<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">I've done what Dan is describing for over five years and can attest to the viability of this approach.<div><br><div><div>On Mar 6, 2016, at 1:41 PM, Dan Bikle wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><font size="4"><br>I have spent a lot of time with various virtualbox setups over the past 4 years.<br><br>I suggest you try windows(10 and/or 8) as host and linux as guest.<br><br>Then try it for a month and see if you like it.<br><br>I have learned that windows(10 and/or 8) as host and linux as guest is a horrible experience.<br><br>You should challenge that view and try the setup yourself to see if you will hate it too.<br><br>Now when I need windows, (about once a year to do my corporate taxes), I buy the cheapest windows laptop which can do the job. <br><br>That is usually about $350.<br><br>Then I setup my good/expensive laptops so they boot Linux.<br><br>One setup which works well for me is Linux as host and Linux as guest.<br><br>Then I use my Linux guests to hold data and apps which require lots of work to setup.<br><br>I try to keep my Linux hosts as clear of data and apps as possible.<br><br>I see a Linux host as a thing which runs virtualbox and nothing else.<br></font></div></blockquote><div>Exactly. I would use a very stable and simple Linux as a host. I had very good luck running CentOS or Debian and not putting many applications on that host. Instead, put your applications in the guests whether Linux, Windows, or OS X. Over the years I did this with host systems ranging from four GB memory up to 32 GB in some serious workstations. This allowed me to run several VMs simultaneously (often six to eight VMs) for compiling, testing, administration work, one as a router for my virtual environment, etc. Also, on that host, turn off automatic updating and be very careful about updating or changing the configurations. Try to limit the updating and potentially risky work to the guest VMs.</div><div><br></div><div>VMs are wonderful.</div><div>You can make snapshots to preserve your VM instance in case you need to revert back to it. Then experiment on the guest, keeping good notes on what you are doing. If it all goes as you wish, fine, take a snapshot. If things don't work out as you like, then revert to an earlier snapshot of your guest system using just a couple of keystrokes to get the job done.</div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><font size="4"><br>As I pack data and complexity into my various Linux guests, I shut them down frequently and back them up to a pair of rotating 8TB usb drives.<br><br>I keep one drive near and the other offsite.<br><br>If I ever lose a drive or a host, I can just buy new ones and restore everything from the offsite usb drive.<br><br>-- Dan<br></font><br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Mar 6, 2016 at 7:13 PM, Leo P <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:yaconsult@gmail.com" target="_blank">yaconsult@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div><div>As the holder of a windows 8 license, you are entitled to a free upgrade to windows 10 which seems much better than windows 8 once the spyware aspects are turned off with SpyBot Anti-Beacon: <a href="https://www.safer-networking.org/spybot-anti-beacon/" target="_blank">https://www.safer-networking.org/spybot-anti-beacon/</a><br><br></div>My suggestion would be to download the official windows 10 ISO from microsoft at: <a href="https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows10" target="_blank">https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows10</a><br></div>I would NOT do an upgrade but would record and store my windows 8 license number as it will be automatically converted to a windows 10 license once you apply it to the fresh install of windows 10 that I suggest you do from the ISO you downloaded.<br></div>I would then decide how much of the disk space I wanted to use for windows and how much for linux and repartition and format the hard drive using gparted running from a usb key or cdrom. Then I would install windows 10 into the partition I created for it, update it, and then install linux. When you install linux it will also install grub and allow you to choose which OS to boot: windows 10 or linux.<br><br></div>That is how I do it. Others, I'm sure, will have different opinions. No need to have the overhead of visualization unless/until it's needed.<span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br><br></font></span></div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">Leo<br></font></span></div><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Mar 6, 2016 at 10:04 AM, Carl Myers <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:cmyers@cmyers.org" target="_blank">cmyers@cmyers.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Virtualbox is available for Linux. If your usage is primarily Linux, you<br>
probably want to install Linux, then Virtualbox, then windows as a guest.<br>
<br>
I am not certain, but I thought there was some rule that you must be provided<br>
windows installation media "upon request" or something? Maybe investigate that<br>
avenue. Failing that, there are other ways to obtain windows (which vary in<br>
degrees of cost / annoyingness / legality).<br>
<br>
-Carl<br>
<br>
On Sun, Mar 06, 2016 at 04:47:51PM +0000, Paul Zander wrote:<br>
> Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2016 16:47:51 +0000 (UTC)<br>
> From: Paul Zander <<a href="mailto:paulz@ieee.org" target="_blank">paulz@ieee.org</a>><br>
> To: Conspire List <<a href="mailto:conspire@linuxmafia.com" target="_blank">conspire@linuxmafia.com</a>><br>
> Subject: [conspire] VirtualBox<br>
<div><div>><br>
> So I have a laptop that was factory installed with Win 8.1. No install media came with it.<br>
><br>
> After I get Linux installed, I anticipate that my usage will be 90% Linux and 10% Windows. I have never used VirtualBox, but several people say it is the way to go. I am inclined to give it a try since dual-boot does not happen as part of installing Debian or Mint on this machine.<br>
><br>
> After reading the documentation, it appears that what I need to do is:<br>
> * Install VirtualBox on Windows.<br>
> * Create a new partition for the guest OS.<br>
> * Possibly create another partition for shared data<br>
><br>
> * Launch VirtualBox<br>
><br>
> * From inside VirtualBox install Linux as a virtual machine into the new partition.<br>
><br>
><br>
> After everything is configured, I will always be running Windows and be subject to the annoying unscheduled downtime when Microsoft decides to install an update.<br>
><br>
> Is this the only practical option?<br>
><br>
><br>
> Perhaps I should bring all of the pieces to the next CABAL and do the install there...<br>
><br>
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</div></div><span><font color="#888888">--<br>
Carl Myers<br>
PGP Key ID 3537595B<br>
PGP Key fingerprint 9365 0FAF 721B 992A 0A20 1E0D C795 2955 3537 595B<br>
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