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<div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">Secret ballots:</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">The only secret ballot is in a booth with no cameras permitted.</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">If you mark the ballot at home or church or ... there might be someone bribing or coercing you to mark the ballot in a particular way before you seal it in the envelope.</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">Actually in a booth is not totally fool proof. It depends on how well you can bluff the neighborhood enforcer when he asks how you voted.</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">In a state-wide election with a significant margin in the count, it would be hard to force enough votes without being caught. However, in recent years, there have been several elections decide by a very few votes...</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div><div><br></div>
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On Sunday, September 19, 2021, 04:50:55 PM PDT, Ivan Sergio Borgonovo <mail@webthatworks.it> wrote:
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<div><div dir="ltr">On 9/19/21 23:20, Rick Moen wrote:<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">> 1. Paying people for their votes. In the strictest sense, this cannot<br></div><div dir="ltr">> be prevented, period. If people are willing to be bribed for their<br></div><div dir="ltr">> votes, that will happen. Ruben's point about that, though, to condense<br></div><div dir="ltr">> down what he said, is that the secret ballot prevents the vote-buyer<br></div><div dir="ltr">> from _enforcing_ the purchase.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">> Again, let's not ignore this risk-factor. It's real. Letting people<br></div><div dir="ltr">> fill out ballots anywhere at all makes it easier for a Tammany Hall-style<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">...<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">> 2. Remote voting options also make possible voter coercion. There are<br></div><div dir="ltr">> many horror stories, in particular, of domineering husbands insisting on<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">> 4. Speaking of things that aren't going to happen, banning the<br></div><div dir="ltr">> handicapped and frail from being accompanied by helpers into the voting<br></div><div dir="ltr">> booth is another non-starter.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">> 5. But my final point to Ruben was: People have small digital cameras,<br></div><div dir="ltr">> these days, often ones in their pockets that also make telephone calls.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">...<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">> On a couple of other occasions, Ruben was terribly worked up over<br></div><div dir="ltr">> "ballot harvesting", telling me that it's a terribly corrupt practice<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">Ruben's concerns are real ones but things don't have to be perfect to <br></div><div dir="ltr">work, you just have to reach a reasonable, context aware compromise.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">Here in Europe it's very common to stroll around with your ID and it is <br></div><div dir="ltr">pretty easy to get all you need to vote and eg. generally you don't have <br></div><div dir="ltr">to register.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">Here in Italy you have to show up with your ID and a "voting card" <br></div><div dir="ltr">that's valid for several elections (administrative, national parliament, <br></div><div dir="ltr">referendum). This card is generally sent to you by mail every time you <br></div><div dir="ltr">change your address. You've to vote alone in a booth by paper.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">But people living abroad can vote by mail and people with disabilities <br></div><div dir="ltr">can be accompanied provided they have some medical certification.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">To make stuff more interesting here in Italy we have a long tradition of <br></div><div dir="ltr">paying/blackmailing people for their votes (organized crime).<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">We even invented a way to use candidate preferences to recognize voters.<br></div><div dir="ltr">Votes can be considered null if there is suspicion the vote was "marked".<br></div><div dir="ltr">With that excuse preferences have been forbidden in some elections <br></div><div dir="ltr">leaving to the parties the choice of who was going to be elected.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">Cameras are forbidden at the voting booth.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">But preventing election frauds is just one of the many things that make <br></div><div dir="ltr">an election democratic (and functional) and may not even be the most <br></div><div dir="ltr">important.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">-- <br></div><div dir="ltr">Ivan Sergio Borgonovo<br></div><div dir="ltr"><a href="https://www.webthatworks.it " rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.webthatworks.it </a><a href="https://www.borgonovo.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.borgonovo.net</a><br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">_______________________________________________<br></div><div dir="ltr">conspire mailing list<br></div><div dir="ltr"><a href="mailto:conspire@linuxmafia.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">conspire@linuxmafia.com</a><br></div><div dir="ltr"><a href="http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/conspire" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://linuxmafia.com/mailman/listinfo/conspire</a><br></div></div>
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