[conspire] so much for politeness to nick

Nick Moffitt nick at zork.net
Sun Sep 2 15:04:35 PDT 2007

Bruce, you seem to have broken the thread here, and I'm genuinely having
a hard time figuring out which part of your mails are quoted text and
which are your own words.  I've tried separating out what I believe to
be your words erroneously appearing in lines beginning with "> ", but
please accept my apologies if this accidentally puts words in your

Also, I notice that you have changed the subject line to read "so much
for politeness to nick".  Do you believe that I somehow responded poorly
to a polite approach, and that it is time for people to be impolite to
me?  Or do I misread you?

bruce coston:
> Nick, unless your links say something hidden deeper than I'm willing
> to go, they are not relevant.

My links?  Which links in particular?  I've not gone back through the
thread, but the only link I believe I posted was the six-month release
schedule for Ubuntu.  

> MEPIS did not lightly switch to buntu , specifically they worried
> about code buntu uses that has not passed from experimental into sid.
> Much of debian code testing centers on  automatic promotion dependant
> on passing automated tests run every thursday. 

Ubuntu does manual inclusion of select packages necessary for the core
system.  If they do not work, they are fixed or rolled back.  These are
two different methods with two different 

> Its rather well known that buntu gets better hd benchmarks because of
> some code that never got out of debian experimental. Given the MANY
> suspicious disk partition wipe outs and 1 incident that wiped all
> linux partitions I'm forced to recommend against buntu and stop
> testing them, ~"go buy all new drives that work"  reinforces my view
> of buntu childishness formed from their long neglect eventually
> addressed of the reality that 90%+ of systems ship with PNP enabled. 

Okay, so this sounds like a very peculiar bug.  You've had data loss,
and you seem to be quoting an Ubuntu developer telling you to replace
your hard drive.  You seem to blame a particular kernel patch (I think)
that Debian never integrated.  Do you have a bug tracker URL where this
exchange took place?  I'd like understand what you're saying a little
more clearly, as I lack a great deal of context at the moment.

> Most of my awareness that debian testing exists  comes from the fact
> that buntu sucks CRITICAL CODE from there. 

It is my understanding that the non-core packages in the distribution
(The "Universe" archive) are largely pulled from Debian testing.  I do
not know this for certain, and can't quickly find documentation of the
process on the wiki right now.

This is different from what happens in the core, or "Main" archive.
That may sync with Debian in select and specific ways, but I believe for
example that the Ubuntu kernel team work pretty much independently of
Debian's kernels (although I'm sure most are also Debian developers and
may contribute back to Debian's kernels as well).

> How many distro do you multi-boot? Do you test on anything but the
> nicest hardware ?

Me?  I don't multi-boot anything, and I only test on my aged laptop and
the systems I need to install at work.  Why has this suddenly become
about me?  Is this part of the "so much for politeness to nick"
statement you made in the subject?

> By not even bothering with research we know of 2 pieces of low level
> software in buntu from experimental and at least 1 causes data loss,
> thus CRITICAL - all lines of code are not created equal. 

I am very sorry that you lost your data, and I would be interested to
see the evidence that it was caused by this particular bit of code.
Could you please make sure that when you follow up with the debbugs or
launchpad URL, that you keep it in the same thread?  I've been traveling
lately and I get a bit confused when you break off into your own new
thread like this.

"Man, if everything were object-oriented then rsync         Nick Moffitt
could do this already. Of course, if everything were       nick at zork.net
object-oriented I'd have a bushy moustache and be
wearing flares, which would suck." -- Sean Neakums

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