Jones) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 11:08:40 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Linux volunteer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1180202920.4933.2.camel@east> Please include me in the list of volunteers for this (preferably after June 1). Catherine On Sat, 2007-05-26 at 08:34 -0700, jim stockford wrote: > > any one want to help Ubuntu-fy P-II boxes for > this project? From jim at well.com Sat May 26 11:14:57 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 11:14:57 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Linux volunteer In-Reply-To: <1180202920.4933.2.camel@east> References: <1180202920.4933.2.camel@east> Message-ID: <4968737c60da6896ebe570991bda44f4@well.com> let Kami know: > From: "Kami Griffiths" On May 26, 2007, at 11:08 AM, Catherine Jones wrote: > Please include me in the list of volunteers for this (preferably after > June 1). > > Catherine > > On Sat, 2007-05-26 at 08:34 -0700, jim stockford wrote: >> >> any one want to help Ubuntu-fy P-II boxes for >> this project? > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From rondosxx at yahoo.com Sat May 26 12:10:59 2007 From: rondosxx at yahoo.com (ron) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 12:10:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Linux volunteer Message-ID: <716265.22796.qm@web52509.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I'm offering to help. ____________________________________________________________________________________Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more. http://mobile.yahoo.com/go?refer=1GNXIC From jim.stockford at gmail.com Sat May 26 18:50:54 2007 From: jim.stockford at gmail.com (Jim Stockford) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 18:50:54 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Embedded Linux Conference and Bootcamp for Beginners Class In-Reply-To: <517DC3FCCF3D8D42BEF1F83F7A633FA801990576@svexch01.mvista.com> References: <517DC3FCCF3D8D42BEF1F83F7A633FA801990576@svexch01.mvista.com> Message-ID: let pamela know if you're interested (and find out what's the cost of the conference for which her offer includes a $100 discount). ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Pamela Sherwood Date: May 16, 2007 1:09 PM Subject: Embedded Linux Conference and Bootcamp for Beginners Class To: jim.stockford at gmail.com Cc: Pamela Sherwood Hi Jim, I work in Marketing at MontaVista Software, in Santa Clara and we are hosting our first embedded Linux developer conference this October. We would like to offer a Linux Bootcamp for Beginners the day before the conference starts and I was doing a bit of research to see if we can generate interest. The cost of the course would be $145 and will include the sessions, a book on embedded Linux (by Chris Hallinan) and then $100 off the conference fee (which starts the next day). Do you think anyone from the SF Linux Users Group chapter would be interested? Thanks and best regards, Pamela Sherwood 408.572.7212 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bill at wards.net Sun May 27 10:43:50 2007 From: bill at wards.net (Bill Ward) Date: Sun, 27 May 2007 10:43:50 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] www.aboutdebian.com In-Reply-To: <331622.20640.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <331622.20640.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3d2fe1780705271043s3144b1b8wab0e63683c6043f@mail.gmail.com> There's a lot on that site that's pretty out of date... "buy a used 2GB drive" ... "don't support USB printers" ... On 4/27/07, Alex Kleider wrote: > In response to the comments about distro choice: > as a relative newbie (I've been one for so long perhaps I don't qualify > anymore!) I've been using Debian and have recently discovered > www.aboutdebian.com > I highly recommend that everyone (even those using other distros) check > it out. I find it to be the perfect source for info that fills the gap > between theory (as in the specialty books) and the simple how toos that > are explained in the intro.to.linux books. > The person who maintains this site deserves a lot of gratitude, I > think. > > > alex at kleider.net > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -- Help bring back the San Jose Earthquakes - http://www.soccersiliconvalley.com/ From rondosxx at yahoo.com Sun May 27 13:48:53 2007 From: rondosxx at yahoo.com (ron) Date: Sun, 27 May 2007 13:48:53 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] ubuntu and xubuntu disks? Message-ID: <660555.1502.qm@web52511.mail.re2.yahoo.com> does anyone have current ubuntu and xubuntu disks that are available? --no burner, old computers, etc. thanks ____________________________________________________________________________________Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today! http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 From bliss at california.com Sun May 27 14:18:15 2007 From: bliss at california.com (bobbie sellers) Date: Sun, 27 May 2007 14:18:15 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] ubuntu and xubuntu disks? In-Reply-To: <660555.1502.qm@web52511.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi ron, on 05/27/07, you wrote: > does anyone have current ubuntu and xubuntu disks > that are available? --no burner, old computers, etc. > thanks yes one of the members brought Ubunto 7.04 to the 1st Sunday meeting earlier this month. I had one then another member returned one last Monday so I have two on hand. Let me know if you want them before the meeting next Sunday. > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug later bliss -- bobbie sellers - (Back to Angband) Team *AMIGA* SF-LUG bliss at california dot com "There's no reality except the one contained within us." --Hermann Hesse From rick at linuxmafia.com Sun May 27 20:31:31 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Sun, 27 May 2007 20:31:31 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] www.aboutdebian.com In-Reply-To: <3d2fe1780705271043s3144b1b8wab0e63683c6043f@mail.gmail.com> References: <331622.20640.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <3d2fe1780705271043s3144b1b8wab0e63683c6043f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20070528033131.GA8685@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Bill Ward (bill at wards.net): > There's a lot on that site that's pretty out of date... "buy a used > 2GB drive" ... "don't support USB printers" ... http://www.debian-administration.org/ has more-current information, and I recommend it for users of Debian, {Xu|Ku|U}buntu, and similar distributions. Hullo from London, by the way (on my way to Athens). -- Cheers, "Of course, NIMBYism is perfectly fine for other Rick Moen places, but we certainly shouldn't allow it in rick at linuxmafia.com _our_ town." -- Rick M., going meta on his $SPOUSE From gilgamesh33 at mail.com Tue May 29 16:16:23 2007 From: gilgamesh33 at mail.com (mark man) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 18:16:23 -0500 Subject: [sf-lug] ubintu live & oscon Message-ID: <20070529231623.249B1102EC@ws1-3.us4.outblaze.com> I am going to Ubuntu live and Oscon in portland - at the end of july, Is anyone else planning on going. Here is the brief rundown on my webpage. The links are in the middle of the page. http://artgrin.com/8.html I know it's not hyperlinked- sorry. - Mark = Casio Super Slim Multimedia Projectors Project directly from Casio Super Slim Xj-S35 using USB thumb drive, simply save presentation, JPEG image or Mpeg4 movie to a USB memory device. http://a8-asy.a8ww.net/a8-ads/adftrclick?redirectid=1498a2a83d2191bcea9284fa1b6c2621 From jim at well.com Wed May 30 08:21:47 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 08:21:47 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Job Posting: VMware seeking experienced System Administrators Message-ID: <6200aa45ed31f1dc085b9d4f65b20456@well.com> Begin forwarded message: > From: "Amanda Ford \(c\)" > Date: May 16, 2007 4:50:46 PM PDT > To: > Subject: VMware seeking experienced System Administrators > > > Enterprise Technical Support Engineer > Palo Alto, CA > ? > Job Description > ? > VMware develops virtualization infrastructure software that allows you > to use multi-operating systems on one server The server virtualization > market is expected to exceed $1Billion by 2007 and VMware has 90%+ of > the market share.? > ? > Currently we are seeking several talented individuals to join our > Global Support Services organization at our Palo Alto headquarters as > an Enterprise Technical Support Engineer.? This is not your typical > support organization! Here at VMware, our technical support engineers > are System Administration experts.? In this challenging role, you will > be providing outstanding support to highly technical customers who are > using VMware products.?You will be working with a strong team of > System Administrators and Technical Support professionals.?In addition > you will be developing in-depth knowledge of system administration, > networking, and storage technologies. We have multiple openings and > are seeking Level 1, 2, and 3 Support Engineers. This is an excellent > opportunity to join a fast growing company and expand your technical > skills and knowledge. > ? > Primary Responsibilities > ? Responding to customer inquiries, primarily via telephone and email > ? Resolving customer technical issues through diligent research, > reproduction, and troubleshooting > ? Collaborating with customers, other departments, venders and > partners > ? Reproducing customer issues in a lab environment > ? Documenting all technical inquires, correspondence, research and > resolutions > Requirements > ? At least 1-3 years experience providing Windows and UNIX/Linux > technical support to customers > ? Familiarity with the installation and configuration of Linux or > UNIX operating systems, as well as Windows environments > ? Familiarity with the setup and operation of TCP/IP networking in > Windows or UNIX/Linux > ? Outstanding verbal and written communication skills in English > ? Good organizational, time management, and research skills > ? Proven troubleshooting and problem solving skills in a technical > environment > ? Able to multi-task and manage changing priorities > ? Good understanding of X86 hardware architecture > ? College Degree in Computer Science, Electrical Engineering, Math, > or equivalent work experience > Additional Desired skills > ? Enterprise environment exposure > ? Familiarity with virtualization technologies and concepts or > VMware products > ? Experience in storage technology such as SAN, iSCI, NAS > ? Experience with Active Directory > ? Language skills in Portuguese, Spanish, French, etc. > ? Familiarity with backup software and procedures > ? Experience administrating network hardware such as Cisco routers > and switches > ***This is a full time employment opportunity with VMware, Inc. *** > Interested candidates, please contact: > ? > Mandy?Ford > Recruiter, VMware, Inc. > 650-842-9516 > aford at vmware.com > Join my LinkedIn Network: http://www.linkedin.com/in/amandaford > ? > ? > VMware is planning on going public at the end of summer so this is a > rare > opportunity to get into VMware pre-IPO. > http://www.vmware.com/company/news/releases/S1.html > ? > ? > ? > ? From jim at well.com Fri Jun 1 06:07:39 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2007 06:07:39 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Meeting Sunday 11 AM at the Javacat Message-ID: <8b427531b6a0ecf6fa261a68e9fde0a5@well.com> Come on by for the SF-LUG first-sunday-in-the-month meeting at the Javacat in SF on Geary Blvd at 20th Ave from 11 AM till 1 PM. From bliss at california.com Fri Jun 1 16:47:22 2007 From: bliss at california.com (bobbie sellers) Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2007 16:47:22 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] [TAML] Trinity Rescue Kit | CPR for your computer (fwd) Message-ID: Hi Users, This may be of interest to some users. (I edited two of Skal's posts together and asked his permission to forward it and he provided additional information.) Skal is a Linux promoter as well but had to go for Windows? credentials because those are the systems he has to work on most often. *** Begin of forwarded message *** Date: 06/01/07 6:57 PM From: Skal Loret Subject: [TAML-WNT] Trinity Rescue Kit | CPR for your computer --- Forwarded message follows --- I ran the AVG and Bit Defender virus checkers that are on TRK today. Took a while, but cleaned out some viruses, spyware and trojans that were buried too deep for everything else. My computer is running a lot better now. Much better. Skal is running Win XP64 there. TRK scanned it with no problem, which really isn't surprising, but might concern some. It also scans Linux partitions quite nicely as well. This is really a "last step before a format and reinstall" type of tool which can save some people a lot of grief with some systems. Very worth the short download, the quick burn to a CD and inclusion in your toolkit. Very worth it indeed. http://trinityhome.org/Home/index.php?wpid=1&front_id=12 Make sure you read about it here. It is Linux, it is a Live CD and boots to a CLI. Help is "trkhelp". *** End of forwarded message *** Thanks for your attention, later bliss -- bobbie sellers - (Back to Angband) Team *AMIGA & SF-LUG* bliss at california dot com While it is true that the United States is not The Netherlands, the example of the Dutch system provides at least an indication that marijuana legalization would not be the disaster that opponents say it would be. Indeed, if marijuana legalization means people would avoid use of alcohol or hard drugs and would use marijuana instead, the net result would be positive, since the harm both to the user and the society would be less. --Douglas McVay From jim at well.com Sat Jun 2 10:53:15 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 10:53:15 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: [AlamedaW] Need help: iptables Message-ID: <468020e9ceba9724e215b0b0acc1f953@well.com> anybody interested in helping Alameda Wireless folks set up a linux box as a port-forwarding firewall router? Begin forwarded message: > From: BlueSkye4 > Date: June 2, 2007 10:36:14 AM PDT > To: AW List > Subject: [AlamedaW] Need help: iptables > > Hi, All, > > This is a request for assistance from anyone who might be versatile in > setting up a firewall for a Linux router. > > Here's our problem. Currently AW4 is using a Netgear FVS318 standard > firewall router to connect the eth0 port of the AW4 router to its ISP > connection. AW4 is currently servicing internet for 7 AW nodes, > including itself, through the Netgear FVS. In order to run selected > internet applications, many of these node owners have requested > specific > ports be forwarded at the FVS to: either their AW node router, or to a > specific machine located on the eth subnet at their node. > > The current problem we have run into in performing such port forwarding > is that the FVS has a max limit of 16 ports (or port ranges) that can > be > declared for possible forwarding. We already have one node that is > using 7 of the available 16 forwards. Clearly, as the network grows, > and as clients are added to routing nodes, having a limit of only 16 > forwards at the internet gateway for any AW node that is sharing an > internet connection, is going to become a severe operational limitation > for the AW Net. At this point, all 16 ports (or port ranges) are being > used at AW4, so AW4 is unable to add any additional forwarding in the > future. > > I have tried to examine the standard router market out there, but what > I > have found is that all the standard routers I have seen on the market > appear to have similar limitations on the number of ports that can be > set up to be forwarded. I've seen routers that max out at: 8, 10, 12, > 16 and 20 ports (or port ranges). Even the 20 max one is not anywhere > great enough to meet the ultimate needs for port forwarding that a > typical active internet-supplying AW node is eventually going to need. > > So . . . what to do? > > The suggestion has been made, that sounds most promising, is to replace > the gateway firewall router (FVS in AW4's specific case), with a Linux > machine running as a wired firewall router. I think there would, for > all practical purposes, be no limit to the number of ports that could > be > forwarded from a Linux box located at the gateway location connecting > to > the ISP modem. This would mean that the machine would have to run > iptables. At the moment none of the AW routers run with any firewall > rules (iptables). Drew and I have, in the past, attempted to set up > rules using iptables, but we (or at least certainly I) found the > process > more than we could handle. We were never successful in properly > configuring a firewall in a Linux box. > > One consideration, besides providing the firewalling and forwarding for > the AW Net, is that this machine also would be performing the gateway > firewalling and forwarding for my personal LAN. I do have another > hardware router that separates my personal LAN from the AW Net, but > "both" of those nets ultimately receive their internet connection from > the FVS. If we can produce a suitable Linux replacement, maybe this > front-line gateway can become a Linux box. > > I suspect that somewhere out on the AW List, there are, most likely, a > number of you skilled in configuring a Linux box with a rugged firewall > that would perform as well, or better, than an FVS (or equal). I can > provide all the hardware and can install a base Linux system, but I > can't configure a firewall, and I don't know anyone who can. What I > would like to do is develop a suitable rugged Linux firewalled router > box, and to well document the process, so that other AW nodes in the > future will be able to utilize this approach it they find the need to > do > perform a large number of port forwards. > > If there is anyone out there would be willing to assist me in setting > up > an effective wired firewalled router for the AW4 (and future AW nodes) > internet connection, I (and AW) could really use your help right now. > > > Pete > > -- > "Good judgment comes from experience > - well, that comes from poor judgment..." > - A.A.Milne > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Alameda Wireless mailing list - alameda at alamedawireless.org > http://alamedawireless.org/mailman/listinfo/alameda > From rick at rbsmith.com Sat Jun 2 11:31:34 2007 From: rick at rbsmith.com (Rick Smith) Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2007 11:31:34 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: [AlamedaW] Need help: iptables In-Reply-To: <468020e9ceba9724e215b0b0acc1f953@well.com> References: <468020e9ceba9724e215b0b0acc1f953@well.com> Message-ID: <4661B786.6010102@rbsmith.com> Hi Pete, I have used and recommend ipcop.org . When I google on "linux firewall", it's coming up first. It's complete package, web and ssh access, ipsec vpn, port forwarding, dhcp, web proxy, and so on. If the feature set fits, then it's a good fit -- easy to install and set up. Rick jim stockford wrote: > anybody interested in helping Alameda Wireless folks > set up a linux box as a port-forwarding firewall router? > > Begin forwarded message: > >> From: BlueSkye4 >> Date: June 2, 2007 10:36:14 AM PDT >> To: AW List >> Subject: [AlamedaW] Need help: iptables >> >> Hi, All, >> >> This is a request for assistance from anyone who might be versatile in >> setting up a firewall for a Linux router. >> >> Here's our problem. Currently AW4 is using a Netgear FVS318 standard >> firewall router to connect the eth0 port of the AW4 router to its ISP >> connection. AW4 is currently servicing internet for 7 AW nodes, >> including itself, through the Netgear FVS. In order to run selected >> internet applications, many of these node owners have requested >> specific >> ports be forwarded at the FVS to: either their AW node router, or to a >> specific machine located on the eth subnet at their node. >> >> The current problem we have run into in performing such port forwarding >> is that the FVS has a max limit of 16 ports (or port ranges) that can >> be >> declared for possible forwarding. We already have one node that is >> using 7 of the available 16 forwards. Clearly, as the network grows, >> and as clients are added to routing nodes, having a limit of only 16 >> forwards at the internet gateway for any AW node that is sharing an >> internet connection, is going to become a severe operational limitation >> for the AW Net. At this point, all 16 ports (or port ranges) are being >> used at AW4, so AW4 is unable to add any additional forwarding in the >> future. >> >> I have tried to examine the standard router market out there, but what >> I >> have found is that all the standard routers I have seen on the market >> appear to have similar limitations on the number of ports that can be >> set up to be forwarded. I've seen routers that max out at: 8, 10, 12, >> 16 and 20 ports (or port ranges). Even the 20 max one is not anywhere >> great enough to meet the ultimate needs for port forwarding that a >> typical active internet-supplying AW node is eventually going to need. >> >> So . . . what to do? >> >> The suggestion has been made, that sounds most promising, is to replace >> the gateway firewall router (FVS in AW4's specific case), with a Linux >> machine running as a wired firewall router. I think there would, for >> all practical purposes, be no limit to the number of ports that could >> be >> forwarded from a Linux box located at the gateway location connecting >> to >> the ISP modem. This would mean that the machine would have to run >> iptables. At the moment none of the AW routers run with any firewall >> rules (iptables). Drew and I have, in the past, attempted to set up >> rules using iptables, but we (or at least certainly I) found the >> process >> more than we could handle. We were never successful in properly >> configuring a firewall in a Linux box. >> >> One consideration, besides providing the firewalling and forwarding for >> the AW Net, is that this machine also would be performing the gateway >> firewalling and forwarding for my personal LAN. I do have another >> hardware router that separates my personal LAN from the AW Net, but >> "both" of those nets ultimately receive their internet connection from >> the FVS. If we can produce a suitable Linux replacement, maybe this >> front-line gateway can become a Linux box. >> >> I suspect that somewhere out on the AW List, there are, most likely, a >> number of you skilled in configuring a Linux box with a rugged firewall >> that would perform as well, or better, than an FVS (or equal). I can >> provide all the hardware and can install a base Linux system, but I >> can't configure a firewall, and I don't know anyone who can. What I >> would like to do is develop a suitable rugged Linux firewalled router >> box, and to well document the process, so that other AW nodes in the >> future will be able to utilize this approach it they find the need to >> do >> perform a large number of port forwards. >> >> If there is anyone out there would be willing to assist me in setting >> up >> an effective wired firewalled router for the AW4 (and future AW nodes) >> internet connection, I (and AW) could really use your help right now. >> >> >> Pete >> >> -- >> "Good judgment comes from experience >> - well, that comes from poor judgment..." >> - A.A.Milne >> >> >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Alameda Wireless mailing list - alameda at alamedawireless.org >> http://alamedawireless.org/mailman/listinfo/alameda From opeters at pacbell.net Sat Jun 2 11:38:13 2007 From: opeters at pacbell.net (Ola Peters) Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 11:38:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Anyone familiar with UML? Message-ID: <872002.67312.qm@web80613.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I am currently taking a course in UML and having a hard time understanding how to write the pseudo code. Anyone willing to help or could point me in the write direction for help? Willing to pay for your help.... Thanks, Ola -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From a_kleider at yahoo.com Sat Jun 2 18:40:40 2007 From: a_kleider at yahoo.com (Alex Kleider) Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 18:40:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] network set up Message-ID: <295028.34569.qm@web36615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> JOB OFFER: Network Setup I have been struggling with networking using a Debian system and appear to have hit an impasse. Is there anyone who might be willing to serve as a consultant and tutor to help me learn and set up (for payment of course.)? My current set up is pretty standard for a home system: ISP (sonic.net) providing adsl with dynamic IP via a modem. Linksys WRT54G Wireless G Broadband Router connected to several Windows 2000 (some wirelessly connected) and linux desktop and laptop (one of each) both ethernet connected. I've already set up an easydns.com account to provide ddns for my own domain name (but haven't been able to figure out how to use it yet.) My goal is to be able to access one or more systems remotely and perhaps learn how to set up a server or two (mail, ftp) mainly to learn the mechanism. I'm running bind9 and have configured it and _think_ that it is providing DNS services for the host on which it is running but the other computers can't seem to use it. The goal here is to learn; nothing "production" grade going on! Is there anyone with the ability and willingness to make a few bucks in "off hours?" My installation is in Redwood City very close to Hwy 101. alex at kleider.net alex at kleider.net ____________________________________________________________________________________ TV dinner still cooling? Check out "Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV. http://tv.yahoo.com/ From a_kleider at yahoo.com Mon Jun 4 01:39:35 2007 From: a_kleider at yahoo.com (Alex Kleider) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 01:39:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] ddclient : perl client Message-ID: <918067.68990.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> under Debian, when I # ddclient I get the following error message: Use of uninitialized value in string ne at /usr/sbin/ddclient line 1828 I've looked at that line number without any revelations. Does this warrant sending an email to the author? alex alex at kleider.net ____________________________________________________________________________________ Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Mon Jun 4 20:19:56 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 20:19:56 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] ddclient : perl client In-Reply-To: <918067.68990.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <918067.68990.qm@web36603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1181013596.4664d65c4377c@webmail.rawbw.com> E-mailing the author of the software is usually *not* the place to start. Try having a look here: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html and here: http://www.debian.org/support for starters. Quoting Alex Kleider : > under Debian, > when I > # ddclient > I get the following error message: > Use of uninitialized value in string ne at /usr/sbin/ddclient line 1828 > I've looked at that line number without any revelations. > Does this warrant sending an email to the author? From mblanc at znet.com Wed Jun 6 17:31:45 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2007 17:31:45 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] volunteer neded at CompuMentor Message-ID: <002b01c7a89b$3c6e3040$b3f71345@mblancznet.com> I telephoned Tami Griffiths today (she had just returned from vacation). It seems that the twelve PII machines are presently somewhere in the East Bay, perhaps in Oakland, at a youth center affiliated with the Tenderloin senior residence, the destination for which they are proposed. Tami agreed to inquire for more details about what her interlocutors wish to do with the equipment, and hopefully what is in these boxes in the way of storage, RAM, ethernet cards, etc. Also about what network/Internet conections are available at the Tenderloin location. I'll wait to see what they suggest. Oakland may be a little out of the way for me to go and take a survey of these machines. We'll have to see about these people's logistical situation and what they are willing to do or think is reasonable. More later. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mblanc at znet.com Wed Jun 6 17:46:31 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2007 17:46:31 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] CompuMentor Message-ID: <001601c7a89d$4b514e60$b3f71345@mblancznet.com> Correction, her name is Kami, not Tami. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Wed Jun 6 18:17:05 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2007 18:17:05 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] volunteer neded at CompuMentor In-Reply-To: <002b01c7a89b$3c6e3040$b3f71345@mblancznet.com> References: <002b01c7a89b$3c6e3040$b3f71345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: i'm willing and able to go to oakland, at least for now. my Element can carry a fair number of computers, if that helps. jim On Jun 6, 2007, at 5:31 PM, Michael Blanc wrote: > I telephoned Tami Griffiths today (she had just returned from > vacation). > ? > It seems that the twelve PII machines are presently somewhere in the > East Bay, perhaps in Oakland, at a youth center affiliated with the > Tenderloin senior residence, the destination for which they?are > proposed. Tami agreed to inquire for more details about what her > interlocutors wish to do with the equipment, and hopefully what is in > these boxes in the way of storage, RAM, ethernet cards, etc. Also > about what network/Internet conections are available at the Tenderloin > location. > ? > I'll wait to see what they suggest. Oakland?may be a little out of the > way for me to go and take a survey of these machines. We'll have to > see?about these people's logistical situation and what they are > willing to do or think is reasonable. > ? > More later. > ?_______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From mblanc at znet.com Wed Jun 6 18:26:41 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2007 18:26:41 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] volunteer neded at CompuMentor Message-ID: <007501c7a8a2$e999fd60$b3f71345@mblancznet.com> Sounds good -- we could have a "field trip". So let's se what info makes its way back. MB -----Original Message----- From: jim stockford To: Michael Blanc Cc: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Wednesday, June 06, 2007 6:14 PM Subject: Re: [sf-lug] volunteer neded at CompuMentor i'm willing and able to go to oakland, at least for now. my Element can carry a fair number of computers, if that helps. jim On Jun 6, 2007, at 5:31 PM, Michael Blanc wrote: > I telephoned Tami Griffiths today (she had just returned from > vacation). > > It seems that the twelve PII machines are presently somewhere in the > East Bay, perhaps in Oakland, at a youth center affiliated with the > Tenderloin senior residence, the destination for which they are > proposed. Tami agreed to inquire for more details about what her > interlocutors wish to do with the equipment, and hopefully what is in > these boxes in the way of storage, RAM, ethernet cards, etc. Also > about what network/Internet conections are available at the Tenderloin > location. > > I'll wait to see what they suggest. Oakland may be a little out of the > way for me to go and take a survey of these machines. We'll have to > see about these people's logistical situation and what they are > willing to do or think is reasonable. > > More later. > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From a_kleider at yahoo.com Thu Jun 7 20:09:53 2007 From: a_kleider at yahoo.com (Alex Kleider) Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2007 20:09:53 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] user on sf-lug.com Message-ID: <818312.79767.qm@web36609.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Jim Stockford has been very kind to serve as a sounding board with regard to some of the networking things I've been trying to do and has set me up with a user account on the sf-lug.com machine with the idea that I could poke around and learn how things are done. It's proven quite interesting. What follows is in no way meant to be a criticism but just an fyi to those in charge in case you might be willing to enhance the experience. Perhaps not all but certainly some of the configuration files are NOT readable. I've been setting up my own DNS server and wanted to have a look at the named.conf file to see how it compared with my own. Undoubtedly this is done for security reasons. Perhaps a readable version with sensitive stuff replaced by token words could be made available. This would take work, I realize, and would be willing to volunteer if you are willing to trust me with the info and could provide guidance as to what would have to be hidden. Also, a simple thing to remedy would be to provide less and/or pager instead of only more. Thank you, Jim, and thanks to all others that are running this machine and whom I don't even know. alex kleider alex at kleider.net ____________________________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Thu Jun 7 23:04:36 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2007 23:04:36 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] user on sf-lug.com In-Reply-To: <818312.79767.qm@web36609.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <818312.79767.qm@web36609.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1181282676.4668f1747a63b@webmail.rawbw.com> A few random items I'll note, ... First of all, there are actually *two* quite independent DNS servers running on the sf-lug.com. box. There's the stuff running primarily for SF-LUG, the default on the host, and there's also the stuff of BALUG interest, running only on: 208.96.15.254 Though I'd guess on the SF-LUG side of things the objectives are likely similar, on the BALUG side of things there's quite an interest in keeping the BALUG DNS server as secure as feasible (notwithstanding any higher priority conflicting objectives). Would I be correct in presuming your login name there is akleider? Let me know, ... and perhaps check back later to see what sudo offers you (e.g. sudo -l). Also, for many/most of the more significant BALUG files, I've got them under RCS ... so the RCS files may be more interesting and informative - giving pretty good information on how they've changed/evolved ... and also generally *why*. In any case, I'd still need to review what's in those files first ... may have fair bits of not-so-public information (e.g. lots of personal contact details for adminitrators of slave system(s), etc.) Some/much of the log stuff may also be at least fairly informative. Giving sudo access to less or more or something like that would generally be highly insecure - as those commands typically allow shell escapes. Something like sudo access to cat - with tightly controlled and secured arguments - would likely be, at least comparatively, much more secure. I believe the BALUG DNS configurations will also allow you to do zone transfers - at least to a few select IPs (including 127.0.0.1, 208.96.15.254, 208.96.15.254) ... might also be *temporarily* much more wide open (as BALUG is in the process of picking up additional slave servers), but will likely continue to work to at least including those IPs mentioned. references/excerpts: http://www.sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:ip_addresses http://www.sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:system_administration_rules_of_the_road_this_box http://www.sf-lug.com/wiki/doku.php?id=system:change_log http://www.sf-lug.com/log.txt Quoting Alex Kleider : > Jim Stockford has been very kind to serve as a sounding board with > regard to some of the networking things I've been trying to do and has > set me up with a user account on the sf-lug.com machine with the idea > that I could poke around and learn how things are done. It's proven > quite interesting. > > What follows is in no way meant to be a criticism but just an fyi to > those in charge in case you might be willing to enhance the experience. > Perhaps not all but certainly some of the configuration files are NOT > readable. I've been setting up my own DNS server and wanted to have a > look at the named.conf file to see how it compared with my own. > Undoubtedly this is done for security reasons. Perhaps a readable > version with sensitive stuff replaced by token words could be made > available. This would take work, I realize, and would be willing to > volunteer if you are willing to trust me with the info and could > provide guidance as to what would have to be hidden. > Also, a simple thing to remedy would be to provide less and/or pager > instead of only more. > > Thank you, Jim, and thanks to all others that are running this machine > and whom I don't even know. From jim at well.com Sat Jun 9 15:02:08 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2007 15:02:08 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] At Google: bayPIGgies meeting Thursday June 14: unittest Message-ID: Thursday, June 14, 2007 Location: Google Agenda----------------------------- ..... 7:30 PM ........................... General hubbub, inventory end-of-meeting announcements, any first-minute announcements. ..... 7:35 PM to 8:40 PM ................ Topic: Unittest Speaker: Collin Winter About the Talk: Collin reports on his recent work to redesign Python's unittest module. This is a preview of the presentation he'll be giving at EuroPython 2007 on the same topic: "Python's unittest module sucks. Come find out why and what's being done to fix it." Links: http://oakwinter.com/code/a-new-unittest/ http://oakwinter.com/code/pythons-unittest-module-sucks/ http://oakwinter.com/code/motivation-for-rewriting-unittest/ About Collin: Collin is a Python core developer and works at Google with Guido van Rossum on Mondrian [1]_, Google's code review tool. Most of his Python work is focused on Python 3000, such as the 2to3 tool [2]_ for translating Python 2 into Python 3 source. _[1] - http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8502904076440714866 _[2] - http://svn.python.org/view/sandbox/trunk/2to3/ ..... 8:40 PM to 9:00 PM ................ Event: Mapping/Random Access Mapping is a rapid-fire audience announcement of topics the announcer is interested in. Random Access follows immediately to allow follow up individually on topics of interest. The July Meeting The July meeting is Newbies' Night, Part 2, presenting the second half of Alex Martelli's Python for Programmers talk. From ffejveg at lycos.com Mon Jun 11 10:40:17 2007 From: ffejveg at lycos.com (jeff gibson) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 13:40:17 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [sf-lug] DSL recommendations, and PCLinuxOS 2007 Message-ID: <20070611134017.HM.000000000000075@ffejveg.bos-mail-wwl14.lycos.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mblanc at znet.com Mon Jun 11 19:37:13 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 19:37:13 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] those twelve P11 computers just disappeared Message-ID: <003501c7ac9a$98136f20$01f71345@mblancznet.com> Kami has written that the situation with her contact seems to have changed. Here is her note: >> Michael, >> Lanya just found out that her organization no longer has the 12 computers we were planning on using for this project, so the Wednesday call is postponed. What do >> you think the response would be if you posted a request for computer donations to the listserv? I?m still very interested in seeing a project like this proceed and have >> a few other places in mind if this one falls through. Thanks for your help! >>Kami -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jstrazza at yahoo.com Mon Jun 11 20:22:30 2007 From: jstrazza at yahoo.com (John F. Strazzarino) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 20:22:30 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] those twelve P11 computers just disappeared In-Reply-To: <003501c7ac9a$98136f20$01f71345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: <639170.44455.qm@web35613.mail.mud.yahoo.com> If it matters, I have a PII, 900 MHz that I can donate. Michael Blanc wrote: Kami has written that the situation with her contact seems to have changed. Here is her note: >> Michael, >> Lanya just found out that her organization no longer has the 12 computers we were planning on using for this project, so the Wednesday call is postponed. What do >> you think the response would be if you posted a request for computer donations to the listserv? I?m still very interested in seeing a project like this proceed and have >> a few other places in mind if this one falls through. Thanks for your help! >>Kami _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug --------------------------------- We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lantechie at yahoo.com Mon Jun 11 21:09:40 2007 From: lantechie at yahoo.com (Ola Peters) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 21:09:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] those twelve P11 computers just disappeared Message-ID: <611653.35074.qm@web80602.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi All, I have several old xeon Dells...would be happy to donate these to the project. Ola "John F. Strazzarino" wrote: Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 20:22:30 -0700 (PDT) From: "John F. Strazzarino" To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Subject: Re: [sf-lug] those twelve P11 computers just disappeared If it matters, I have a PII, 900 MHz that I can donate. Michael Blanc wrote: Kami has written that the situation with her contact seems to have changed. Here is her note: >> Michael, >> Lanya just found out that her organization no longer has the 12 computers we were planning on using for this project, so the Wednesday call is postponed. What do >> you think the response would be if you posted a request for computer donations to the listserv? I?m still very interested in seeing a project like this proceed and have >> a few other places in mind if this one falls through. Thanks for your help! >>Kami _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug --------------------------------- We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list._______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From mblanc at znet.com Mon Jun 11 23:23:00 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 23:23:00 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] those twelve P11 computers just disappeared Message-ID: <001601c7acba$579dc380$4af71345@mblancznet.com> I will let Kami know about these offers, and thanks! -----Original Message----- From: Ola Peters To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Monday, June 11, 2007 9:11 PM Subject: Re: [sf-lug] those twelve P11 computers just disappeared Hi All, I have several old xeon Dells...would be happy to donate these to the project. Ola "John F. Strazzarino" wrote: Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2007 20:22:30 -0700 (PDT) From: "John F. Strazzarino" To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Subject: Re: [sf-lug] those twelve P11 computers just disappeared If it matters, I have a PII, 900 MHz that I can donate. Michael Blanc wrote: Kami has written that the situation with her contact seems to have changed. Here is her note: >> Michael, >> Lanya just found out that her organization no longer has the 12 computers we were planning on using for this project, so the Wednesday call is postponed. What do >> you think the response would be if you posted a request for computer donations to the listserv? I?m still very interested in seeing a project like this proceed and have >> a few other places in mind if this one falls through. Thanks for your help! >>Kami _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list._______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Wed Jun 13 19:22:40 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2007 19:22:40 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: UNIX Senior Systems Administrator (PAIII) at University of California, Berkeley Message-ID: <4d4a00705dc60b4f49ce1191a9e5513b@well.com> one of the best job postings yet, at least as to form. Begin forwarded message: > From: Julie Ashworth > Date: June 13, 2007 5:32:14 PM PDT > To: jim at well.com > Subject: UNIX Senior Systems Administrator (PAIII) at University of > California, Berkeley > > A UNIX SA position is available in the Letters & Sciences Computing > Resources at UC Berkeley: > http://math.berkeley.edu/~julie/listing.html > > If you're interested, please submit your application to the Human > Resources page: > http://jobs.berkeley.edu/ > Job #006645 > > You may contact me with questions. > thanks, > Julie > > -- > Julie Ashworth (julie at ls.berkeley.edu, 510-643-8747) > Letters & Sciences Computer Resources, University of CA, Berkeley > > PGP Key ID: 0x17F013D2 From jim at well.com Wed Jun 13 19:27:01 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2007 19:27:01 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Linux Embedded Software Engineer needed for hot start-up in Santa Clara; Message-ID: <7e0a7a01f65643e8799524bf9acd9d61@well.com> a job posting, not bad as to form. Begin forwarded message: > From: "Mark Apton" > Date: June 11, 2007 5:29:33 PM PDT > To: > Subject: Linux Embedded Software Engineer needed for hot start-up in > Santa Clara; > > Enabling Video Everywhere. > It starts with talented people devoted to creating the most advanced > digital video compression technology in the world. Mobilygen is the > pioneer in low power H.264 solutions and a great startup backed by > top-tier venture investors (KPCB & Redpoint). Be part of the team that > will revolutionize mobile video. > > We are looking for an experienced Software Engineer, fulltime employee > (with benefits and stock). > > The Linux Software Engineer will be part of the SOC team of Mobilygen. > As a member > of this team he will be responsible for bringing up various hardware > interfaces > and writing applications running on Mobilygen's next generation > platforms. > > The Linux Software Engineer is responsible for the following: > > * Developing and maintaining part of an embedded Linux platform. > * Writing Linux 2.6 device drivers. > * Develop and support Reference Designs on various platforms. > > Requirements: > > * Experience in Unix systems administration. > * 3-5 years of experience in C programming. > * In depth knowledge of Linux internals and computer systems > architecture. > * Good knowledge of the GNU toolchain. > * Ability to work as part of a team. > > The following experience is a plus: > > * Writing linux block device drivers. > * Working with the Open Source community. > * Developping for Embedded systems. > * Installing/porting/using an embedded Linux distribution. > * Writing networking applications. > > Find out why we are making low power (<200 mW) headline news. > > Our web-site is; > > www.mobilygen.com > > Please contact me with any questions or just send me your resume. > > I look forward to hearing from you, > > Mark > > Mark Apton > Corporate Recruiter > Mobilygen Corporation > Santa Clara, CA > 408 869-4048 > mapton at mobilygen.com > www.mobilygen.com > > Feel free to pass on this information to interested parties. From jim at well.com Thu Jun 14 16:03:24 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2007 16:03:24 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Senior Software Engineers, Linux at Omneon Message-ID: hey, another job posting. Begin forwarded message: > From: "Skip Franks" > Date: June 14, 2007 2:53:53 PM PDT > To: > Subject: Senior Software Engineers, Linux at Omneon > > > Hi Jim, > ? > I sure hope this is appropriate. > ? > We are currently seeking talented software engineers. > ? > Could you please forward below opportunity to your user group? > ? > Thank you in advance. > ? > Best regards, > Skip > ? > ?Senior Software Engineer, Linux > ? > Omneon is a dynamic company providing innovative server and storage > products to the broadcast, media and entertainment industries. > We have experienced tremendous growth to date and are actively looking > to build our team with high-caliber talent.? We are backed by > well-respected venture capital firms including Accel Partners, > Advanced Technology Ventures, Intel Capital, Invesco Private Capital, > Lucent Venture Partners, Meritech Capital and Norwest Venture > Partners. Omneon Video Networks is an equal opportunity employer > with opportunities at its headquarters in Sunnyvale, its Beaverton > Oregon development office and at regional offices throughout the > world. > ? > We have an opportunity for a Linux systems software engineer to join > our team. ?We are building applications that run media processing > functions on a grid of parallel x86 PCs. ?You will be responsible for > creating the Linux base for our servers, integrating?applications, > drivers, > management and services. > > The ideal candidate will have the following qualifications:?? ? > ? Bachelors degree in Computer Science or related field > ? 5+ years experience developing Linux or Unix system level software > ? Experience with Linux internals and system bring-up (configuring, > patching and building Linux kernels) > ? Experience working with networking and client/server or > distributed systems > ? Experience with parallel/ grid processing systems > ? Experience documenting processes and tools > ? Excellent communication skills > Please send resume to: > sfranks at omneon.com > **********CHECK US OUT: WWW.OMNEON.COM > ? > ? > ? -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: unknown.gif Type: image/gif Size: 46 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > Skip Franks > Staffing Consultant > p. > +1 (408) 585-5145 > > SFranks at Omneon.com > www.omneon.com -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: unknown.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 13345 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > ? From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Thu Jun 14 23:51:43 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2007 23:51:43 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] user on sf-lug.com (DNS, etc.) In-Reply-To: <156932.21159.qm@web36610.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <156932.21159.qm@web36610.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1181890303.467236ff489f0@webmail.rawbw.com> Well, first of all you might want to write the list with the more general questions - e.g. if it's not quite specifically related to just aspects of BALUG on the sf-lug.com. box, no real need to target the question specifically to me or just those mostly focusing on the BALUG side of things. Anyway, on your questions and such, ... "answers"/replies in context, with references/excerpts (and slightly redacted): > Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2007 23:05:23 -0700 (PDT) > From: Alex Kleider > Reply-To: alex at kleider.net > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] user on sf-lug.com > To: Michael Paoli > I just sent you a note at mpaoli at sf-lug.com > but forgot one more thing I was going to ask: > can you run more than one DNS server on a single host or do you mean > one on each of the two hosts: balug and sf-lug? One can run multiple DNS servers simultaneously on a single host. They must not conflict/collide on both same IP and port (and interface) simultaneously, or have conflicts on how they're handling their files/configurations/control and such, but other than those and BALUG related DNS on 208.96.15.254. Both also use rndc on 127.0.0.1, but they use distinct ports for rndc. They have their own configuration files, start/stop scripts, etc. BIND can also support multiple "views" - but that's something rather different (in that case a DNS server gives different "views" (answers, etc.) depending upon the IP from which the query came). > Or do you mean one server but zone files for each lug? "We" have chosen to implement much of this in this manner (relatively independent services) so we can avoid stepping on each others toes (much less coordination needed for services that are highly independent), and this also allows us the freedom to run quite different services (e.g. SF-LUG and BALUG may want to run completely different SMTP servers and configurations). http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2007q2/001544.html > Return-Path: > Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2007 22:59:12 -0700 > From: akleider at sf-lug.localdomain Uhm, ... that's an "interesting" From: address ... won't work too well. > To: mpaoli at sf-lug.com > Subject: questions > I ran sudo -l and after entering my password I got a list of commands that I > "may run" but was in fact not able to do so: permission denied! The commands should work fine. The part that may be confusing in the sudo -l output, is that the commands are separated by , (comma) - however the commands actually end in ,v (comma and v), as they operate directly on (reading) the RCS files. E.g. if you see something like: $ sudo -l Password: User akleider may run the following commands on this host: (root) /bin/cat /some_pathname/some_file,v, yet more commands ... So, with something like that, you should be able to run: sudo /bin/cat /some_pathname/some_file,v > I checked out the IP Addresses: > HSRP is something new to me- > is 208.96.15.249 the virtual router/gateway i.e no physical host here? > while ...250 and ...251 are the routers running HSRP? Are they cisco routers > or are they linux boxes? You probably know almost as much about HSRP as I do. I first bumped into it some weeks/months ago regarding the sf-lug.com. box & BALUG & IPs and planning IPs and such. I dropped in some links on the documentation that reference more information about HSRP. From what I recall from what I quickly skimmed of it, it's a Cisco proprietary protocol for high availability router failover configuration. At least typically (e.g. "our" configuration with such), there's a high availability IP used for routing, which is provided by exactly one of the routers at any given time, and there are also two other IPs, used for the routers to communicate with and monitor each other and negotiate movement/failover of the routing IP between the two routers. > Your network is fundamentally different in that all hosts have a public internet IP address. > What I've been studying is the situation where I have a private (192.168.) You've got an RFC 1918 IP - 192.168/16 IPs aren't useable on the Internet - e.g. they're not routable. For such IPs to communicate with the Internet, they have to go through some type of IP address translation (often also accompanied by port remapping) to talk to the Internet - e.g. NAT/SNAT, or in the case of LINUX, masquerading. > local area network () interfacing through a () router. If I'm not mistaken, that's a consumer grade device which also includes NAT/SNAT and/or masquerading. > My ISP gives me an IP address by dhcp so it might (but doesn't seem to) change. Most typically it can and will change - though that might be a rather to exceedingly rare occurrence, depending on usage and other factors. The IP address you obtain from the ISP is an Internet IP. If you have more than one IP device you want to simultaneously have Internet connectivity with, while only having one Internet IP from your ISP, that's where NAT/SNAT/masquerading comes in - they effectively let multiple such devices "share" a single Internet IP address. Running an Internet DNS server without a fixed IP address will be rather difficult to infeasible, but by no means impossible. Given the relatively static IP requirements of typical BIND configurations for serving DNS, I certainly wouldn't recommend DNS server on dynamic IP address as an easy place to start. > I'm trying to set up ddns with easydns.com. > I've got dns server running on @ and it seems to be providing dns services for (since /etc/resolv.conf has been completely commented out except for nameserver 127.0.0.1) but when other computers on the network have /etc/resolv.conf configured to read nameserver 192.168. ('s fixed IP) things don't work. I can ssh between computers but I think they are using the hosts file rather than s dns services. For the DNS server to be useable, it must be reachable from the client. If it's only running on 127/8 IP(s), it won't be accessible beyond the server itself (unless you have a highly unusual configuration). If it's running on RFC 1918 ("Intranet") IP(s), those will generally only be reachable from clients that know how to reach those IPs. From the Internet, they'll need to know Internet IP(s) to use, and some type of NAT/SNAT/masquerading will have to handle the go-between between the Internet IP(s) being used for the DNS server, and actual DNS server host RFC 1918 IPs used by the DNS server. > One more question: what distribution of linux is/are being used on balug and on sf-lug.com? You've got the access to pretty well answer that one yourself, at least for the sf-lug.com. box. I'll offer some hints: /etc/*release /etc/*version cat(1) http://www.tech-recipes.com/linux_tips728.html http://www.groupsrv.com/linux/about33529.html It's also of note that for UNIX, the problem is rather similar, e.g. uname -a is often not sufficient to identify the operating system and its version/release. Many UNIX flavors each have their own unique commands to get that information. At least with LINUX, there's the LSB ... so there should be convergence towards a solution on that. From jim at well.com Fri Jun 15 15:29:10 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:29:10 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] sf-lug meeting this monday evening, 6/18 6 PM Message-ID: <20ac8c4d1dcf5a5894157623b00fd371@well.com> come on down (or up) to the SF-LUG meeting, Monday, 6/18, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM, at the Javacat in San Francisco, on Geary Boulevard at 20th Avenue. From rick at linuxmafia.com Sun Jun 17 14:37:07 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2007 14:37:07 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] user on sf-lug.com (DNS, etc.) In-Reply-To: <1181890303.467236ff489f0@webmail.rawbw.com> References: <156932.21159.qm@web36610.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1181890303.467236ff489f0@webmail.rawbw.com> Message-ID: <20070617213706.GA9968@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Michael Paoli (Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu): > > One more question: what distribution of linux is/are being used on > > balug and on sf-lug.com? > > You've got the access to pretty well answer that one yourself, at > least for the sf-lug.com. box. I'll offer some hints: /etc/*release > /etc/*version cat(1) http://www.tech-recipes.com/linux_tips728.html > http://www.groupsrv.com/linux/about33529.html It's also of note that > for UNIX, the problem is rather similar, Possibly useful in the general case, e.g., in scripts: "Release Files" on http://linuxmafia.com/kb/Admin/ From nbs at sonic.net Sun Jun 17 14:34:57 2007 From: nbs at sonic.net (Bill Kendrick) Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2007 14:34:57 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Reminder: LUGOD meeting tomorrow in Davis (Mon Jun 18) - "Tux Paint, again" Message-ID: <20070617213457.GE4389@sonic.net> The Linux Users' Group of Davis meets tomorrow, Monday June 18th, at the Davis Public Library (315 East 14th St.) from 6:30pm to 9:00pm. Yours truly will be discussing the upcoming improvements to my Open Source drawing app for children, "Tux Paint" (http://www.tuxpaint.org/). For details, visit: http://www.lugod.org/meeting/ Maps/directions: http://www.lugod.org/meeting/library/ -bill! pr at lugod.org http://www.lugod.org/ Linux Users' Group of Davis From mblanc at znet.com Tue Jun 19 00:13:00 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 00:13:00 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps Message-ID: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> Kami Griffiths at CompuMentor has sent me this update on the status of her project. Who's got one of those Ubuntu disks to loan? -----Original Message----- From: Kami Griffiths To: Michael Blanc Date: Monday, June 18, 2007 4:34 PM Subject: Another volunteer & next steps Michael, I was going through my email and realized that someone else from SF-LUG was interested in helping. I?ve added his name to the bottom of this list: Tom Haddon, tom at greenleaftech.net Catherine Jones, cathjone at eskimo.com Cristina, cristina_errors at yahoo.com Ron, rondosxx at yahoo.com I heard back from the senior center and they aren?t interested in the donation, but there?s a housing project in the Lower Haight I?ve been working with that has old equipment (that can also be converted to Linux) as well as space to store extra equipment. They?re current PCs are 8 years old running a mixture of NT and Windows 2000 and super slow. They don?t have the admin passwords anymore so there?s not much we can do to fix them. I?m about to send an email to Romel to work out a time to pick up the donation, I have a friend with a pickup truck who I hope is free to help transport them. Can we schedule some time to talk? There are several details to discuss: ? Getting the necessary Ubuntu/Edubuntu install disks ? Schedule time to test one ? Scheduling the volunteers and planning that day This is really exciting and I appreciate your help and interest in helping make this a success! Thanks! Kami -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bliss at california.com Tue Jun 19 09:03:29 2007 From: bliss at california.com (bobbie sellers) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 09:03:29 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: Hi Michael Blanc, on 06/19/07, you wrote: > Kami Griffiths at CompuMentor has sent me this update on the > status of her project. Who's got one of those Ubuntu disks to > loan? I have one or more of the latest as I am willing to make more of the disks, one of which was given to me at about two meetings ago. > -----Original Message----- > From: Kami Griffiths > To: Michael Blanc > Date: Monday, June 18, 2007 4:34 PM > Subject: Another volunteer & next steps > Michael, > > I was going through my email and realized that someone else > from SF-LUG was interested in helping. I ve added his name to > the bottom of this list: > > Tom Haddon, tom at greenleaftech.net > Catherine Jones, cathjone at eskimo.com > Cristina, cristina_errors at yahoo.com > Ron, rondosxx at yahoo.com > > > I heard back from the senior center and they aren t interested > in the donation, but there s a housing project in the Lower > Haight I ve been working with that has old equipment (that can > also be converted to Linux) as well as space to store extra > equipment. They re current PCs are 8 years old running a > mixture of NT and Windows 2000 and super slow. They don t have > the admin passwords anymore so there s not much we can do to > fix them. > > I m about to send an email to Romel to work out a time to pick > up the donation, I have a friend with a pickup truck who I hope > is free to help transport them. Can we schedule some time to > talk? There are several details to discuss: > > ? Getting the necessary Ubuntu/Edubuntu install disks > ? Schedule time to test one > ? Scheduling the volunteers and planning that day > > This is really exciting and I appreciate your help and interest > in helping make this a success! > > Thanks! > Kami later bliss -- bobbie sellers - (Back to Angband) Team *AMIGA & SF-LUG* bliss at california dot com Science is not belief, but the will to find out. From tom at greenleaftech.net Tue Jun 19 09:32:03 2007 From: tom at greenleaftech.net (Tom Haddon) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 09:32:03 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2007-06-19 at 00:13 -0700, Michael Blanc wrote: > Kami Griffiths at CompuMentor has sent me this update on the status of > her project. Who's got one of those Ubuntu disks to loan? > (Replied from wrong email address, so I'm not sure if it got through - apologies for duplication). I have copies of both stock Ubuntu and the alternate install CD which is recommended for installation on lower resource systems (it's a text based installer instead of the LiveCD/GUI installer). Happy to give those as needed and can make other copies if needed. Thanks, Tom > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kami Griffiths > To: Michael Blanc > Date: Monday, June 18, 2007 4:34 PM > Subject: Another volunteer & next steps > > > Michael, > > > > I was going through my email and realized that someone else from > SF-LUG was interested in helping. I?ve added his name to the bottom of > this list: > > > > Tom Haddon, tom at greenleaftech.net > > Catherine Jones, cathjone at eskimo.com > > Cristina, cristina_errors at yahoo.com > > Ron, rondosxx at yahoo.com > > > > > > I heard back from the senior center and they aren?t interested in the > donation, but there?s a housing project in the Lower Haight I?ve been > working with that has old equipment (that can also be converted to > Linux) as well as space to store extra equipment. They?re current PCs > are 8 years old running a mixture of NT and Windows 2000 and super > slow. They don?t have the admin passwords anymore so there?s not much > we can do to fix them. > > > > I?m about to send an email to Romel to work out a time to pick up the > donation, I have a friend with a pickup truck who I hope is free to > help transport them. Can we schedule some time to talk? There are > several details to discuss: > > > > ? Getting the necessary Ubuntu/Edubuntu install disks > > ? Schedule time to test one > > ? Scheduling the volunteers and planning that day > > > > This is really exciting and I appreciate your help and interest in > helping make this a success! > > > > Thanks! > > Kami > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From penguin at techbandit.com Tue Jun 19 11:11:37 2007 From: penguin at techbandit.com (Romel Jacinto) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 11:11:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <16651.207.90.163.99.1182276697.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007, Tom Haddon wrote: > I have copies of both stock Ubuntu and the alternate install CD... Hi All, Disclosure: My workplace is the source of the pc's that are being donated to Kami. I hope to be involved with the install-fest and setup, time permitting, but whatever happens to the computers is up to the SF-LUG community and the housing project. That said, and not to belabor the obvious, but here are some points I'd like to bring up for discussion. The hardware and operating system installation are only a small part of the larger picture. 1. Evaluation with housing project about what their specific application needs are. 2. Training for computer lab managers. 3. Training for end-users. The computers are all nearly identical Dell Gx150 (900 MHz, 256MB or 512 MB of RAM, 10 GB hard drives). I hope that there is some thought given to imaging since there are 15 pc's. So that's my $0.02. I'm just happy that there will be some new folks using Linux and that computers can get some more use before being recycled. -- Romel From tom at greenleaftech.net Tue Jun 19 11:32:45 2007 From: tom at greenleaftech.net (Tom Haddon) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 11:32:45 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <16651.207.90.163.99.1182276697.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> <16651.207.90.163.99.1182276697.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> Message-ID: <1182277965.6838.90.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2007-06-19 at 11:11 -0700, Romel Jacinto wrote: > On Tue, 19 Jun 2007, Tom Haddon wrote: > > > I have copies of both stock Ubuntu and the alternate install CD... > > > > Hi All, > > Disclosure: > My workplace is the source of the pc's that are being donated to Kami. > > I hope to be involved with the install-fest and setup, time permitting, > but whatever happens to the computers is up to the SF-LUG community and > the housing project. > > That said, and not to belabor the obvious, but here are some points I'd > like to bring up for discussion. > The hardware and operating system installation are only a small part of > the larger picture. > > 1. Evaluation with housing project about what their specific application > needs are. This one's kind of key, and will really determine if the project's a success or failure. For instance, if they __need__ Quickbooks then we're out of luck. Michael, are you planning to do this with Kami, or has it been determined already? > > 2. Training for computer lab managers. Wasn't aware there were computer lab managers. Maybe they could be trained (if necessary) to train the end users so that we aren't duplicating effort. Are they going to be responsible for ongoing maintenance of the machines/applying security updates, backups, etc.? > > 3. Training for end-users. > > The computers are all nearly identical Dell Gx150 (900 MHz, 256MB or 512 > MB of RAM, 10 GB hard drives). I hope that there is some thought given to > imaging since there are 15 pc's. I'm not familiar with imaging technologies myself, but think if there are folks with the knowledge to do that, it'd be a great approach. Thanks, Tom > > So that's my $0.02. > I'm just happy that there will be some new folks using Linux and that > computers can get some more use before being recycled. > > -- > Romel > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From penguin at techbandit.com Tue Jun 19 13:28:22 2007 From: penguin at techbandit.com (Romel Jacinto) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 13:28:22 -0700 (Pacific Daylight Time) Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <1182277965.6838.90.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> <16651.207.90.163.99.1182276697.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> <1182277965.6838.90.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Tue, 19 Jun 2007, Tom Haddon wrote: >> 1. Evaluation with housing project about what their specific application >> needs are. > > This one's kind of key, and will really determine if the project's a > success or failure. For instance, if they __need__ Quickbooks then we're > out of luck. Michael, are you planning to do this with Kami, or has it > been determined already? I wasn't thinking of such a specialized application like Quickbooks, but had more in mind more general user applications that may be wanted, i.e. listening/watching multimedia or DVD's (may need to install codecs and add relevant repositories). >> 2. Training for computer lab managers. > > Wasn't aware there were computer lab managers. Maybe they could be > trained (if necessary) to train the end users so that we aren't > duplicating effort. Are they going to be responsible for ongoing > maintenance of the machines/applying security updates, backups, etc.? I don't know for a fact that there is a lab manager, it was an assumption. Personally I think there has to be a someone in that community who can take a leadership role in maintaining the computers. I think of it as sustainable computing: we teach someone who can teach others. Setting up computers without a long-term support plan is a recipe that doesn't have a high probability of succeeding. > I'm not familiar with imaging technologies myself, but think if there > are folks with the knowledge to do that, it'd be a great approach. I only brought imaging up because of the number of computers to be setup. In my mind once the base set of applications and other user-specified configurations are set, that image can be deployed onto the other computers since the hardware is essentially identical. Might save time, but more importantly there is a known standard configuration; this can save time and effort when performing maintenance down the road. I'm most familiar with imaging technologies used on proprietary operating systems, but I'd like to learn about implementing imaging in the open-source world. I've used G4U on occasion as a quick and dirty backup, but have not used it in a mass deployment situation. -- Romel From jackofnotrades at gmail.com Tue Jun 19 14:29:29 2007 From: jackofnotrades at gmail.com (Jeff Bragg) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 14:29:29 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> <16651.207.90.163.99.1182276697.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> <1182277965.6838.90.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <2f8a56f70706191429v66d14a50i4163121eb2c45fc8@mail.gmail.com> DD could simplify the repetitive aspects of imaging the machines, but it's ugly, and not particularly fast; it also requires that the destination drive be at least as big as the source drive, and any extra space on the destination drive will be rendered unusable (outside parameters of partition table). Using PXE it would be possible to largely automate this, but it would require a dedicated machine running TFTP and housing a copy of the desired image. I've never set one up to do this, but it doesn't appear to be terribly difficult; for only 15 machines, the process of setting up a build automation system would need to be pretty trivial to be worthwhile (except as a learning exercise). On 6/19/07, Romel Jacinto wrote: > > On Tue, 19 Jun 2007, Tom Haddon wrote: > > >> 1. Evaluation with housing project about what their specific > application > >> needs are. > > > > This one's kind of key, and will really determine if the project's a > > success or failure. For instance, if they __need__ Quickbooks then we're > > out of luck. Michael, are you planning to do this with Kami, or has it > > been determined already? > > I wasn't thinking of such a specialized application like Quickbooks, but > had more in mind more general user applications that may be wanted, i.e. > listening/watching multimedia or DVD's (may need to install codecs and add > relevant repositories). > > > >> 2. Training for computer lab managers. > > > > Wasn't aware there were computer lab managers. Maybe they could be > > trained (if necessary) to train the end users so that we aren't > > duplicating effort. Are they going to be responsible for ongoing > > maintenance of the machines/applying security updates, backups, etc.? > > I don't know for a fact that there is a lab manager, it was an > assumption. > > Personally I think there has to be a someone in that community > who can take a leadership role in maintaining the computers. > I think of it as sustainable computing: we teach someone who can teach > others. > > Setting up computers without a long-term support plan is a recipe that > doesn't have a high probability of succeeding. > > > > I'm not familiar with imaging technologies myself, but think if there > > are folks with the knowledge to do that, it'd be a great approach. > > I only brought imaging up because of the number of computers to be setup. > > In my mind once the base set of applications and other user-specified > configurations are set, that image can be deployed onto the other > computers since the hardware is essentially identical. > Might save time, but more importantly there is a known standard > configuration; this can save time and effort when performing > maintenance down the road. > > I'm most familiar with imaging technologies used on proprietary operating > systems, but I'd like to learn about implementing imaging in the > open-source world. > I've used G4U on occasion as a quick and dirty backup, > but have not used it in a mass deployment situation. > > -- > Romel > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jim at well.com Tue Jun 19 14:46:41 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 14:46:41 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: <55bef6e306c4729c05fe25fb5fafc350@well.com> I've got some ubuntu disks of various dates. you gotta have the very latest, i don't got, but seems to me you could use a recent one and update the boxes after the build. On Jun 19, 2007, at 12:13 AM, Michael Blanc wrote: > > Kami Griffiths at CompuMentor has sent me this update on the status of > her project. Who's got one of those Ubuntu disks to loan? > ? > ? > -----Original Message----- > From: Kami Griffiths > To: Michael Blanc > Date: Monday, June 18, 2007 4:34 PM > Subject: Another volunteer & next steps > > > Michael, > ? > I was going through my email and realized that someone else from > SF-LUG was interested in helping. I?ve added his name to the bottom of > this list: > ? > Tom Haddon, tom at greenleaftech.net > Catherine Jones, cathjone at eskimo.com > Cristina, cristina_errors at yahoo.com > Ron, rondosxx at yahoo.com > ? > ? > I heard back from the senior center and they aren?t interested in the > donation, but there?s a housing project in the Lower Haight I?ve been > working with that has old equipment (that can also be converted to > Linux) as well as space to store extra equipment. They?re current PCs > are 8 years old running a mixture of NT and Windows 2000 and super > slow. They don?t have the admin passwords anymore so there?s not much > we can do to fix them. > ? > I?m about to send an email to Romel to work out a time to pick up the > donation, I have a friend with a pickup truck who I hope is free to > help transport them. Can we schedule some time to talk? There are > several details to discuss: > ? > ????????? Getting the necessary Ubuntu/Edubuntu install disks > ????????? Schedule time to test one > ????????? Scheduling the volunteers and planning that day > ? > This is really exciting and I appreciate your help and interest in > helping make this a success! > ? > Thanks! > Kami > ? > ? > ? > ? > ? > ? > ?_______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From jim at well.com Tue Jun 19 14:54:15 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 14:54:15 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <1182277965.6838.90.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> <16651.207.90.163.99.1182276697.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> <1182277965.6838.90.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <395112ce28f9d705218121c3b38bd1d6@well.com> i'd like to participate in the build. I'm sure there are a few other SF-LUG members who're also interested. I hope you can include us--let the list know ( sf-lug at linuxmafia.com ). On Jun 19, 2007, at 11:32 AM, Tom Haddon wrote: > On Tue, 2007-06-19 at 11:11 -0700, Romel Jacinto wrote: >> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007, Tom Haddon wrote: >> >>> I have copies of both stock Ubuntu and the alternate install CD... >> >> >> >> Hi All, >> >> Disclosure: >> My workplace is the source of the pc's that are being donated to Kami. >> >> I hope to be involved with the install-fest and setup, time >> permitting, >> but whatever happens to the computers is up to the SF-LUG community >> and >> the housing project. >> >> That said, and not to belabor the obvious, but here are some points >> I'd >> like to bring up for discussion. >> The hardware and operating system installation are only a small part >> of >> the larger picture. >> >> 1. Evaluation with housing project about what their specific >> application >> needs are. > > This one's kind of key, and will really determine if the project's a > success or failure. For instance, if they __need__ Quickbooks then > we're > out of luck. Michael, are you planning to do this with Kami, or has it > been determined already? > >> >> 2. Training for computer lab managers. > > Wasn't aware there were computer lab managers. Maybe they could be > trained (if necessary) to train the end users so that we aren't > duplicating effort. Are they going to be responsible for ongoing > maintenance of the machines/applying security updates, backups, etc.? > >> >> 3. Training for end-users. >> >> The computers are all nearly identical Dell Gx150 (900 MHz, 256MB or >> 512 >> MB of RAM, 10 GB hard drives). I hope that there is some thought >> given to >> imaging since there are 15 pc's. > > I'm not familiar with imaging technologies myself, but think if there > are folks with the knowledge to do that, it'd be a great approach. > > Thanks, Tom > >> >> So that's my $0.02. >> I'm just happy that there will be some new folks using Linux and that >> computers can get some more use before being recycled. >> >> -- >> Romel >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -- > > > ---------------------------------- > Tom Haddon > mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net > m +1.415.871.4180 > www.greenleaftech.net > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From jim at well.com Tue Jun 19 14:56:21 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 14:56:21 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <2f8a56f70706191429v66d14a50i4163121eb2c45fc8@mail.gmail.com> References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> <16651.207.90.163.99.1182276697.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> <1182277965.6838.90.camel@localhost.localdomain> <2f8a56f70706191429v66d14a50i4163121eb2c45fc8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <82cdf178f884ae54a5353eba990cad16@well.com> there may be reasons to build some machines uniquely (resource differences, user needs...), just a tho't. On Jun 19, 2007, at 2:29 PM, Jeff Bragg wrote: > DD could simplify the repetitive aspects of imaging the machines, but > it's ugly, and not particularly fast; it also requires that the > destination drive be at least as big as the source drive, and any > extra space on the destination drive will be rendered unusable > (outside parameters of partition table).? Using PXE it would be > possible to largely automate this, but it would require a dedicated > machine running TFTP and housing a copy of the desired image.? I've > never set one up to do this, but it doesn't appear to be terribly > difficult; for only 15 machines, the process of setting up a build > automation system would need to be pretty trivial to be worthwhile > (except as a learning exercise). > > On 6/19/07, Romel Jacinto wrote: >> >> >> 1. Evaluation with housing project about what their specific >> application >> >> needs are. >> > >> > This one's kind of key, and will really determine if the project's a >> > success or failure. For instance, if they __need__ Quickbooks then >> we're >> > out of luck. Michael, are you planning to do this with Kami, or has >> it >> > been determined already? >> >> I wasn't thinking of such a specialized application like Quickbooks, >> but >> had more in mind more general user applications that may be wanted, >> i.e. >> listening/watching multimedia or DVD's (may need to install codecs >> and add >> relevant repositories). >> >> >> >> 2. Training for computer lab managers. >> > >> > Wasn't aware there were computer lab managers. Maybe they could be >> > trained (if necessary) to train the end users so that we aren't >> > duplicating effort. Are they going to be responsible for ongoing >> > maintenance of the machines/applying security updates, backups, >> etc.? >> >> I don't know for a fact that there is a lab manager, it was an >> assumption. >> >> Personally I think there has to be a someone in that community >> who can take a leadership role in maintaining the computers. >> I think of it as sustainable computing: we teach someone who can teach >> others. >> >> Setting up computers without a long-term support plan is a recipe that >> doesn't have a high probability of succeeding. >> >> >> > I'm not familiar with imaging technologies myself, but think if >> there >> > are folks with the knowledge to do that, it'd be a great approach. >> >> I only brought imaging up because of the number of computers to be >> setup. >> >> In my mind once the base set of applications and other user-specified >> configurations are set, that image can be deployed onto the other >> computers since the hardware is essentially identical. >> Might save time, but more importantly there is a known standard >> configuration; this can save time and effort when performing >> maintenance down the road. >> >> I'm most familiar with imaging technologies used on proprietary >> operating >> systems, but I'd like to learn about implementing imaging in the >> open-source world. >> I've used G4U on occasion as a quick and dirty backup, >> but have not used it in a mass deployment situation. >> >> -- >> Romel >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From penguin at techbandit.com Tue Jun 19 15:07:58 2007 From: penguin at techbandit.com (Romel Jacinto) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:07:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <82cdf178f884ae54a5353eba990cad16@well.com> References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> <16651.207.90.163.99.1182276697.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> <1182277965.6838.90.camel@localhost.localdomain> <2f8a56f70706191429v66d14a50i4163121eb2c45fc8@mail.gmail.com> <82cdf178f884ae54a5353eba990cad16@well.com> Message-ID: <43803.207.90.163.99.1182290878.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> On Tue, June 19, 2007 14:56, jim stockford wrote: > > there may be reasons to build some machines > uniquely (resource differences, user needs...), > just a tho't. Jim, You're absolutely right. That's why I'm hoping that there is an evaluation and written agreement up front between the installers and the end-users about what is needed and wanted on the machines. My idea about imaging was just that; I figured that we've all done individual installations ad nauseum for ourselves or for friends and family, so I thought this might be a neat learning opportunity. If this instance isn't appropriate for imaging, then that's ok with me too. -- Romel From jackofnotrades at gmail.com Tue Jun 19 15:14:37 2007 From: jackofnotrades at gmail.com (Jeff Bragg) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:14:37 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Another volunteer & next steps In-Reply-To: <43803.207.90.163.99.1182290878.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> References: <005b01c7b241$469d97e0$d5f61345@mblancznet.com> <1182270723.6838.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> <16651.207.90.163.99.1182276697.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> <1182277965.6838.90.camel@localhost.localdomain> <2f8a56f70706191429v66d14a50i4163121eb2c45fc8@mail.gmail.com> <82cdf178f884ae54a5353eba990cad16@well.com> <43803.207.90.163.99.1182290878.squirrel@webmail.tuffmail.net> Message-ID: <2f8a56f70706191514u5df548c6rdd41678cb7e008a5@mail.gmail.com> Image automation or not, with 3-5 people and as many installation discs (as well as a clear plan about what each machine will need) this could easily be accomplished in less than a day, barring really exotic configuration needs. On 6/19/07, Romel Jacinto wrote: > > On Tue, June 19, 2007 14:56, jim stockford wrote: > > > > there may be reasons to build some machines > > uniquely (resource differences, user needs...), > > just a tho't. > > > Jim, > > You're absolutely right. > That's why I'm hoping that there is an evaluation and written agreement up > front between the installers and the end-users about what is needed and > wanted on the machines. > > My idea about imaging was just that; I figured that we've all done > individual installations ad nauseum for ourselves or for friends and > family, so I thought this might be a neat learning opportunity. If this > instance isn't appropriate for imaging, then that's ok with me too. > > -- > Romel > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mblanc at znet.com Tue Jun 19 18:27:34 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 18:27:34 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info Message-ID: <002501c7b2da$2eb24c40$8df71345@mblancznet.com> Everybody ready? Here's what I have been able to learn from Kami at this point: The destination location for the computers is an already-existing, though un(der)used computer learning room located in a public housing complex on Haight at Buchanan. There are already about five machines there with NT or Win2000, which are semi-usable, and which we should probably leave as they are on this occasion. Some other machines are there which are not in use, with and an unknown number of extra monitors, amount of spare parts, etc. The nature of the network/Internet hookup is unknown, but is presumed to exist in some form (cable, DSL?) The equipment which is to be received (on Thursday, I think), consists of bare units without screens, kbs, or rodentae, but it sounds as if they have ethernet cards and possibly CD drives. Kami's intention is to start classes there for school kids, which sounds like a worthwhile goal. She wants to teach OPEN OFFICE. Can we supply an installation of it? She has also mentioned a vesion of Ubuntu for schools called Edubuntu, but this is a lower priority, certainly at this point. I recommend that we bring several distributions and then see which one works (best). Bring screwdrivers, not the alcohloic kind. Even bring some bootable 3.5" diskettes for diagnostic purposes. We'llsee how far we get. It may be that all we could do is plan out what to do next time; maybe we get the whole thing done that afternoon; we'll just see what we see. Where and when for this: 310 Haight Street (at Buchanan) This SATURDAY (June 23) 1 P.M. The place is called the Hayes Valley South Learning Center, but Kami said there is no sign to that effect. The facility is essentially a public room inside the project. A woman named Gloria is our contact, though Kami will be there for sure. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From penguin at techbandit.com Tue Jun 19 20:29:08 2007 From: penguin at techbandit.com (Romel Jacinto) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 20:29:08 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <002501c7b2da$2eb24c40$8df71345@mblancznet.com> References: <002501c7b2da$2eb24c40$8df71345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: <46789F04.1010609@techbandit.com> On 06/19/2007 06:27 PM, Michael Blanc wrote: > The equipment which is to be received (on Thursday, I think), consists of bare units without screens, kbs, or rodentae, but it sounds as if they have ethernet cards and possibly CD drives. The pc's are coming from my workplace (and are being picked up on Thursday) so I know exactly what the specs are: Dell Optiplex Gx150 Small form factor (which means that these are physically smaller and won't take a standard-height PCI card) 900 MHz 256 MB or 512 MB RAM (more likely the latter) CD-ROM drives Ethernet cards are on the motherboard The built-in video card can be somewhat temperamental when running monitors at higher resolutions under Ubuntu (Dapper Drake; have not tested with Feisty Fawn). All of these pc's were in working condition running Windows XP when we decommissioned them over the past several months. We did not donate any monitors, keyboards or mice, so I'm not sure of the plan for those. > Kami's intention is to start classes there for school kids, which sounds like a worthwhile goal. > She wants to teach OPEN OFFICE. Can we supply an installation of it? Open Office comes standard with Ubuntu. > Bring screwdrivers, not the alcohloic kind. Even bring some bootable 3.5" diskettes for diagnostic purposes. The Optiplex Gx150's are "tool-less"; no tools are needed to swap out any of the replaceable components, except for the motherboard. > We'll see how far we get. It may be that all we could do is plan out what to do next time; maybe we get the whole thing done that afternoon; we'll just see what we see. I'm fairly busy and probably won't be able to make it this Saturday, but I still maintain that there should be plan (both for the installation and for longer term support) before diving into the install-fest, however I'll defer to the sf-lug collective decision. It's fun for us to install, but these folks are going to be relying on these computers and if the computers are not configured properly, the end-users will likely get frustrated. Let's put on a good show and illustrate what open-source software can do for them. -- Romel From david at sterryit.com Tue Jun 19 22:03:35 2007 From: david at sterryit.com (David Sterry) Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 22:03:35 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <46789F04.1010609@techbandit.com> References: <002501c7b2da$2eb24c40$8df71345@mblancznet.com> <46789F04.1010609@techbandit.com> Message-ID: <4678B527.1030803@sterryit.com> I've been watching this discussion for a bit and though I have no experience doing this sort of thing, I did see it on TV! Actually YouTube via slashdot. See this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rts0xK5Uu3M So I just wrote to the guy that did a similar project with 150 PCs and what follows is his prompt response. -Dave ==================================================================== As for managing a lab, I just installed a dual-boot system with customizations like crazy on about 150 computers at our school. It's pretty easy, and I did it in about 1 week. 1.) The computers you are imaging should be identical. The hard drive size is especially important, but I've found that doing what I am about to explain on different pieces of hardware creates problems, and sometimes it just doesn't work. Identical hardware is the key: 2.) Start by configuring one computer the way you want it. If it is going to be used by many people, you'll want to install programs like kiosktool and you'll need to go in and tweak file permissions on things like the Desktop directory for public users. Basically, install all of your programs and make it look real pretty. 3. Boot Knoppix onto the computer to be imaged, we'll call this the slave computer. (The orginal is hereafter referred to as the Master.) 4. Determine the slave's ip address and be sure you can ping the master. 5. Determine the device name of the hard drive that will receive the data on the slave. (It is usually /dev/hda or /dev/sda) 6. On the slave type nc -l -p 9000 | dd of=/dev/hda <-- whatever the output device is. (This command uses netcat to pipe information to dd. It will create a one-to-one image of the master disk once you start sending information.) 7.) on the master type dd if=/dev/hda | nc ip_address_of_slave 9000 (This will begin sending information to the netcat process that is listening on the slave, which is in turn is written out to the disk. The hard drive lights on both computers should begin flashing in unison.) 8.) For every 80 gigs it takes about 2 1/2 hours I've found. Write back and let me know how it works out. I have a lot of experience managing lots-o-linux. I hope I can help further. Take it easy, Josh Romel Jacinto wrote: > On 06/19/2007 06:27 PM, Michael Blanc wrote: > >> The equipment which is to be received (on Thursday, I think), consists of bare units without screens, kbs, or rodentae, but it sounds as if they have ethernet cards and possibly CD drives. > > The pc's are coming from my workplace (and are being picked up on > Thursday) so I know exactly what the specs are: > > Dell Optiplex Gx150 > Small form factor (which means that these are physically smaller and > won't take a standard-height PCI card) > 900 MHz > 256 MB or 512 MB RAM (more likely the latter) > CD-ROM drives > Ethernet cards are on the motherboard > > The built-in video card can be somewhat temperamental when running > monitors at higher resolutions under Ubuntu (Dapper Drake; have not > tested with Feisty Fawn). > > All of these pc's were in working condition running Windows XP when we > decommissioned them over the past several months. > > We did not donate any monitors, keyboards or mice, so I'm not sure of > the plan for those. > > >> Kami's intention is to start classes there for school kids, which sounds like a worthwhile goal. > > She wants to teach OPEN OFFICE. Can we supply an installation of it? > > > Open Office comes standard with Ubuntu. > > >> Bring screwdrivers, not the alcohloic kind. Even bring some bootable 3.5" diskettes for diagnostic purposes. > > The Optiplex Gx150's are "tool-less"; no tools are needed to swap out > any of the replaceable components, except for the motherboard. > > >> We'll see how far we get. It may be that all we could do is plan out what to do next time; maybe we get the whole thing done that afternoon; we'll just see what we see. > > I'm fairly busy and probably won't be able to make it this Saturday, but > I still maintain that there should be plan (both for the installation > and for longer term support) before diving into the install-fest, > however I'll defer to the sf-lug collective decision. > > It's fun for us to install, but these folks are going to be relying on > these computers and if the computers are not configured properly, the > end-users will likely get frustrated. > > Let's put on a good show and illustrate what open-source software can do > for them. > > -- > Romel > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From jim at well.com Wed Jun 20 09:32:51 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 09:32:51 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Full-Time Direct Linux Systems Administrator (SF) Message-ID: > Hello all, > > My name is Jojo Lam and I am a technical recruiter with Eastridge > Infotech. I specialize in the infrastructure and telecom space and > wanted to share this opportunity with your group. > > This is a full-time direct position in the 80-90k range (negotiable > depending on relevant professional experience). We are looking for a > Linux Systems Administrator with 3-6 years experience, someone who > knows > Foundry ServerIron and/or other load balancing technologies. The > company > has grown from 100 to 250 servers in the past year. Their technology is > utilized by 3000+ clients, i.e. www.tomhardware.com > . They are located in downtown San > Francisco, with the opportunity to travel abroad once a year and to > their East Coast location as well. We are seeking candidates local to > this area. > > The hours for the role are 8am-5pm, on call support is provided between > two people until 12am (however, not a ton of calls off hours). Some > travel to San Jose is required. This is an open and social work > environment! > > If you would like more information, please contact me via email at > jlam at eastridgeit.com with a copy of your resume. Or, you can also reach > me at the office between the hours of 10-12 and 2-4 at 925-944-2988 ext > 211. If not for you but sounds like an opportunity for someone you > know, > I offer $500 bonuses for successfully placed referral candidates. > > Warm regards, > > Jojo Lam > > > Jojo Lam > Technical Recruiter > Eastridge Infotech > 925-944-2988 ext 211 > jlam at eastridgeit.com > http://www.linkedin.com/in/jojolam > From tom at greenleaftech.net Wed Jun 20 10:53:00 2007 From: tom at greenleaftech.net (Tom Haddon) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 10:53:00 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <002501c7b2da$2eb24c40$8df71345@mblancznet.com> References: <002501c7b2da$2eb24c40$8df71345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: <1182361980.6838.153.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2007-06-19 at 18:27 -0700, Michael Blanc wrote: > Everybody ready? Here's what I have been able to learn from Kami at > this point: > > The destination location for the computers is an already-existing, > though un(der)used computer learning room located in a public housing > complex on Haight at Buchanan. There are already about five machines > there with NT or Win2000, which are semi-usable, and which we should > probably leave as they are on this occasion. Some other machines are > there which are not in use, with and an unknown number of extra > monitors, amount of spare parts, etc. The nature of the > network/Internet hookup is unknown, but is presumed to exist in some > form (cable, DSL?) > > The equipment which is to be received (on Thursday, I think), consists > of bare units without screens, kbs, or rodentae, but it sounds as if > they have ethernet cards and possibly CD drives. > > Kami's intention is to start classes there for school kids, which > sounds like a worthwhile goal. She wants to teach OPEN OFFICE. Can we > supply an installation of it? She has also mentioned a vesion of > Ubuntu for schools called Edubuntu, but this is a lower priority, http://www.edubuntu.com/ If this is what's wanted, it would probably be a good idea to install/test it upfront. It also looks like the current version includes out of the box support for LTSP which might be a nice consideration for lower resource boxes. Check out http://www.edubuntu.com/Download for more details... I'll download these CDs and bring them along (all three). Personally, I think it's unrealistic to do all the testing and installation in one afternoon. It would be nice to install a few different distros, and then have the users test them and give us feedback - we could then come back and configure the one that seems to fit best a week later or so. What do people think of that idea? Thanks, Tom > certainly at this point. I recommend that we bring several > distributions and then see which one works (best). Bring screwdrivers, > not the alcohloic kind. Even bring some bootable 3.5" diskettes for > diagnostic purposes. > > We'llsee how far we get. It may be that all we could do is plan out > what to do next time; maybe we get the whole thing done that > afternoon; we'll just see what we see. > > Where and when for this: 310 Haight Street (at Buchanan) > This SATURDAY (June > 23) 1 P.M. > > The place is called the Hayes Valley South Learning Center, but Kami > said there is no sign to that effect. The facility is essentially a > public room inside the project. A woman named Gloria is our contact, > though Kami will be there for sure. > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From jim at well.com Wed Jun 20 11:00:51 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 11:00:51 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <1182361980.6838.153.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <002501c7b2da$2eb24c40$8df71345@mblancznet.com> <1182361980.6838.153.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: i like the idea of installing several different distros, maybe several different configurations of each distro. It's a great idea to get user feedback. And it does seem more realistic to commit to more than a single day/afternoon. On Jun 20, 2007, at 10:53 AM, Tom Haddon wrote: > On Tue, 2007-06-19 at 18:27 -0700, Michael Blanc wrote: >> Everybody ready? Here's what I have been able to learn from Kami at >> this point: >> >> The destination location for the computers is an already-existing, >> though un(der)used computer learning room located in a public housing >> complex on Haight at Buchanan. There are already about five machines >> there with NT or Win2000, which are semi-usable, and which we should >> probably leave as they are on this occasion. Some other machines are >> there which are not in use, with and an unknown number of extra >> monitors, amount of spare parts, etc. The nature of the >> network/Internet hookup is unknown, but is presumed to exist in some >> form (cable, DSL?) >> >> The equipment which is to be received (on Thursday, I think), consists >> of bare units without screens, kbs, or rodentae, but it sounds as if >> they have ethernet cards and possibly CD drives. >> >> Kami's intention is to start classes there for school kids, which >> sounds like a worthwhile goal. She wants to teach OPEN OFFICE. Can we >> supply an installation of it? She has also mentioned a vesion of >> Ubuntu for schools called Edubuntu, but this is a lower priority, > > http://www.edubuntu.com/ > > If this is what's wanted, it would probably be a good idea to > install/test it upfront. It also looks like the current version > includes > out of the box support for LTSP which might be a nice consideration for > lower resource boxes. Check out http://www.edubuntu.com/Download for > more details... > > I'll download these CDs and bring them along (all three). > > Personally, I think it's unrealistic to do all the testing and > installation in one afternoon. It would be nice to install a few > different distros, and then have the users test them and give us > feedback - we could then come back and configure the one that seems to > fit best a week later or so. What do people think of that idea? > > Thanks, Tom > >> certainly at this point. I recommend that we bring several >> distributions and then see which one works (best). Bring screwdrivers, >> not the alcohloic kind. Even bring some bootable 3.5" diskettes for >> diagnostic purposes. >> >> We'llsee how far we get. It may be that all we could do is plan out >> what to do next time; maybe we get the whole thing done that >> afternoon; we'll just see what we see. >> >> Where and when for this: 310 Haight Street (at Buchanan) >> This SATURDAY (June >> 23) 1 P.M. >> >> The place is called the Hayes Valley South Learning Center, but Kami >> said there is no sign to that effect. The facility is essentially a >> public room inside the project. A woman named Gloria is our contact, >> though Kami will be there for sure. >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -- > > > ---------------------------------- > Tom Haddon > mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net > m +1.415.871.4180 > www.greenleaftech.net > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From rondosxx at yahoo.com Wed Jun 20 11:15:21 2007 From: rondosxx at yahoo.com (ron) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 11:15:21 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info Message-ID: <862588.99644.qm@web52509.mail.re2.yahoo.com> yes, that sounds like an excellent plan. We need to do something age-appropriate that will hook kids' interest. An appropriate plan is always best, we'll be more likely to succeed with feedback. Also we need to survey the computers to make sure they're identical, otherwise ghosting is not an option, is it? ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545469 From penguin at techbandit.com Wed Jun 20 11:29:01 2007 From: penguin at techbandit.com (Romel Jacinto) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 11:29:01 -0700 (Pacific Daylight Time) Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <1182361980.6838.153.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <002501c7b2da$2eb24c40$8df71345@mblancznet.com> <1182361980.6838.153.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Wed, 20 Jun 2007, Tom Haddon wrote: > Personally, I think it's unrealistic to do all the testing and > installation in one afternoon. It would be nice to install a few > different distros, and then have the users test them and give us > feedback - we could then come back and configure the one that seems to > fit best a week later or so. What do people think of that idea? I'm unable to make it this weekend, but I might be able to make it during the follow-up visit, depending on when that happens. During this weekend's test run, I hope that there is some discussion of ongoing maintenance and support. Thankfully Ubuntu and variants are generally low-maintenance, but security patches should still be applied. -- Romel From penguin at techbandit.com Wed Jun 20 11:35:13 2007 From: penguin at techbandit.com (Romel Jacinto) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 11:35:13 -0700 (Pacific Daylight Time) Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <862588.99644.qm@web52509.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <862588.99644.qm@web52509.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 20 Jun 2007, ron wrote: > Also we need to survey the computers to make sure they're identical, > otherwise ghosting is not an option, is it? The computers should be identical, with the exception of RAM. They are either 256 MB or 512 MB. They have been imaged successfully when they ran Windows XP, so presumably imaging them with a Linux distro should be successful. -- Romel From rondosxx at yahoo.com Wed Jun 20 13:09:13 2007 From: rondosxx at yahoo.com (ron) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 13:09:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info Message-ID: <112522.17196.qm@web52503.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I'm planning to be there at 1 pm on saturday, subject to an official confirmation. BTW parking is tight in that neighborhood, for those of us who drive. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online. http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting From mblanc at znet.com Wed Jun 20 13:17:32 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 13:17:32 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info Message-ID: <000a01c7b378$0a1bf400$4ff61345@mblancznet.com> I intend to post an update, on Thursday or Friday, confirming that the equipment has been dropped off and that the 1 PM Saturday meet is still on. -MB -----Original Message----- From: ron To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 1:10 PM Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info >I'm planning to be there at 1 pm on saturday, subject >to an official confirmation. BTW parking is tight in >that neighborhood, for those of us who drive. > > > >___________________________________________________________________________ _________ >Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online. >http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting > >_______________________________________________ >sf-lug mailing list >sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From jwmurray at gmail.com Wed Jun 20 14:33:40 2007 From: jwmurray at gmail.com (John Murray) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 14:33:40 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <000a01c7b378$0a1bf400$4ff61345@mblancznet.com> References: <000a01c7b378$0a1bf400$4ff61345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: Guys: I have done a few of these projects also and it is cheap and productive to just by a hard disk mastering device or use a single pc. On the imaging machine you need: > boot drive > image drive > target drive Image all the drives in advance on one machine and then just put them in the other machines and boot up and you are "good to go". The commercial disk duplication machines are a few hundred dollars: http://www.ics-iq.com/index.cfm/action/catalog.browse/category/Handheld_Duplication/id_category/8c53de87-f79f-419b-8f6a-9d889d5b97c4 This is just a google result, I can't recommend it. Hope this helps. John On 6/20/07, Michael Blanc wrote: > > I intend to post an update, on Thursday or Friday, confirming that the > equipment has been dropped off and that the 1 PM Saturday meet is still > on. > -MB > -----Original Message----- > From: ron > To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > Date: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 1:10 PM > Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info > > > >I'm planning to be there at 1 pm on saturday, subject > >to an official confirmation. BTW parking is tight in > >that neighborhood, for those of us who drive. > > > > > > > > >___________________________________________________________________________ > _________ > >Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you > all > the tools to get online. > >http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting > > > >_______________________________________________ > >sf-lug mailing list > >sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > >http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -- John Murray 220 Bush Street, Suite 941 San Francisco, CA 94105 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jackofnotrades at gmail.com Wed Jun 20 14:41:40 2007 From: jackofnotrades at gmail.com (Jeff Bragg) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 14:41:40 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <862588.99644.qm@web52509.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <862588.99644.qm@web52509.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2f8a56f70706201441o1418a0c7y1648e7985c794290@mail.gmail.com> "Personally, I think it's unrealistic to do all the testing and installation in one afternoon. It would be nice to install a few different distros, and then have the users test them and give us feedback - we could then come back and configure the one that seems to fit best a week later or so. What do people think of that idea?" If they knew exactly what they needed and could communicate that clearly, I would disagree that one day is unrealistic (with the right resources, e.g. a KVM switch and several copies of installation discs, and a clear plan I could do that many in a single day all by myself). However, since neither of those seem to be the case, I agree that one day may not be realistic (especially if we're talking about multiple distros). "Also we need to > survey the computers to make sure they're identical, > otherwise ghosting is not an option, is it?" Ghosting is only an option if they are identical machines needing an identical (totally identical, not just similar) image. It would also be necessary to have a valid copy of Ghost (nobody has mentioned so far that they do). I've never had much luck with Ghost + Linux anyway. ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who > knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out. > http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545469 > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From johnlowry at gmail.com Wed Jun 20 15:08:20 2007 From: johnlowry at gmail.com (John Jefferson Lowry IV) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 15:08:20 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <2f8a56f70706201441o1418a0c7y1648e7985c794290@mail.gmail.com> References: <862588.99644.qm@web52509.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <2f8a56f70706201441o1418a0c7y1648e7985c794290@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <528b20610706201508r60ebd56dhbab3f3713a1b857@mail.gmail.com> Ghost 4 Linux is a good ghosting solution. On 6/20/07, Jeff Bragg wrote: > > "Personally, I think it's unrealistic to do all the testing and > installation in one afternoon. It would be nice to install a few > different distros, and then have the users test them and give us > feedback - we could then come back and configure the one that seems to > fit best a week later or so. What do people think of that idea?" > > If they knew exactly what they needed and could communicate that clearly, > I would disagree that one day is unrealistic (with the right resources, > e.g. a KVM switch and several copies of installation discs, and a clear > plan I could do that many in a single day all by myself). However, since > neither of those seem to be the case, I agree that one day may not be > realistic (especially if we're talking about multiple distros). > > "Also we need to > > survey the computers to make sure they're identical, > > otherwise ghosting is not an option, is it?" > > > Ghosting is only an option if they are identical machines needing an > identical (totally identical, not just similar) image. It would also be > necessary to have a valid copy of Ghost (nobody has mentioned so far that > they do). I've never had much luck with Ghost + Linux anyway. > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > > > > Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who > > knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out. > > http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545469 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > -- John Lowry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Wed Jun 20 16:32:17 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 16:32:17 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <2f8a56f70706201441o1418a0c7y1648e7985c794290@mail.gmail.com> References: <862588.99644.qm@web52509.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <2f8a56f70706201441o1418a0c7y1648e7985c794290@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20070620233217.GA16356@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Jeff Bragg (jackofnotrades at gmail.com): > If they knew exactly what they needed and could communicate that > clearly, I would disagree that one day is unrealistic (with the right > resources, e.g. a KVM switch and several copies of installation discs, > and a clear plan I could do that many in a single day all by myself). > However, since neither of those seem to be the case, I agree that one > day may not be realistic (especially if we're talking about multiple > distros). I think logically you'll want to start with: 1) a long, careful, and skeptical discussion with Tami Griffiths and whoever is relevant management at the cited "computer learning room at a housing project in the Lower Haight", to find out what they want to do, for what users and with what needs, and what sort of mandate (if any) exists to keep those installations going when you're done. Kami is quoted as saying she wants to "start classes there for school kids", featuring OpenOffice.org -- which is a start, but what does the intended teaching environment look like. Has it been prototyped and tried out on a test learner? If not, shouldn't that happen first? Note the bit about ongoing mandate: The history of volunteer Linux work is festooned with intensively worked-on projects that got almost immediately junked for lack of meaningful buy-in from sponsoring agencies. Their attitude was: "One of our staff wants to supervise you working yourself to death over a couple of weekend, and it won't cost us a cent, and it might result in free usable computers in a fashion we don't even begin to understand? Cool, go to it!" But a month later, the Executive Director's nephew blows away all the machines and reinstalls with his old pirated W2k CD, because otherwise he can't run World of Warcraft on them. Computer geeks tend to obsessively delve straight into technological fine points when there are key discussions about the nature and scope of the project that badly need to occur first. That would be a grave mistake, here. 2) a physical survey of the (unspecified number of) keyboardless, monitorless, mouseless Dell Optiplex Gx150 boxen to verify their condition and usefulness. (They sound fine, but one should check.) From penguin at techbandit.com Wed Jun 20 16:51:08 2007 From: penguin at techbandit.com (Romel Jacinto) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 16:51:08 -0700 (Pacific Daylight Time) Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <4678B527.1030803@sterryit.com> References: <002501c7b2da$2eb24c40$8df71345@mblancznet.com> <46789F04.1010609@techbandit.com> <4678B527.1030803@sterryit.com> Message-ID: <4678C442.4000900@techbandit.com> On 06/19/2007 10:03 PM, David Sterry wrote: > I've been watching this discussion for a bit and though I have no > experience doing this sort of thing, I did see it on TV! Actually > YouTube via slashdot. See this video: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rts0xK5Uu3M > > So I just wrote to the guy that did a similar project with 150 PCs and > what follows is his prompt response. -Dave Wow, what a cool find, David! Thanks for sharing with the list. I think it's a good primer for an installation methodology and I'm sure there are few other ways to consider as well. What I was (am still hoping) is that there is a business process plan for how these computers will be setup, used and maintained. Disclosure: I helped start one of the first community computer labs for Tibetan refugees in Northern India in 1998. It was started with the best of intentions and was popular _while it was maintained_, but ultimately it folded because of...lack of a long-term plan. I'm confident that the sf-lug community can tackle an install-fest. However, what on-going maintenance and support is going to be done so that the computer lab is still in good shape in six months or a year? Who is the computer lab going to contact if they want to do ? I'm under the impression these folks don't want to use technology for technology's sake, rather they want to use technology to accomplish something else. What is that "something else" for these folks? I don't know, but it'd be great to define it, find the proper tools and a roadmap to help them accomplish it. The collective sf-lug community can tackle the technology aspect, but for the technology to be used successfully, it needs dialogue, partnership and agreement from the ALL parties using the technology. -- Romel From rondosxx at yahoo.com Wed Jun 20 17:07:12 2007 From: rondosxx at yahoo.com (ron) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 17:07:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info Message-ID: <370775.92237.qm@web52501.mail.re2.yahoo.com> thanks, John Lowry, for that grounding message. Personally, I was expecting that we'd go to the site on saturday and scope it out. I agree with you that proper planning for the project is essential. So I'd like to see that get nailed down before an installation crew shows up. We could go there to survey the equipment, assure that working monitors keyboards and mouses are present and that all the necessary cabling is available. Maybe take one of the units away to be set up offsite. But before a lot of my time is invested, I want to know that we're doing a meaningful installation. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more. http://mobile.yahoo.com/go?refer=1GNXIC From penguin at techbandit.com Wed Jun 20 17:32:14 2007 From: penguin at techbandit.com (Romel Jacinto) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 17:32:14 -0700 (Pacific Daylight Time) Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info In-Reply-To: <20070620233217.GA16356@linuxmafia.com> References: <862588.99644.qm@web52509.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <2f8a56f70706201441o1418a0c7y1648e7985c794290@mail.gmail.com> <20070620233217.GA16356@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 20 Jun 2007, Rick Moen wrote: > 2) a physical survey of the (unspecified number of) keyboardless, > monitorless, mouseless Dell Optiplex Gx150 boxen to verify their > condition and usefulness. (They sound fine, but one should check.) There will be 15 boxen donated. I've heard the lab will accomodate 12 computer setups, but I'm not positive. Although they had all been working when they were decommissioned over the past several months, they've been moved to and fro as we struggled to find spare storage space for them, so it would be prudent to verify that they are all still working and useful, as Rick as wisely suggested. One of the live Linux CD's that are lightweight might be a useful tool to do this. Some of the external cases are scratched, but that should not affect functionality. -- Romel From mblanc at znet.com Wed Jun 20 23:14:09 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 23:14:09 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info Message-ID: <001e01c7b3cb$62827bc0$bdf61345@mblancznet.com> This is my thought as well -- that a survey of the situation and of the inventory needs to be done first. Kami is pushing for as much as can be done the first day. zzso why don't we just meet down there on Sat. afternoon and start by looking things over. That shouldn't take long, and needs to be done first. The director, or coordinator for the computer room (who might a community volunteer) will be there, and Kami. We could ascertain their level of organization, expectations and wishes - as well as size up the possibilities, hopefully in reasonably short order. Then take it from there. -----Original Message----- From: ron To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 5:08 PM Subject: [sf-lug] Ubuntu project for the housing project - latest info >thanks, John Lowry, for that grounding message. >Personally, I was expecting that we'd go to the site >on saturday and scope it out. I agree with you that >proper planning for the project is essential. So I'd >like to see that get nailed down before an >installation crew shows up. We could go there to >survey the equipment, assure that working monitors >keyboards and mouses are present and that all the >necessary cabling is available. Maybe take one of the >units away to be set up offsite. But before a lot of >my time is invested, I want to know that we're doing a >meaningful installation. > > > >___________________________________________________________________________ _________ >Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more. >http://mobile.yahoo.com/go?refer=1GNXIC > >_______________________________________________ >sf-lug mailing list >sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From asheesh at asheesh.org Thu Jun 21 14:05:21 2007 From: asheesh at asheesh.org (Asheesh Laroia) Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 17:05:21 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Becoming a user on sf-lug.com; also, Asterisk Message-ID: I'm very interested in becoming a shell user on sf-lug.com, particularly as a place with lowish-latency in the US to keep an Asterisk setup. (My personal server is in Japan, which for all its advantages has a 250ms round-trip time....) What I want out of Asterisk is a phone system I feel I am in control of. If you dial into some US number, the call should be routed to the Asterisk server over the Internet; after that point, the call can be forwarded (admittedly at my expense) to my cell phone, my work phone, my temporary number in London, voice mail that has a sane interface, a program that reads random Wikipedia articles to the other end, or anything like that. So (a) may I become a user on sf-lug.com, and (b) may I run an Asterisk service there? As far as I know, running an Asterisk doesn't need any special privileges to run the service; it can run on any port, so multiple users can run separate Asterisk setups. I'd be happy to give an SF-LUG and/or BALUG talk on what tricks I pull off with Asterisk if I do get it set up. (-: I'll be making my return to San Francisco on July 8 and starting as a hacker at Creative Commons full-time (some of you might recall my being an intern there last summer). See you all soon! -- Asheesh. P.S. https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-asheesh has SSH public keys of mine, and the username I would prefer is paulproteus. -- Beware the new TTY code! From bliss at california.com Thu Jun 21 16:18:39 2007 From: bliss at california.com (bobbie sellers) Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 16:18:39 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Becoming a user on sf-lug.com; also, Asterisk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Asheesh Laroia, On 06/21/07, you wrote: > I'm very interested in becoming a shell user on sf-lug.com, > particularly as a place with lowish-latency in the US to keep > an Asterisk setup. (My personal server is in Japan, which for > all its advantages has a 250ms round-trip time....) > What I want out of Asterisk is a phone system I feel I am in > control of. If you dial into some US number, the call should be > routed to the Asterisk server over the Internet; after that > point, the call can be forwarded (admittedly at my expense) to > my cell phone, my work phone, my temporary number in London, > voice mail that has a sane interface, a program that reads > random Wikipedia articles to the other end, or anything like > that. > So (a) may I become a user on sf-lug.com, and (b) may I run an > Asterisk service there? As far as I know, running an Asterisk > doesn't need any special privileges to run the service; it can > run on any port, so multiple users can run separate Asterisk > setups. I'd be happy to give an SF-LUG and/or BALUG talk on > what tricks I pull off with Asterisk if I do get it set up. (-: > I'll be making my return to San Francisco on July 8 and > starting as a hacker at Creative Commons full-time (some of you > might recall my being an intern there last summer). See you all > soon! > -- Asheesh. > P.S. https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-asheesh has SSH public keys > of mine, and the username I would prefer is paulproteus. Sounds interesting to me. bliss -- bobbie sellers - (Back to Angband) Team *AMIGA & SF-LUG* bliss at california dot com Sin that pays its way can travel freely, and without a passport; whereas virtue, if a pauper, is stopped at all frontiers. From mblanc at znet.com Thu Jun 21 18:28:59 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 18:28:59 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Saturday is NOT CONFIRMED Message-ID: <001b01c7b46c$b65d8b80$0ef61345@mblancznet.com> At least not yet, and it looks like we should postpone to another week. I received two emails from Kami Griffiths today: 1> She had not picked up the equipment today, but hoped to do it tomorrow (Fri 22) PM 2> Would we please reschedule for 4 pm on Saturday, as she remembered a previous engagement. Unless people are adamant about going down there (maybe) at 4 on Saturday, I say we just put this off until we all have our little ducks in a row. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Thu Jun 21 19:09:35 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 19:09:35 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Saturday is NOT CONFIRMED In-Reply-To: <001b01c7b46c$b65d8b80$0ef61345@mblancznet.com> References: <001b01c7b46c$b65d8b80$0ef61345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: <20070622020935.GA11788@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Michael Blanc (mblanc at znet.com): > Unless people are adamant about going down there (maybe) at 4 on > Saturday, I say we just put this off until we all have our little > ducks in a row. That being the case, y'all are invited to come down to Saturday's CABAL meeting (4 pm to midnight in West Menlo Park), and I'll be glad to discuss installation methods and options with you, and also you're welcome to come duplicate CABAL's Ubuntu and other installation media. http://linuxmafia.com/cabal/ From tom at greenleaftech.net Fri Jun 22 09:44:01 2007 From: tom at greenleaftech.net (Tom Haddon) Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2007 09:44:01 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Saturday is NOT CONFIRMED In-Reply-To: <001b01c7b46c$b65d8b80$0ef61345@mblancznet.com> References: <001b01c7b46c$b65d8b80$0ef61345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: <1182530641.7799.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2007-06-21 at 18:28 -0700, Michael Blanc wrote: > At least not yet, and it looks like we should postpone to another > week. I received two emails from Kami Griffiths today: > > 1> She had not picked up the equipment today, but hoped to do it > tomorrow (Fri 22) PM > > 2> Would we please reschedule for 4 pm on Saturday, as she remembered > a previous engagement. I've been thinking a lot about Rick's comments about preparation for this kind of volunteer work. I think he made some excellent points about ensuring the long term success of the project. I thought it might be useful to get some of these questions answered (I'm not sure if they have already been answered, or if anyone has any suggestions for changes or additions that would be great): --------------------------- Why do you want Linux installed on these machines (OpenOffice is available on Windows as well)? What are the expected uses of these computers, and by whom (and what is their computer familiarity/experience)? Are the users familiar with a particular version of Linux and/or who will be training the users to get them familiar with it? Who will be maintaining the computers in terms of hardware issues? How will these computers connect to the internet? What is the network topology, and/or is one needed to be put in place? Who will be maintaining the computers in terms of software after the initial installation (installing new applications as needed, fixing software issues that come up, installing security updates)? Who will be responsible for backups and recovery? What important information will need to be backed up? --------------------------- Again, any changes or comments welcome. Thanks, Tom > > > Unless people are adamant about going down there (maybe) at 4 on > Saturday, I say we just put this off until we all have our little > ducks in a row. > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From jim at well.com Fri Jun 22 10:28:53 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2007 10:28:53 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Saturday is NOT CONFIRMED In-Reply-To: <001b01c7b46c$b65d8b80$0ef61345@mblancznet.com> References: <001b01c7b46c$b65d8b80$0ef61345@mblancznet.com> Message-ID: your idea sounds right to me. On Jun 21, 2007, at 6:28 PM, Michael Blanc wrote: > At least not yet, and it looks like we should postpone to another > week. I received two emails from Kami Griffiths today: > ? > 1> She had not picked up the equipment today, but hoped to do it > tomorrow (Fri 22) PM > ? > 2> Would we please reschedule for 4 pm on Saturday, as she remembered > a previous engagement. > ? > ? > Unless people are adamant about going down there (maybe) at 4 on > Saturday, I say we just put this off until we all have our little > ducks in a row._______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug From rondosxx at yahoo.com Fri Jun 22 12:26:36 2007 From: rondosxx at yahoo.com (ron) Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2007 12:26:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Saturday is NOT CONFIRMED (should be "You want it when???") Message-ID: <20070622192636.29341.qmail@web52502.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I think we should step back and insist on a fully formed plan for this before we lift a finger further. I think a lot of that should be able to be accomplished digitally, rather than requiring us to send a committee of busy people over there. Also I don't like the idea that they think we don't have schedules and full lives already, and it's ok to not have their ducks lined up before they pull the trigger. I've just remembered I too have a prior commitment for tomorrow. lol ____________________________________________________________________________________Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks on Yahoo! TV. http://tv.yahoo.com/ From mblanc at znet.com Fri Jun 22 13:06:47 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2007 13:06:47 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Saturday is NOT CONFIRMED (should be "You want itwhen???") Message-ID: <001101c7b508$de29ddc0$c6f61345@mblancznet.com> This is asking them to run or fly before they can walk. For our first meeting, I think that just a "scouting party" would be in order, not a full-fledged invasion. -----Original Message----- From: ron To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Friday, June 22, 2007 12:31 PM Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Saturday is NOT CONFIRMED (should be "You want itwhen???") >I think we should step back and insist on a fully >formed plan for this before we lift a finger further. >I think a lot of that should be able to be >accomplished digitally, rather than requiring us to >send a committee of busy people over there. Also I >don't like the idea that they think we don't have >schedules and full lives already, and it's ok to not >have their ducks lined up before they pull the >trigger. I've just remembered I too have a prior >commitment for tomorrow. lol > > > >___________________________________________________________________________ _________Ready for the edge of your seat? >Check out tonight's top picks on Yahoo! TV. >http://tv.yahoo.com/ > >_______________________________________________ >sf-lug mailing list >sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From mblanc at znet.com Fri Jun 22 13:05:03 2007 From: mblanc at znet.com (Michael Blanc) Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2007 13:05:03 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fw: Saturday is NOT CONFIRMED Message-ID: <000c01c7b508$a02084c0$c6f61345@mblancznet.com> Kami, It looks like the consensus of our group is to wait until more is prepared. Please let us know that the machines are delivered, and that we can arrange a firm appointment to take stock of things. I am forwarding the comment of one member, who most succinctly summarizes some of the recent discussions on our list. While my own opinion is that it is overly ambitious, it will yet be useful to have them in mind as desireable goals. MB > >I've been thinking a lot about Rick's comments about preparation for >this kind of volunteer work. I think he made some excellent points about >ensuring the long term success of the project. I thought it might be >useful to get some of these questions answered (I'm not sure if they >have already been answered, or if anyone has any suggestions for changes >or additions that would be great): > >--------------------------- > >Why do you want Linux installed on these machines (OpenOffice is >available on Windows as well)? > >What are the expected uses of these computers, and by whom (and what is >their computer familiarity/experience)? > >Are the users familiar with a particular version of Linux and/or who >will be training the users to get them familiar with it? > >Who will be maintaining the computers in terms of hardware issues? > >How will these computers connect to the internet? What is the network >topology, and/or is one needed to be put in place? > >Who will be maintaining the computers in terms of software after the >initial installation (installing new applications as needed, fixing >software issues that come up, installing security updates)? > >Who will be responsible for backups and recovery? What important >information will need to be backed up? > >--------------------------- > >Again, any changes or comments welcome. > >Thanks, Tom > >---------------------------------- >Tom Haddon >mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net >m +1.415.871.4180 >www.greenleaftech.net > > From Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu Sun Jun 24 14:55:16 2007 From: Michael.Paoli at cal.berkeley.edu (Michael Paoli) Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2007 14:55:16 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Large(ish) scale LINUX installations on older (x86) hardware Message-ID: <1182722116.467ee844b5f07@webmail.rawbw.com> Well, many good points have already been made along this "thread". I'll try not to say too much, for fear of increasing the fan-out ratio. A few (not so?) "random" bits: While clearing out some older e-mail, stumbled across: http://www.debian.org/News/weekly/2006/42/ Most notably the parts under "Installing Debian without CD-ROM", including useful bits such as: PXE-On-A-Disk: ftp://ftp.scyld.com/private/jlehan/pxe-on-a-disk.html Various good points about "needs" assessment have been made. I'd think key among them, is who will use them for what, what are the objectives, musts, shoulds, cans, should nots, and cannots, how will they be supported, and will they (hopefully) become mostly self-supporting (rather than a project that whithers and dies due to lack of support or unsupportability), etc. I don't see it as being probable to be a simple marathon install - likely a fair amount of planning - and even advance testing - may be required for most optimal results. Even doing some testing - e.g. read-write testing of disks - before attempting installations, might be useful - but that takes time - and can be quite a bit of time with larger hard drives or slower older hard drives. I'd guestimate it may be highly useful to collaborate with folks that have already done similar successful projects. What they've already learned from that experience, testing, etc. would likely be highly useful and generally actionable information. Some of the stuff Christian Einfeldt has been doing with/in schools is one such project that comes to mind, and is relatively local. There may be other projects that can also be learned from (some of them might have lots of the relevant information on-line). I'm not a huge fan of "cloning". Some things should not be cloned (e.g. items which should be unique - such as host's ssh keys, filesystem UUIDs, etc.). "Cloning" also generally only works quite well on highly matched target hardware. Also, as disks get bigger and bigger, "cloning" becomes generally increasingly time inefficient. E.g. writing out all the blocks on a >80 GiB drive is rather time consuming; for a brand new installation, even rather fully loaded, probably less than 10% of those blocks actually need to get written to the hard drive; i.e. probably much faster to plop a partition table in place, format the filesystems & swap, and then only write out the needed filesystem data - e.g. via relatively "normal" installation, or by writing files out from an archive (such as tar or cpio). Such methods can be much faster than doing dd or the like - again, particularly as drive sizes increase. Also, with large numbers of systems, what is often most important is not machine time to install, but person time - set it going, ignore it for many hours, then come back later, and see that all was done successfully. Whether it's 30 minutes per box, or 72 hours typically isn't a major factor - as long as all ends well and requires zero interaction after kick-off is set in motion. disclaimer: I'm not necessarily pushing Debian as the optimal solution in all cases or this specific case, ... I just "happen" to like it lots for various reasons, and am typically more familiar with much of it than similar aspects of other distributions. references: http://www.diyparts.org/ http://www.informatik.uni-koeln.de/fai/ http://groups.google.com/group/alt.os.linux.debian/msg/0e1af800407305eb?dmode=source&output=gplain http://linuxmafia.com/pipermail/sf-lug/2007q2/date.html From bill at wards.net Mon Jun 25 10:52:52 2007 From: bill at wards.net (Bill Ward) Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 10:52:52 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] PenLUG this week - VoIP/Asterisk with Dr Sameer Verma Message-ID: <3d2fe1780706251052v525e0fd4t22a25870547fdc6@mail.gmail.com> Note: this is the third month in our NEW LOCATION sponsored by Qualys. Date: Thursday, June 28th, 2007 Time: meeting 7:00 - 9:00 PM, social/networking until 10 PM Location: Bayshore Technology Park 1300 Island Drive Redwood City, CA 94065 Suite 106 - Training Room Dr. Sameer Verma, Voice over Internet Protocol (VoIP) using Asterisk. This presentation will cover the design of VoIP for a small-business scenario. It will cover configuration and use of AstLinux using 1) a bootable CD and a USB Flash key, 2) Soekris net4801 embedded x86 platform. The presentation will also touch on other Asterisk distros such as TrixBox, which supports many additional features such as billing, CRM etc. Dr. Sameer Verma is Associate Professor of Information Systems at San Francisco State University. His research focuses on the diffusion and adoption of innovative technologies. He is currently working on several academic research projects which include the diffusion of open source software, wireless networks, and geo-spatial systems. In addition to his academic work, Dr. Verma has worked with companies in consulting capacity in the areas of content analysis, management and delivery. Dr. Verma also serves on the advisory boards of some SF Bay Area technology companies. Dr. Verma's first exposure to Linux was in 1997. He currently runs Linux on his laptop at work, servers and workstations in his lab, desktop at home, media center behind the bookshelf at home, and the PDA in his pocket. RSVP * Although it is not required, we like to have an idea of how many people to expect, so if possible please email rsvp at penlug.org if you are planning to attend. From nbs at sonic.net Wed Jun 27 08:22:56 2007 From: nbs at sonic.net (Bill Kendrick) Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 08:22:56 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Opportunity for LUG booth at LinuxWorld Expo (SF in August) Message-ID: <20070627152256.GG16240@sonic.net> The Linux Users' Group of Davis (LUGOD) has the opportunity to participate at LinuxWorld Expo in San Francisco this August (as we've done in the past[*]). Please see the threads over on LUGOD's "vox-outreach" mailing list for details: http://www.lugod.org/mailinglists/archives/vox-outreach/2007-06/maillist.html We need to confirm with LWE organizers by next Tuesday (July 3rd), so _now_ is the time to round up volunteers. I've suggested we go in together with other LUGs (e.g., SacLUG, SVLUG, etc.). It sounds like SF-LUG and a group called "PloneLounge" are already planning to go. SF-LUG folks - can you tell me more? Would you like to participate in a multi-LUG booth? (They're easier to staff :^) ) LUGOD's "vox-outreach" mailing list is a good place to discuss this, so please do so there. (Some of you have been emailing me privately, which is fine, but is muchmore likely to get ignored or lost, due to my busy-ness!) Sign up here: http://www.lugod.org/mailinglists/#vox-outreach -bill! pr at lugod.org http://www.lugod.org/ Linux Users' Group of Davis [*] LUGOD at LWE SF 2003 and 2004: http://www.lugod.org/projects/lwe/ From rondosxx at yahoo.com Wed Jun 27 12:43:16 2007 From: rondosxx at yahoo.com (ron) Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 12:43:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Opportunity for LUG booth at LinuxWorld Expo (SF in August) (Bill Kendrick) Message-ID: <280111.47761.qm@web52508.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I volunteered last year with a company of programmers, don't remember who they were. This year I will volunteer with whichever LUG that has a booth. A combined LUG booth sounds interesting. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC From kgriffiths at compumentor.org Mon Jun 25 10:49:02 2007 From: kgriffiths at compumentor.org (Kami Griffiths) Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 10:49:02 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab Message-ID: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F0305680B@cmexch.compumentor.org> Thanks for all your interest and enthusiasm in helping to create a Linux lab. I apologize for changing plans so late last week, I understand you're all busy people and I appreciate your patience! I'd like to give you a little background on this project and address some questions that were raised. I work at CompuMentor/TechSoup and create materials that help organizations offer technology programs to their community. We're currently working on a guide specifically for librarians to help them with the maintenance of their public computers. I am gathering best practices by interviewing librarians who have learned how to do this successfully. I interviewed someone from Alabama who was fed up with Microsoft and installed Ubuntu on all her Windows 98 machines and couldn't be happier. It was this interview that motivated me to test the idea here. How challenging is it to take your old machines and install Ubuntu? Can TechSoup create educational material to help others organizations with old computers do something similar? Can I help create a better quality lab in my community to help the several hundred people there learn how to use the computer? Not everyone can afford a computer and the 2007 City Survey shows that 20% of San Francisco residents still don't have a computer or internet access. That number jumps to 30% in the Southeast and the report highlights the growing digital divide when it comes to income, education level and race. There was a push to address this issue in the late 90s, government and foundation funding was plentiful and computer labs popped up everywhere. The current administration declared that there was no longer a digital divide, funding dried up and so did the salaries that paid for trainers and technicians to keep the labs running. But people still don't know how to use the computer even though the need to know is growing. Here are some questions posed by a member and my responses: Q: Why do you want Linux installed on these machines (OpenOffice is available on Windows as well)? A: Linux uses less space on the hard drive and allows older, slower machines to perform better than using Windows. Also, MS has stopped supporting older versions of Windows making it a challenge to continue using them. Lastly, the option to upgrade to a newer MS OS may not be an option for some organizations with little funding. Q: What are the expected uses of these computers, and by whom (and what is their computer familiarity/experience)? A: The computer lab resides in a housing project and is only used occasionally by the after school program. They don't have funding to pay for a computer teacher so there haven't been classes for adults in many years. I have offered to teach a weekly basic course which will be open only to residents of the housing project (there are around 200 adults that have little/no computer experience). I'd like to install Edubuntu which has educational programs that can be utilized by the after school program and OpenOffice which can help adults acquire skills to obtain a better job. Q: Are the users familiar with a particular version of Linux and/or who will be training the users to get them familiar with it? A: Very few adults within this housing project own a computer or know how to use one. They wouldn't know the difference between operating systems, or OpenOffice and Microsoft Office. Q: Who will be maintaining the computers in terms of hardware issues? Who will be maintaining the computers in terms of software after the initial installation (installing new applications as needed, fixing software issues that come up, installing security updates)? A: There's an interesting opportunity to train someone in the community how to do this, like a mentoring program. But right now there is no one on staff with IT experience and we would need to rely on volunteers. Q: How will these computers connect to the internet? What is the network topology, and/or is one needed to be put in place? A: They have a DSL line for internet and a server, but I'm not sure it's being used. There is also a color laser printer still in the box that needs to be installed. Q: Who will be responsible for backups and recovery? What important information will need to be backed up? A: Backups won't be necessary, since it's a public lab they should not be saving their files on the computers but to a flash drive. Next Steps: Set up a couple of machines, install Edubuntu, test it, determine if it's the best configuration. This will require 2 people to be present and 1-2 available via phone for troubleshooting help. I anticipate it will take 2 hours. The install-fest can happen anytime after that and we'll need 4-5 people. I'm not an expert at any of this and am learning as I go too. I think there's a great opportunity here to help aging labs around the world understand how they can convert from Windows to Linux, saving them money and promoting open source. Let me know if there are additional questions and I look forward to working on this project together! _________________________________ Kami Griffiths CompuMentor, Senior Program Associate 525 Brannan Street, Suite 300 San Francisco, CA 94107 P: 415-633-9392 F: 415-633-9400 kami at compumentor.org www.compumentor.org Bringing people and technology together to strengthen our communities www.techsoup.org Technology served the way nonprofits need it, powered by CompuMentor -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tom at greenleaftech.net Wed Jun 27 17:15:26 2007 From: tom at greenleaftech.net (Tom Haddon) Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 17:15:26 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab In-Reply-To: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F0305680B@cmexch.compumentor.org> References: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F0305680B@cmexch.compumentor.org> Message-ID: <1182989726.9838.65.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 10:49 -0700, Kami Griffiths wrote: > > > > Next Steps: Set up a couple of machines, install Edubuntu, test it, > determine if it?s the best configuration. This will require 2 people > to be present and 1-2 available via phone for troubleshooting help. I > anticipate it will take 2 hours. The install-fest can happen anytime > after that and we?ll need 4-5 people. > > I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just testing that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > > > > I?m not an expert at any of this and am learning as I go too. I think > there?s a great opportunity here to help aging labs around the world > understand how they can convert from Windows to Linux, saving them > money and promoting open source. Let me know if there are additional > questions and I look forward to working on this project together! > > Definitely all in favor of that! Thanks, Tom > > _________________________________ > > Kami Griffiths > > CompuMentor, Senior Program Associate > > 525 Brannan Street, Suite 300 > San Francisco, CA 94107 > > > P: 415-633-9392 F: 415-633-9400 > > > kami at compumentor.org > > > > > www.compumentor.org Bringing people and technology together to > strengthen our communities > > > www.techsoup.org Technology served the way nonprofits need it, > powered by CompuMentor > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From asheesh at asheesh.org Wed Jun 27 21:27:30 2007 From: asheesh at asheesh.org (Asheesh Laroia) Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 00:27:30 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [sf-lug] Finally Frickin' Freedom Fone Message-ID: There will be OpenMoko phones available for sale July 9, finally, according to the head of the project. More information at http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-June/006005.html . July 9's version won't have wifi but will cost a "measly" $300; the full wifi'd and accelerometer and 3D-accelerated edition in October will cost $450. People do tell me that it's more important to buy a data plan on the cell network than to have wifi even if your phone has wifi because the cell network is always there for you. I've been waiting for this since I heard about the project in January. It's like the Trolltech Greenphone, only actually interesting. GSM only (in the US, that means T-Mobile or Cingular/AT&T/NSA); Verizon users need not apply. I just switched to T-Mobile in preparation for this (if the other choice is funding a secret NSA eavesdropping lab, it's not really a choice at all). I, for one, plan to enjoy this beautiful, liberated, liberating convergence device as a music player, mobile telephone, personal digital assistant, and so on. And regardless I'll see you all soon - I'm arriving to SF in about two weeks. -- Asheesh. -- So this is what it feels like to be potato salad From Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com Thu Jun 28 08:18:21 2007 From: Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com (Blake Haggerty) Date: 28 Jun 2007 11:18:21 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] Finally Frickin' Freedom Fone Message-ID: <18279588.1183043902992.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> I have been reading about this phone for about the last six months and I am wondering what are the real advantages to owning over lets say a regular PDA phone (mine plays music, movies, has all the bells and whistles) Anyone have a picture of it??? Best Regards, Blake M. Haggerty -----Original Message----- From:Asheesh Laroia asheesh at asheesh.org To: "sf-lug at linuxmafia.com" ; Sent: Jun 27, 2007 09:29:39 PM Subject: [sf-lug] Finally Frickin' Freedom Fone There will be OpenMoko phones available for sale July 9, finally, according to the head of the project. More information at http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-June/006005.html . July 9's version won't have wifi but will cost a "measly" $300; the full wifi'd and accelerometer and 3D-accelerated edition in October will cost $450. People do tell me that it's more important to buy a data plan on the cell network than to have wifi even if your phone has wifi because the cell network is always there for you. I've been waiting for this since I heard about the project in January. It's like the Trolltech Greenphone, only actually interesting. GSM only (in the US, that means T-Mobile or Cingular/AT&T/NSA); Verizon users need not apply. I just switched to T-Mobile in preparation for this (if the other choice is funding a secret NSA eavesdropping lab, it's not really a choice at all). I, for one, plan to enjoy this beautiful, liberated, liberating convergence device as a music player, mobile telephone, personal digital assistant, and so on. And regardless I'll see you all soon - I'm arriving to SF in about two weeks. -- Asheesh. -- So this is what it feels like to be potato salad _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug The information transmitted in this e-mail is for the exclusive use of the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain privileged or confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from reading, printing, duplicating, disseminating or otherwise using or acting in reliance upon this information. If you have received this information in error, please notify the sender at Sapphire Technologies immediately, delete this information from your computer and destroy all copies of the information. Thank you. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kgriffiths at compumentor.org Thu Jun 28 12:21:17 2007 From: kgriffiths at compumentor.org (Kami Griffiths) Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 12:21:17 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab In-Reply-To: <1182989726.9838.65.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F030571A2@cmexch.compumentor.org> >I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the >questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by >testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just testing >that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? First: Install and test on 2-3 computers, make sure they access the internet and that the programs work. Check that they print on the equipment available and connect to their server. Address related issues. Second: Have community members test them out and check to see if the different OS confuses them. Find out if there are other programs they would like. Will we need to deal with demand for programs that only run on MS, etc. Third: Install all 15 computers (thanks to Romel!) Move all PCs into the lab. I'd like get started in the next couple of weeks. What days work for the group? Thanks! Kami -----Original Message----- From: Tom Haddon [mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 5:15 PM To: Kami Griffiths Cc: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 10:49 -0700, Kami Griffiths wrote: > > > > Next Steps: Set up a couple of machines, install Edubuntu, test it, > determine if it's the best configuration. This will require 2 people > to be present and 1-2 available via phone for troubleshooting help. I > anticipate it will take 2 hours. The install-fest can happen anytime > after that and we'll need 4-5 people. > > I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just testing that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > > > > I'm not an expert at any of this and am learning as I go too. I think > there's a great opportunity here to help aging labs around the world > understand how they can convert from Windows to Linux, saving them > money and promoting open source. Let me know if there are additional > questions and I look forward to working on this project together! > > Definitely all in favor of that! Thanks, Tom > > _________________________________ > > Kami Griffiths > > CompuMentor, Senior Program Associate > > 525 Brannan Street, Suite 300 > San Francisco, CA 94107 > > > P: 415-633-9392 F: 415-633-9400 > > > kami at compumentor.org > > > > > www.compumentor.org Bringing people and technology together to > strengthen our communities > > > www.techsoup.org Technology served the way nonprofits need it, > powered by CompuMentor > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From jim at well.com Thu Jun 28 18:01:15 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 18:01:15 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab In-Reply-To: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F030571A2@cmexch.compumentor.org> References: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F030571A2@cmexch.compumentor.org> Message-ID: <8bb55fba2ea32601cb02da20efe54622@well.com> i can make pretty much anytime and day in the next couple of weeks. On Jun 28, 2007, at 12:21 PM, Kami Griffiths wrote: >> I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the >> questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by >> testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just testing >> that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > > > First: Install and test on 2-3 computers, make sure they access the > internet and that the programs work. Check that they print on the > equipment available and connect to their server. Address related > issues. > > > Second: Have community members test them out and check to see if the > different OS confuses them. Find out if there are other programs they > would like. Will we need to deal with demand for programs that only run > on MS, etc. > > Third: Install all 15 computers (thanks to Romel!) Move all PCs into > the > lab. > > > I'd like get started in the next couple of weeks. What days work for > the > group? > > Thanks! > Kami > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Haddon [mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net] > Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 5:15 PM > To: Kami Griffiths > Cc: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab > > On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 10:49 -0700, Kami Griffiths wrote: > >> >> >> >> Next Steps: Set up a couple of machines, install Edubuntu, test it, >> determine if it's the best configuration. This will require 2 people >> to be present and 1-2 available via phone for troubleshooting help. I >> anticipate it will take 2 hours. The install-fest can happen anytime >> after that and we'll need 4-5 people. >> >> > > I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the > questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by > testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just testing > that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > >> >> >> >> I'm not an expert at any of this and am learning as I go too. I think >> there's a great opportunity here to help aging labs around the world >> understand how they can convert from Windows to Linux, saving them >> money and promoting open source. Let me know if there are additional >> questions and I look forward to working on this project together! >> >> > > Definitely all in favor of that! > > Thanks, Tom > >> >> _________________________________ >> >> Kami Griffiths >> >> CompuMentor, Senior Program Associate >> >> 525 Brannan Street, Suite 300 >> San Francisco, CA 94107 >> >> >> P: 415-633-9392 F: 415-633-9400 >> >> >> kami at compumentor.org >> >> >> >> >> www.compumentor.org Bringing people and technology together to >> strengthen our communities >> >> >> www.techsoup.org Technology served the way nonprofits need it, >> powered by CompuMentor >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> sf-lug mailing list >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -- > > > ---------------------------------- > Tom Haddon > mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net > m +1.415.871.4180 > www.greenleaftech.net > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > From jim at well.com Fri Jun 29 11:28:51 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 11:28:51 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Sunday meeting, Javacat, 11 AM July 1 Message-ID: come on down, stop by and chat, bring a problem.... SF-LUG meeting Sunday July 1 11 AM till 1 PM or so. Javacat is in San Francisco on Geary Blvd at 20th Avenue. From Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com Fri Jun 29 11:39:40 2007 From: Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com (Blake Haggerty) Date: 29 Jun 2007 14:39:40 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] Drive Access issues Message-ID: <30850383.1183142368655.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> I would love to be able to bring this up at Sundays Meeting but I will be out of town this weekend. (I also am rarely up by 11 on Sundays) That being said I recently switched to Ubuntu and I am really enjoying much more than my previous SUSE installation. One issue I am having though is I installed one of my other Hard drives that was an old windows drive. I can access the drive and look around in it I can even open the files on the drive but I cannot delete from it or copy anything to it. I have tried logging in as ROOT and still it will not let me do it. It always says permission denied. Anyone have any suggestions??? Best Regards, Blake M. Haggerty Technical Recruiter Sapphire Technologies Phone #415-788-8488 Fax #415-788-2592 -----Original Message----- From:jim stockford jim at well.com To: "SF-LUG List" ; Sent: Jun 29, 2007 11:27:54 AM Subject: [sf-lug] Sunday meeting, Javacat, 11 AM July 1 come on down, stop by and chat, bring a problem.... SF-LUG meeting Sunday July 1 11 AM till 1 PM or so. Javacat is in San Francisco on Geary Blvd at 20th Avenue. _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tom at greenleaftech.net Fri Jun 29 11:58:54 2007 From: tom at greenleaftech.net (Tom Haddon) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 11:58:54 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Drive Access issues In-Reply-To: <30850383.1183142368655.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> References: <30850383.1183142368655.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> Message-ID: <1183143534.9838.152.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2007-06-29 at 14:39 -0400, Blake Haggerty wrote: > I would love to be able to bring this up at Sundays Meeting but I will > be out of town this weekend. (I also am rarely up by 11 on Sundays) > That being said I recently switched to Ubuntu and I am really enjoying > much more than my previous SUSE installation. One issue I am having > though is I installed one of my other Hard drives that was an old > windows drive. I can access the drive and look around in it I can even > open the files on the drive but I cannot delete from it or copy > anything to it. I have tried logging in as ROOT and still it will not > let me do it. It always says permission denied. Do you mean that it still holds Windows and is a FAT/NTFS filesystem, or is it now a Linux native filesystem (ext2/3, etc.)? Try mount -l and that should tell you about mounted filesystems. My guess is (if it's the latter case) it's mounted it as read-only - either because it's specified that way in /etc/fstab or because the OS has detected some kind of corruption on the disk and has switched it to read-only - check /var/log/messages for this... Thanks, Tom > > Anyone have any suggestions??? > > > Best Regards, > > Blake M. Haggerty > Technical Recruiter > Sapphire Technologies > Phone #415-788-8488 > Fax #415-788-2592 > > > -----Original Message----- > From:jim stockford jim at well.com > To: "SF-LUG List" ; > Sent: Jun 29, 2007 11:27:54 AM > Subject: [sf-lug] Sunday meeting, Javacat, 11 AM July 1 > > > come on down, stop by and chat, bring a problem.... > SF-LUG meeting Sunday July 1 11 AM till 1 PM or so. > Javacat is in San Francisco on Geary Blvd at 20th Avenue. > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From johnlowry at gmail.com Fri Jun 29 11:56:49 2007 From: johnlowry at gmail.com (John Jefferson Lowry IV) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 11:56:49 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Drive Access issues In-Reply-To: <528b20610706291148r698cbfefie07a5c31e6c25e59@mail.gmail.com> References: <30850383.1183142368655.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> <528b20610706291148r698cbfefie07a5c31e6c25e59@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <528b20610706291156k2c194dd2j4510fee194c69220@mail.gmail.com> Sorry about that, accidentally replied off list If the windows drive is formated NTFS you will have to do some futzing with it. Check out: http://www.linux-ntfs.org/ http://www.ntfs-3g.org/ Two different projects that both help linux deal with a NTFS fielsystem. *Forwarded Conversation* Subject: *[sf-lug] Drive Access issues* ------------------------ * From: Blake Haggerty* To: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Date: Fri, Jun 29, 2007 at 11:39 AM I would love to be able to bring this up at Sundays Meeting but I will be out of town this weekend. (I also am rarely up by 11 on Sundays) That being said I recently switched to Ubuntu and I am really enjoying much more than my previous SUSE installation. One issue I am having though is I installed one of my other Hard drives that was an old windows drive. I can access the drive and look around in it I can even open the files on the drive but I cannot delete from it or copy anything to it. I have tried logging in as ROOT and still it will not let me do it. It always says permission denied. Anyone have any suggestions??? Best Regards, Blake M. Haggerty Technical Recruiter Sapphire Technologies Phone #415-788-8488 Fax #415-788-2592 -----Original Message----- *From:*jim stockford jim at well.com *To:* "SF-LUG List" ; *Sent:* Jun 29, 2007 11:27:54 AM *Subject:* [sf-lug] Sunday meeting, Javacat, 11 AM July 1 come on down, stop by and chat, bring a problem.... SF-LUG meeting Sunday July 1 11 AM till 1 PM or so. Javacat is in San Francisco on Geary Blvd at 20th Avenue. _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -------- * From: John Jefferson Lowry IV* To: Blake Haggerty < Blake.Haggerty at sapphire.com> Date: Fri, Jun 29, 2007 at 11:48 AM If the windows drive is formated NTFS you will have to do some futzing with it. Check out: http://www.linux-ntfs.org/ http://www.ntfs-3g.org/ Two different projects that both help linux deal with a NTFS fielsystem. [Quoted text hidden] > [Quoted text hidden] > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > -- John Lowry -------- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com Fri Jun 29 12:01:39 2007 From: Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com (Blake Haggerty) Date: 29 Jun 2007 15:01:39 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] Drive Access issues Message-ID: <31960877.1183143700992.JavaMail.cfservice@webservera1> I believe that the drive is still a FAT/NTFS (not 100% positive I have allot of drives laying around and mess with them all the time) I think I left this drive alone though from a previous windows install... Is there anyway to tell for sure? Best Regards, Blake M. Haggerty Technical Recruiter Sapphire Technologies Phone #415-788-8488 Fax #415-788-2592 -----Original Message----- From:Tom Haddon tom at greenleaftech.net To: "Blake Haggerty" ; Cc: "sf-lug at linuxmafia.com" ; Sent: Jun 29, 2007 11:57:44 AM Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Drive Access issues On Fri, 2007-06-29 at 14:39 -0400, Blake Haggerty wrote: > I would love to be able to bring this up at Sundays Meeting but I will > be out of town this weekend. (I also am rarely up by 11 on Sundays) > That being said I recently switched to Ubuntu and I am really enjoying > much more than my previous SUSE installation. One issue I am having > though is I installed one of my other Hard drives that was an old > windows drive. I can access the drive and look around in it I can even > open the files on the drive but I cannot delete from it or copy > anything to it. I have tried logging in as ROOT and still it will not > let me do it. It always says permission denied. Do you mean that it still holds Windows and is a FAT/NTFS filesystem, or is it now a Linux native filesystem (ext2/3, etc.)? Try mount -l and that should tell you about mounted filesystems. My guess is (if it's the latter case) it's mounted it as read-only - either because it's specified that way in /etc/fstab or because the OS has detected some kind of corruption on the disk and has switched it to read-only - check /var/log/messages for this... Thanks, Tom > > Anyone have any suggestions??? > > > Best Regards, > > Blake M. Haggerty > Technical Recruiter > Sapphire Technologies > Phone #415-788-8488 > Fax #415-788-2592 > > > -----Original Message----- > From:jim stockford jim at well.com > To: "SF-LUG List" ; > Sent: Jun 29, 2007 11:27:54 AM > Subject: [sf-lug] Sunday meeting, Javacat, 11 AM July 1 > > > come on down, stop by and chat, bring a problem.... > SF-LUG meeting Sunday July 1 11 AM till 1 PM or so. > Javacat is in San Francisco on Geary Blvd at 20th Avenue. > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rick at linuxmafia.com Fri Jun 29 12:04:47 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 12:04:47 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Drive Access issues In-Reply-To: <30850383.1183142368655.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> References: <30850383.1183142368655.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> Message-ID: <20070629190447.GE28415@linuxmafia.com> Quoting Blake Haggerty (Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com): > I would love to be able to bring this up at Sundays Meeting but I will > be out of town this weekend. (I also am rarely up by 11 on Sundays) > That being said I recently switched to Ubuntu and I am really enjoying > much more than my previous SUSE installation. One issue I am having > though is I installed one of my other Hard drives that was an old > windows drive. I can access the drive and look around in it I can even > open the files on the drive but I cannot delete from it or copy > anything to it. I have tried logging in as ROOT and still it will not > let me do it. It always says permission denied. It seems the Windows filesystem(s) is(/are) mounted read-only. There's undoubtedly a clicky-mousey way in GNOME to remount filesystems read/write, but GNOME is not my cuppa, so someone else will have to tell you how. At the command line: $ mount #lists what's mounted, where, and how (e.g., "ro" for read-only) $ sudo mount -o rw,remount [something] #Remounts r/w, where "[something]" is #either a mountpoint dir or a device spec. Or: Very vaguely speaking, in the GNOME desktop-thingie app (Nautilus, or whatever it is, these days), you might just right-click on the desktop icon for the mounted Windows filesystem, and see if it has something about read-only versus read/write, or about remounting. Looking prospectively, there may also be a Nautilus Preferences setting (or whatever) where you can adjust what will be mounted r/w versus ro in the future. From rick at linuxmafia.com Fri Jun 29 12:08:03 2007 From: rick at linuxmafia.com (Rick Moen) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 12:08:03 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Drive Access issues In-Reply-To: <528b20610706291156k2c194dd2j4510fee194c69220@mail.gmail.com> References: <30850383.1183142368655.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> <528b20610706291148r698cbfefie07a5c31e6c25e59@mail.gmail.com> <528b20610706291156k2c194dd2j4510fee194c69220@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20070629190803.GF28415@linuxmafia.com> Quoting John Lowry (johnlowry at gmail.com): > Sorry about that, accidentally replied off list > If the windows drive is formated NTFS you will have to do some futzing with > it. Right. Forgot that almost all 'Doze users these days are doing NTFS. For Blake's benefit: The NTFS filesystem (partition) format is kept as a closely held secret by Microsoft Corporation, and has had to be painfully and carefully reverse-engineered by Linux coders with zero help. There is very recent software that safely mounts NTFS with full r/w access, but it's not yet included in most Linux distros. The links John provided will tell more. From Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com Fri Jun 29 12:15:08 2007 From: Blake.Haggerty at Sapphire.com (Blake Haggerty) Date: 29 Jun 2007 15:15:08 -0400 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Drive Access issues Message-ID: <28337354.1183144509275.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> Thanks everyone for the help. I think I am going to begin trying NTFS-3g... I will keep the list posted on how it goes. Best Regards, Blake M. Haggerty Technical Recruiter Sapphire Technologies Phone #415-788-8488 Fax #415-788-2592 -----Original Message----- From:Rick Moen rick at linuxmafia.com To: "sf-lug at linuxmafia.com" ; Sent: Jun 29, 2007 12:09:41 PM Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Fwd: Drive Access issues Quoting John Lowry (johnlowry at gmail.com): > Sorry about that, accidentally replied off list > If the windows drive is formated NTFS you will have to do some futzing with > it. Right. Forgot that almost all 'Doze users these days are doing NTFS. For Blake's benefit: The NTFS filesystem (partition) format is kept as a closely held secret by Microsoft Corporation, and has had to be painfully and carefully reverse-engineered by Linux coders with zero help. There is very recent software that safely mounts NTFS with full r/w access, but it's not yet included in most Linux distros. The links John provided will tell more. _______________________________________________ sf-lug mailing list sf-lug at linuxmafia.com http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tom at greenleaftech.net Fri Jun 29 12:20:44 2007 From: tom at greenleaftech.net (Tom Haddon) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 12:20:44 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Drive Access issues In-Reply-To: <20070629190803.GF28415@linuxmafia.com> References: <30850383.1183142368655.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> <528b20610706291148r698cbfefie07a5c31e6c25e59@mail.gmail.com> <528b20610706291156k2c194dd2j4510fee194c69220@mail.gmail.com> <20070629190803.GF28415@linuxmafia.com> Message-ID: <1183144844.9838.166.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2007-06-29 at 12:08 -0700, Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting John Lowry (johnlowry at gmail.com): > > > Sorry about that, accidentally replied off list > > If the windows drive is formated NTFS you will have to do some futzing with > > it. > > Right. Forgot that almost all 'Doze users these days are doing NTFS. > For Blake's benefit: The NTFS filesystem (partition) format is kept as > a closely held secret by Microsoft Corporation, and has had to be > painfully and carefully reverse-engineered by Linux coders with zero > help. There is very recent software that safely mounts NTFS with full > r/w access, but it's not yet included in most Linux distros. The links > John provided will tell more. It is in the latest version of Ubuntu (7.04), although I'd have to refer to docs to how to actually get it working :) : $ aptitude show ntfs-3g Package: ntfs-3g New: yes State: not installed Version: 1:1.328-1 Priority: optional Section: universe/otherosfs Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers Uncompressed Size: 90.1k Depends: libc6 (>= 2.5-0ubuntu1), libfuse2 (>= 2.6), libntfs-3g0 (>= 1.0) PreDepends: fuse-utils Description: read-write NTFS driver for FUSE The ntfs-3g driver is an open source, GPL licensed, third generation Linux NTFS driver for 32-bit, little-endian architectures which was implemented by the Linux-NTFS project. It provides full read-write access to NTFS, excluding access to encrypted files, writing compressed files, changing file ownership, access right. Technically it's based on and a major improvement to the third generation Linux NTFS driver, ntfsmount. The improvements includes functionality, quality and performance enhancements. ntfs-3g is based on FUSE (userspace filesystem framework for Linux), thus you will have to prepare fuse kernel module to be able to use it. Homepage: http://www.ntfs-3g.org/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From johnlowry at gmail.com Fri Jun 29 12:25:36 2007 From: johnlowry at gmail.com (John Jefferson Lowry IV) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 12:25:36 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Drive Access issues In-Reply-To: <1183144844.9838.166.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <30850383.1183142368655.JavaMail.cfservice@webserverb1> <528b20610706291148r698cbfefie07a5c31e6c25e59@mail.gmail.com> <528b20610706291156k2c194dd2j4510fee194c69220@mail.gmail.com> <20070629190803.GF28415@linuxmafia.com> <1183144844.9838.166.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <528b20610706291225o59760168o52ad37667a633e49@mail.gmail.com> For people lookign to do some system rescuing there is a great project called System Rescure CD based on Gentoo and comes with a lot of these things pre-installed. Just used to save a bunch of files off of my brother laptop that windows said was unrecoverable. http://www.sysresccd.org/Main_Page Will also install to a USB drive and be bootable from that! On 6/29/07, Tom Haddon wrote: > > On Fri, 2007-06-29 at 12:08 -0700, Rick Moen wrote: > > Quoting John Lowry (johnlowry at gmail.com): > > > > > Sorry about that, accidentally replied off list > > > If the windows drive is formated NTFS you will have to do some futzing > with > > > it. > > > > Right. Forgot that almost all 'Doze users these days are doing NTFS. > > For Blake's benefit: The NTFS filesystem (partition) format is kept as > > a closely held secret by Microsoft Corporation, and has had to be > > painfully and carefully reverse-engineered by Linux coders with zero > > help. There is very recent software that safely mounts NTFS with full > > r/w access, but it's not yet included in most Linux distros. The links > > John provided will tell more. > > It is in the latest version of Ubuntu (7.04), although I'd have to refer > to docs to how to actually get it working :) : > > $ aptitude show ntfs-3g > Package: ntfs-3g > New: yes > State: not installed > Version: 1:1.328-1 > Priority: optional > Section: universe/otherosfs > Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers > Uncompressed Size: 90.1k > Depends: libc6 (>= 2.5-0ubuntu1), libfuse2 (>= 2.6), libntfs-3g0 (>= > 1.0) > PreDepends: fuse-utils > Description: read-write NTFS driver for FUSE > The ntfs-3g driver is an open source, GPL licensed, third generation > Linux NTFS driver for 32-bit, little-endian architectures which was > implemented by the > Linux-NTFS project. It provides full read-write access to NTFS, > excluding access to encrypted files, writing compressed files, changing > file ownership, > access right. > > Technically it's based on and a major improvement to the third > generation Linux NTFS driver, ntfsmount. The improvements includes > functionality, quality > and performance enhancements. > > ntfs-3g is based on FUSE (userspace filesystem framework for Linux), > thus you will have to prepare fuse kernel module to be able to use it. > > Homepage: http://www.ntfs-3g.org/ > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -- > > > ---------------------------------- > Tom Haddon > mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net > m +1.415.871.4180 > www.greenleaftech.net > > > _______________________________________________ > sf-lug mailing list > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > -- John Lowry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tom at greenleaftech.net Fri Jun 29 16:24:07 2007 From: tom at greenleaftech.net (Tom Haddon) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 16:24:07 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab In-Reply-To: <8bb55fba2ea32601cb02da20efe54622@well.com> References: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F030571A2@cmexch.compumentor.org> <8bb55fba2ea32601cb02da20efe54622@well.com> Message-ID: <1183159447.29221.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2007-06-28 at 18:01 -0700, jim stockford wrote: > i can make pretty much anytime and day in > the next couple of weeks. I can't make it this weekend but can make next. Could make most evenings next week if needed. Could also figure out how to get edubuntu CDs to someone if you're going ahead without me. Just let me know... Thanks, Tom > > On Jun 28, 2007, at 12:21 PM, Kami Griffiths wrote: > > >> I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the > >> questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by > >> testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just testing > >> that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > > > > > > First: Install and test on 2-3 computers, make sure they access the > > internet and that the programs work. Check that they print on the > > equipment available and connect to their server. Address related > > issues. > > > > > > Second: Have community members test them out and check to see if the > > different OS confuses them. Find out if there are other programs they > > would like. Will we need to deal with demand for programs that only run > > on MS, etc. > > > > Third: Install all 15 computers (thanks to Romel!) Move all PCs into > > the > > lab. > > > > > > I'd like get started in the next couple of weeks. What days work for > > the > > group? > > > > Thanks! > > Kami > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Tom Haddon [mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net] > > Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 5:15 PM > > To: Kami Griffiths > > Cc: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab > > > > On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 10:49 -0700, Kami Griffiths wrote: > > > >> > >> > >> > >> Next Steps: Set up a couple of machines, install Edubuntu, test it, > >> determine if it's the best configuration. This will require 2 people > >> to be present and 1-2 available via phone for troubleshooting help. I > >> anticipate it will take 2 hours. The install-fest can happen anytime > >> after that and we'll need 4-5 people. > >> > >> > > > > I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the > > questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by > > testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just testing > > that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > > > >> > >> > >> > >> I'm not an expert at any of this and am learning as I go too. I think > >> there's a great opportunity here to help aging labs around the world > >> understand how they can convert from Windows to Linux, saving them > >> money and promoting open source. Let me know if there are additional > >> questions and I look forward to working on this project together! > >> > >> > > > > Definitely all in favor of that! > > > > Thanks, Tom > > > >> > >> _________________________________ > >> > >> Kami Griffiths > >> > >> CompuMentor, Senior Program Associate > >> > >> 525 Brannan Street, Suite 300 > >> San Francisco, CA 94107 > >> > >> > >> P: 415-633-9392 F: 415-633-9400 > >> > >> > >> kami at compumentor.org > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> www.compumentor.org Bringing people and technology together to > >> strengthen our communities > >> > >> > >> www.techsoup.org Technology served the way nonprofits need it, > >> powered by CompuMentor > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> sf-lug mailing list > >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > -- > > > > > > ---------------------------------- > > Tom Haddon > > mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net > > m +1.415.871.4180 > > www.greenleaftech.net > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From tom at greenleaftech.net Fri Jun 29 18:43:43 2007 From: tom at greenleaftech.net (Tom Haddon) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 18:43:43 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab In-Reply-To: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F030574F4@cmexch.compumentor.org> References: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F030574F4@cmexch.compumentor.org> Message-ID: <1183167823.29221.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2007-06-29 at 18:21 -0700, Kami Griffiths wrote: > Thanks Tom! Which days work better for the group? > > Tuesday evening, Thursday evening or Sunday afternoon? Thursday evening or Sunday (8th July) afternoon would be my preference. Thanks, Tom > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Haddon [mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net] > Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 4:24 PM > To: jim stockford > Cc: Kami Griffiths; sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab > > On Thu, 2007-06-28 at 18:01 -0700, jim stockford wrote: > > i can make pretty much anytime and day in > > the next couple of weeks. > > I can't make it this weekend but can make next. Could make most evenings > next week if needed. Could also figure out how to get edubuntu CDs to > someone if you're going ahead without me. Just let me know... > > Thanks, Tom > > > > > On Jun 28, 2007, at 12:21 PM, Kami Griffiths wrote: > > > > >> I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the > > >> questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean > by > > >> testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just > testing > > >> that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > > > > > > > > > First: Install and test on 2-3 computers, make sure they access the > > > internet and that the programs work. Check that they print on the > > > equipment available and connect to their server. Address related > > > issues. > > > > > > > > > Second: Have community members test them out and check to see if the > > > different OS confuses them. Find out if there are other programs > they > > > would like. Will we need to deal with demand for programs that only > run > > > on MS, etc. > > > > > > Third: Install all 15 computers (thanks to Romel!) Move all PCs into > > > > the > > > lab. > > > > > > > > > I'd like get started in the next couple of weeks. What days work for > > > > the > > > group? > > > > > > Thanks! > > > Kami > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Tom Haddon [mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net] > > > Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 5:15 PM > > > To: Kami Griffiths > > > Cc: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab > > > > > > On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 10:49 -0700, Kami Griffiths wrote: > > > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> Next Steps: Set up a couple of machines, install Edubuntu, test it, > > >> determine if it's the best configuration. This will require 2 > people > > >> to be present and 1-2 available via phone for troubleshooting help. > I > > >> anticipate it will take 2 hours. The install-fest can happen > anytime > > >> after that and we'll need 4-5 people. > > >> > > >> > > > > > > I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the > > > questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by > > > testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just > testing > > > that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > > > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> I'm not an expert at any of this and am learning as I go too. I > think > > >> there's a great opportunity here to help aging labs around the > world > > >> understand how they can convert from Windows to Linux, saving them > > >> money and promoting open source. Let me know if there are > additional > > >> questions and I look forward to working on this project together! > > >> > > >> > > > > > > Definitely all in favor of that! > > > > > > Thanks, Tom > > > > > >> > > >> _________________________________ > > >> > > >> Kami Griffiths > > >> > > >> CompuMentor, Senior Program Associate > > >> > > >> 525 Brannan Street, Suite 300 > > >> San Francisco, CA 94107 > > >> > > >> > > >> P: 415-633-9392 F: 415-633-9400 > > >> > > >> > > >> kami at compumentor.org > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> www.compumentor.org Bringing people and technology together to > > >> strengthen our communities > > >> > > >> > > >> www.techsoup.org Technology served the way nonprofits need it, > > >> powered by CompuMentor > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> sf-lug mailing list > > >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > -- > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------- > > > Tom Haddon > > > mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net > > > m +1.415.871.4180 > > > www.greenleaftech.net > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > sf-lug mailing list > > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > > > -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net From jim at well.com Sat Jun 30 10:54:33 2007 From: jim at well.com (jim stockford) Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2007 10:54:33 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Fwd: Apress Seeks New Reviews! Message-ID: <3446f9337868f81442e116c0ec4a7e60@well.com> Begin forwarded message: > From: Apress User Group Liaison > Date: June 29, 2007 4:04:00 PM PDT > To: jim at well.com > Subject: Apress Seeks New Reviews! > > > Apress Seeks New Reviewers! > > > > Apress is actively seeking fresh voices to write about our books. As a > publisher, we rely on independent writers and reviewers to speak > forcefully and honestly about our products to the larger technology > book-buying community. > > > > Which of these titles would you like to review immediately? > > > > ************************************ > > > > "Foundations of GTK+ Development" > > By Andrew Krause | ISBN: 1-59059-739-1 > > http://apress.com/book/bookDisplay.html?bID=10247 > > > > "Practical MythTV: Building a PVR and Media Center PC" > > By Stewart Smith and Michael Still | ISBN: 1-59059-779-6 > > http://apress.com/book/bookDisplay.html?bID=10245 > > > > ************************************ > > > > Please take a moment to read the review-writing guidelines we've > posted: http://www.apress.com/userGroups/writeareview.html. In > general, we like to see reviews posted to Amazon, Barnes and Noble, > and/or Bookpool--to name a few places. > > > > Please reply to me at cheryl.martinez at apress.com, if you or another > group member would be interested in posting a prompt, thorough review > on one or both of these books. > > > > Thank you in advance! > > > Cheryl Martinez > From kgriffiths at compumentor.org Fri Jun 29 18:21:48 2007 From: kgriffiths at compumentor.org (Kami Griffiths) Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 18:21:48 -0700 Subject: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab In-Reply-To: <1183159447.29221.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1CD1B9B063974A468574B018B2DA2E7F030574F4@cmexch.compumentor.org> Thanks Tom! Which days work better for the group? Tuesday evening, Thursday evening or Sunday afternoon? -----Original Message----- From: Tom Haddon [mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net] Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 4:24 PM To: jim stockford Cc: Kami Griffiths; sf-lug at linuxmafia.com Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab On Thu, 2007-06-28 at 18:01 -0700, jim stockford wrote: > i can make pretty much anytime and day in > the next couple of weeks. I can't make it this weekend but can make next. Could make most evenings next week if needed. Could also figure out how to get edubuntu CDs to someone if you're going ahead without me. Just let me know... Thanks, Tom > > On Jun 28, 2007, at 12:21 PM, Kami Griffiths wrote: > > >> I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the > >> questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by > >> testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just testing > >> that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > > > > > > First: Install and test on 2-3 computers, make sure they access the > > internet and that the programs work. Check that they print on the > > equipment available and connect to their server. Address related > > issues. > > > > > > Second: Have community members test them out and check to see if the > > different OS confuses them. Find out if there are other programs they > > would like. Will we need to deal with demand for programs that only run > > on MS, etc. > > > > Third: Install all 15 computers (thanks to Romel!) Move all PCs into > > the > > lab. > > > > > > I'd like get started in the next couple of weeks. What days work for > > the > > group? > > > > Thanks! > > Kami > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Tom Haddon [mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net] > > Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 5:15 PM > > To: Kami Griffiths > > Cc: sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > Subject: Re: [sf-lug] Creating a Linux Lab > > > > On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 10:49 -0700, Kami Griffiths wrote: > > > >> > >> > >> > >> Next Steps: Set up a couple of machines, install Edubuntu, test it, > >> determine if it's the best configuration. This will require 2 people > >> to be present and 1-2 available via phone for troubleshooting help. I > >> anticipate it will take 2 hours. The install-fest can happen anytime > >> after that and we'll need 4-5 people. > >> > >> > > > > I think this sounds pretty reasonable, as do the answers to the > > questions. I guess the main question is determining what you mean by > > testing it. Do you mean test it on specific end users, or just testing > > that the computers work as expected/perform adequately? > > > >> > >> > >> > >> I'm not an expert at any of this and am learning as I go too. I think > >> there's a great opportunity here to help aging labs around the world > >> understand how they can convert from Windows to Linux, saving them > >> money and promoting open source. Let me know if there are additional > >> questions and I look forward to working on this project together! > >> > >> > > > > Definitely all in favor of that! > > > > Thanks, Tom > > > >> > >> _________________________________ > >> > >> Kami Griffiths > >> > >> CompuMentor, Senior Program Associate > >> > >> 525 Brannan Street, Suite 300 > >> San Francisco, CA 94107 > >> > >> > >> P: 415-633-9392 F: 415-633-9400 > >> > >> > >> kami at compumentor.org > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> www.compumentor.org Bringing people and technology together to > >> strengthen our communities > >> > >> > >> www.techsoup.org Technology served the way nonprofits need it, > >> powered by CompuMentor > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> sf-lug mailing list > >> sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > >> http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > -- > > > > > > ---------------------------------- > > Tom Haddon > > mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net > > m +1.415.871.4180 > > www.greenleaftech.net > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > sf-lug mailing list > > sf-lug at linuxmafia.com > > http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/sf-lug > > > -- ---------------------------------- Tom Haddon mailto:tom at greenleaftech.net m +1.415.871.4180 www.greenleaftech.net